What do you consider buying a coin based on an Internet Image to be??
keets
Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
All you have to base the answer on is the image, no other criteria.
What do you consider buying a coin based on an Internet Image to be??
This is a public poll: others will see what you voted for.
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Sight seen. I buy 99.9% of my coins off the internet.
There is a standard definition for “sight seen” which, when adapted to Internet purchases, is based on return policy and what I use.
This is still relevant for Internet purchases as there are many things that cannot be observed in a photo.
Basically, when buying from Internet images, eBay is sight seen for the sellers I frequent, while HA and SB are sight unseen.
Sight unseen to me is ordering a coin with just a word description. If you are given an image, you are seeing the coin. It may not be a good image, but that is another issue.
Successful BST with drddm, BustDMs, Pnies20, lkeigwin, pursuitofliberty, Bullsitter, felinfoel, SPalladino
$5 Type Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/type-sets/half-eagle-type-set-circulation-strikes-1795-1929/album/344192
CBH Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/everyman-collections/everyman-half-dollars/everyman-capped-bust-half-dollars-1807-1839/album/345572
"Sight seen" if it meets or exceeds my expectations based on the pics; "sight unseen" if the pics turn out to be deceptive or hiding something...
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
If you are given an image, you are seeing the coin.
with "no other criteria" and with the 1915 Buffalo thread still in your memory, you would consider that a "sight seen" transaction??
OK...........................
I need a choice for sight partially seen. I see pictures and it gives me some idea of what I’ll get. Sometimes it’s very close to in hand and other times pretty far.
simple question, geez!! I can't figure out if everyone is being deliberately difficult or actually struggles with reading comprehension. this isn't a trick question.
Actually never opened that thread because the only Buffalo's that I collect are $50 face
If you don't like the picture, don't buy the coin. A photo of the slab then gives you the chance to look for a Trueview or past auction.
Successful BST with drddm, BustDMs, Pnies20, lkeigwin, pursuitofliberty, Bullsitter, felinfoel, SPalladino
$5 Type Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/type-sets/half-eagle-type-set-circulation-strikes-1795-1929/album/344192
CBH Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/everyman-collections/everyman-half-dollars/everyman-capped-bust-half-dollars-1807-1839/album/345572
Agree. Image is seen. Coin is not.
Gambling?
I kid... I buy most of my coins via images. Good images are helpful and bad images can be a gamble....
No way it's "sight seen". To me it's "tentative". The first gate it has to pass to get it in hand for final judgement.
Coinlearner, Ahrensdad, Nolawyer, RG, coinlieutenant, Yorkshireman, lordmarcovan, Soldi, masscrew, JimTyler, Relaxn, jclovescoins
Now listen boy, I'm tryin' to teach you sumthin' . . . . that ain't no optical illusion, it only looks like an optical illusion.
My mind reader refuses to charge me....
So if I understand this, if you see a photo of your Grandkids but can't hold them in your arms, you consider them to be sight unseen.
Interesting.....
Successful BST with drddm, BustDMs, Pnies20, lkeigwin, pursuitofliberty, Bullsitter, felinfoel, SPalladino
$5 Type Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/type-sets/half-eagle-type-set-circulation-strikes-1795-1929/album/344192
CBH Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/everyman-collections/everyman-half-dollars/everyman-capped-bust-half-dollars-1807-1839/album/345572
twisting in the wind, how elegant.
Plus in hand, return policy, reputation of seller. Peace Roy
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Definitely sight seen with a return policy.
Sight unseen without one.
Not a black and white answer.
(No pun intended)
I think if we buy a coin based on a description only we would all agree that’s sight unseen. If we buy a coin with images then it would be logical IMO to conclude that we’re now buying sight seen although this still may not be the optimal sight seen buying experience.
For me, looking at an image only is sight unseen. A lot of things can’t be seen even even in the best of photos, an example is hairlines on proofs. Try buying a 19th century proof on images only.
A photo is more similar to a text description than viewing a coin in hand to me. An image can be manipulated. It may not even be the coin you receive!
No matter how good the image, it is rarely as good as inspecting the coin in hand. I would say I ask for (when possible) sight unseen privilege's, just so if there is something the pictures don't show (or have been manipulated to hide), but I also study pictures closely so I can consider the action an almost sight seen purchase.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
It's neither. Sight seen/unseen has absolutely nothing to do with images--only with whether or not the coin can be physically seen in-hand prior to making a final decision. If the seller allows returns then it is sight seen even with no photo at all. If returns aren't allowed--as in most major auctions--then internet bids are sight unseen even with perfect pics.
How many angels can dance on an image?
I'm a bit surprised the first option got any votes.
Seeing a coin is seeing a coin. A photo is just a representation of it. Even a good video is just "close".
Ever been to the Grand Canyon? Ever seen a photo that captured the grandeur?
I do sometimes buy coins without having seen them first, but I usually have someone review them for me, there is a solid return privilege, or it's basically a bullion deal. This is one significant limitation in the business model of auction houses. With SB and Heritage there are people there I trust to take a look. If there's something important, I try to view the lots in-hand, and I've even had the big auction houses ship coins to me for review if I can't attend the auctions and there's enough time to do it. With GC, I sometimes just roll the dice. Usually it works out..... sometimes not so much. This is where photo interpretation skills and a little bit of sleuthing to find old photos comes in.
That term was generally used when putting together a deal. I'd purchase a coin based on the dealer's reputation (before photos were offered). There would be a bit of negotiation in the sense the price would be slightly lowered- possibly- if I bought the coin sight-unseen. Meaning I couldn't return the coin.
If I did have full return privileges, it would be considered a sight seen transaction.
If the coin is offered with a full return option, it is a sight seen purchase (whether photos are used or not).
if the coin is offered with no return option, it is. sight unseen purchase (whether photos are used or not.)
peacockcoins
It depends on the quality of the pictures (lighting, sharpness or resolution, etc). Generally, I would say that most pics on eBay would be considered to be sight unseen.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
If there is a photo, sight seen. W/O a photo, sight unseen. Can't unsee a photo, good or bad.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
If you are looking at a photograph of a coin then you have seen it.
So simple but some of you think this is some complex question.
Maybe the OP should have use the term "In Hand"
Until I've actually looked at a coin in hand, I consider it sight unseen. There are too many things that can be hidden in photos.
Unseen since lighting greatly affects the look of the coin. Certain lighting can be very deceptive.
Bad photos of a great coin equals a huge opportunity.
Great photos of a great coin equals very little opportunity.
My bread and butter.
Depends on the seller and if I know the quality of his or her images.
Perhaps the option of sometimes or both should have been included.
this thread was prompted by that 1915 Buffalo GSC thread. understanding that, how can anyone claim to have "seen the coin" by looking at the picture?? to my way of thinking, the whole reason for any kind of return policy at any online venue is because a buyer needs to actually "see" the coin in order to make a final decision.
I would rather have no image and a worded description from someone I trust than an image from someone I don't know. images are routinely manipulated to hide something or accentuate something, sometimes both. understanding that, and not knowing what has been done to edit an image, how can you claim to actually "see" a coin because you see a picture of it??
BTW, please, no more grandchildren or Grand canyon comparisons.
Never saw the 1915 thread as I have zero interest in the series.
OP Failed to mention that in the OP
So I stand by my statements.
If you see a photo you have seen the item unless of course digital manipulation has occurred, but I would consider that fraud.
"Great" photos of a bad coin equals return hassle.
Why would you buy a bad coin?
Sort of. Some pictures are better than others.
My understanding is that PCGS came up with the term "sight-unseen" and as long as it's in a PCGS holder it is considered "sight-seen"
In other words, the coin won't be net graded or what they now call details.
(Note...PCGS still does net grade some coins under unusual market circumstances)
https://www.pcgs.com/news/no-grade-coins-pt1
My Saint Set
My point is that photos can make a coin with issues look great sometimes. That's why great was in quotes.
There was an attempt to create a market based on TPG grades only, no image, but it never really took off.
I voted sight seen, but in reality it depends on the image. If it’s all blurry, or photoshopped too much, then it doesn’t really count as sight seen.
Also, since I became far sighted after cataract surgery, I often miss details of the coin if I buy it in person that I later see when I make an image of the coin.
Mr_Spud
Photography can be used as a tool to hide flaws.
This can happen intentionally or unintentionally.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
After all the photographic analysis and various pictures of the same coin shown here (lighting, angles, focus), I would have to say, sight unseen. Cheers, RickO
With that seller everything is sight unseen.
I would not assume that images are routinely manipulated.
A numismatist can become adept at reading unaltered images, and some will develop excellent skills and some will not.
If you know the seller or auction house is reputable then you need not worry about manipulation. Manipulation or extreme enhancement is a form of fraud.
I agree with those that say that "sight-seen" implies you personally saw the coin in hand. An image (or video) can be sufficiently close (and certainly better than just a description).
This. The terms are essentially irrelevant. Is there a return privilege or not? Wether I consider it sight seen or unseen is meaningless.
I'm seeing it, just not all of it, so to speak. Internet images can't always capture luster/cartwheel, eye appeal, toning, etc.
"Bongo hurtles along the rain soaked highway of life on underinflated bald retread tires."
~Wayne
Jesusus - why the double post why the double post?????????
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