What happened to the 1961 Wilt RC?
ndleo
Posts: 4,136 ✭✭✭✭✭
I see two 1961 Fleer Wilt PSA 7 on ebay both over $17K. This was like a $6000-$7000 card in June, which was already a spike from April $4000-$5000 levels.
The pop is 226. Is there new Wilt love? Or is this basketball demand related?
Mike
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Dr J rookies in an 8 one could get a nice one for $1500 a few months ago then $5000 and now 8-9 10K. Basketball is 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Basketball as a sport is incredibly popular with folks under 40, and, the cards have a tiny print run compared to their baseball equivalents. Frankly it’s ridiculous that it has taken this long. That card should be worth what a 51 Bowman Mantle is, easy.
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
1961 Fleer set has been incredibly undervalued for years, IMO. The recent set in REA auction, however, went for $9,000, buyer's premium included, and it has modestly graded stars (Chamberlain SGC 2.5, West - SGC 4) and pencil marks on the back of 61% of the set.
Always looking for Mantle cards such as Stahl Meyer, 1954 Dan Dee, 1959 Bazooka, 1960 Post, 1952 Star Cal Decal, 1952 Tip Top Bread Labels, 1953-54 Briggs Meat, and other Topps, Bowman, and oddball Mantles.
If I listed my Dr J PSA 8 right now it probably would get no where near 10 grand. It would be my luck.
You aren't allowed. I had that card.....in a PSA 9!!! Makes me sick to think how fast they have gone up!
I agree the Wilt has been undervalued for a while, but over the past few years you could get a 7 almost anytime you wanted, there was always one for sale somewhere. I thought it would hang out in the $5000 hood for a while but it loaded up the truck and moved to Beverly rather quickly.
Sold a beautiful PSA 7 Dr J for $700 and thought I made out well at the time...until it went 5X...
Too bad i never really got into Basketball cards. I only enjoy watching college. Although I do have a pretty Nice Wilt rookie in a PSA 7.5
Terry Bradshaw was AMAZING!!
Ignore list -Basebal21
There should not be a modern card that sells for more than that. Period. I don’t care if it’s a 1/1 rainbow gazelle prizm.
guessing that is close to 50k now?
i would take the over.
That 9 is incredible. Way over 50k.
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
What happened to the Wilt is what happened to Koufax and Rose RCs back in 2016. Just browse past realized prices from that time til now.
What happens, as many know, is that a small cadre of guys out to profit identify a card or cards that are ripe for the scam. Cards that have enough going for them, popularity, HOFer, etc. Cards the masses will believe are legitimately — suddenly, without real reason — experiencing new demand and are “exploding.”
This cadre buys a good supply of this card, then manipulates the sales data of it— in some cases buying at auction via proxies.
In some cases they also get hype on the card “out there” via online platforms. Many collectors then unwittingly and organically echo the scam’s messaging by cheering on the rise, as they like seeing their own collections increase in value.
Soon enough, reality follows suit: fish take the bait, sometimes these are new buyers who have now heard of this new way to make money and also like sports or cards— they buy in at the new price level.
Lastly, in some cases the new price takes or sticks. In others, the card settles back down the road to a varying degree. Hope that helps answer the original post’s question.
@DM23HOF that and some buy because they are collectors. I Bought mine a few years ago and because of the centering. Mine is not for sale.
I agree. I buy cards because I am a collector as well. And I also like a well centered card and am happy to pay a premium for such an example.
But there is a difference between an outlier example with rare centering causing a one-off bidding war spike because of how pretty it is, and the manipulated run up I outlined. I don’t see any way to stop that nefarious scenario other than for collectors to hang a lantern on it and refrain from participating where possible.
I would argue that things are a tad bit different than the 2016 run up. Not saying that isnt occurring and one should always stay on their toes, but the run up this time seems to be any and everything across the entire board of not just sportscards but gaming cards too whereas the last time it seemed like just key hof rcs were targeted.
Again, not saying youre wrong at all. At the very least, hopefully the covid frenzy has made it harder and more expensive for these guys!
This is definitely broader than the 2016 iteration. And certainly could be a perfect storm in terms of there being prevailing societal conditions due to Covid that may have helped the wildfire spread and intensify. No way for us to tell, yet like you said can’t hurt for collectors to be aware of what schemes are out there.
Example: I bought a nice PSA 7 Kareem Rookie a few years back for around $800. Its like taking candy from a baby at that price. Alot of cards are up including unopened. Vintage and Modern.
The tough part, too, is that vintage basketball has been so undervalued for so long that even if a small group of people are manipulating a handful of watershed cards it's really just triggering a long-overdue market correction. I think I paid $115 for my '69 Topps Elvin Hayes PSA 8 RC a few years ago. That's just dumb. Paid maybe $135 for my PSA 8 Earl Monroe RC.
I think a certain portion of it is modern collectors (and within that group contains a subgroup of people that do this solely as an investment) branching out and getting into vintage. When you're dropping $3k on a Jayson Tatus Prism and then realize you can get a nice Wilt Chamberlain RC it's probably hard to pass up.
Arthur
This closing at 75k = something's afoot. Anyone who knows cards knows this is way, way off.
It’s not only Wilt but Jerry West, Oscar Robertson rookies are also way up. Buyers need to be wary. I sold my PSA 7 Koufax RC during the spike for $4500, around $3500 now maybe?
Considering cashing out of my PSA 5 Wilt. Seems like they're closing at +- 10k. Thoughts?
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
Sell it....if it will sell.
@Ahmanfan said:
If it is well-centered, I would sell. Funny money or not, both of the $20K+ PSA 7's were well-centered compared to most 7s. For this card, eye appeal is a big X factor in the final price.
I sold my Dr. J 8 recently; replaced it with a raw vg-ex at less than 10% of the cost and am just dandy with it. I dumped my early Jordan cards into the Last Dance nuttiness. I am ready to part with my Russell RC too, just waiting for the right deal.
Now, for perspective: I bought cards in the last run up on a FOMO basis but I looked for good (relative to the time) deals. I was even or slightly negative for a while but every card I purchased is now up considerably, some so much so that I am considering selling them. My Aaron RC-which was one of them-has tripled but unfortunately I am a Hammerin' Hank fan so it isn't going anywhere.
I'm considering selling my PSA 7.5 Wilt. Where would be the best place to list to get the most value?
I would agree on this one. Unless it's a dummy who doesn't realize psa doesn't grade these anymore and thinks it's a no brainer bc of the extremely low pop!
Maybe it’s a sign of what’s to come if PSA ever starts grading these. I’m guessing that is the highest PSA graded Jordan 101? It’s print run is orders of magnitude less than a 86 fleer which goes for 6k at PSA 8. That card is Crazy expensive but I feel like the BGS Jordan 101s are probably undervalued in relation to the 86 fleer. I’d buy 6 BGS 8.5 Jordan 101s before I would buy that PSA 8 Jordan 101. . . . If I had 75k that I was allowed to spend on basketball cards.
I mentioned this here back at the time but there was another PSA 8 #101 that sold in May that had an asking price of $50k that sold at best offer for $10.6k.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Agreed. I love the Star Jordan XRC and wish they would be graded by PSA. But at best that card is a BGS 8 worth 10k. And the salient point: in its current state it is just in a disavowed slab and sticker. The potential argument one could make that it is somehow rare in the PSA slab is beyond specious.
I agree wholeheartedly. And i hate even using the word "but" here, but a lot of this newly injected money isn't necessarily smart money.
Who's paying $500 for 2019 lebron and luka non rc base cards? Certainly nobody here. But a lot of "folks" are.
That is the only other feasible option I can fathom. A run up and or someone that doesn't know the history of the card with psa and that pop report they just learned how to read looks like a home run. Especially when they see how many bgs cards are available. And they factor in the psa premium vs bgs. Or a solid mixture of both.
I think you are dead on correct, sir. The interesting part is how the winner was bid up that high.
Only one reasonable conclusion there unless Lloyd and Harry aren't communicating these days!
Amazing how Beckett’s designation of the 101 as an XRC has affected the value of both that card and the 86 Fleer. If the 101 is designated as MJ’s rookie it probably trades For several multiples higher than it currently does, especially considering the scarcity.
This same madness is happening in equity markets. This is what trillions of dollars injected into the economy looks like. Everything is inflated to ridiculous amounts. Fundamentals out the window, pump pump pump.
When this gasbag finally pops it is going to be spectacular. 1991 all over again
Was never planning on grading this, let alone selling it. Might be time, though.
Successful transactions with: yankeeno7, raiderguy10, Beck6, CDsNuts, DaveP01, Dboneesq, Elemenopeo, gameusedhoop, georgebailey2, Goldlabels, gstarling, justmichael, etc
Working on.........
Tony Dorsett Master Set
1977 Topps Mexican FB (raw)
1957 Topps FB Set (raw or graded)
We'll see if this $19375 sale goes thru on the dr. j 9...
Keep an eye on these two from today
keeping a real close eye on one of them! 😉
the $24,999 had an offer request and sent.
Haha
Nice. Good luck!
What is the matter with the Star Jordan. It is dead centered - 45/45 🤣
$25k one is not legit. guy flaked. ebay id kept.
never mind. it's real. and a swarm. relisted at $23999.
craziness. never have i seen such!
Oh wow. So all the conspiracy theorists were wrong again. How surprising.
I know what you are implying about the pump pump pump, my intuition also feels the same. However looking at it for a global monetary policy point of view, every developed economy in the world is pumping money. Every time a govt calls for budget cuts and spending austerity, the people protest and vote the party out. Now the govts may pump less going forward, but I don't see how they can pull it back and cause those soft slowdowns. The money in the system now bidding up assets is going to stay in the system, this could be the new normal.
I will pump all my gas then and move to solar.
It’s crazy times folks.
If anyone wants to dig into the archive I remember I did a thread saying how under appreciated the dr j rookie was maybe 5 years ago. I picked up these real guys for about $2500 total
You might want to cash in that $40,000 before the music stops and you're left without a chair.
I don't see any fat ladies getting ready sing but she maybe on her way in an Uber.