Wilson Dollar 100 Year Anniversary Medals Restrike by Daniel Carr......final mintages?

coinsarefun

Does anyone have more information? Got this in today’s email from Jeff Shelvin
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U1chicago

I saw it too and am also curious.
@dcarr ?

3stars

Shouldn't it be dated 2020 if its the 100 year anniversary?

cardinal

I got that email as well.

cardinal

@3stars said:
Shouldn't it be dated 2020 if its the 100 year anniversary?

It shows in the advertisement that the reverse would bear the date of 2020.

jwitten

Interesting. I can't tell if the reverse is supposed to be pretty much the same design, just 2020 date? That price though... ugh. Why does gold have to be at an all time high when they come out? lol

jwitten

Found the answer to my own question. The design will be the same on the reverse, just the date will change to 2020, and the word "opening" changed the "anniversary"

pruebas

I can't imagine anyone wanting one of these at that price, but then again, judging by the prices of the English retro pieces sold in Heritage lately, I guess anything is possible.

291fifth

Interesting modern medal but way to pricey.

dcarr

@pruebas said:
I can't imagine anyone wanting one of these at that price, but then again, judging by the prices of the English retro pieces sold in Heritage lately, I guess anything is possible.

The mintage on the gold one will likely be quite low (although I don't know the exact number yet).
They will weigh 1.6 troy oz (50 grams), so that is nearly $3,300 "melt" value.

coinsarefun

When can we expect these @dcarr ?
Are we buying them through you ?

oih82w8

Whew! That's a really nice one...but I never really acquired the taste for gold.

Zoins

@dcarr said:

@pruebas said:
I can't imagine anyone wanting one of these at that price, but then again, judging by the prices of the English retro pieces sold in Heritage lately, I guess anything is possible.

The mintage on the gold one will likely be quite low (although I don't know the exact number yet).
They will weigh 1.6 troy oz (50 grams), so that is nearly $3,300 "melt" value.

Nothing wrong with a low mintage

cameonut2011

@Zoins said:

The mintage on the gold one will likely be quite low (although I don't know the exact number yet).
They will weigh 1.6 troy oz (50 grams), so that is nearly $3,300 "melt" value.

Nothing wrong with a low mintage

Holy cow. His mark up is larger than Apple's.

cameonut2011

FWIW, it is a beautiful design.

Jimnight

I like it ... And I don't think the price is that bad either.

pruebas

@dcarr said:

@pruebas said:
I can't imagine anyone wanting one of these at that price, but then again, judging by the prices of the English retro pieces sold in Heritage lately, I guess anything is possible.

The mintage on the gold one will likely be quite low (although I don't know the exact number yet).
They will weigh 1.6 troy oz (50 grams), so that is nearly $3,300 "melt" value.

With all due respect @dcarr, a low mintage doesn't change anything. A fake is a fake. Call it a retro or repo design, fluff it up with marketing, it's still a fake Wilson gold dollar. It never ceases to amaze me how many gullible people are in this hobby.

Zoins

I like how it's going to say "To Commemorate the Anniversary of the Mint" in addition to having the 2020 date.

ricko

Should be a really nice medal... and I am sure @dcarr will do an excellent job on the reverse...Price is high, but gold is high and likely going higher...Cheers, RickO

cardinal

This just arrived:

coinsarefun

Cool cardinal, mine shipped out yesterday. Are those die polish lines on the obverse?

cardinal

@coinsarefun said:
Cool cardinal, mine shipped out yesterday. Are those die polish lines on the obverse?

I purchased the full 7-piece set, and all of those show those same identical lines. Supposedly, the original obverse die was used to strike these tribute medals, so I would expect those lines come from the original die.

coinsarefun

@cardinal said:

@coinsarefun said:
Cool cardinal, mine shipped out yesterday. Are those die polish lines on the obverse?

I purchased the full 7-piece set, and all of those show those same identical lines. Supposedly, the original obverse die was used to strike these tribute medals, so I would expect those lines come from the original die.

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That will make an awesome collection. I order the silver and the gold overlay.
However I should have waited for the actual pictures to come out as I just checked the website
today and see that the gold is on the obverse only. I thought it would be more of a gold gilt on the
entire tribute coin.

dcarr

@cardinal said:

@coinsarefun said:
Cool cardinal, mine shipped out yesterday. Are those die polish lines on the obverse?

I purchased the full 7-piece set, and all of those show those same identical lines. Supposedly, the original obverse die was used to strike these tribute medals, so I would expect those lines come from the original die.

Yes, the original obverse (Wilson portrait) die was used as-is. It was decided not to do any bead-blasting or polishing on the die.

I engraved the reverse (Manila Mint Opening) die. On this die the word "OPENING" was changed to "ANNIVERSARY" and the date "1920" was changed to "2020".

Note that these were commissioned by Jeff Shevlin and he is doing all the distribution of them.

cardinal

Here’s the set in its holder:

The 50 gram gold medal has a different holder, with openings for the silver and copper medals.

coinsarefun

@dcarr said:

@cardinal said:

@coinsarefun said:
Cool cardinal, mine shipped out yesterday. Are those die polish lines on the obverse?

I purchased the full 7-piece set, and all of those show those same identical lines. Supposedly, the original obverse die was used to strike these tribute medals, so I would expect those lines come from the original die.

Yes, the original obverse (Wilson portrait) die was used as-is. It was decided not to do any bead-blasting or polishing on the die.

I engraved the reverse (Manila Mint Opening) die. On this die the word "OPENING" was changed to "ANNIVERSARY" and the date "1920" was changed to "2020".

Note that these were commissioned by Jeff Shevlin and he is doing all the distribution of them.

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I'm glad it was decided to leave the original die as is and not polish it away. They did come out beautiful

coinsarefun

After seeing these in hand and seeing how beautiful they are I wish I had the spare cash to obtain the solid gold one.
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3stars

some serious octopus arms on the reverse.

cardinal

@coinsarefun said:
After seeing these in hand and seeing how beautiful they are I wish I had the spare cash to obtain the solid gold one.
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You're a better photographer than I!

coinsarefun

@cardinal said:

You're a better photographer than I!

Thanks but, the lighting does not capture the die polish lines as much as I’d like too.

Akbeez

Interesting medals! Any mintages reported? Couldn't find them on the website.

The gold would be amazing but beyond my allowance

FilamCoins

Just got mine. Nice restrike set. An important anniversary date for USPI collectors.

MedalCollector

“Struck from the original obverse die...”

Was there only one original obverse die?

coinsarefun

I noticed on @dcarr website some mintages.....
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I have a few questions.
Do I understand it right, there are 9 gold struck?
Which one is the silver with portrait gold gilt?
When were a few errors created and were they for sale?
Some are o/s, I must have missed all these varieties, were they posted on
the website?
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2020 So-Called Dollar Annual Gathering
Anniversary of Manila Mint Opening
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ZoidMeister

Late to the party, as usual. I was fortunate to have secured these.

Z

Pioneer1

These pieces have so many interesting parallels with so-called dollar collecting:

• Many so-called dollar medals come in a variety of metals/plating/finishes... some known to many... but others only known to a few who have them
• I was told that some of the metal varieties occurred as a result of "running out of the original planchets" and "substituting what was available"... I love that ! .. because I am sure things like that occurred over the 200+ years of making medals at expos. My favorite story is the "remelting all the metal at the end of the day and making new planchets for the next day" that is the reason for why HK-301 to HK-303 is the way they are....
• Various die states are known for some SCDs which makes collecting the varieties interesting; look no farther than Thomas Elder and Q. David Bowers Continental Dollar Restrikes
• People do collect "restrikes" or updates... as these are with the 2020 date.. the US mint has issued modern "restrikes" that were not intended as fakes... neither are these intended as fakes.... rather they are anniversary medals for a new generation
• Yes, there are true SCD fakes... and I know a great many people who hunt for them and collect them; some fakes are more rare than the originals.... and very hard to find... I have a small collection of SCD fakes that parallel my original SCD collection
• Dan (@dcarr) and Jeff creating interesting strikes over original medals parallels what others have done in the past, which is very interesting and very cool; what I would find interesting would be the possibility of Jeff and Dan striking over one of the original gold Wilson Dollars. If that would be done, we are talking about taking a $25-$50K coin and striking this new design over it.

I have attended almost all of the SCD Gatherings since 2014 and own some of the SCD Gathering varieties of these medals. Many thanks to @dcarr for the work in helping to make these. These annual meetings are a great venue to meeting other collectors and exchange knowledge and information. The last one in Reno NV was very safe; we all wore masks and socially-distanced and things went fine for all of us "over 50" aged folks. I spent a lot of time on the William Warner & Bros medals including my discovery of the original artist of the HK-143 series.

There are just enough of these medals made that we can all own one or a set if you so choose. If you like them, then get into SCD collecting; it's a fascinating area of numismatics that leads down many roads into other areas of numismatics... including learning a lot about who made the medals and why/how they were made. I know most of the readers here know all of this... but I figured I'd say it anyway....

coinsarefun

@Pioneer1 well said.......sums it up pretty well indeed.
But, would still like to know the answers to the few of my questions.
Maybe @dcarr will chime in .

Pioneer1

Do I understand it right, there are 9 gold struck?

Yes, 9. Jeff confirmed this.

Which one is the silver with portrait gold gilt?

The one made of silver with Wilson's obverse gilted; I believe @ZoidMeister posted one already above (7th image in his post).

When were a few errors created and were they for sale?

Jeff was selling some of these at the SCD Gathering in Aug 2020. Many were sold. I didn't buy any but thought about it. My loss....

Some are o/s, I must have missed all these varieties, were they posted on the website?

I don't believe so. You'd need to ask Jeff in person or e-mail him. I know of some over struck on IKE dollars, etc. If we would ever get back to an in person coin show, i'm sure they would be for sale.

coinsarefun

Thank you so very much @Pioneer1 that clears it up considerably.
I’ve never been to one of the shows where he is in it nor an open house.
I usually buy when the are offered on his site. In one case I missed a few and
managed to put together on set through a member here.

Zoins

@Pioneer1 said:
I spent a lot of time on the William Warner & Bros medals

It would be great to hear what you learned about William Warner and which medals he and his brother Charles did! I was able to match William Warner to these So-Called Dollars via the Collections of the Massachusetts Historical Society, Volume 76. More info here:

https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1029294/springfield-so-called-dollars-pynchon-house-revisited-hk-608-hk-609#latest

Here's my HK-608 which is still raw.

ZoidMeister

@Pioneer1 said:
These pieces have so many interesting parallels with so-called dollar collecting:

• Many so-called dollar medals come in a variety of metals/plating/finishes... some known to many... but others only known to a few who have them
• I was told that some of the metal varieties occurred as a result of "running out of the original planchets" and "substituting what was available"... I love that ! .. because I am sure things like that occurred over the 200+ years of making medals at expos. My favorite story is the "remelting all the metal at the end of the day and making new planchets for the next day" that is the reason for why HK-301 to HK-303 is the way they are....
• Various die states are known for some SCDs which makes collecting the varieties interesting; look no farther than Thomas Elder and Q. David Bowers Continental Dollar Restrikes
• People do collect "restrikes" or updates... as these are with the 2020 date.. the US mint has issued modern "restrikes" that were not intended as fakes... neither are these intended as fakes.... rather they are anniversary medals for a new generation
• Yes, there are true SCD fakes... and I know a great many people who hunt for them and collect them; some fakes are more rare than the originals.... and very hard to find... I have a small collection of SCD fakes that parallel my original SCD collection
• Dan (@dcarr) and Jeff creating interesting strikes over original medals parallels what others have done in the past, which is very interesting and very cool; what I would find interesting would be the possibility of Jeff and Dan striking over one of the original gold Wilson Dollars. If that would be done, we are talking about taking a $25-$50K coin and striking this new design over it.

I have attended almost all of the SCD Gatherings since 2014 and own some of the SCD Gathering varieties of these medals. Many thanks to @dcarr for the work in helping to make these. These annual meetings are a great venue to meeting other collectors and exchange knowledge and information. The last one in Reno NV was very safe; we all wore masks and socially-distanced and things went fine for all of us "over 50" aged folks. I spent a lot of time on the William Warner & Bros medals including my discovery of the original artist of the HK-143 series.

There are just enough of these medals made that we can all own one or a set if you so choose. If you like them, then get into SCD collecting; it's a fascinating area of numismatics that leads down many roads into other areas of numismatics... including learning a lot about who made the medals and why/how they were made. I know most of the readers here know all of this... but I figured I'd say it anyway....

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Bravo Pioneer! Exceptionally excellent synopsis.

The medals I was able to secure above are the brass, copper, nickel, and "silver select." I am waiting on a second order from Jeff and hope to have that next week. I will have a few more to show.

SCD / SC$1 collection has become a new passion and addiction for me. Many members can attest to this with my purchases over the past few months.

Restrikes and SCD's are a way for us "po folks" to chase and acquire beautiful design rarities that would be otherwise unattainable. Shelvin and Carr are just modern and prolific artists and businessmen following in the footsteps of Lovett, Bashlow, and Bowers, all highly respected in their own right. Ron Landis is another.

I applaud their work and efforts. They do not detract from numismatics, rather they bring a dimension that otherwise didn't exist. Detractors probably don't like chocolate milk either.

Medals, tokens, commemorative strikes, all have a place and like Lovett, Bashlow, Landis, and others, I believe history will judge well their work.

Z

Zoins

@ZoidMeister said:

@Pioneer1 said:
These pieces have so many interesting parallels with so-called dollar collecting:

• Many so-called dollar medals come in a variety of metals/plating/finishes... some known to many... but others only known to a few who have them
• I was told that some of the metal varieties occurred as a result of "running out of the original planchets" and "substituting what was available"... I love that ! .. because I am sure things like that occurred over the 200+ years of making medals at expos. My favorite story is the "remelting all the metal at the end of the day and making new planchets for the next day" that is the reason for why HK-301 to HK-303 is the way they are....
• Various die states are known for some SCDs which makes collecting the varieties interesting; look no farther than Thomas Elder and Q. David Bowers Continental Dollar Restrikes
• People do collect "restrikes" or updates... as these are with the 2020 date.. the US mint has issued modern "restrikes" that were not intended as fakes... neither are these intended as fakes.... rather they are anniversary medals for a new generation
• Yes, there are true SCD fakes... and I know a great many people who hunt for them and collect them; some fakes are more rare than the originals.... and very hard to find... I have a small collection of SCD fakes that parallel my original SCD collection
• Dan (@dcarr) and Jeff creating interesting strikes over original medals parallels what others have done in the past, which is very interesting and very cool; what I would find interesting would be the possibility of Jeff and Dan striking over one of the original gold Wilson Dollars. If that would be done, we are talking about taking a $25-$50K coin and striking this new design over it.

I have attended almost all of the SCD Gatherings since 2014 and own some of the SCD Gathering varieties of these medals. Many thanks to @dcarr for the work in helping to make these. These annual meetings are a great venue to meeting other collectors and exchange knowledge and information. The last one in Reno NV was very safe; we all wore masks and socially-distanced and things went fine for all of us "over 50" aged folks. I spent a lot of time on the William Warner & Bros medals including my discovery of the original artist of the HK-143 series.

There are just enough of these medals made that we can all own one or a set if you so choose. If you like them, then get into SCD collecting; it's a fascinating area of numismatics that leads down many roads into other areas of numismatics... including learning a lot about who made the medals and why/how they were made. I know most of the readers here know all of this... but I figured I'd say it anyway....

Bravo Pioneer! Exceptionally excellent synopsis.

The medals I was able to secure above are the brass, copper, nickel, and "silver select." I am waiting on a second order from Jeff and hope to have that next week. I will have a few more to show.

SCD / SC$1 collection has become a new passion and addiction for me. Many members can attest to this with my purchases over the past few months.

Restrikes and SCD's are a way for us "po folks" to chase and acquire beautiful design rarities that would be otherwise unattainable. Shelvin and Carr are just modern and prolific artists and businessmen following in the footsteps of Levitt, Bashlow, and Bowers, all highly respected in their own right. Ron Landis is another.

I applaud their work and efforts. They do not detract from numismatics, rather they bring a dimension that otherwise didn't exist. Detractors probably don't like chocolate milk either.

Medals, tokens, commemorative strikes, all have a place and like Levitt, Bashlow, Landis, and others, I believe history will judge well their work.

Z

Good info. Another yesteryear die sinker Dan Carr can be compared to is John Adams Bolen who did both his own tokens and medals and fantasy coins. Here's an Ex-Dave Wnuck bar cent by Bolen that sold for $6,600 in Feb 2019. Imagine that for a Moonlight Mint piece?

https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1014688/the-bolen-woodward-silver-bar-cent#latest

dcarr

@coinsarefun said:
I noticed on @dcarr website some mintages.....
.
I have a few questions.
Do I understand it right, there are 9 gold struck?
Which one is the silver with portrait gold gilt?
When were a few errors created and were they for sale?
Some are o/s, I must have missed all these varieties, were they posted on
the website?
.
2020 So-Called Dollar Annual Gathering
Anniversary of Manila Mint Opening
.
.

The gold plating was not done by me at Moonlight Mint. I still do gold plating once in a while for very limited quantities. But I don't like doing it beyond that. So Jeff Shevlin had the gold plating done somewhere else (I don't know where).

All versions of this medal are distributed by Jeff Shevlin and none by me. The over-strikes were done while Jeff was at my mint. If any are made available, he will be the source.

Some of the medals will be available until the end of the year. There may be one more small production run to fill the last orders, if necessary. That will be up to Jeff.

coinsarefun

Thanks for the answers @dcarr

Bsktmkr

A question arose above about die polish lines on the obverse. I had the opportunity to study the die in hand when it was offered to Jeff. The die shows clash marks from a lightly rotated reverse die. These clash marks are visible on the commemorative medal Jeff had struck by Dan using the original obverse die. I created an overlay photo using a nickel example since the clash marks show best on that particular photo of my medals. I used a photograph of an actual reverse from a silver medal since Dan's new reverse die is not the die that created the clash marks. It is not a perfect mapping because I had to resize the photograph to match my images. But, it does allow you to see where the clash marks appear and how they match up with the reverse image.

ZoidMeister

Jeff approved the posting of these.

Here are some interesting "novodels" that were created. I was fortunate to get a couple. Whomever grabbed the lion's share, contact me. I am interested in a few of your "hand me downs" . . . . . .

Z
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Double Struck Off Center

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Flip Over / Double Struck Off Center

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1907-S Philippine Peso Over Strike

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Morgan Dollar Over Strike

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Peace Dollar Over Strike

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Walking Liberty Half Over Strike

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And my absolute favorite - Triple Struck, Off Center, Silver Select (gold gilt)

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@Bullsitter , @Akbeez , either one of you grab one of these FOR me?

Z

Zoins

Those are awesome @ZoidMeister!

Jeff and Dan @dcarr really did a great job on these!

Bullsitter

Cool man, cool. None are mine, I'm sorry to say.

ZoidMeister

@Zoins said:
Those are awesome @ZoidMeister!

Jeff and Dan @dcarr really did a great job on these!

I wasn't able to get many of the above ordered, but did get the Morgan over strike and the double strike off center. The other photos are examples of the variety that Jeff had available. SOMEONE here got them, just not I . . . . . .

Low quantity buyers, to the back of the bus . . . . ..

Z

ZoidMeister

Thought I would post this one here . . . . . . just because . . . . .

Z
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ZoidMeister

A fantasy strike, and my lowest mintage Daniel Carr piece, Antiqued Brass.

Z.