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I have an authentic AU $10 Indian with unusual feathers on the wing. **Answered**
Insider2
Posts: 14,452 ✭✭✭✭✭
One of the first places to look for wear on the $10 Indian is the shoulder of the eagle's wing. While examining this coin for authentication and grade. I noticed an unusual feather pattern. Could this be a "special" coin?
PLEASE NOTE: It takes too much effort to post these if the knowledgeable folks answer in the first reply. I know you know the answers. Let's give the newer members a chance to think these out.
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spark erosion counterfeit?
The neck looks suspiciously thin.
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The coin is authentic.
Tooled.
WS
Reengraved?
1908 No Motto, stippled eagle variety.
Both tooling and reengraving involve moving metal on the surface. So neither of these. Possible pattern?
I thought it might be a "new" variety. Show us yours..
Die scratches?
Since you said special coin, I was thinking proof with polished dies that had lint or some other material that was struck onto the coin
I'm just being facetious....sorry......
Keep guessing. Do those feathers look like scratches?
Maybe some type of metal "stippling tool" was used to apply texture (like a tiny meat tenderizer) thus concealing wear?
Was this Coin Underwater?
Damaged coin? Re engraved details?
Young Numismatist/collector
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Possibly in a piece of jewelry?
Weird looking..... Seeing that on a potential purchase would cause me to move on.....Cheers, RickO
Never use 60 grit flips!
Rusted die...wild guess.
No. PMD. Also reject for Thanksgiving dinner.
Bad planchet. Looks like many Jeffersons.
I may not know what I'm doing most of the time, but I'm Damn good at it. 😇 😈
Answer will be posted late tonight.
Maybe someone trying to "improve" the coin.
Possible I guess, but why and how?
$ and a tool of some kind.
Hmmm... well, this one is a poser... My first thought was counterfeit, but you said the piece is authentic. Then I thought tooled, but you're right... I don't really see any metal being removed. I guess I'm down to struck through something that left a repetitive mark on the wing.
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Looks like someone just say down with a penny nail or something and started poking it for fun.
Perhaps poked to hide graffiti or an obvious scratch of some sort. An attempt to improve the coin.
Delam on a bad planchet?
Have no clue otherwise.
bob
It does look a bit like the gold Buffalos with the "hand hammered" fields.
Could be done with detailing tools for metal, jewelry, etc...
I may not know what I'm doing most of the time, but I'm Damn good at it. 😇 😈
I’m still thinking jewelry piece, that had a clamp pressed onto the reverse of the coin
Would you post a pic of the whole reverse before giving the answer?
Watching and learning.
Maybe debris on the die?
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
Looks like someone stippled the wing with a sharp tool to hide or camouflage wear or other problems.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
Coin sent back. This is the important part and the reason it looks different.
I find it very helpful if I describe what I'm looking at. Try to describe the feather design on the wing of this coin to a blind collector who cannot see them. The reason I posted this image is because they look different than those on the other $10 Indians around here.
I must be guilty of MASSIVE underuse of my loupe.
Fair enough. I’m just wondering what it would have looked like/how much it would have stood out from a little farther away. Up close it looks like the surface has been eaten away by something (not sure what would eat away gold though).
If the shoulder of the wing was originally worn smooth though, it’s possible someone roughed it up a little in the hopes it would look like the fine textured feathers on an MS or better struck eagle in the hopes of passing it off as a better specimen.
Are those from the edge of another coin?
Collector, occasional seller
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Hmm... Sand or media blasted?
Maybe the the coin was taped up except for the wings and shot with some abrasive course media to give that pockmark texture.
struck through circus peanut
Partially grease-filled die or struck-through would be my guesses.
FWIW that's the bird's wrist, not the shoulder. But everyone "gets" shoulder.
No guess on the waffle look except that it's PMD.
Lance.
Excellent point!
While the joint at the "shoulder" is attached to the body and the part showing is correctly called the "wrist" of a wing, it seems that when the wing is folded next to the body it resembles and is called a "shoulder" by most folks. Sadly, I think it's best if I continue to post incorrectly so others "get it."
PS It is informed posters such as yourself that make this place a great place to learn.
This is an altered coin. Someone has taken a "tool" of some kind and marked up the worn area of the wing turning an obvious AU into a beat up MS coin. Here is a similar yet better executed alteration on a Morgan dollar. Just another reason to purchase coins that are already graded.
People have got to use their Tandy leather tools for more than just making wallets. It's called multi-tasking.
Interesting - seems like it would turn a AU coin into Genuine rather than a beat up MS??
Right. A genuine AU with obvious wear to a genuine beat up MS coin with no wear.
Except who looks for wear there on this series? Not any graders or professionals I know.
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