I haven't read everything about the second box rip. Since Steve offered him a second box at a 50% discount, did Jabs pass the savings along to his customers?
@ReggieCleveland said:
Besides, between the gesture and that sweet Ozzie the karma gods will reward Steve with increased business from those two videos to more than compensate him. Steve has his karma locked down tight. Nobody beats Steve in a karmathon.
Arthur
"Karmathon" -- I deem this to be the most amazing word of the day. I shall try to use it as many times as I can. You sir, have outdone yourself.
Speaking of all this BBCE talk. It's been a few months. Shouldn't we be looking at a fall BBCE group purchase/rip or whatever we call it?
@PaulMaul said:
I’ll wait for all the unopened experts to post about how many legit boxes they have seen over the years with cards from only one sheet. So far in this thread that hasn’t happened.
It's not just boxes with card from one sheet, they have to be clunkers of boxes with cards from one sheet in order to just be noticed. If somebody rips an '83 Topps box and they bang out 3 Boggs, 3 Gwynn and 3 Sandberg (I have no idea if they're on the same sheet, just play along) they're not going to go digging into the box to find out what went wrong. They're going to scan their cards and post about the lucky score they had. What if it were a '78 box with no Murray but you got multiples of Brett and Yount? That wouldn't cause any alarm bells to go off.
This really was a unique situation and Steve proved, once again, why it pays to avoid eBay on unopened.
@Mintacular said:
On the issue, feel like Steve has set a dangerous precedent, what would prevent other like buyers to request refund/partial refund on other boxes that don't yield "hits"?
Can everyone please stop pretending that the complaints about the original box were based simply on “not yielding hits?” The box was a complete anomaly in terms of its contents and collation. I don’t think Steve had any real obligation to do what he did, but his gesture was not unreasonable given what the box was like.
I see your point, but no, this was not a "complete anomaly" in any way, shape or form. It might not have been common practice, but Topps packaged cards in this "unusual" way from time to time.
Even though cards were collected and had some value in 1979, Topps did not put much effort into making sure the cards were even well cut, much less that boxes had a good mix of cards. In fact I would think the reverse could have been true. Get the kids to keep buying packs searching for their "guy".
This couldn't be further from the truth. By 1979, the layout of their sheets were designed specifically to address the issue of getting many duplicates of the same cards within the same box/pack. The box was definitely an anomaly.
@jfkheat said:
I haven't read everything about the second box rip. Since Steve offered him a second box at a 50% discount, did Jabs pass the savings along to his customers?
Hiya James
He used the "same" group of people and did the rip at no charge to them. Except he gave a refund to one of the participants.
@Mintacular said:
On the issue, feel like Steve has set a dangerous precedent, what would prevent other like buyers to request refund/partial refund on other boxes that don't yield "hits"?
Can everyone please stop pretending that the complaints about the original box were based simply on “not yielding hits?” The box was a complete anomaly in terms of its contents and collation. I don’t think Steve had any real obligation to do what he did, but his gesture was not unreasonable given what the box was like.
I see your point, but no, this was not a "complete anomaly" in any way, shape or form. It might not have been common practice, but Topps packaged cards in this "unusual" way from time to time.
Even though cards were collected and had some value in 1979, Topps did not put much effort into making sure the cards were even well cut, much less that boxes had a good mix of cards. In fact I would think the reverse could have been true. Get the kids to keep buying packs searching for their "guy".
This couldn't be further from the truth. By 1979, the layout of their sheets were designed specifically to address the issue of getting many duplicates of the same cards within the same box/pack. The box was definitely an anomaly.
BUT Topps decided to package them any way they felt like, completely obliterating the plan, at the very least in 1979.
OBVIOUSLY decisions were made to liquidate product with no regard whatsoever to getting duplicates.
The "plan" had nothing to do with making sure there was good collation or any other kind of quality control above the absolute minimum.
The "plan" was to sell packages of baseball cards, originally it was to sell gum. So as long as you got a piece of gum, you got what you paid for, the cards were a bonus.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
BUT Topps decided to package them any way they felt like, completely obliterating the plan, at the very least in 1979.
OBVIOUSLY decisions were made to liquidate product with no regard whatsoever to getting duplicates.
The "plan" had nothing to do with making sure there was good collation or any other kind of quality control above the absolute minimum.
The "plan" was to sell packages of baseball cards, originally it was to sell gum. So as long as you got a piece of gum, you got what you paid for, the cards were a bonus.
You don’t know that. The collation of packs was the result of a process. So how little Topps cared about quality control doesn’t change the process. It is certainly not impossible that there were exceptions to the process. But if you’re going to excuse any pack contents as Topps not caring, Steve may as well stop rejecting cello packs based on collation considerations.
Steve's business is thru the roof. He just issued a statement telling people he is so full of boxes to "wrap" he won't be accepting anymore until further notice.
@PaulMaul said:
I’ll wait for all the unopened experts to post about how many legit boxes they have seen over the years with cards from only one sheet. So far in this thread that hasn’t happened.
I posted earlier about an 84 Topps B.B. fasc box that had all cards from the same row in the same sheet in the bottom half of each pack. That’s even weirder.
BUT Topps decided to package them any way they felt like, completely obliterating the plan, at the very least in 1979.
OBVIOUSLY decisions were made to liquidate product with no regard whatsoever to getting duplicates.
The "plan" had nothing to do with making sure there was good collation or any other kind of quality control above the absolute minimum.
The "plan" was to sell packages of baseball cards, originally it was to sell gum. So as long as you got a piece of gum, you got what you paid for, the cards were a bonus.
You don’t know that. The collation of packs was the result of a process. So how little Topps cared about quality control doesn’t change the process. It is certainly not impossible that there were exceptions to the process. But if you’re going to excuse any pack contents as Topps not caring, Steve may as well stop rejecting cello packs based on collation considerations.
I know better than most about your "process", I worked in a factory for 24 years and watched how things were done. A process is great in theory but is nothing more than a guideline. If they didn't bother to "pull" miscut cards (the so-called process probably didn't call for them either) why would they worry too much about collation? They wouldn't. MOST of the cards were pretty well cut, MOST of the boxes were fairly well collated.
You got your cards for a penny or so each, some delicious gum, chewed the gum and usually destroyed the cards. If you would have told anyone at Topps that people would be paying $2,000.00 for a box of 1979 baseball cards in 2019, they would have told you to seek psychiatric care. Most of them anyway,
This is getting to be as silly of a debate as the thread itself. "Ripping" unopened, especially from that era is a bad gamble. It doesn't matter what was supposed to happen, the odds are you are going to get a LOT of garbage. Not to mention that the value of unopened has (in my opinion) gotten so high that ripping it is generally economically foolish.
Opening old packs is fun, and occasionally you will get a nice valuable card, but the fact remains that to whine about what Topps did 40 freaking years ago is idiotic and pointless.
I would bet Steve did NOT make a mistake in authentication, you can TRY to say Topps made a mistake, but I surmise it was done to get rid of crap that was lying around at the end of the day/week/month/year. What do you think they were going to do, throw it away? Maybe schedule some overtime to produce a few more sheets 1 and 2? They were running a business. You don't throw away product that you can sell.
Why not cry and whine to Topps? They would laugh you right out the door. Which is what I am doing to this thread.
Have fun collecting!
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
but I surmise it was done to get rid of crap that was lying around at the end of the day/week/month/year. What do you think they were going to do, throw it away?
Oh I don’t know, sell it in a 8,000 card cut card case for pennies on the dollar like they did with most of the leftover cards?
@gomezadams2 said:
Steve's business is thru the roof. He just issued a statement telling people he is so full of boxes to "wrap" he won't be accepting anymore until further notice.
@gomezadams2 said:
Steve's business is thru the roof. He just issued a statement telling people he is so full of boxes to "wrap" he won't be accepting anymore until further notice.
That means PSA pack grading will suffer even more time wise. It is already at least 4 months for packs.
@Mintacular said:
On the issue, feel like Steve has set a dangerous precedent, what would prevent other like buyers to request refund/partial refund on other boxes that don't yield "hits"?
Can everyone please stop pretending that the complaints about the original box were based simply on “not yielding hits?” The box was a complete anomaly in terms of its contents and collation. I don’t think Steve had any real obligation to do what he did, but his gesture was not unreasonable given what the box was like.
I see your point, but no, this was not a "complete anomaly" in any way, shape or form. It might not have been common practice, but Topps packaged cards in this "unusual" way from time to time.
Even though cards were collected and had some value in 1979, Topps did not put much effort into making sure the cards were even well cut, much less that boxes had a good mix of cards. In fact I would think the reverse could have been true. Get the kids to keep buying packs searching for their "guy".
This couldn't be further from the truth. By 1979, the layout of their sheets were designed specifically to address the issue of getting many duplicates of the same cards within the same box/pack. The box was definitely an anomaly.
Welcome to the forum. Thank you for bringing your knowledge here.
@softparade said:
I worry about the stability of such a growing and more important part of the hobby when everything hinges on just one human being.
This has been discussed in the past. Frankly, the situation is ripe for corruption, and it’s only Steve’s impeccable ethical standards that have allowed the situation to develop and thrive as it has.
I heard it was because Madame Tussauds sent him a cease and desist order.
@gomezadams2 said:
Steve's business is thru the roof. He just issued a statement telling people he is so full of boxes to "wrap" he won't be accepting anymore until further notice.
Comments
I haven't read everything about the second box rip. Since Steve offered him a second box at a 50% discount, did Jabs pass the savings along to his customers?
"Karmathon" -- I deem this to be the most amazing word of the day. I shall try to use it as many times as I can. You sir, have outdone yourself.
Speaking of all this BBCE talk. It's been a few months. Shouldn't we be looking at a fall BBCE group purchase/rip or whatever we call it?
It's not just boxes with card from one sheet, they have to be clunkers of boxes with cards from one sheet in order to just be noticed. If somebody rips an '83 Topps box and they bang out 3 Boggs, 3 Gwynn and 3 Sandberg (I have no idea if they're on the same sheet, just play along) they're not going to go digging into the box to find out what went wrong. They're going to scan their cards and post about the lucky score they had. What if it were a '78 box with no Murray but you got multiples of Brett and Yount? That wouldn't cause any alarm bells to go off.
This really was a unique situation and Steve proved, once again, why it pays to avoid eBay on unopened.
Arthur
This couldn't be further from the truth. By 1979, the layout of their sheets were designed specifically to address the issue of getting many duplicates of the same cards within the same box/pack. The box was definitely an anomaly.
Hiya James
He used the "same" group of people and did the rip at no charge to them. Except he gave a refund to one of the participants.
His "Super Chat" is interesting - just wow.
BUT Topps decided to package them any way they felt like, completely obliterating the plan, at the very least in 1979.
OBVIOUSLY decisions were made to liquidate product with no regard whatsoever to getting duplicates.
The "plan" had nothing to do with making sure there was good collation or any other kind of quality control above the absolute minimum.
The "plan" was to sell packages of baseball cards, originally it was to sell gum. So as long as you got a piece of gum, you got what you paid for, the cards were a bonus.
>
You don’t know that. The collation of packs was the result of a process. So how little Topps cared about quality control doesn’t change the process. It is certainly not impossible that there were exceptions to the process. But if you’re going to excuse any pack contents as Topps not caring, Steve may as well stop rejecting cello packs based on collation considerations.
Steve's business is thru the roof. He just issued a statement telling people he is so full of boxes to "wrap" he won't be accepting anymore until further notice.
I posted earlier about an 84 Topps B.B. fasc box that had all cards from the same row in the same sheet in the bottom half of each pack. That’s even weirder.
I know better than most about your "process", I worked in a factory for 24 years and watched how things were done. A process is great in theory but is nothing more than a guideline. If they didn't bother to "pull" miscut cards (the so-called process probably didn't call for them either) why would they worry too much about collation? They wouldn't. MOST of the cards were pretty well cut, MOST of the boxes were fairly well collated.
You got your cards for a penny or so each, some delicious gum, chewed the gum and usually destroyed the cards. If you would have told anyone at Topps that people would be paying $2,000.00 for a box of 1979 baseball cards in 2019, they would have told you to seek psychiatric care. Most of them anyway,
This is getting to be as silly of a debate as the thread itself. "Ripping" unopened, especially from that era is a bad gamble. It doesn't matter what was supposed to happen, the odds are you are going to get a LOT of garbage. Not to mention that the value of unopened has (in my opinion) gotten so high that ripping it is generally economically foolish.
Opening old packs is fun, and occasionally you will get a nice valuable card, but the fact remains that to whine about what Topps did 40 freaking years ago is idiotic and pointless.
I would bet Steve did NOT make a mistake in authentication, you can TRY to say Topps made a mistake, but I surmise it was done to get rid of crap that was lying around at the end of the day/week/month/year. What do you think they were going to do, throw it away? Maybe schedule some overtime to produce a few more sheets 1 and 2? They were running a business. You don't throw away product that you can sell.
Why not cry and whine to Topps? They would laugh you right out the door. Which is what I am doing to this thread.
Have fun collecting!
Oh I don’t know, sell it in a 8,000 card cut card case for pennies on the dollar like they did with most of the leftover cards?
Flight to Quality.
That means PSA pack grading will suffer even more time wise. It is already at least 4 months for packs.
Welcome to the forum. Thank you for bringing your knowledge here.
Why did I read all this?
I worry about the stability of such a growing and more important part of the hobby when everything hinges on just one human being.
ISO 1978 Topps Baseball in NM-MT High Grade Raw 3, 100, 103, 302, 347, 376, 416, 466, 481, 487, 509, 534, 540, 554, 579, 580, 622, 642, 673, 724__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ISO 1978 O-Pee-Chee in NM-MT High Grade Raw12, 21, 29, 38, 49, 65, 69, 73, 74, 81, 95, 100, 104, 110, 115, 122, 132, 133, 135, 140, 142, 151, 153, 155, 160, 161, 167, 168, 172, 179, 181, 196, 200, 204, 210, 224, 231, 240
This has been discussed in the past. Frankly, the situation is ripe for corruption, and it’s only Steve’s impeccable ethical standards that have allowed the situation to develop and thrive as it has.
We need someone following Steve around making sure he's not skydiving or wrestling alligators.
Arthur
I heard it was because Madame Tussauds sent him a cease and desist order.