Is rust on an otherwise BU coin a bad thing? An Update!!
superpsychmd
Posts: 1,291 ✭✭✭
Picked up a stunner uncirculated Mexican peso from 1908 but there appears to be some orange rust streaks present, almost look like crayon in a few crevices. Will the coin grade problem free or do I have to remove the rusty toning which is minimal?
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Also it did not come off with a quick dip in e-z-est or Conserve.
If I’m not mistaken rust is ED.
Yes.
But we need a picture. There's a big difference between actual "rust" and rust-colored toning
YES. Anything detracting on a BU coin hurts the grade and eye appeal.
Ok let me add a photo now
The coin is very lustrous, took the pic in poor lighting
I'll take some pie with that crust
It doesn't look like rust to me. Try acetone.
Yeah I will, can only help it.
Tape residue? Edit, part of it.
I had that thought also. Acetone will help decide
It’s orange though so I’m not sure that would come from tape. Bought the coin in a flip but makes me think of the color of a rusted staple
There's a lot of things that could color it orange. I've even seen melted crayons on coins. Tape residue will usually head towards brown with age. And, of course, it will pick up the color of whatever sticks to it.
Pass! If dipping didn't get it.....acetone won't touch it.
That is not at all true. Conserve and E-Z-est are essentially aqueous detergents. Acetone is an organic solvent.
I’ll try tomorrow and report on the results!
Before and after pics request.
I thought E-Z-est was like Jeweler luster and took off everything including metal.
The orange stuff looks like some sort of corrosion and the black stuff looks like where something was previously removed.
I agree that the orange looks like tape residue. Either way, I would give it a soak in acetone first.
I would bet that there was a lot of black stuff on this coin at one time. The coin isn't undesirable, but I wouldn't send it in for grading.
The reverse is really brilliant and without hairlines so I am hopeful it will grade
EZest (coin dip) is an acidic solution that removes the top layer of metal and everything on it - both polar and non-polar substances alike. We're not talking about solvent effects when using coin dip. The coin should only be in there for a couple of seconds or so in any event.
It does at the surface. Solvent effect would come into play if choosing between polar (e.g. alcohols) and non-polar (e.g. acetone, xylene, etc.) solvents.
Solvent effects are always present. If you have an impermeable, highly non-polar substance, dip will do nothing. Acetone or xylene might (depends). Most commercial dip has surfactants, so it can get at slightly non-polar stuff, but it won't touch real gunk.
Aercus Numismatics - Certified coins for sale
Solvent effects are de minimis given the strength of the solution and the exposure time (if you follow normal usage and/or the directions on the label). You're not leaving the coin in Ezest for several minutes or longer.
If it is rust - iron oxide - oxalic acid should take care of it. What will happen to the rest of the coin is a toss-up. In the photo it already looks dull from dipping in everything from corn liquor to mayonnaise.
This falls into the "it is what it is" camp. Just leave it.
If an acetone bath does not remove it, then it is not organic. If you have access to a materials lab (college, business etc.) then have it analyzed by a non destructive method....and be sure they understand how to handle a coin prior to allowing the test....Cheers, RickO
No, this is incorrect. Solvent effects cover solubility (including of intermediates) and are always present. A substance that is harder to dissolve will cause a reaction to proceed more slowly. A reaction proceeding under nominal conditions quickly does not mean solvent effects are not present. Remember we are talking solid/liquid, not liquid/liquid.
But we don't really need to dive too deeply into chemistry here. Simple thought experiment: put petroleum jelly on one area of a toned coin. Dip for however long is recommended. What will be the result? Now use xylene. What will be the result?
PS: Fun fact, using acids on many popular adhesives will actually make it harder to dissolve them in aqueous solutions!
Aercus Numismatics - Certified coins for sale
Whatever it is, it's raised on the surface and probably will come off with proper conservation.
After 4 hrs soaking in acetone
I really love the reverse!
Wow an update, just added isopropyl alcohol to a wet q-tip and look now!
Even removed some blotchy toning around Mexicana
This is going off to the grading gods this week!
Thanks everyone for your input!
Looks way better. Well done.
Will you submit it as an original, or as a "restrike"?
1898 is the restrike year, not 1908.
Yes, sorry. Read the catalog too quickly, plus a brainfart or two.
No worries. 1908s do have two different assayer initial options, though.
It’s the AM variety that I have
Very nice results... I trust you did not 'rub' with the Qtip though.... I do not see hairlines in the pictures, so that is good. Let us know what grade you receive... Cheers, RickO
I had a similar experience long ago with a 1915 Lincoln. My conclusion was that I was able to remove ink stain with isopropyl alcohol.
Your coin seemed to have two different types of discoloration, so I didn't expect you to be able to get both types in one shot. IPA has zero effect on a coin's surface. Nice work.
I knew it would happen.
Thank you for your kind support gents. Usually I kill every coin I try to clean so I am excited this one really came out ok. There was another coin I saw when I bought this one, namely an 1819 Mexico 8 reales that had semi prooflike fields which also had a haze on it. I might buy that one now!
I can attest to that. Alcohol will dissolve ink very nicely.
Keep us posted on the submission results.
I like happy endings. Out damn spot!
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It will probably be weeks till I get grades back but I won’t forget to post it
Glad you got it off and it looks nice, but ezest should not be the starting point. Other chemicals, as noted above, are much safer and won't remove toning(surface) at the same time.
Collector, occasional seller