For those of you (Collectors, not dealers) that have set up a table at a small, local, show
Bochiman
Posts: 25,405 ✭✭✭✭✭
What did you need to do ahead of time and what tips do you have?
Did you have to get a business license, even though you were just selling (I assume) extras/dupes or just selling off your collection?
What type of accounting did you do for it? I think most of us have a spreadsheet, or list of some time, that has information for most of our collection (aside from what I call "pocket change collection" (raw SHQs and the like). Did you use a "dumbed down" version of that?
Did you get fancy with the pricing, like a real dealer? I'm talking about using a code for pricing info on the slab itself?
Would you do it again? Did you feel "hawked on" by the normal dealers hoping to scalp a newbie?
Other things?
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Comments
Paranoia is best left at home.
Coinstartled...since I have you on "ignore" on the other forum, and you know it, I don't know why you stalk any thread/post of mine over here. Would be best if you just ignored me over here, wouldn't it? No need to reply, just ignore things I post here as you don't add anything of value to the thread (evidenced by the above).
Thank you.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Great questions @Bochiman
Are you contemplating a small table soon?
Best of luck
Boston
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
It probably depends on the state, but in general:
I am a collector and set up at our club's annual regional coin show. I am not treated any differently by the dealers or patrons (who don't know I'm not a professional until I tell them ... and it makes no difference).
@jmlanzaf makes some good points, especially ... you are a dealer (like it or not!
). I will add ... in no order of importance:
Edited to add ... you won't get 'scalped' by the 'normal' dealers if you know your inventory. But be aware that someone will 'cherrypick' you sooner or later.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Even though I'm a dealer, these still apply. (And yes, you are too.)
--Bring water or snacks. The food you bring is probably healthier than what is offered at the show.
--I wear my loupe always and only on a chain/string around my neck. Avoids constantly searching for it.
--Will you have one price for everyone? Or one for dealers, one for collectors? (Wholesale/retail, whatever those are?)
--Will you be prepared to purchase lots offered to you? Everything? If not, what?
--Yes, be polite, but be prepared to say no if necessary.
--It's your table; you make the rules.
--Learn how to get rid of people who want to set up camp and chat.
--If you use a fancy price code, learn how to decode it quickly!
--Asking open-ended questions (what's in the bag? are you enjoying the show? have you found anything interesting today?) is far preferable to the stale "can I show you anything?" which is guaranteed to elicit a "no thanks" response.
--A show is not always about making sales. Sometimes it is about making purchases, or making contacts for future business.
--"I'll be back" means (99.9% of the time) "I won't be back." (Why do people do this? Although, in all fairness, at the last show I did, a fellow did actually come back near quittin' time, and bought three nice toned proofs and wrote a check! You could have knocked me down with a feather!)
Good luck!
Kind regards,
George
The best way to do it is to .....share.....a table with a dealer you know.
I started setting up at shows as a collector. It's actually how I became a dealer. When I 1st started attending coins shows I was an avid darksider. None of the dealers had much interest in world coins. I noticed people bring world coins to sell and if they were lucky they were offered 10 cents on the dollar. So! I started setting up to buy coins for my collection.
As far as how the other dealers will treat you I have only 1 comment" "FRESH MEAT!"
I have been picked over when I have set up at shows. Yep I have been fresh meat.
Ususally i was ill prepared unlike the list of things to consider above.
Im actually setting up again at the PNNA this weekend. World coins to be offered.
I noticed I forgot my loupe and receipt book ! And many of my coins I forgot what I paid for them..
Thst why this is strictly a hobby for me!
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
So, what table will you be at this weekend??
Well known Colonial dealer has a great code - if he wants $35,000 for a coin, the code on the front of the slab is 35001, or something similar. I imagine it saves him a lot of time with the tire kickers.
I still don’t understand why it matters how much you paid for a coin. When you sell your house the buyer doesn’t care if your house has gone up or down in price. If you bought a coin 2 years ago and it has lost half its value the buyer doesn’t care. If you bought a coin that has gone up significantly are you pricing it based on how much you paid or the current value. I guess that’s why I see the same coins collecting dust at shows.
The code is not for 2 year old coins, necessarily. It could be a coin bought that very day. Dealers take a loss all the time on coins, but they do like to keep track of what they have into a coin. And depending on what it is, I might not be in a hurry to sell away a loss.
It is odd that you don't want to hear from dealers who have had experience and know what to expect. Many of us started as collectors and were collectors going into the profession the first time we set up at a local show.
Tomorrow is always another day. Unless you have totally blown it with a purchase, most anything will find a home before too long if you are setting up regularly.
You have to judge the situation. Yes, some people can be time wasters, but sometimes you make connections with advanced collectors who want to know if a perspective dealer knows his stuff and will be worthwhile. I got a lot of want list business through chit chat, and having regualar customers, who have money, is the cornerstone to most dealers' business.
Yes, you have to be prepared from the beginning, have a hard skin and be prepared to the set the rules and say "no."
You really have to watch people who will be grabbing in your case when they flock around you, which will probably happen. That's how some stuff gets stolen.
You have to be aware of what you paid and what the market is. Yes, blowing off "dead stock" for which you paid too much and which is not moving is a good strategy, but you have to keep track what what you did pay alll the time, especially for recent purchases. Sometimes you learn from your mistakes.
I get why you should keep track of how much you paid and purchase price is much more important for recent purchases. But still, if you overpaid for a recent purchase isn’t it better to cut your losses and move on?
I always like this topic.
Every collector daydreams about setting up at a show but I'll bet a very small percentage actually do it.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
Often customer will say he is interested in coin or will be back. Many times they come back especially if price attractive.
However u owe them nothing so if it sells to somebody else his loss. Our u may put it on bottom of stack sorta hold for him. Just be able quickly find it if he comes back.
You will find selling no cakewalk. Your competing for their money with the other dealers in the room. Many of the other dealers low profit high volume operators. With their huge inventories piled like treasure say a bullion dealer they are drawing lots of lookers. At a recent show one had stacks of generic Morgan’s freshly graded at bid plus 10-15 pct. Possibly a huge BU roll estate pickup.
I’m setting up at a 35 table show next month. First time in about 8 or 10 years.
I have a business license for my booth in an antique mall, but I’m doing the show from my personal collection and will not be reporting the sales as part of the business or using my business inventory
The show organizer requires:
I bring my own black tablecloth. All tables must have one
I have to give a door prize worth not less than ten dollars
I provide my own security (it’s a one day show)
I had to join that local club (12.00) as only club members are allowed to sell
I have to bring my own extension cord if I want juice for a light
There will be a back-table for stock and supplies
I’m going to price most items with a visible price on the front., no codes.
I’m trying to sell, so I’m welcoming dealers to come and pick, but I do have a firm bottom on most items.
Well, tomorrow Saturday is our annual , local Community Garage sale in Union Bay, BC, a small town on Vancouver Island and close to C.YQQ ( for the flyboys amongst you). (Comox AF Base)
It takes place in our community hall from 0900-1400. Yes, you are all invited...
I attend with a table every year for years and I am usually the solo table with nice coins.
I take some Canadian coins , mid and low grades and a Laptop. the laptop shows some of my real nice coins.....and people line up to see these.
However, my direct sales are usually between $1 and $ 10 (one -ten) TOTAL
But the contacts made are usually paying off very well a few weeks / months later.
The best ever about 2 months later?? a collection worth to me $ Can 11,000, most in Newfoundland British and Canadian Gold and silver coins. Surprisingly, the seller is a neighbor 5 houses down. he loved the cash
My most moving memory: about 4 years ago a elderly lady was waiting outside the locked door in the cold. She held a purse tightly. she wanted to be the first one to see me. and she was. inside her purse she had another small purse containing a few Silver dollars, including 2 1948 and a 1947 ML. Plus she had some QV (Queen Victoria) coins. Actually all very excellent and sought after coins. I was seriously surprised. When I told her that I offer her $3700 for all of it, she started to cry and was literally shaking. As it turns out May Jane was 84 years old and living alone in a small Basement suit. Rent was coming due and food was scarce. I was concerned about her having all that cash so I asked a friend to stay at my table for a bit and I drove her to her Credit Union 3 minutes away and made sure the $$ got there. (open Saturdays). Mary Jane was the happiest 84 year old I have ever seen. then I drove her home. She told me she was praying for help and hoped her coins would cover the rent. . and it did a few times over
Guess what??? 5 hours later Mary Jane came back to the hall with chocolate chip cookies she baked for me.
Making Connections is what it is all about for me.
I will take a picture tomorrow of my setup and post it.
It is always fun!!!
YQQ
That’s an inspiring post. Thank you
For me, if something sat around for three and four months, and got no "hits," then I'd consider dumping it. If you knew right off the bat you overpaid because maybe your finger ran to the wrong line on the Grey Sheet, you might well blow if off. BUT if you are ready to pull the pug after a couple shows on something for which you did not overpay, your selling figure is too itchy. You don't need a lot of those to be in the hole and out of business.
I've heard of guys who went to show, bought stuff, took it around to the dealers, sold it all and left with cash only. I was never one of those guys, and somehow I think that they might be the stuff of fairy tales.
Just please please pretty please try not to say, "Can I show you something?"
How about. “Whattcha looken for today?”
Bill, I'm very open to hearing from actual dealers who have done shows, particularly small shows, but the reason I wanted to elicit responses from collectors who have done this is that they may call out things that dealers may take for granted. Ie, needing a business license, the bags/change needed, etc.
When someone does something as part of their normal routine/business, the little things may not be thought of. When people try something for the first time, they usually learn (the hard way) what they could have done better/differently.
If the software wasn't currently broken, I would have put a few LIKES on some of the responses above. Sincerely appreciate it.
I don't know if I will end up doing it, but I kind of want to, just to see what it is like and also to possibly sell off some of my accumulation (notice, I didn't call it a "collection" at this point) to people who may enjoy it. Anything from moderns (slabbed SHQs, raw, still in USMint rolls SHQs, SAEs (slabbed and raw)) to raw/slabbed Morgans and half cents. Just a varied bit.
Also, if I did it, I would probably try to partner up with someone I could trust and have fun with at the same time...and who may want to sit there and either sell a few items of theirs or buy if something walks up.
While, technically, if I sold in this fashion, some may consider it becoming " a dealer", my plans wouldn't include really buying anything ... unless it was so cool, or so "needed", I couldn't help it, so, I, personally, wouldn't view myself as a dealer.
Always fun to read the responses.....especially when it comes from experience of having been there.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
AKA Pakasmom
>
Can one even segregate coins in that manner if they are a dealer of any sort?
The best way to do it is to .....share.....a table with a dealer you know.
if you can't do that:
1). get two used showcases if you can them or buy a new one from AllState MFG. --- about $50-75 used, $200 new.
2). four trays for each case, but not necessary. again, used ones or from AllState.
3). Casio printing calculator, HR-8TM, and paper. --- around $20.
4), small scale. --- under $20.
5). a couple satchels(Clarke) or a briefcase and boxes to put everything in.
6). two Bank money pouches, cash in/cash out.
7). GreySheet and any printed price sheets you think you might need.
8). a laptop is very helpful but not necessary.
9). whatever reference(s) you think will help, pads and pens/markers.
10). flips, baggies and assorted supplies that will help keep things organized.
you know what you'll be selling and what you might try to buy. since it's the first show for you the "Vultures" will descend and try to pick you. the better organized you are the more fun you'll have.
one last thing, you'll need the dealer code-word that only you know, 10 letters long.
that's because dealers are evil and only know how to rip off the customers. He's better than a dealer. {end sarcasm}
Again, it depends on what it is. If it's a widget, maybe. If it's a rainbow toned Oregon commem in a 68 CAC holder, I might not mind having it around to spruce up the case and attract eyes.
A collection is usually organized and structured. An accumulation is just miscellaneous stuff that has piled up.
Not in the eyes of the IRS or even most state agencies, I would guess. Of course it is hard for them to track revenue from small shows. Doesn't make it legal, mind you, it just makes it easier to cheat.
A local dealer got in trouble with the county for trying to keep inventory separate for two businesses which had separate DBAs!!! The police were {rightly} suspicious that two sole proprietorships easily allowed someone to pass inventory from one business to another. In his case, his collectibles business would allow him to skirt pawn shop rules on the gold/coin business.
Beware of gypsies.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
For me, since I was the one who said it, I would call my structured half-cents, or IHC proofs, or basically anything else I have put into a registry set, as a collection. I would also call my toned SAEs a collection and some others.
I would call rolls of SHQs that I have (inherited, largely, from my recently deceased mother), rolls of SAEs, rolls of 90% quarters, and a few other things as "accumulation". Either purchased when I had no purpose or just purchased for fun but I don't view them as my collection any longer (if I ever did).
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I would love to do this because no matter how I much I try to convince myself otherwise, I am not cut out to setup at a show.
It would be guaranteed vapor lock. You need to be quick on your feet and be able to crunch numbers on the fly.
Hell, I vapor lock on the other side of the table when looking to buy.
Unfortunately, not many collectors have that close of a relationship with a dealer of fellow collector who does shows..
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
Set up for a few years some years ago. Great learning experience and fun IF you approach it with a light heart.
I am in MD and have been told that I can set up in 2-3 in-state shows/year with no license. I do not know if that's true. I also heard from a small dealer friend that in 20 years dealing he has only once been asked for a license.
Part of me thinks that the "coin show circuit" would be great past-time after I retire from my 'real job'.....and part of me thinks I'd really, really suck at it.
Someday, I'll have to do the one-day internship too, just to find out which...
Years ago, I set up at small comic conventions with my wife as my associate. It was a bit of work, setting up the tables, screens for display, and carting the boxes to and from the show They were all in NYC so at least it was local. I never insured the inventory but at least each graded comic was in a rather large slab.
I loved the shows as I walked the floor often looking to pounce on something I could add to my inventory. In general, I loved buying and selling (especially at the same time).
From time to time , I toy with the idea of setting up at a coin show. I am rather specialized in that I only collect $20 gold. Thus even, if I brought 100 pieces or so I am still dealing with a $100,000 + inventory which can fit into a rather small bag and therefore I wonder about the theft rate? Insurance would be a necessity. I finally decided I'm too old to deal with the risks versus any potential rewards.
@keets offered the kind practical advice I hoped to see in this thread.
@sparky64's comment about #vaporlock on the buy side of the table rings a bell with me.
"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working" Pablo Picasso
For some reason, seeing @Bochiman 's talk here and chatting privately with him, I do believe that he would have the right approach and demeanor.
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
Coin envelopes Zip lock bags, rubberbands, and Small bags.
As a customer I like because it keeps each purchase separate and safe.
BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out
Ziploc bags can draw special customers to a shop.
Price 'em low and watch 'em move. Price 'em high and watch 'em tone.
Real good advice so far.
A few things haven't been mentioned: grading guide, power strip to plug in all of your lights, an adapter for 3 prong to 2 prong (2 prong outlets are still found in some older buildings), small fan, screwdrivers, hand sanitizer, invoices, rubber bands.
If you are carrying your coins in boxes, put rubber bands around each box. Then if a box or its lid is dropped, the coins won't go all over the place. I saw this happen with about 8 2x2 boxes without rubber bands - - that took quite a while to clean up and I don't know if all of the coins were found.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
Lots of good feedback here.
I set up at about a dozen shows in NC until I stopped a few years ago (actually a pause as I intend to start again). I was selling off duplicates, and material I no longer enjoyed. Was also an opportunity to buy, but rarely did so.
1) I did get a NC tax ID - wanted to keep coin business separate from personal. The tax man occasionally checked in at shows - some show organizers require one. Also got a separate bank/checking account and a Square account for the occasional charge, but didn't really advertise that option.
2) I used a spiral notebook to track transactions, but then transferred data to a spreadsheet during slow times. Sometimes you can get quite busy and other times it drags.
3) I tried to price every piece so people could see what I was asking. On the back of the slab was my secret code to remind me what I paid for it. People are impatient, they want instant answers.
4) Was I cherrypicked? I doubt it, but you never know. I think some of the pieces in old green holders got cracked out for possible upgrade.
@keets mentioned a number of items as well.
-Since I normally set up at multi-day shows, I bought a canvas table cover that zipped up at the end of the day. Once locked, it kept things out of sight and a bit secure. Also bought some cheap table cloths from Walmart to cover the back table. I bought black as it doesn't tend to show dirt. Most venues are really not that clean.
Some other thoughts
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
I was concerned about her having all that cash so I asked a friend to stay at my table for a bit and I drove her to her Credit Union 3 minutes away and made sure the $$ got there. (open Saturdays). Mary Jane was the happiest 84 year old I have ever seen. then I drove her home. She told me she was praying for help and hoped her coins would cover the rent. . and it did a few times over
Only in Canada
Just like I predicted. Great info here.
@Cameonut , your post is gold.
This discussion is good because even if me or others never set up at a show, it gives one some appreciation as to what goes into it.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
Used to be 2 but when the ANA came to town it was lobbied and was changed to 3. It was due to the Baltimore show and afterwards the Baltimore show added the summer show. You do have to get a Temp but don't have to get a full blown sales tax account. There are exclusions related to your percentage of sales. If all your sales are in Maryland this does not apply.