For example, "There is no VAM for a 1878 CC Morgan with a DDR" I can only assume there isn't one, There are so many things I don't know, it will take me years of study to come close to 1/10 of the knowledge I experience here on Cu in a day.
@aus3000tin said:
Maybe Heritage should watermark their photos to prevent theft.
Just a thought.
Chris
Unless they put their watermark on the actual coin in the picture, it would not help. They edited the background of the picture, which would have removed the watermark.
(a) Offense defined.--A person is guilty of theft if he intentionally obtains or withholds property of another by deception. A person deceives if he intentionally:
(1) creates or reinforces a false impression, including false impressions as to law, value, intention or other state of mind; but deception as to a person's intention to perform a promise shall not be inferred from the fact alone that he did not subsequently perform the promise;
(2) prevents another from acquiring information which would affect his judgment of a transaction; or
(3) fails to correct a false impression which the deceiver previously created or reinforced, or which the deceiver knows to be influencing another to whom he stands in a fiduciary or confidential relationship.
(b) Exception.--The term "deceive" does not, however, include falsity as to matters having no pecuniary significance, or puffing by statements unlikely to deceive ordinary persons in the group addressed.
Cross References. Section 3922 is referred to in sections 3311, 5708 of this title; sections 5552, 9717 of Title 42 (Judiciary and Judicial Procedure).
@aus3000tin said:
Maybe Heritage should watermark their photos to prevent theft.
Just a thought.
Chris
Good approach, however, I can think of two reasons why this would not move forward.
1. A meaningful watermark would have to cross the coin's image. That would be met with outrage by online bidders. A watermark in a 'non-critical' area would be resolved easily by 2 below.
2. Photoshop (or equivalent).
Numismatist Ordinaire See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Note that these coins referred to by the OP were in fact slabbed, and the guarantee extended by the seller is limited to mere authenticity.
The fraud I would argue comes in where these coins were given XF details, for example, and the seller is calling them AU, all but BU, etc. Cracking them out of slabs with a laundry list of problems and passing them off with no mention of them also sounds fraudulent to me.
Judging by the bids, tho, it looks like the people in the market for these are smarter than the seller(s) gives them credit for.
I recognize that the backstory is “smoke and mirrors “ or BS. The coins listed by the seller in question are, by examples, legit coins for sale with a fictional back story that seems to cleverly skirt legal boundaries.
(b) Exception.--The term "deceive" does not, however, include falsity as to matters having no pecuniary significance, or puffing by statements unlikely to deceive ordinary persons in the group addressed.
I think this is the loop hole!
Key words “exception” “ordinary persons” “does not include falsity”
(Personal note, down with contractions! If you see me using them it is from autocorrect)
Side note:
As adversarial and combative as jmlanzaf can be at times, I tend to think the best and assume they (jmlanzaf) is just a very intelligent “devil’s advocate” or counterpoint specialist. Maybe debate team or legalese speaker?
I thought they just liked to stir up the mix at first, but after being around a while I now assume good intentions with thought provoking responses.
(a) Offense defined.--A person is guilty of theft if he intentionally obtains or withholds property of another by deception. A person deceives if he intentionally:
(1) creates or reinforces a false impression, including false impressions as to law, value, intention or other state of mind; but deception as to a person's intention to perform a promise shall not be inferred from the fact alone that he did not subsequently perform the promise;
(2) prevents another from acquiring information which would affect his judgment of a transaction; or
(3) fails to correct a false impression which the deceiver previously created or reinforced, or which the deceiver knows to be influencing another to whom he stands in a fiduciary or confidential relationship.
(b) Exception.--The term "deceive" does not, however, include falsity as to matters having no pecuniary significance, or puffing by statements unlikely to deceive ordinary persons in the group addressed.
Cross References. Section 3922 is referred to in sections 3311, 5708 of this title; sections 5552, 9717 of Title 42 (Judiciary and Judicial Procedure).
@ifthevamzarockin said: @Edthelorax
"If you really want an Ebay counterfeit listing removed, PM me with the item number and the diagnostics to prove beyond any doubt the item is counterfeit with enough time left to make it happen."
Do you have a special "in" with ebay?
How many listings would you have time to have removed in a day?
Here's you one to practice with 352613487173 it should be quite clear to you it is not genuine, if you need diagnostics feel free to PM.
"We looked everywhere.
Looks like this page is missing. If you still need help, visit our help pages."
@planetsteve said:
Note that these coins referred to by the OP were in fact slabbed, and the guarantee extended by the seller is limited to mere authenticity.
The fraud I would argue comes in where these coins were given XF details, for example, and the seller is calling them AU, all but BU, etc. Cracking them out of slabs with a laundry list of problems and passing them off with no mention of them also sounds fraudulent to me.
Judging by the bids, tho, it looks like the people in the market for these are smarter than the seller(s) gives them credit for.
Slabs are opinions. If I crack out a details coin and it straight grades on resubmission, did I commit fraud.
I don't like what they are doing, but i'm not sure it's fraud.
@planetsteve said:
Note that these coins referred to by the OP were in fact slabbed, and the guarantee extended by the seller is limited to mere authenticity.
The fraud I would argue comes in where these coins were given XF details, for example, and the seller is calling them AU, all but BU, etc. Cracking them out of slabs with a laundry list of problems and passing them off with no mention of them also sounds fraudulent to me.
Judging by the bids, tho, it looks like the people in the market for these are smarter than the seller(s) gives them credit for.
Except there is nothing legally binding in the opinion on the slab. How many people on this board have disagreed with a slab grade and cracked out to resubmit. How many people got a questionable color designation and resubmitted and got a slab.
What he's doing is sleazy, but i'm not sure it qualifies as legal fraud.
Side note:
As adversarial and combative as jmlanzaf can be at times, I tend to think the best and assume they (jmlanzaf) is just a very intelligent “devil’s advocate” or counterpoint specialist. Maybe debate team or legalese speaker?
I thought they just liked to stir up the mix at first, but after being around a while I now assume good intentions with thought provoking responses.
Well, it's a fake. Clearly Chinese made. Here is a pic of an 1885CC sitting on my desk. The reverses are the same.
Same die chip from wing tip to S, same gash on eagle's breast, same random dot of metal over D.
bob
Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
@Wabbit2313 said:
You all can't possibly believe anyone at eBay is going to check diagnostics on coins and then remove them??
I never said that.
Then please tell what you did say and why diagnostics has anything to do with eBay actually removing an auction. They don't even know what that word means. (or care)
@Wabbit2313 said:
You all can't possibly believe anyone at eBay is going to check diagnostics on coins and then remove them??
I never said that.
Then please tell what you did say and why diagnostics has anything to do with eBay actually removing an auction. They don't even know what that word means. (or care)
I did say: provide diagnostics proving a coin is counterfeit and I'll get it removed.
First off let me say your efforts are appreciated.
I have asked 2 times what method of reporting you are using, they say if you ask 3 times without an answer the 4th time you ask you will not get an answer or you will get a lie.
The time it would take to educate you on every die marker for all the counterfeits listed on ebay would be never ending.
If I post an item number for a 1878 CC Morgan and you can't tell it is the wrong reverse (reverse of 79) , maybe we need to take a different approach. ( Sorry not being hard on you )
I have fought with ebay for years & reported hundreds of listings, I will even bid on them when they refuse to take them down. This is not my first rodeo.
you guys are all soooooo right and I like the way you go about it.
However, if some shyster legitimately purchased some items from whomever and paid for them with real legal tender, he can do with them whatever he wants. he can call them whatever he wants, grade them whatever he wants, deface them how he wants... and then call these items whatever he wants, all legitimately as all is in his "own Opinion". He is not under any obligation to even tell anyone where he obtained them or what he paid for them etc...
Even if we could proof without a single daubt that these are the coins he bought from HA, there is nothing legally we can do. It is not fraud to sell your own property. It is not deception if he does not misrepresent the item. he also invent whatever story he wants, as long as the item is not misrepresented. AND, he can ask whatever price he wants.
If someone is dumb enough to pay that price or more, that is not the sellers fault.
we can bitch and lament about it , but all we can do is to let anyone else know who might be interested. However, If HA can proof that these are their images, it is HA who can sue him for a copyright infringement.
There may be something else we all could do:
Together, and with out hosts permission, we could start a blacklist within this forum of sellers and other crooks who deserve to be on that black list. it is not just sellers who are crooks.
I think that would get Ebay and other entities to wake up.
First off let me say your efforts are appreciated.
I have asked 2 times what method of reporting you are using, they say if you ask 3 times without an answer the 4th time you ask you will not get an answer or you will get a lie.
The time it would take to educate you on every die marker for all the counterfeits listed on ebay would be never ending.
If I post an item number for a 1878 CC Morgan and you can't tell it is the wrong reverse (reverse of 79) , maybe we need to take a different approach. ( Sorry not being hard on you )
I have fought with ebay for years & reported hundreds of listings, I will even bid on them when they refuse to take them down. This is not my first rodeo.
Can you imagine then what it would be like trying to learn every die marker for the counterfeits without someone to guide you?
Maybe a different approach would be to provide diagnostics for items you can prove are counterfeits. If I have to do that, why does all the work have to be mine? I already take enough time away from my family and my free time searching for unbeatable deals.
If I disclosed in public how this is done then everyone would be doing it. Someone would eventually abuse it by removing competing listings or for taking revenge on a seller.
We need to band together and fight Ebay to change their handling of their own policy. This "Whack-a-Mole" approach does not cure the disease, it is only treating some of the symptoms.
Thanks for the PM explaining your reporting process. I will shoot you another PM. I wanted to let everyone know you responded to my question. Sorry if anyone took it as me being a jerk or all knowing.
@mapleman said:
Theft by deception is a criminal offence in PA.
What's the theft? If he sells you a coin with a fake backstory, you are still buying and receiving the coin.
I guess intentionally misrepresenting qualifys as deception for gain. Jmo
I'm not sure what the disclosure laws are with regard to coins. As a general rule, crack outs are not illegal.
Per ebay coin listing policy "Include all relevant information that you know about the item, such as origin, date of issue, and condition," and "Include all information about any alterations that may have been made to the item."
Seller told me he bought the coin on ebay. He's been busted and he knows it.
The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong
Per ebay coin listing policy "Include all relevant information that you know about the item, such as origin, date of issue, and condition," and "Include all information about any alterations that may have been made to the item."
Seller told me he bought the coin on ebay. He's been busted and he knows it.
I stand by "sleazy" not illegal.
That is an interesting question. I still don't think there is even an ebay violation. He's offering his "expert" (?) opinion as to country of origin, date and condition. And no alteration has been made to the coin. The SLAB got altered with a vise (LOL), but he's not selling the slab.
@ArizonaRareCoins said:
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
@ArizonaRareCoins said:
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
Actually, he listed it as "near uncirc ?" which is an interesting grade in and of itself.
The other interesting thing about that listing is that because of the retainer in the slab, he had to put a circular mask around the coin which cut off a lot of the edges of the coin. Why anyone would spend $9k on a coin that is clearly circ and when you can't even see the whole coin just boggles my underpaid mind.
@ArizonaRareCoins said:
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
Actually, he listed it as "near uncirc ?" which is an interesting grade in and of itself.
Clearly listed as Uncirculated. (From XF details slab)
@ArizonaRareCoins said:
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
Actually, he listed it as "near uncirc ?" which is an interesting grade in and of itself.
Clearly listed as Uncirculated. (From XF details slab)
.
well, right above where you circled it also says "near uncirc ?"
@ArizonaRareCoins said:
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
Actually, he listed it as "near uncirc ?" which is an interesting grade in and of itself.
Clearly listed as Uncirculated. (From XF details slab)
.
well, right above where you circled it also says "near uncirc ?"
@ArizonaRareCoins said:
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
Actually, he listed it as "near uncirc ?" which is an interesting grade in and of itself.
Clearly listed as Uncirculated. (From XF details slab)
.
well, right above where you circled it also says "near uncirc ?"
He should change the "BU" to "BS"
LOL. I don't disagree. But that's why I'm surprised anyone would pay $9100 for that coin. Although I suppose they can always return it. But seems like it is pretty obviously circ in the photo and only a rich moron would bid
@ArizonaRareCoins said:
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
Actually, he listed it as "near uncirc ?" which is an interesting grade in and of itself.
Clearly listed as Uncirculated. (From XF details slab)
.
well, right above where you circled it also says "near uncirc ?"
He should change the "BU" to "BS"
LOL. I don't disagree. But that's why I'm surprised anyone would pay $9100 for that coin. Although I suppose they can always return it. But seems like it is pretty obviously circ in the photo and only a rich moron would bid
Comments
@ifthevamzarockin funny you picked one from my stomping grounds.> @ifthevamzarockin said:
Definitive diagnostics is a must. I can look and see it's wrong. Prove it to someone that doesn't go by looks.
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
For example, "There is no VAM for a 1878 CC Morgan with a DDR" I can only assume there isn't one, There are so many things I don't know, it will take me years of study to come close to 1/10 of the knowledge I experience here on Cu in a day.
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
What's the theft? If he sells you a coin with a fake backstory, you are still buying and receiving the coin.
I guess intentionally misrepresenting qualifys as deception for gain. Jmo
If it's a consignor then it's not part of the pottery hoard? Either way it's questionable.
Unless they put their watermark on the actual coin in the picture, it would not help. They edited the background of the picture, which would have removed the watermark.
I have been told before on something like this that it is just the seller's opinion that the TPG got it wrong.
I'm sure the half-eagle was mounted with Invisalign and he just couldn't see the mount area once removed.
Looks like his reputation is showing in his feedback.
PA theft by deception statute;
§ 3922. Theft by deception.
(a) Offense defined.--A person is guilty of theft if he intentionally obtains or withholds property of another by deception. A person deceives if he intentionally:
(1) creates or reinforces a false impression, including false impressions as to law, value, intention or other state of mind; but deception as to a person's intention to perform a promise shall not be inferred from the fact alone that he did not subsequently perform the promise;
(2) prevents another from acquiring information which would affect his judgment of a transaction; or
(3) fails to correct a false impression which the deceiver previously created or reinforced, or which the deceiver knows to be influencing another to whom he stands in a fiduciary or confidential relationship.
(b) Exception.--The term "deceive" does not, however, include falsity as to matters having no pecuniary significance, or puffing by statements unlikely to deceive ordinary persons in the group addressed.
Cross References. Section 3922 is referred to in sections 3311, 5708 of this title; sections 5552, 9717 of Title 42 (Judiciary and Judicial Procedure).
Good approach, however, I can think of two reasons why this would not move forward.
1. A meaningful watermark would have to cross the coin's image. That would be met with outrage by online bidders. A watermark in a 'non-critical' area would be resolved easily by 2 below.
2. Photoshop (or equivalent).
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Here's another: 123675337021
That cinder block foundation doesn't look 200 years old, either.
Pick a photo of an older building.
Note that these coins referred to by the OP were in fact slabbed, and the guarantee extended by the seller is limited to mere authenticity.
The fraud I would argue comes in where these coins were given XF details, for example, and the seller is calling them AU, all but BU, etc. Cracking them out of slabs with a laundry list of problems and passing them off with no mention of them also sounds fraudulent to me.
Judging by the bids, tho, it looks like the people in the market for these are smarter than the seller(s) gives them credit for.
I recognize that the backstory is “smoke and mirrors “ or BS. The coins listed by the seller in question are, by examples, legit coins for sale with a fictional back story that seems to cleverly skirt legal boundaries.
I think this is the loop hole!
Key words “exception” “ordinary persons” “does not include falsity”
(Personal note, down with contractions! If you see me using them it is from autocorrect)
Side note:
As adversarial and combative as jmlanzaf can be at times, I tend to think the best and assume they (jmlanzaf) is just a very intelligent “devil’s advocate” or counterpoint specialist. Maybe debate team or legalese speaker?
I thought they just liked to stir up the mix at first, but after being around a while I now assume good intentions with thought provoking responses.
Just my 2¢
Best wishes, and don’t buy that pottery crap!
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistry/publishedset.aspx?s=142753
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
You all can't possibly believe anyone at eBay is going to check diagnostics on coins and then remove them??
I never said that.
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
It is a 1893-CC Morgan. So what?
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
"We looked everywhere.
Looks like this page is missing. If you still need help, visit our help pages."
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
1916_D removed.
Without diagnostics, the Morgans stay.
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
I'm not sure what the disclosure laws are with regard to coins. As a general rule, crack outs are not illegal.
Slabs are opinions. If I crack out a details coin and it straight grades on resubmission, did I commit fraud.
I don't like what they are doing, but i'm not sure it's fraud.
Except there is nothing legally binding in the opinion on the slab. How many people on this board have disagreed with a slab grade and cracked out to resubmit. How many people got a questionable color designation and resubmitted and got a slab.
What he's doing is sleazy, but i'm not sure it qualifies as legal fraud.
You find me argumentative? That's fighting words.
Well, it's a fake. Clearly Chinese made. Here is a pic of an 1885CC sitting on my desk. The reverses are the same.
Same die chip from wing tip to S, same gash on eagle's breast, same random dot of metal over D.
bob
Then please tell what you did say and why diagnostics has anything to do with eBay actually removing an auction. They don't even know what that word means. (or care)
"It's a fake" and "Chinese made" may be clear to you but not to everyone.
Can I use your image?
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
I did say: provide diagnostics proving a coin is counterfeit and I'll get it removed.
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
it is best not to post diagnostic images where the Chinese counterfeiters can see them and repair their mistakes.
Kinda sorry I inadvertently hijacked this thread from moral listing practices to counterfeit coins.
I did request this all be done in PM.
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
Ed,
First off let me say your efforts are appreciated.
I have asked 2 times what method of reporting you are using, they say if you ask 3 times without an answer the 4th time you ask you will not get an answer or you will get a lie.
The time it would take to educate you on every die marker for all the counterfeits listed on ebay would be never ending.
If I post an item number for a 1878 CC Morgan and you can't tell it is the wrong reverse (reverse of 79) , maybe we need to take a different approach. ( Sorry not being hard on you )
I have fought with ebay for years & reported hundreds of listings, I will even bid on them when they refuse to take them down. This is not my first rodeo.
Thank you, great work
you guys are all soooooo right and I like the way you go about it.
However, if some shyster legitimately purchased some items from whomever and paid for them with real legal tender, he can do with them whatever he wants. he can call them whatever he wants, grade them whatever he wants, deface them how he wants... and then call these items whatever he wants, all legitimately as all is in his "own Opinion". He is not under any obligation to even tell anyone where he obtained them or what he paid for them etc...
Even if we could proof without a single daubt that these are the coins he bought from HA, there is nothing legally we can do. It is not fraud to sell your own property. It is not deception if he does not misrepresent the item. he also invent whatever story he wants, as long as the item is not misrepresented. AND, he can ask whatever price he wants.
If someone is dumb enough to pay that price or more, that is not the sellers fault.
we can bitch and lament about it , but all we can do is to let anyone else know who might be interested.
However, If HA can proof that these are their images, it is HA who can sue him for a copyright infringement.
There may be something else we all could do:
Together, and with out hosts permission, we could start a blacklist within this forum of sellers and other crooks who deserve to be on that black list. it is not just sellers who are crooks.
I think that would get Ebay and other entities to wake up.
Can you imagine then what it would be like trying to learn every die marker for the counterfeits without someone to guide you?
Maybe a different approach would be to provide diagnostics for items you can prove are counterfeits. If I have to do that, why does all the work have to be mine? I already take enough time away from my family and my free time searching for unbeatable deals.
If I disclosed in public how this is done then everyone would be doing it. Someone would eventually abuse it by removing competing listings or for taking revenge on a seller.
We need to band together and fight Ebay to change their handling of their own policy. This "Whack-a-Mole" approach does not cure the disease, it is only treating some of the symptoms.
http://www.silverstocker.com
Anyone can PM me Any Time about Any thing.
Ed,
Thanks for the PM explaining your reporting process. I will shoot you another PM. I wanted to let everyone know you responded to my question. Sorry if anyone took it as me being a jerk or all knowing.
Yes, of course you can.
bob
Per ebay coin listing policy "Include all relevant information that you know about the item, such as origin, date of issue, and condition," and "Include all information about any alterations that may have been made to the item."
Seller told me he bought the coin on ebay. He's been busted and he knows it.
The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong
eral rule, crack outs are not illegal.
I stand by "sleazy" not illegal.
That is an interesting question. I still don't think there is even an ebay violation. He's offering his "expert" (?) opinion as to country of origin, date and condition. And no alteration has been made to the coin. The SLAB got altered with a vise (LOL), but he's not selling the slab.
I still think "sleazy" but "legal".
This less than honest seller & the amount of counterfeits on ebay brings two little words to mind.
Caveat Emptor
So, here is a 90cc with the same reverse as the 93cc above.....this one is currently on ebay as well.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1890-CC-Morgan-Silver-Dollar-Carson-City-Mint-AP1057829/153412278473?hash=item23b81598c9:g:EZsAAOSwbmFchvj3
His 200 year old pottery barn find that he bought last month on Heritage for $4800 (1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS XF details repaired) made him $4300 from some sucker on eBay:
1802/1 $2 1/2 gold PCGS-XF REPAIRED $4800 HERITAGE:
https://coins.ha.com/itm/early-quarter-eagles/quarter-eagles/1802-1-2-1-2-bd-2-high-r5-repaired-pcgs-genuine-secure-xf-details/a/1291-5521.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515
1802/1 $2 1/2 gold "NEAR UNCIRC BU MS 3DAY SALE Safe Find of 200 year old store during demo!" $9100 ebay:
https://ebay.com/itm/1802-1-Key-Quarter-Eagle-NEAR-UNCIRC-2-50-Dollar-Liberty-Gold-Real-DEAL-BU-MS-/292987087051?_trksid=p2047675.m43663.l10137&nordt=true&rt=nc&orig_cvip=true
With profits like that, he will never stop perpetrating his scam against the suckers.
He listed is as uncirculated. If someone is stupid enough to believe that, they deserve to lose their money.
Actually, he listed it as "near uncirc ?" which is an interesting grade in and of itself.
The other interesting thing about that listing is that because of the retainer in the slab, he had to put a circular mask around the coin which cut off a lot of the edges of the coin. Why anyone would spend $9k on a coin that is clearly circ and when you can't even see the whole coin just boggles my underpaid mind.
Clearly listed as Uncirculated. (From XF details slab)
.
.
well, right above where you circled it also says "near uncirc ?"
He should change the "BU" to "BS"
LOL. I don't disagree. But that's why I'm surprised anyone would pay $9100 for that coin. Although I suppose they can always return it. But seems like it is pretty obviously circ in the photo and only a rich moron would bid
The buyer sure looks like a shill account to me.
Feedback of 16, 100% of all bid activity with the same seller.
good luck on the return. He'll be in the wind.......> @jmlanzaf said:
372621283481 and 153406603166 are still up.
The 1893cc fake sold for $330.