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1819/8 103a R4+ What do you grade and why?
Sean1990
Posts: 64 ✭✭✭
I am beyond excited to get this piece in hand and will be sending in this week. I currently own an 1819/8 103 Prime (R5) in AU55 and think this will make a nice addition. I personally see 50/53 detail on this coin but the proof like! surfaces and darker but lovely toning dull the luster. The rim ding at o'clock on the reverse concerned me at first but it seems inconsequential seeing how it's minor and only shows on one side. Can't wait to hear your opinions guys! 
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Here are two more angles with less lighting washing it out. Slight iridescent coloring graces this piece when rolled under light.
I don't see the proof like tendencies you reference. The surfaces look weird in the first obverse photo and have an unusual texture. I also don't see a lot of luster which is a concern on a coin with that much meat.
AU details
@cameonut2011 The fields are much nicer in hand. Wish I could post a video to the forum to show the way they react to light. The first pictures definitely don't look great or represent the coin too well. That's what I get for investing in coins instead of a camera
I will say that I am very happy with the price even if it comes back AU details. I, perhaps inaccurately,look at earlier coinage with semi reflectice/smoother fields as proof like compared to the typical lustre I see on most examples. Gotta train myself to avoid that!
It appears to have XF45-ish details. Based on the 2nd set of pics, it may grade, but the 1st pics look kind of weird and cleaned. I personally am not too crazy about it. Just being honest, sorry. It's a desirable variety, though.
Early American Copper, Bust and Seated.
as stated above, I don't see the luster on it, nor the PL surfaces.
Perhaps it is the pictures
BHNC #203
EF Details, altered surfaces. Something just doesn't look right about the surfaces.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Based on the second set of photos, I would say XF45.... Let us know what the TPG labels it. Cheers, RickO
The coin should grade AU 55 . Due to cabinet friction. Now, it's always possible it would grade 58 if you take the coin on balance (all things considered) because it's pretty, original and pretty. Kinda like a "market grade" don't cha think?
I'm so sorry. I didn't read or see the part about a rim ding it may bring it down to 50/53 where you are "IN HAND" thinking, but that mark doesn't bother me. I like that coin.
Without cameras pictures are tough. Lord knows I drive a few folks nuts with my cell phone specials.
I will definitely be updating everyone with the grade or lack there of and providing the Trueview when I receive them in a month or so. I'm pretty happy with this one whether it comes back in XF detail or in a AU straight graded holder.
This is my 1819/8 103 Prime in AU55.
The 1819 O.103 is a tough R4 Die Marriage especially in the late “a” die state with all the die cracks. It’s even tougher, R5, without any of the cracks as you have now.
Here’s my 1819 O.103a PCGS AU53 with all the cool reverse die cracks fully formed and some peripheral rainbow toning.
Please keep us posted how your 103a does at PCGS.
Dave
The OP's coin has excessive marks, close together, all over the obverse. When I see a coin like that I examine it very carefully. While it may have a 55+ amount of wear, it is not choice. IMO, it is not PL either. The light reflecting from the toned surface gives it an "apparent PL" look. I just VF "detailed" one of these today that was lightly buffed.
You guys have posted some amazing coins.
@Insider2 I am noticing the marks you are talking about on the obverse which are much more noticeable in the pictures. Definitely not the choicest example but it will so for my die state study. Definitely not too shabby at the $300 after grading I have invested in it.
@drddm That is an absolutely remarkable example and if you ever sell it I would definitely be interested! That's the kind of coin you don't see every day.....or year!
Is that a scratch on the reverse?
I don’t see how you guys can give this coin an EF sharpness grade given level of detail and the overall degradation and “grade-flation” which has lowered the EF standards. The coin has AU-55 detail, but something disturbs me about the field surfaces in the first few photos. I can’t quite put my finger on it, it’s a lightly grainy look that does not seem to be quit right.
No, it’s a mark that was in the die when the coin was struck.
It's a die crack and characteristic of the 'a' die state, but from the lighting in some of the images it does look like a scratch. This die state is neat because of the 'near terminal' die cracks on the reverse.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
I have a O-103 in XF, but I guess I should re-check the reverse
BHNC #203
altered surfaces, genuine not gradeable.