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Would you pay less for a collection if you found out the owner committed suicide?
abcde12345
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I know in purchasing property or homes it must be disclosed if someone in that home was murdered or had committed suicide. Should the same be told to a potential buyer of a coin collection?
Any experiences?
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Comments
I'm considering suicide after opening this thread.
I'd probably want to pay more to help out, but it really wouldn't make a difference to how I'd value the collection.
Depends on a lot of circumstances. Serious collector, dealer, small side hobby and on and on. Never thought about it.
Some states require such disclosure when selling real property and a lot do not. No disclosure here in NV but there was in CO (I was licensed in both states at one time, long long ago).
I would not discount it. Makes no difference to the next buyer. How many coins are on the market today or owned in collections today from sellers that did not die of natural causes? I think the number would be quite large.
bob
I don't understand how those two things are correlated.
Gobrecht's Engraved Mature Head Large Cent Model
https://www.instagram.com/rexrarities/?hl=en
Wanting to make sure your new coins are not haunted.
Cause the house would be haunted and the Ghostbusters are not available. Peace Roy
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Are the coins haunted?
Unless they somehow used the coins to commit suicide (or murder) it is not a factor.
My house is over 200 years old - I am sure a lot of things happened there. If the walls could talk I probably would not want to listen...
Coins recovered from shipwrecks, Concentration Camp scrip, Japanese Invasion Money, WWII German military currency - on and on. A lot of what is collected was witness to some horrible things.
Wouldn't pay less.
Who cares?
Let's use an 1850 coin as an example. If the coin was collected it's whole life, a number of owners have passed over the decades.
The current owner is nothing more than a custodian until passed to the next collector.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
Coins were used to cover the eyes of the deceased in some cases. I don't know if they were always buried with the body or not, and I wonder if there are any in collections that are KNOWN to have been used this way.
I often wondered if anyone that has a shekel of Tyre actually has one the 30? Those must have went somewhere?
It's irrational to connect tangible objects with the unstable or tragic fate of an individual. However if I had a say in it, I would have a good chunk of the proceeds going to a charity.
If the collector committed suicide after trying to sell the collection ...
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Yes, but only if he left a note saying he just couldn't take looking at his collection any longer.
Dave
And while we're at it, unless your gold or silver bullion coins are from newly mined metal, there is no telling where the bullion has been over the years/decades/centuries.
This is a very strange question.
Agree; disclosure is a state by state decision.
It sounds like a good excuse to try to get the coins cheap but I think there is someone who'd outbid you.
"A dog breaks your heart only one time and that is when they pass on". Unknown
Of course I would pay less.
I would rub the mustard stains off of my best leisure suit and beat feet over to the deceased's abode.
Upon arrival, I would then show the family my well worn blue book (minus the front cover with the date) that proves my offer will be fair.
I would do my best to assuage the grief of the bereaved by assuring them that my offer was the best they could hope for.
Accepting my offer would relieve them of the burden and pain associated with all of the fond memories of their loved one as they undo his time, effort, and life as a collector. But they will only have to do it once rather than shop this collection around.
I would then decrement the blue book number by at least 40%.
Is this question legitimate?
About as legitimate as your answer.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
Neither do I. Go figure.
Pete
Only if the coins still had the blood stains on them,,,,,,,,
Your are buying coins not the history is a good idea
Dang! You snagged my response! Why do you think there were grave robbers? There are certainly a few Large Cents floating around that came from a protected 6 feet under!
I agree. I hope it is more of the OP's history of off humor and not something dark.
To answer the question, as long as there are no blood stains on the coin, it shouldn't affect the value.
It's amazing this thread has generated this many comments.
The fingerprints of all coin dealers should be entered into a database that is searchable by detectives.
Reminds me of that old joke...
What's the difference between a lawyer and a coin dealer?
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Lawyers chase ambulances, coin dealers chase hearses.
My Saint Set
hah hah...best laugh today!!
If there was a choice along with agree, like, etc labeled “Blow up this thread” I would punch it.
Isn't the back story, good or bad, part of the allure of collecting? An interesting coin is like an interesting woman...both have a history.
I deal in early Ford Mustang parts, and I have bought cars that were fatal accidents. Long ago, cars were not "cleaned" of organics, so it was just a fact of life dealing with parts. The picture below is a car I bought a few months ago. The front of the car is on the trailer behind the rest of the car, literally torn off in a high speed accident, the forum decorum will leave unstated the result.
and the educational value here is???
I am a full time real estate broker in Hawaii. Suicides need to be disclosed. Buyer will pay less for suicide homes. Surprisingly they will discount much more if the person died IN THE UNIT from an suicide overdose vs someone jumping off the lanai and dying NOT IN THE UNIT.
Slabbing is often discussed here.
Sounding like a typical coin dealer.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
That's a new one for me.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
Frankly it doesn't matter to me. Who knows what happened to the former owns of the coins that we have? If the coin is dated from the early 1900s and before, we know that they are all dead.
If you are uneasy about buying any coin that had a former owner who committed suicide, run away from any piece that lists Waldo Newcomer as a former owner. He had a wonderful collection, and he committed suicide.
I must say that this is a bit of an odd question.
I would buy the coins at a fair market price if the coins were up my alley. Otherwise, I would recommend that the heirs go to another venue that would buy things like wheat pennies, silver eagles, proof sets, etc.
Keep in mind that the heirs are most likely deeply hurt by the loss of their loved one. No way would I want to rip them off.
Debbie Downer thread of the year.
PCGS is expected to announce a spiritual conservation service at FUN, so I wouldn't worry about it.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars
No.
Wanting to make sure your new coins are not haunted.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
It makes no difference to me... coins, cars, firearms, houses... I could care less if anyone died owning, in or using any of them.... No such thing as ghosts or haunts or spirits ... I will buy the product for the best price I can get. Cheers, RickO
I have known people who have contemplated, attempted, and succeeded due to the stressors of my former occupation. This topic is depressing.
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Happy Thanksgiving!
_No such thing as ghosts or haunts or spirits _
You've obviously never heard of the Bradley mansion in Denver.
Dr. Bradley pioneered the so-called Bradley method of child-birth and delivered our youngest son in 1976. I visited the Bradley mansion with my wife on several occasions. Ceci, my wife, worked for Dr. Bradley as a housekeeper for a time before i knew her. Dr. Bradley told Ceci some of the stories of haunting that you will see in the article below. Article somewhat lengthy but since some will not click on links, i decided to publish the article in its entirety here.
I saw who i am convinced was Ethel on one of my visits there for child-birth classes with my wife.
This immense 20 room mansion was originally built in 1920, by a wealthy family for their daughter, and spared no expense. The daughter, Ethel, lived in this mansion, that she dearly loved, with both her husbands. After her second husband died, she continued to live there for another 20 years.
When she died, it really fell into disrepair, abandoned by all, until Dr. Bradley & family saw it, and fell in love with this unique mansion. Described as a “hulking, deserted, white elephant”, vandals had taken over and had trashed the inside, and had broken over 100 windows. Despite its disastrous shape, the Bradleys felt “a quiet feeling of security there”, and bought this ultimate fixer-upper opportunity. They immediately started a massive restoration project, to bring the Bradmar Tudor Manor back into mint condition, sparing no time or expense, in a similar attitude/manner as the original builders had felt.
The manor’s bricks were of the finest quality, imported from England, as were the gigantic hinges on the 3 inch thick, solid oak doors. The drawing room has 30 ft long timber beams, 15 inches deep, & 18 inches high. This mansion has a great hall, with a marble floor & offshoot halls, which divide/separate the mansion into 2 complete wings, which are connected on the second floor, by a balcony, that crosses between the stair cases. Dr. & Mrs. Bradley claimed the suites in the second floor wing, which are over the first floor drawing room and solarium. The wing on the other side of the great hall has on the first floor, the library, dining room, butler’s pantry and kitchen. Over these rooms, on the second floor, are the guest rooms.
On the first floor, past the kitchen, one can find the breakfast room, utility rooms, halls, and finally the back entrance. The Bradleys’ 3 teenage sons lived in the old servants’ quarters located above these back rooms.
One of the first incidents experienced had the purpose of letting the living know that they had unseen house mates. While the floors were being sanded, when they first moved in, all were sleeping in Dr. & Mrs. Bradleys’ suites, way in front of the manor. The interior decorator, Mrs. Bradley’s cousin, who was living with them, was awakened by the slamming of the back door, that was downstairs, clear in the other wing. The slamming door, echoing throughout the manor, had been carefully locked, as had all the other doors. Concerned, the interior decorator started to hear the shuffling sound of bedroom slippers, that older women like to wear. He went to the balcony, to see if anyone was in the great hall below. The moonlight from the undraped windows shown brightly upon the marble floor, making it very bright, and easy to see clearly in the hall.
When the shuffling entered the great hall, he felt a tingling sensation/chill of the unseen presence. Feeling afraid, he bellowed at the unseen entity, “Ethel, if what I’m doing to the house isn’t satisfactory, you better tell me, before it’s too late!” The shuffling stopped, so he went back to bed, a little shaken. While lying there on his bed, he heard the shuffling start up again, going toward the back door, and then heard the slamming of the door once again.
Some unseen entity wasn’t pleased at first about the fact that electricity was being restored. When the electrician was putting in new wiring, some entity kept foiling his attempts, even undoing the braided cable, that was carefully, and expertly fed through the conduit, and properly connected.
From the beginning the electricity and bell system seemed to have “a life of its own.” Lights would go on and off at will; sometimes with self- moving light switches, sometimes not. Bells sounded in the middle of the night, which included the maid’s bell in the kitchen as well. Sometimes at night, the family heard footsteps walking throughout the house, with the lights going on and off, as the footsteps traveled from room to room. The wiring was checked, but nothing was found to be amiss.
Lights in the chandelier in the library would flare up brightly, as if to agree with a point made in conversation.
A psychic friend of the Bradleys was visiting with them in the library. As soon as she walked in, the lights “practically danced,” flaring up bright, then dimming, then flaring right back up . After she left, the lights calmed down.
Before going to work one early morning, Dr. Bradley went to the drawing room to light his cigar with the weighted, bulky metallic lighter on the table. Imagine his surprise, when the lighter gently arose by itself up in the air, and floated slowly through the air, landing softly about a foot away on its side, without making a sound.
A massive, heavy bronze chandelier which hung in the great hall, bobbed up and down on its long chain, sometimes as hard as it could go. The Bradleys had reinforced the ceiling clasp, so it won’t jerk itself lose.
While practicing on the baby grand piano in the drawing room, the youngest son, was surprised to see the top 4 keys in the right hand being played without any help from him.
Mrs. Bradley looked into her purse for a handkerchief she knew she had put in it. She closed the purse, and opened it again, to find 3 green, plastic mermaids, about 2 inches high, lying on top of her missing handkerchief.
While raking trash in the front yard, the Bradleys’ middle son saw out of the corner of his eye, a thing floating very slowly through the air, softly landing on the ground. It was a green apple tied to a wire, described as a very weird object. There was no place that it could’ve come from normally.
The Bradleys had really particular tastes when it came to Christmas decorations; only the first-rate, top-notch ones would do. When getting Christmas decorations down from the attic, they found an unknown box, labeled Halloween Lollipops, and inside there were 6 crudely made pottery angels, who were inelegant, fat, and dumpy; not the sort of thing the Bradleys would ever consider purchasing. When a friend of theirs, pointed out to them, that the angels looked pregnant, the Bradleys’ attitude changed toward these unattractive angels, as Dr. Bradley was an obstetrician.
When the problems with the lights were first happening, Dr. Bradley had a meeting with a famous medium, Arthur Ford, at Ford’s home. This medium went into a trance, and told him that an elderly couple had lived by themselves for a long time in the mansion. As she liked the place to be completely dark, the wife kept all the blinds pulled over the manor’s many windows, keeping everything in the dark. When her husband would have enough of living in the dark, he would angrily go all over the mansion, snapping on the lights. But she would follow right behind him, snapping the lights off again. The medium told Dr. Bradley that they were still doing it. After this meeting, the Bradleys invited the former head housekeeper over for a visit. She immediately noticed how bright and sunny the inside of the manor was, and told how her former mistress insisted on having a dark house.
As mentioned before, the Bradleys had kept careful records of all the incidents, and had discovered that overtime something out of the established pattern happened, it meant that something was about to happen. The following two examples make this point.
When Mrs. Bradley heard big explosive sounds coming from her cabinets at night, she knew that the next day was going to be a lulu.
After the lights had come on by themselves 5 mornings in a row, at 4:30 a.m., the Bradley boys became very ill, but they did recover.
It seems that the spirits of the former owners became fond of the Bradleys, despite their annoying love of having a bright home, instead of a dark one. The Bradleys loved Woodburn Manor, as much as the former owners, which must have endeared the whole family to these entities, who had chosen to remain, and participate in their lives, while watching over them at the same time.
Dr. Bradley did write a book about their experiences, called Psychic Phenomena: Revelations and Experiences, which expounds on his personal theories.
Yes, the entities of Ethyl and Hubert Work are still haunting the place. Dr. Bradley sold the mansion in 1980. The people who bought it didn’t stay long, but the mansion is now owned by people willing to live with eccentric ghosts.
The property was sold to a private golf club that is mostly open during the day and early evening, leaving the home to the spirits at night.
https://ghost.hauntedhouses.com/colorado_denver_bradmar_tudor_manor#
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
No - Not a factor for me.
Coins usually have previous owners too one would go nuts.....