PCGS RESTORATION EXPERIENCE AND RESULTS 1921 PEACE DOLLAR (CAC) approved
Peace_dollar88
Posts: 1,220 ✭✭✭✭✭
I have never used PCGS restoration service. I have submitted several coins to them. A few months ago I posted a guess the grade on this forum on a new 1921 Peace Dollar I had acquired. It was darker in color. Had some PVC growth that could be seen under magnification. @Broadstruck recommended I take care of it quick. It was housed in a PCGS holder as a AU58. So I decided to send it in to PCGS to have them restore it. (I know people dip their own coins and send them in. Having no experience doing that I didn't want to mess anything up even though it is not a very expensive or rare coin.)
here is the before pictures.
I sent the coin in and it was signed for by PCGS on April 26th. on May 2nd PCGS reached out to me by phone saying that I didn't check one of the boxes on the submission form. That was my bad, and I figured it would delay the process a bit.
I then received a email on May 7th saying my coin was received and was in process.
May 30th I received an email saying the grades are available. Looks liked it shipped out today.
I was really impressed in the turnaround time. looks like all of my concerns were addressed. The coin looks phenomenal to me. It went from a AU58 to a MS62. I also paid to have the VAM 1H attribution.
I wanted to give a shout out to a fellow board member @broadstruck to encourage to get the PVC taken care of. Also wanted to thank PCGS for there service and @PCGSPhoto for the phenomenal Truviews. Had a great experience.
Comments
looks very nice and a picture to boot. Jumped 2 grades after they gave her a peel.
Glad your happy with the results.
Best place to buy !
Bronze Associate member
Great results, congrats
BHNC #203
Looks like you made a good decision. Looks great!
Much better eye-appeal!
Sweet, congratulations !!!
Awesome!!
My YouTube Channel
Wow, it looks so much nicer!
Do you mind if I ask what the breakdown in fees were to have it conserved?
Looks really nice! How much was the service? How long did it take?
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Great looking coin, and great work by PCGS!
You picked a good candidate. Great results.
The coin has not changed except for some superficial debris/tarnish removal. Therefore, the coin cannot be once "AU" now "MS-62." You paid for cleaning and the TPG gave you a bonus "grade inflation" up-grade. (Kind of like when Motel 6 moves you from the room with large rats next to the freeway to the deluxe room with mice next to the dumpsters.)
Enjoy your good fortune.
Great looking coin. I'm still trying to understand how it went from AU (some wear) to MS (no wear). I guess the restorers really did restore your coin.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
Gold Shield - $5
Variety Attribution - $18
Restoration - $30
Handling fee - $10
Return shipping - $23.05
Total cost - $86.05
@oih82w8 about one month. @gtstang
58 to 62? Looks like gradeflation is alive and well.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
The coin looks nice and PCGS did a good job on the restoration, but looking at the hair I think they got it right the first time.
It looks like they are speeding up in their conservation department, and I have always liked their work better than the leading competitor, their chemicals must be better too with those aesthetic results.
I recently sold this 1921 Peace dollar that was darkly toned, he had called it XF; I dipped it in EZest for a few seconds and got decent results:
Cost: $10 grading fee, and return shipping on that invoice group was gratis usps due to shipping delays.
AU to MS?
I have a ugly AU58 that I would like to have fixed but it's in a Everyman set and I don't want to get another.
I'm thinking that toned puppy could easily bump up some points well into the Unc. territory with the right type of restoration by today's friendly and jubilant grading standards.
Well played
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Well, it’s a nice coin and it looks better now than before, but I guess we all finally and officially have to toss the idea that wear precludes an MS grade.
Oh look we did a great job , even if we do say so ourselves. Besides which , couldn't you have sold it to some nimrod with an "everyman" set , then bought a 62 for less money if thats the grade you wanted?
Correct me if I'm wrong.....
But I'm assuming the intent of sending it to restoration was to remove the PVC, and preserve the coin. The upgrade, while a surprise, wasn't the intent.
So the indignant "why didn't you sell it and BUY a 62?" question seems pretty silly.
I had a remarkably similar turn around on a 3-cent nickel recently. Sent it in for PVC, got it back upgraded from 55 to 62. Go figure.
That would be 3 grades! 58-60-61-62!
Nice restoration work...and a nice Peace dollar.... I have been looking (not very diligently) for one like that... I just like the '21 Peace.... Cheers, RickO
Perhaps you should try reconsideration for plus only? See if the people at PCGS customer service can help you out with a method to get it conserved while it is being reconsidered for that plus grade.
I understand your concern regarding the PVC, an acetone dip might have removed it. Regardless, spending $86.05 to conserve (Dip) a 1921 Peace dollar graded AU-58 doesn't make sense to me unless I was convinced the coin was way under-graded. Fortunately this time it worked out because they rewarded you with a 3 point upgrade.
I agree with BryceM and RogerB. Recently I emailed DH and suggested he modify their mint state definition to reflect the fact that they are grading coins with light wear mint state. Other grading companies are doing this as well, right or wrong it's today's reality and it's not new. Currently their mint state definition includes the words "No wear".
News flash: The abolishment of "NO TRACE OF WEAR" for Mint State coins was going on years before 1986 (an important date in numismatic history) It to Q. David to actually put this fact into plain English years later when the First Ed of his grading guide was published.! Generations have grown up with this situation and its not going to change.
@shish I was in it pretty good. I wanted one with a 1H attribution which I got. I wouldn't have sent it in for restore if it wasn't for the vam.
Insider I understand your point, as I said this is not new, although it's more prevalent in my opinion. I Agree that it's not going to change, why not be accurate and modify the definition?
It hinges on the meaning of the word "wear": https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/wear
If the coin has not circulated and has most of the attributes of a new coin, why should it grade less than MS60 unless the issue is obvious? Stacking friction, cabinet friction, bag marks.
Oh I know it's been going on for a long time. It's just time to drop the pretense.
4 grades.
Though not used, 59 is a grade, a "place-holder" if you will. MS 61, 62, 63, 64, 66 weren't used either, but there wasn't a one-grade jump from MS60 to MS65.
Note that I agreed with your post as soon as you posted it.
AFAIK, this member has provided an example of one of the "newcomers" who were not around to witness the "Old Standard" of the past. Back then, there were no Kool-Aid terms such as "stacking friction, cabinet friction, or roll rub," As folks became more knowledgeable about the sources of luster lost from friction, they became useful. Unfortunately, these terms became abused to the extent that they are very often substitutes for describing a mid-range AU coin.
A coin that has a weak strike can appear to be worn when it is not. When tarnished it may obscure that it is in fact the strike that is the issue. This is why a coin can change from "AU" to "MS" after conservation - it really was MS but was incorrectly designated as AU. This is also what AU58/MS61/MS62 sliders are in general - coins that have weak elements that are difficult to distinguish as being due to strike or wear.
Gobrecht's Engraved Mature Head Large Cent Model
https://www.instagram.com/rexrarities/?hl=en
Here is an example of a "Bad" attempt at conservation:
A dummy wanted to save money and tried to remove the black corrosion spots from this 1921. Too bad, as now he is left with a "details" coin. If properly done at a Conservation Service, the result should have been virtually undetectable!
can you zoooooom in a bit more ?
LOL, I'm a details sort of guy.
I get paid to detect things on coins that should not be on them.
Then the "commercial graders" determine if what I saw affects the coin's final grade or not.
It's fun either catching the weasels trying to get over on us or helping unformed collectors to become better numismatists.
Do you own a 16X hand lens?
Well said! Experience is a great teacher.
"Back then, there were no Kool-Aid terms such as "stacking friction, cabinet friction, or roll rub," As folks became more knowledgeable about the sources of luster lost from friction, they became useful. Unfortunately, these terms became abused to the extent that they are very often substitutes for describing a mid-range AU coin."
Entirely false. A pathetic means of self-deception and overt greed-promotion. Raw coprolite.
Your welcome & congrats!
Major improvement as I forgot it originally looked homely with negative eye appeal.
Absolutely true! Curious, what grading company or coin dealership were you working for before 1986 to make that claim. How many coin shows were you attending a year?
Deliberate misrepresentation and distortion does not express truth or reality.
One can maintain truthful standards, or succumb to the lies.
The grading standard did not change. The application of the standard did change. Long ago.
Looks great, reasonable fees except for high shipping cost.
They did a great job imo. Sometimes the crud is covering up a bag of horrors. All in all, restoration is left to the pros. At least one has some recourse with our hosts. Find a covered up horror story on your own, and it is all yours. If there is a problem-such as pvc-and it can be stopped, and or 'saved', I have no problem paying an expert for their opinion.
Agreed. The $23.05 return shipping did strike me as being high. Would not have paid much attention, except for the regular bashing given Heritage on their shipping which is less. One can also figure in shipping charges in, along with the buyers' premium into what one is willing to pay for a coin.
It's a little late in the thread, but we must all remember only the OP has seen the coin raw and in person. It is possible the original TPG was incorrect, or that the 2nd pass-through was incorrect - or both. Objectively, the coin cannot be both "AU" and "Uncirculated" simultaneously. (See the oft-mentioned Schrodinger's Cat paradox; neither coin nor cat are quantum objects.)
My personal position is to follow a fixed set of standards as accurately and consistently as possible - regardless of any other stated opinion. The "grade" is the same regardless of the 'rarity' of any particular coin. The market, and only the free market, establishes the "value" of any specific piece.
I just sent a in relatively expensive Buffalo for restoration. Logged in two days ago. Hopefully they can help it.
Collector, occasional seller
@RogerB said: "My personal position is to follow a fixed set of standards as accurately and consistently as possible - regardless of any other stated opinion. The "grade" is the same regardless of the 'rarity' of any particular coin. The market, and only the free market, establishes the "value" of any specific piece."
You have just described the "Technical Grading System" as originally devised in 1972 for internal use and then used at the first TPGS - INSAB Grade the coin and let the market put a price on it. Today, when a coin is "detailed" that is similar to our old technical system as long as the coin is not net graded at the same time.