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1864 O-FR Cap and Rays 8 reales NGC 67
Greig
Posts: 89 ✭✭
For the Mexican collectors (and anyone with an eye for remarkable mint state coins):
Stacks Bowers is auctioning one of only 6 Mexican Cap and Rays 8 reales that NGC has graded at MS67: a 1864 O FR. The coin is also WINGS approved. I hope someone more skilled than I am can link the auction lot (No. 30103 of the forthcoming December 2014 Macau sale) in a post.
Stacks is also selling an NGC 66 1875 Go FR Cap and Rays 8 reales as the next lot in the same auction (also WINGS approved).
Our hosts have never graded a Cap and Rays 8 reales as MS 67; only one at MS 66+ and 27 others at MS 66.
I wonder if the 1864 O FR would cross? It is a strikingly beautiful coin and I expect it will approach $10K.
Sadly, not my $10K...
Stacks Bowers is auctioning one of only 6 Mexican Cap and Rays 8 reales that NGC has graded at MS67: a 1864 O FR. The coin is also WINGS approved. I hope someone more skilled than I am can link the auction lot (No. 30103 of the forthcoming December 2014 Macau sale) in a post.
Stacks is also selling an NGC 66 1875 Go FR Cap and Rays 8 reales as the next lot in the same auction (also WINGS approved).
Our hosts have never graded a Cap and Rays 8 reales as MS 67; only one at MS 66+ and 27 others at MS 66.
I wonder if the 1864 O FR would cross? It is a strikingly beautiful coin and I expect it will approach $10K.
Sadly, not my $10K...
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Here they are:
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I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Highly enthusiastic about world coins, contemporary circulating counterfeits and unusual stuff
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Latin American Collection
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The 1875 is attractive, but I thought it had too much chatter under the toning to make the grade. Obviously, I was wrong.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
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Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
<< <i>I would have suspected a higher hammer for this one. A later date from the 1890s I would place in the $4500-5500 range in 67. >>
Seems to suggest that there were some questions about if this was a true 67.
Latin American Collection
bingo!
Was told it’s a 66 in pcgs - and who cares if its wings approved? - I just noticed that - like really?
Proves they were wrong here - big time! Hehe
Andy you were NOT wrong on the 1875 – I question that grade too - why would you second guess your opinion?
oh hmm that one has a wings sticky too
Yes I love them both - they are equally spectacular but that's besides the point.
P.S. trying to generate some fireworks here
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
I picked this one up this year.
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
@bidask, what is on the leg of the eagle? Just toning?
Yes
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Thank you @bidask , fabulous coin.
I picked up this date earlier this year also in NGC 66. I don't know if this will cross, but I would love to get it into a PCGS 66 holder. I just have the Heritage images for now.
Jeff
Jeff, beautiful coin! From the same dies as the OP coin it looks like. Wonder if there was a mini board of this date?
Are the marks through the rays and the cap all pre-strike? Hard to tell from the pics.
Thanks @scubafuel !!!
The originally posted coin and mine both have that bold and complete die crack from the rim going right alongside the B and ending at the eagle's wing. Now bidask's coin looks (to me) to have the beginnings of that crack going from the rim to the top of the B. Now the originally posted coin also looks to have faint clashing on the reverse showing show rays from the obverse in the same general area of the die crack. Now I'm no die stage expert, but could we say here that the images shown represent an early-mid die state, then a mid-late die state and then finally a late die state?
The marks on the obverse of my coin, three or four prominent ones at the lower end of the cap and rays I have always assumed were pre-strike adjustment marks. But, I'll admit that I have seen a lot of coinage with adjustment marks...I know late 18th century larger US silver issues were know for adjustment marks. If NGC determined they were post mint damage, then the 66 grade would have been a no go. The other thing, and perhaps @Abuelo can weigh in, I remember reading in Resplandores that Oaxaca was very particular about their planchet weights and as a result so many of the Oaxaca 8 reales show adjustment marks.
Resplandores also stated that their were two Oaxaca mints, one which turned out really nice coins. The coins in this post must have come from that Oaxaca mint. I don't have the reference with me now, but much information is given regarding the two Oaxaca mints that operated 1861-1864.
Jeff
Yes, Resplandores hypothesized that there are 2 mints. I do not know if that was ever proved. One needs to remember than in the early 1860s Oaxaca was a small village, at best, and frequent target of both, the end of the War of 3 Years as well as the French Invasion. Do I believe there were 2 mints? I do not know but I would be shocked given the size of the village. I would not be surprised if sometime, they got new equipment in the one, and both minted at the same time. Overall, I am always surprised that Oaxaca was able to mint anything, period. And quality pieces? That is what is beyond my understanding. But the 8 reales from Oaxaca can be very interesting, and occasionally very nice.
Coincidentally, Mexican Coin Company has right now an interesting selection of 8 reales oaxaqueños.
Very nice examples here!
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Our MS-65 appears to be from the same die pair as well.
https://www.civitasgalleries.com
New coins listed monthly!
Josh Moran
CIVITAS Galleries, Ltd.
@CIVITAS Very nice, CIVITAS. There is that bold die crack again!
Disappointing season in Mad Town, eh? (I live in Waukesha.)
Jeff
Could not find that coin on your website ?
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Dan, try this link
civitasgalleries.com/cgi/store/commerce.cgi?product=World_Coins&keywords=mexico+1864+oaxaca&search_request_button=+Search+
https://www.civitasgalleries.com
New coins listed monthly!
Josh Moran
CIVITAS Galleries, Ltd.