$10 indian in fake pcgs rattler holder

steveben · January 2, 2012 11:34PM

i go into this coin store in charleston, sc. they have a 1932 $10 indian in an old rattler holder graded ms63 along side a 1904 $20 coin also in an old rattler holder graded ms63 as well. i ask to see both.

on the indian, i notice a big copper spot at 6 o'clock on the reverse. also the eagle's bust and wing look really worn...no luster left at all. the obverse is 58 at best, but better than the reverse by at least 8. i am thinking why is this 63????

then, i look at the $20 and it looks about like what i would expect.

i look at the $10 again...he wants $1,295...way below pcgs value for that grade. however, i still don't agree with the 63 grade at all. then, upon closer inspection, i notice a small crack in the holder that is unusual near 6 o'clock on the coin. then it hits me to check the counterfeit diagnostics for a rattler holder. the serifs are wrong, the spacing is wrong...it's fake! no doubt about it...especially when there's a real rattler, the $20, right beside it for comparison. it's label is completely legit.

so, i show the guy helping me the diagnostics and he compares the two holders.

<he> says: yeah.
 say: that's not a real holder (pointing to the $10)
<he>: we're still pricing like it is (in a very defensive voice as he somewhat recoils)
: sorry, i'm not trying to cause trouble or anything, i am just pointing out something
<silence>
: ok, well thanks for showing those to me.
<he>: sure.
: great. i didn't mean any offense by pointing that out.
<he>: none taken. i'll be sure to point that out to the numismatist when he returns.
: i can email you a link to a web page that shows what i am talking about, if you want.
<he>: no, i am sure he knows about it.

he puts both coins back in the display case and i leave. so, if the numismatist knows about it...then why did he put it in the case to begin with? buyer beware i suppose.

thanks to condor101's thread.

and the advice of all those who preach learning to grade coins yourself and never buy the holder, only the coin.

also...watch out for coins in charleston sc! do your homework before you buy

Yukoncornelius1 · January 2, 2012 11:38PM

One of two things going on here, either he or someone at the store bought the coin for 63 money or he got the coin dirt cheap and wants to make some good money on it.

STONE · January 2, 2012 11:42PM

So was the $10 Indian fake too, from what you could tell?

If so, you should really contact the police/authorities since the dealer may have been selling counterfeited money and was committing fraud by not disclosing the fake slab!

steveben · January 2, 2012 11:46PM

well, i don't think it's a fake indian. i should point that out...but i would be suspect of it until i could get it out of the holder and weigh and measure it, just because of the circumstances. assuming the coin is real, it would be worth only bullion value based on it's condition and the common date.

also, i forgot to mention that the price tag on the back read $1550 (about pcgs value)...but i was quoted $1295. the actual value that day was $750.

libertydude · January 3, 2012 12:07AM

Thanks for sharing this valuable information. The link to condor101's thread. is extremely informative for a noob like me

ricko · January 3, 2012 12:35AM

If you go back tomorrow, I would bet it is still there, still for sale at the same price. Then you will know it is a definite con job. Cheers, RickO

OldEastside · January 3, 2012 1:27AM

Ya I found condor101's thread last week when they were talking
about the new pronged holder and I came away a more knowlegable
person, I wish they would let him back here.

Steve

$10 indian in fake pcgs rattler holder

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