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Are approval buyers less serious than payment first buyers?
RYK
Posts: 35,800 ✭✭✭✭✭
I think the answer to the question posed in the title of the thread is "Sometimes."
My response to another thread got me thinking, and perhaps dealer forum members can give their perspective, too.
The background is that I have heard dealers complain about people who return lots of coins, and these are often people who are receiving the coin on approval. As someone who has received hundreds of coins on approval, and has sold dozens of coins on approval, I believe that I can see both sides of the issue. My theory is that when you pay for a coin before it is sent, there is a greater level of commitment and perhaps greater interest, too.
If a buyer is receiving a coin on approval, there is little investment in the process. I request the coin, it shows up in a day or in a week, and I can decide whether to keep or return it. When I ask for the coin, my financial status* may be different than when I have received it. For example, I might request the coin on Day 1 and someone else's coin on Day 2, with the money I was expecting to pay for the Day 1 coin when I receive it on Day 6. Or the air conditioner needs to be replaced on Day 4. Or I find a better, cheaper, example at the coin show on Day 5. You get the idea.
I can be semi-serious about buying something, just to have a lookie, and send it back when I get it. I have hours or days to talk myself out of it. There are all sorts of ways that I can wiggle out of a transaction.
When I send payment first, I have to look in the checking account, make sure the funds are there*, and make some commitment. There is something symbolic, and seemingly more permanent, about writing the check. Yes, I can unwind the commitment if I do not like the coin, but there is a greater level of engagement in the process when I pay first.
From the seller's standpoint, approval is a terrific tool, when used appropriately. Is the potential buyer on the fence? Great, I'll send it out, and you can see for yourself how cool the coin is. Often, it turns a "maybe" into a "yes". (Oh, and while I am at it, have a look at these three coins, too. I'll just send them on approval.)
"There are two draped bust halves in stock, and you are not sure which one to buy? I'll send them both to you." Several times, dealers have sent me a panel of various coins, up to a dozen or more, for me to shop at home. If I end up buying three or five and sending the rest back, everyone is happy.
Sellers get unhappy, very quickly, when approvals are consistently returned and no purchases are made. It costs them time and money for shipping, and ties up the coin for sometimes weeks at a time, preventing others from buying them. Some buyers probably have unrealistic expectations. Some coins are overmarketed. Some buyer-seller relationships are just not meant to be. Some coins are just not meant for some buyers.
(* To be clear, I do not order approval coins if I am unsure about being able to fund the purchase, but I was using the first person in this discussion for illustrative purposes.)
My response to another thread got me thinking, and perhaps dealer forum members can give their perspective, too.
The background is that I have heard dealers complain about people who return lots of coins, and these are often people who are receiving the coin on approval. As someone who has received hundreds of coins on approval, and has sold dozens of coins on approval, I believe that I can see both sides of the issue. My theory is that when you pay for a coin before it is sent, there is a greater level of commitment and perhaps greater interest, too.
If a buyer is receiving a coin on approval, there is little investment in the process. I request the coin, it shows up in a day or in a week, and I can decide whether to keep or return it. When I ask for the coin, my financial status* may be different than when I have received it. For example, I might request the coin on Day 1 and someone else's coin on Day 2, with the money I was expecting to pay for the Day 1 coin when I receive it on Day 6. Or the air conditioner needs to be replaced on Day 4. Or I find a better, cheaper, example at the coin show on Day 5. You get the idea.
I can be semi-serious about buying something, just to have a lookie, and send it back when I get it. I have hours or days to talk myself out of it. There are all sorts of ways that I can wiggle out of a transaction.
When I send payment first, I have to look in the checking account, make sure the funds are there*, and make some commitment. There is something symbolic, and seemingly more permanent, about writing the check. Yes, I can unwind the commitment if I do not like the coin, but there is a greater level of engagement in the process when I pay first.
From the seller's standpoint, approval is a terrific tool, when used appropriately. Is the potential buyer on the fence? Great, I'll send it out, and you can see for yourself how cool the coin is. Often, it turns a "maybe" into a "yes". (Oh, and while I am at it, have a look at these three coins, too. I'll just send them on approval.)
"There are two draped bust halves in stock, and you are not sure which one to buy? I'll send them both to you." Several times, dealers have sent me a panel of various coins, up to a dozen or more, for me to shop at home. If I end up buying three or five and sending the rest back, everyone is happy.
Sellers get unhappy, very quickly, when approvals are consistently returned and no purchases are made. It costs them time and money for shipping, and ties up the coin for sometimes weeks at a time, preventing others from buying them. Some buyers probably have unrealistic expectations. Some coins are overmarketed. Some buyer-seller relationships are just not meant to be. Some coins are just not meant for some buyers.
(* To be clear, I do not order approval coins if I am unsure about being able to fund the purchase, but I was using the first person in this discussion for illustrative purposes.)
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Comments
We always worked with dealers whom we trusted, and likewise.
if I hadn't.
Do you have the day off?? Family out of town?
I can see your point. Never looked at it that way.
Regarding dealers that got tired of sending me coins on approval and "fired me" - I prefer to look at it this way. I told them exactly what I was looking for and they kept sending me "stuff" that happened to be in inventory and didn't come close to what I was looking for.
For that I was grateful to be fired since I didn't have the courage to fire them.
What's it to you?
Bottom line:
As a collector, if you cannot envision yourself writing the check for the coin, do not accept it on approval.
There are times that I am unsure and will tell the dealer: "There is a 40% chance that I will buy it." (or whatever the number). Then, it is up to them to decide whether it is worth it to send it.
From each, I have purchased more and I have them on my daily watch for items. I will give them any business I can because they have earned it.
If it weren't for approval, I wouldn't buy as many as I do.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I never ask for things to be sent to me if I dont have the money though.
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Box of 20
SeaEagleCoins: 11/14/54-4/5/12. Miss you Larry!
If I do order a coin I ask the questions I need to as I hate sending coins in the mail unless it's necessary. Some dealers don't really want to answer a few
questions and just say.... "I'll send it to you to view it. I pass on those. When I have had to return a coin if they tried their best to answer my questions, I also have included their postage cost to me as well. If they just sent it hoping it would stick they get nothing and I usually don't ask for another one.
But, some dealers that I included their cost to me appreciated it so much they couldn't even let me know they got the coin back, let alone perhaps say a quick thanks. Yes I want to know they got the coin back so I know my liability is over. Oh...... I fully insure the coin back to them as well.
That's not surprising, though.
Personally I get a lot of items sent to me via approval and always make sure even if the dealer doesn't charge for shipping to include a check to cover their expense should I reject the item.
<< <i>I do not believe there is a difference in the level of seriousness, but I will say that the return rate for approval items is considerably higher than for items that are ordered and paid.
That's not surprising, though. >>
"Serious" may not be the right word choice. Perhaps "committed" would have been better.
<< <i>Is there really a difference between approval and a solid return privilege? >>
I think so, as the psychological commitment level is different.
Most of the fellows I deal with are very selective, and I understand and appreciate that.
I know my pics suck, but my coins don't, and a very high percentage are retained once they get to see them in hand.
Fortunately I have never been burned, nor have the privileges been abused.
<< <i>I can only speak for myself, and my answer is "No." When I get a coin on approval for me it's the same as if I sent a check. If the deal works, I buy. If not it goes back. Whether or not I've advanced the money, it makes no difference. >>
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.