Lost in the mail- question- UPDATE- Happy Ending!
cmerlo1
Posts: 7,960 ✭✭✭✭✭
I just had an eBay buyer contact me to say the coin he bought hasn't arrived. I shipped it USPS insured using PayPal shipping, but the tracking only shows that the shipping info was received. The other items I shipped that day have all been delivered. I've had a lot of transactions over the years and this is only the second time I've had this happen (I've been lucky, I guess). The last time, the item was cheap, and I simply refunded the buyer's money since they waited almost a month to tell me it hadn't arrived. I have a couple of questions, for the more experienced sellers out there:
1. I seem to remember with the last issue that you had to wait 21 days before you could file a claim with the PO. Is this true? I tried looking it up on the USPS site, but got nowhere. The item was shipped on 6/7, so it's been 9 days.
2. What's the best way to keep the buyer happy? Is it cool to offer a refund, if there will be a delay with the PO, or should I just let him know it will be a while. I'm thinking of giving him both options, but I don't want the buyer to think I'm just trying to back out of the deal.
Any advice is appreciated, as always.
UPDATE:
Got this from the friendly mailman today, no coin or packing list. It is stamped 'Received without contents':
I'm thinking 'received without contents' is the PO's way of getting out of paying the insurance. Its funny, it was dropped into the same slot as two others, which arrived, and this did somehow make it into the PO. Any further advice?
Edited to add:
FYI- the buyer was cool with waiting. I'm going to contact him and issue a refund, then duke it out with the PO, I guess. Fortunately, it wasn't a high-dollar coin.
NEW UPDATE 6/23/11
Got this from the buyer today, just as I was getting ready to issue his refund. I had contacted him this morning to let him know it was lost and to expect a refund:
hi just to let you know the post office delivered the coin today 6/23/11. it was in a post office envelope,
the packing slip was inside, riped in half. i will leave feed back of five stars.
It's good to know there are some honest people out there!
1. I seem to remember with the last issue that you had to wait 21 days before you could file a claim with the PO. Is this true? I tried looking it up on the USPS site, but got nowhere. The item was shipped on 6/7, so it's been 9 days.
2. What's the best way to keep the buyer happy? Is it cool to offer a refund, if there will be a delay with the PO, or should I just let him know it will be a while. I'm thinking of giving him both options, but I don't want the buyer to think I'm just trying to back out of the deal.
Any advice is appreciated, as always.
UPDATE:
Got this from the friendly mailman today, no coin or packing list. It is stamped 'Received without contents':
I'm thinking 'received without contents' is the PO's way of getting out of paying the insurance. Its funny, it was dropped into the same slot as two others, which arrived, and this did somehow make it into the PO. Any further advice?
Edited to add:
FYI- the buyer was cool with waiting. I'm going to contact him and issue a refund, then duke it out with the PO, I guess. Fortunately, it wasn't a high-dollar coin.
NEW UPDATE 6/23/11
Got this from the buyer today, just as I was getting ready to issue his refund. I had contacted him this morning to let him know it was lost and to expect a refund:
hi just to let you know the post office delivered the coin today 6/23/11. it was in a post office envelope,
the packing slip was inside, riped in half. i will leave feed back of five stars.
It's good to know there are some honest people out there!
You Suck! Awarded 6/2008- 1901-O Micro O Morgan, 8/2008- 1878 VAM-123 Morgan, 9/2022 1888-O VAM-1B3 H8 Morgan | Senior Regional Representative- ANACS Coin Grading. Posted opinions on coins are my own, and are not an official ANACS opinion.
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Comments
I have had a few things go missing even with a tracking number.
If the buyer never gets it, you will have to refund his money which is good business.
The tracking info only shows that it was received at your PO and not scanned anywhere else? So there's a possibility that it's still at your PO somewhere? Also, 9 days is a long time, but not THAT long. Delays happen, but not all the time.
I'd wait another few days and them give him either option on the refund and hope he tells you to wait 'till you file a claim and collect then refund. Explain it to them in as much detail as you can to let them know that you're not pulling a fast one on them.
In the meantime I would call Paypal and let them see if they can track it in some other way. Good thing it was shipped insured.
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
<< <i>The tracking info only shows that it was received at your PO and not scanned anywhere else? So there's a possibility that it's still at your PO somewhere? Also, 9 days is a long time, but not THAT long. Delays happen, but not all the time.
I'd wait another few days and them give him either option on the refund and hope he tells you to wait 'till you file a claim and collect then refund. Explain it to them in as much detail as you can to let them know that you're not pulling a fast one on them.
In the meantime I would call Paypal and let them see if they can track it in some other way. Good thing it was shipped insured. >>
Paypal can only track the same way you can, USPS on line. Your tracking info does not even show it was taken to the post office, only that you printed a lable. Always take self printed labels on high dollar items to the PO counter and request them to scan it into the system. Then you have proof it was delivered to the PO.
USPS Claim timetable
Nine days means it is possible it is just delayed getting there. Tell your buyer that you are working with the post office to track it down and not to worry, he'll get the item or his money back. Apologize for the inconvenience and tell him once the PO verifies it is lost you will refund. If he starts a paypal dispute, wait until the last day to refund, it may show up before then. If he demands immediate refund, tell him to start a paypal dispute so that there is a record of everything that transpires. This will buy you some time in case shipment is just delayed. If you refund now and he then receives coin you could end up without the money or the coin.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
Wait at least until a claim is made or 30 days you don't have too many options. I would communicate with your customer explaining that you will file a claim as soon as you are able and ask for him to remain patient a bit longer.
<< <i>
<< <i>The tracking info only shows that it was received at your PO and not scanned anywhere else? So there's a possibility that it's still at your PO somewhere? Also, 9 days is a long time, but not THAT long. Delays happen, but not all the time.
I'd wait another few days and them give him either option on the refund and hope he tells you to wait 'till you file a claim and collect then refund. Explain it to them in as much detail as you can to let them know that you're not pulling a fast one on them.
In the meantime I would call Paypal and let them see if they can track it in some other way. Good thing it was shipped insured. >>
Paypal can only track the same way you can, USPS on line. Your tracking info does not even show it was taken to the post office, only that you printed a lable. Always take self printed labels on high dollar items to the PO counter and request them to scan it into the system. Then you have proof it was delivered to the PO.
USPS Claim timetable
Nine days means it is possible it is just delayed getting there. Tell your buyer that you are working with the post office to track it down and not to worry, he'll get the item or his money back. Apologize for the inconvenience and tell him once the PO verifies it is lost you will refund. If he starts a paypal dispute, wait until the last day to refund, it may show up before then. If he demands immediate refund, tell him to start a paypal dispute so that there is a record of everything that transpires. This will buy you some time in case shipment is just delayed. If you refund now and he then receives coin you could end up without the money or the coin. >>
Similar scenario happened to me as a buyer....seller refunded my money & 5 month later the item was delivered. (No damage & with the postmark of when it was mailed ... 5 month prior) Fortunately I kept the sellers address & mailed him a check with a postscript...."Christmas in July and yes there is a Santa"....btw it was an inexpensive (less than $50) bullion piece that was not insured.
<< <i>Any further advice? >>
Hold onto the package (what's left of it, anyway). Don't throw it away or send it to the seller. Assuming the shipment was insured, the post office will want to see the package just as it is in order to process the claim.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>The package looks like it got caught in some type of conveyor and ripped open. >>
This is one reason I always ship coins in boxes. They don't go through the sorting machine as do these bubble mailers. This is a result as to why I will never use a bubble mailer for a coin. I am glad you got the envelope back. It's obvious that the damage is from the auto-sorter. Proving it though is another thing. Best of luck in sorting this out.
<< <i>Proving it though is another thing. >>
Should be an easy proof. The post office would obviously have rejected the package if it was presented for shipping as pictured, so the fact it was accepted would indicate it was packed properly. And since the package was returned to the sender, it was never out of the possession of the post office from the time it was accepted for shipping in good condition until it was returned with damage. So... the package was damaged by the post office- end of story.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
<< <i>Always take self printed shipments on insured items to the PO counter and request them to scan it into the system. Then you have proof it was delivered to the PO. >>
Be aware not all post offices will do this, as an acceptance scan is specifically not included as a part of the service according to USPS policies:
Electronic Price Delivery Confirmation Summary
The electronic fee for the Delivery Confirmation service provides delivery information only: it does not provide tracking of the item enroute or acceptance scans.
<< <i>
<< <i>Always take self printed shipments on insured items to the PO counter and request them to scan it into the system. Then you have proof it was delivered to the PO. >>
Be aware not all post offices will do this, as an acceptance scan is specifically not included as a part of the service according to USPS policies:
Electronic Price Delivery Confirmation Summary
The electronic fee for the Delivery Confirmation service provides delivery information only: it does not provide tracking of the item enroute or acceptance scans. >>
When shipping labels are printed from the USPS website, shipper has the option to print a "scan" form. This form his handed to the postal clerk who is required to scan it and return it to the customer. Scanning the scan form will show acceptance on line. The shipper also receives a receipt from the clerk upon scanning of the scan form. Shippers that use paypal printed shipping labels can request the counter clerk to scan the item into the system. Some clerks will and some won't. Also, note that while paypal shipping has a $500 insurance limit, the USPS website does not.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
<< <i>Always take self printed shipments on insured items to the PO counter and request them to scan it into the system. Then you have proof it was delivered to the PO. >>
My post office won't do this. --Jerry
<< <i>All good advice! I also have good photos of both sides of the coin and slab. I'm friends with most of the dealers here in town, and I'll be asking them to be on the lookout. Again, not a high dollar coin, so I'll chalk it up to a cheap lesson and learn from it. I feel worse for the buyer than I do for myself, though. >>
If you're going to chalk it up as a lesson learned then QUIT BUYING INSURANCE. First class insurance is insanely overpriced. Put a dollar in an envelope every time you ship a package and pay your losses out of the envelope and you'll be way ahead.
I don't think "Rec'd without contents." is supposed to mean you shipped without contents. That means at whatever location stamped it, the contents were missing. I think they will pay without question. --jerry
<< <i>Shippers that use paypal printed shipping labels can request the counter clerk to scan the item into the system. Some clerks will and some won't. >>
That was the point of my post. There have been numerous comments here complaining about the post office not scanning PayPal generated labels. If they do it, it's a bonus- one that you shouldn't always count on getting.
That stamp is used by the destination post office to cover their butts.
<< <i>
<< <i>Shippers that use paypal printed shipping labels can request the counter clerk to scan the item into the system. Some clerks will and some won't. >>
That was the point of my post. There have been numerous comments here complaining about the post office not scanning PayPal generated labels. If they do it, it's a bonus- one that you shouldn't always count on getting. >>
Note that the clerk is required to scan the associated "scan form" when a shipping label is printed from usps's website and the shipper also prints the "scan form." This immediately provides proof acceptance of the shipment by the post office. The clerk will also give you a receipt.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
Thanks for updating us!
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Also good to note is that not only was the buyer a good person, and let you know, but the postal folks there were also straight up and did what they could to make things right. Would have been easy for them to leave it at the ripped package but they went the extra step, that they should, and finished it as best could be done given the circumstances.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment