Options
Was the following opinion that I offered unprofessional?
halfcentman
Posts: 1,498 ✭✭✭
Went to a customer's house in town to evaluate an accumulation. He's 82 years old.
I go there, and he had well over $10K face value (really!). He had about $2,500.00 of buyable material, but then we uncovered almost a third of a bag of 90%, so the offer was increased by over $7K.
I offer him around $9.5K for the non-face. He asks me how much I would charge to take the pocket change off of his hands, but I told him that I am not doing it unless I get to buy everything. Before, he told me that he might to keep some of the silver and give it to his grandkids (he has six of them).
HERE'S WHERE THE "FUN" BEGAN
I told him that as a professional I would strongly advise against that. I told him that 90% of the estate sales that I have dealt with had some horror story or another with regards to items all of a sudden disappearing. I also told him that the material was nothing more than silver, and even the most detailed instructions in your will are not going to solve the problem. I reiterated that this is the advice I would give anyone, including my own family members and friends.
I concluded that his best option was to sell the material (whether it be him or someone else, but hopefully me) and to consult with his financial professional as what would be the best option to do with the money. I walked out of there without the stuff.
Two days later I called him, because he was in the process of moving about 40 miles away (he lives in the same town that I do).
NOW IS THE CRAZY PART:
Instead of selling the stuff, he was willing to pack it all away and move it (including the face value). When I questioned this, he told me that he did not appreciate my unsolicited advice regarding leaving his material to his grandchildren and how his family would turn into a bunch of evil minions (I did not use that term).
I have done this before, and people have been very grateful. Nonetheless, I would like to know what your reaction would be if someone said this to you.
Thanks,
Greg
I go there, and he had well over $10K face value (really!). He had about $2,500.00 of buyable material, but then we uncovered almost a third of a bag of 90%, so the offer was increased by over $7K.
I offer him around $9.5K for the non-face. He asks me how much I would charge to take the pocket change off of his hands, but I told him that I am not doing it unless I get to buy everything. Before, he told me that he might to keep some of the silver and give it to his grandkids (he has six of them).
HERE'S WHERE THE "FUN" BEGAN
I told him that as a professional I would strongly advise against that. I told him that 90% of the estate sales that I have dealt with had some horror story or another with regards to items all of a sudden disappearing. I also told him that the material was nothing more than silver, and even the most detailed instructions in your will are not going to solve the problem. I reiterated that this is the advice I would give anyone, including my own family members and friends.
I concluded that his best option was to sell the material (whether it be him or someone else, but hopefully me) and to consult with his financial professional as what would be the best option to do with the money. I walked out of there without the stuff.
Two days later I called him, because he was in the process of moving about 40 miles away (he lives in the same town that I do).
NOW IS THE CRAZY PART:
Instead of selling the stuff, he was willing to pack it all away and move it (including the face value). When I questioned this, he told me that he did not appreciate my unsolicited advice regarding leaving his material to his grandchildren and how his family would turn into a bunch of evil minions (I did not use that term).
I have done this before, and people have been very grateful. Nonetheless, I would like to know what your reaction would be if someone said this to you.
Thanks,
Greg
0
Comments
<< <i>It is of my opinion that when you give advice to somebody at his age, you'd better just accept whatever is coming your way whether it is appreciated or not appreciated. People have their minds made up by that age. I do not disagree with your advice. And I don't disagree with how he responded when you called back. It comes with the territory. Everybody is entitled to their own reactions.
I deal with tons of elderly people, and the reaction to the advice was a first.
His moving the stuff was not.
Sometimes that's how it is with good advice, though.
<< <i>It is of my opinion that when you give advice to somebody at his age, you'd better just accept whatever is coming your way whether it is appreciated or not appreciated. People have their minds made up by that age. I do not disagree with your advice. And I don't disagree with how he responded when you called back. It comes with the territory. Everybody is entitled to their own reactions.
I agree.
Giving advice to an 82 year old (right or wrong) can be a dangerous move.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
party (if you are hoping to make a profit from the deal). Anything else you say can and will be used against you.
Although gentle general advice is usually appreciated, such as "it's best for YOU to sell it because YOU know what everything is."
<< <i>I think that a lot of people would have been offended by what you told him. >>
I agree. I would have discussed the topic of dispensation of the estate, but it would have been from a planning point of view without mention of the possibility of the difficulties that sometimes arise from relatives fighting over their slice of the pie. And, I'd have opened that discussion by telling him it's a wonderful idea to leave a little bit of the legacy to his grandchildren.
Russ, NCNE
I think you were ill-advised to offer it. You were there to evaluate his accumulation, that is, to conduct a business transaction, not to (implicitly) criticize his family.
One never knows how advice (especially unsolicited advice) will be received.
Check out the Southern Gold Society
<< <i>I think your advice was spot on.
I think you were ill-advised to offer it. You were there to evaluate his accumulation, that is, to conduct a business transaction, not to (implicitly) criticize his family.
One never knows how advice (especially unsolicited advice) will be received. >>
that
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
MOO
TD
<< <i>Went to a customer's house in town to evaluate an accumulation. He's 82 years old.
I go there, and he had well over $10K face value (really!). He had about $2,500.00 of buyable material, but then we uncovered almost a third of a bag of 90%, so the offer was increased by over $7K.
I offer him around $9.5K for the non-face. He asks me how much I would charge to take the pocket change off of his hands, but I told him that I am not doing it unless I get to buy everything. Before, he told me that he might to keep some of the silver and give it to his grandkids (he has six of them).
HERE'S WHERE THE "FUN" BEGAN
I told him that as a professional I would strongly advise against that. I told him that 90% of the estate sales that I have dealt with had some horror story or another with regards to items all of a sudden disappearing. I also told him that the material was nothing more than silver, and even the most detailed instructions in your will are not going to solve the problem. I reiterated that this is the advice I would give anyone, including my own family members and friends.
I concluded that his best option was to sell the material (whether it be him or someone else, but hopefully me) and to consult with his financial professional as what would be the best option to do with the money. I walked out of there without the stuff.
Two days later I called him, because he was in the process of moving about 40 miles away (he lives in the same town that I do).
NOW IS THE CRAZY PART:
Instead of selling the stuff, he was willing to pack it all away and move it (including the face value). When I questioned this, he told me that he did not appreciate my unsolicited advice regarding leaving his material to his grandchildren and how his family would turn into a bunch of evil minions (I did not use that term).
I have done this before, and people have been very grateful. Nonetheless, I would like to know what your reaction would be if someone said this to you.
Thanks,
Greg >>
Perhaps he was looking for an offer, rather than a sale at the time, and simply used that as an excuse not to sell to you.
Amazing what a "higher offer" that he was hoping for might do - suddenly he would probably appreciate your "advice". LOL
<< <i>I think that a lot of people would have been offended by what you told him. >>
I would have to agree.
<< <i>Perhaps he was looking for an offer, rather than a sale at the time, and simply used that as an excuse not to sell to you.
Amazing what a "higher offer" that he was hoping for might do - suddenly he would probably appreciate your "advice". LOL >>
Sounds like he was looking for you to take the junk before the move, never intended for you to get the silver.
I get the feeling he was just looking for a free appraisal from you.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I think you were ill-advised to offer it. You were there to evaluate his accumulation, that is, to conduct a business transaction, not to (implicitly) criticize his family.
One never knows how advice (especially unsolicited advice) will be received. "
AL
<< <i>Unsolicited advice is often resented. >>
As a professional salesman I strive to remember this.
It isn't easy, especially if you care about your customers.
"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working" Pablo Picasso
<< <i>
<< <i>Perhaps he was looking for an offer, rather than a sale at the time, and simply used that as an excuse not to sell to you.
Amazing what a "higher offer" that he was hoping for might do - suddenly he would probably appreciate your "advice". LOL >>
Sounds like he was looking for you to take the junk before the move, never intended for you to get the silver. >>
He offered me a percentage to take the face value, which I accepted.
<< <i>"I think your advice was spot on.
I think you were ill-advised to offer it. You were there to evaluate his accumulation, that is, to conduct a business transaction, not to (implicitly) criticize his family.
One never knows how advice (especially unsolicited advice) will be received. "
It's advice I have given 100 times before and I have never had a problem. As a matter of fact, I bought every single collection at that time while giving that advice.
BTW, he called me up and I just bought everything. I have to go and get it in the AM.
He told me that he did not the family comment, until he talked to one of his friends who regaled him about a tale of his friend's sister whose brother sold over $25K of antiques from their father's estate and denied they were even there. This is the same sister who drove her brother back-and-forth to chemotherapy while he was battling leukemia.
I appreciate your feedback. It's very much appreciated. Thanks for taking the time to reply. Because of this, I will tweak the way I handle this.
Thanks again,
Greg
AL >>
<< <i>Your advice was not wrong, but if he did not ask for it you should not have offered such a negative scenario. Unsolicited advice is often resented.
MOO
TD >>
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
<< <i>You lost any chance at a buy when you said "all or nothing." I understand your reasoning but, even said nicely.....IMHO, whether 82 or 32, more times than not, that kind of statement is going to get you shown the door and it will hit you in the butt after you go past it. >>
Read the previous post, because I bought all of it and I am going to pick it up tomorrow.
The "all or nothing" was with respect to buying over $10K of face value and cashing it in for him. I told him that I would not do that if I was not able to purchase the entire deal. If he had sold me one, 90% dime that would have been his prerogative - and I would have chalked that up to business.
"I have seen in the past when collectables are left to heirs. that the heirs have no idea of value
and have sold it for far less than what it was worth. They were taken advantage of just because
they didn't have enough information about the collectables/silver/gold/ etc.
I have also see very capable heirs that knew the exact value and were quite happy to get the
bequeaths from the relative.
It goes both ways but as you can imagine most heirs do not have your knowledge or desire
to obtain that knowledge. If this is your situation then you might consider disposing of the
collection before hand."
bob
PS: I have used this statement more than once and have found that some sellers have kids that
know as much about coins as Dad. But, most often they know nothing or next to nothing and
the statement is to my advantage. But, do give the owner the chance to make the decision.
edited: Glad you got the deal. Just read that and answered before I scrolled down to the bottom!
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Practice makes perfect & nobody is perfect. So, practice being nobody.
<< <i>Either make an appriaisal or an offer to buy -- nothing else. You can easily hang yourself by giving advice, as you are not a disinterested
party (if you are hoping to make a profit from the deal). Anything else you say can and will be used against you.
Although gentle general advice is usually appreciated, such as "it's best for YOU to sell it because YOU know what everything is." >>
Frank,
To me, this was the best reply of the thread. Your semantics with regards to this situation were perfect.
Usually, I am a master at doing this. However, this time I screwed up.
Just because it turned out OK is irrelevant.
Thanks,
Greg
<< <i>Was the following opinion that I offered unprofessional? >>
Yes, at the point where the "fun" began. Figure out what type of professional you are and stick to that profession.
<< <i>You lost any chance at a buy when you said "all or nothing." I understand your reasoning but, even said nicely.....IMHO, whether 82 or 32, more times than not, that kind of statement is going to get you shown the door and it will hit you in the butt after you go past it. >>
Actually, refusing to take the face value stuff unless the seller sells substantially all of a deal is common business practice.
TD
And as for possibly being insulted...let me give you an example of something that happened to me: My father (who was by no means helpless or feeble-minded at 70 years old), went to an estate planning attorney to have a trust drawn up and a revised will written. My mother was deceased, he had no other children or significant others, but in my presence she still laid out all of the "nightmare" scenarios of what could happen if his [evil] son decided to start stealing his stuff and put him in a nursing home.
Was I offended...no. Did dad need to hear this...who knows? But that was her professional opinion that he was actually paying to hear. Meanwhile, I'm sure some of her other clients get into a huff and storm out of the office...such is life. You can't please everyone.
PS...when it came time to sign various documents, she made me leave the room, called in a witness, and had my father swear that I wasn't threatening to kill his puppy, lick his Mercury dimes...or using some other form of duress on him!
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
We are people, too, and you were trying to do the right thing by offering good advise based on your experience.
Fortunately he saw the light, and you succeeded, both as a professional, and a "good guy".
Of course, it's a judgement call when to be a professional and when to take a path more towards helping the
person and less in one's own relative self interest.
It wasn't completely clear from your post whether he wanted to give silver to the grandkids as a bequest upon his death,
or maybe more immediately (now, or as Xmas, etc.). The latter way would seem better than the former.
Again Andy, SPOT ON.
Best,
Eric
<< <i>"It seems to me that a "professional" would have simply quoted the job at $300 an hour. But you're a coin dealer, so anything goes." - Andy "Mr. Eureka"
Again Andy, SPOT ON.
Best,
Eric >>
OK, I just went and picked everything up! (yes, VERY EARLY)
Andy is the best, BTW.
I must have been really off that day, because as I walked in the guy was chugging a Guiness! He offered me a variety of 10 different, quality beers. Too bad he's moving.
Have a nice Saturday everyone. I learned a lot.
Greg