How often do collectors actually pay "retail" nowadays?
C0inCollect0r
Posts: 374 ✭✭
Hi folks,
I was just having a conversation with a local dealer about this and thought it would be interesting to hear any thoughts of dealers/collectors on this board. I am just curious as to how often collectors realistically are paying traditional "retail" prices for collector coins nowadays - let's say prices comparable to PCGS Price Guide, Numismedia Retail, or Red Book. It seems that most "standard" coins I see are selling for prices around GS Bid (give or take obviously). I have heard from some that "GS is the new retail." There are of course rarities or very PQ coins that are underpriced by either GS or the PCGS Guide but I am generally talking about the "norm" instead of exceptions to the rule.
We were also discussing whether this situation is different depending on whether you're talking about online sales (like eBay) versus coin shows versus Brick and Mortar shops. Any thoughts on that would also be interesting.
As always any opinions are great to hear.
I was just having a conversation with a local dealer about this and thought it would be interesting to hear any thoughts of dealers/collectors on this board. I am just curious as to how often collectors realistically are paying traditional "retail" prices for collector coins nowadays - let's say prices comparable to PCGS Price Guide, Numismedia Retail, or Red Book. It seems that most "standard" coins I see are selling for prices around GS Bid (give or take obviously). I have heard from some that "GS is the new retail." There are of course rarities or very PQ coins that are underpriced by either GS or the PCGS Guide but I am generally talking about the "norm" instead of exceptions to the rule.
We were also discussing whether this situation is different depending on whether you're talking about online sales (like eBay) versus coin shows versus Brick and Mortar shops. Any thoughts on that would also be interesting.
As always any opinions are great to hear.
0
Comments
"How often do collectors actually pay "retail" nowadays?"
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When I'm buying, always.
When I'm selling, never.
~
"America suffers today from too much pluribus and not enough unum.".....Arthur Schlesinger Jr.
Of course, I guess that it does depend on what you collect. For the coins that I collect, anyone trying to put together a set by paying sheet prices would likely end up with a bunch of dogs.
merse
But in any event, while I haven't been an active buyer for a couple of years, I used to do all my buying at coin shows and from an established dealer who sold at both shows and through his website; generally I would pay a discount to Coin World's Coin Values prices. My experience was generally that dealers would buy coins from me at a discount to Grey Sheet Bid and sell them to me at their purchase price plus their profit margin. Usually, this meant that I was paying less than Coin Values' prices (sometimes a lot less).
Did this mean I was paying below "retail" or did this mean that I was paying "retail", but Coin Values was "above retail"?
Damfino.
Check out the Southern Gold Society
collecting the high end good stuff you pay above retail...
collecting average you pay average.....
Low and behold, a Trueview was shot, even though I did not order or pay for it. Here's the Trueview:
And nope - its not for sale
==Looking for pre WW2 Commems in PCGS Rattler holders, 1851-O Three Cent Silvers in all grades
Successful, problem free and pleasant transactions with: illini420, coinguy1, weather11am,wayneherndon,wondercoin,Topdollarpaid,Julian, bishdigg,seateddime, peicesofme,ajia,CoinRaritiesOnline,savoyspecial,Boom, TorinoCobra71, ModernCoinMart, WTCG, slinc, Patches, Gerard, pocketpiececommems, BigJohnD, RickMilauskas, mirabella, Smittys, LeeG, TomB, DeusExMachina, tydye
merse
Go to big shows, like Long Beach, and you might get a few deals (if they will even talk to you)
The new "collector / dealer bread" has skewed (and screwed) prices to the high side, as they (the CDB) often pay retail to get inventory, which is just the rejects from thier mega hoard/collections.
Michael Kittle Rare Coins --- 1908-S Indian Head Cent Grading Set --- No. 1 1909 Mint Set --- Kittlecoins on Facebook --- Long Beach Table 700
<< <i>I wish I could find a coin for as little as the PCGS price guide lately. 115% on the one I bought about an hour ago.
The last one I paid full retail price for was only 109.6% of the PCGS Guide... I must have gotten a great deal!!!
Michael Kittle Rare Coins --- 1908-S Indian Head Cent Grading Set --- No. 1 1909 Mint Set --- Kittlecoins on Facebook --- Long Beach Table 700
If a dealer is selling a customer a coin at GS Bid, it is likely a low-for-the-grade coin. I have not seen the mantra "GS is the new retail" apply to solid-to-premium coins.
It tends to be the well connected collectors and part time dealers that pay real wholesale price, and that usually is well back of sheet for common coins. Retail buyers that shop only on price often take home low end coins, though not always.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>Collectors always pay retail even if they think they are not. >>
<< <i>Why would anyone EVER consider Redbook pricing to have any credence whatsoever except to determine that a 93-s Morgan is worth more than most other Morgans? >>
I'll pay 100% of redbook for any Good thru AU 1839-O halves and 1851-O 3 cent silvers that are graded by PCGS and CAC'd, totally original and problem free!
==Looking for pre WW2 Commems in PCGS Rattler holders, 1851-O Three Cent Silvers in all grades
Successful, problem free and pleasant transactions with: illini420, coinguy1, weather11am,wayneherndon,wondercoin,Topdollarpaid,Julian, bishdigg,seateddime, peicesofme,ajia,CoinRaritiesOnline,savoyspecial,Boom, TorinoCobra71, ModernCoinMart, WTCG, slinc, Patches, Gerard, pocketpiececommems, BigJohnD, RickMilauskas, mirabella, Smittys, LeeG, TomB, DeusExMachina, tydye
<< <i>Collectors always pay retail even if they think they are not. >>
If he is buying from a dealer, this is almost always true.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Rainbow Stars
<< <i>Whats over retail >>
Paying a premium for colorful tarnish?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Whats over retail >>
Some dealers charge more than others. At a coin show, for common coins, the same coin with similar quality can be found in a wide range of prices. Some might call the highest prices over retail.
Separately, some coin sellers at other venues such as TV show sellers, precious metals telemarketers that promote primarily with radio ads, sellers with big ads in mainstream magazines, tend to price at double to triple the price levels at the coin show. I'd call that way over retail, a burial as those buyers will probably never get out even.
<< <i>
<< <i>Why would anyone EVER consider Redbook pricing to have any credence whatsoever except to determine that a 93-s Morgan is worth more than most other Morgans? >>
I'll pay 100% of redbook for any Good thru AU 1839-O halves and 1851-O 3 cent silvers that are graded by PCGS and CAC'd, totally original and problem free! >>
I'm sure you can find examples in the RB that are lower than current pricing, but there are any price guides that are accurate for scarce or thinly traded coins. How does RB compare to Morgan prices for the recent upswing in white MS63/64 prices? Considering how long ago those prices were fixed for printing anything that is right on is just dumb luck IMO.
<< <i>
<< <i>Whats over retail >>
Some dealers charge more than others. At a coin show, for common coins, the same coin with similar quality can be found in a wide range of prices. Some might call the highest prices over retail.
Separately, some coin sellers at other venues such as TV show sellers, precious metals telemarketers that promote primarily with radio ads, sellers with big ads in mainstream magazines, tend to price at double to triple the price levels at the coin show. I'd call that way over retail, a burial as those buyers will probably never get out even. >>
I can think of a few right off the top 'o my head who are uber retail. Buy from them and try to sell it for what you paid.
The other part of the story is that PCGS price guide tends to be inaccurate for scarcer coins, like early bust and copper, better date 18th and 19th century coinage,
and premium circ examples of most pre-1933 coinage. If the coin you're looking at is readily available in that grade/quality from multiple sources, then
paying 100% PCGS price guide, or even 10-20% under it, is not something to crow about.
roadrunner
right on roadrunner
And yes if I could find a 1796 No Stars quarter eagle or a 1821-7 Quarter eagle in AU that I liked, I'd be more than happy to pay a retail price for it.
expect to pay "full retail" or more. When picking up a bunch of widgets at a local coin
shop or at a show, I never pay anywhere close to retail.
<< <i>when the right coin comes up that you just must have, you pay retail and be thankful for it!!! Don't ask for a better deal or give anyone else a chance to get that coin from you!!! >>
I agree completely.
<< <i>
<< <i>when the right coin comes up that you just must have, you pay retail and be thankful for it!!! Don't ask for a better deal or give anyone else a chance to get that coin from you!!! >>
I agree completely. >>
I've paid 20% over PCGS price guide for a coin I liked, then received an offer that was 15% higher than what I paid for the coin just a few months later.
to sell it. As he was crossing the rail road tracks, along came a fast freight train
which cut the cow's tail off. At that point, the poor farmer had to wholesale his
cow, because he was unable to retail it.
Camelot
<< <i>
<< <i>Whats over retail >>
Paying a premium for colorful tarnish?
Then I pay WAYYYYYYYYY over retail
Rainbow Stars
How often do collectors actually pay "retail" nowadays?
...i would say pretty often. especially if you're buying from any advertised coins in any mag or coin company's
web-site online.
<< <i>I think it depends on how strong the coin market is, and how rare the coin is. Last year I was able to buy higher grade Morgans for my collection, at a significant discount to what was considered to be the "retail" price at the time. It seems that gap is narrowing a bit now. With some of the other dollar series, I have had to pay significantly over "retail" this year for the top grades. >>
I found the Morgan Dollar market to be really slow last year when I was wrapping up my business. In fact it had been slow the last couple of years I was still setting up at shows. Perhaps with the price of silver driving things, that has changed.