If you were looking to buy 3 or 4 ounces of gold to hold onto for years (min 15 years) would you buy 1oz age's or pay the small premium for pcgs ms63 saints?
If I were accumulating today I'd be a buyer of $20 libs & saints in circ grades over AGEs. Minimal premium today. The best part of owning $20's is that in an orderly market with stable prices, $20s will carry a nice collector premium to the spot price of the gold.
Nice looking Saints near melt would be my choice but there's nothing wrong with AGE's or Buffalo's.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Price of circ XF saints is currently around 9% above spot if you are paying current retail prices from large gold wholesalers. Many here have better sources and can probably buy closer to 5% above spot which is what the big boys currently offer to pay. In my mind 5-10% over spot is darn close.
For MS63 Saints they cost about 14% above melt on the retail end. It would not be too hard to find them from other sources (such as BST) for only 10% above spot. Imo that's a pretty small premium for an 80 yr old choice BU collectible gold coin vs. a slug of gold. It's actually a fairly small premium considering they were run up to 50% above spot during the November 2009 run to $1225/oz gold.
I frequently make the analogy to circ wheat cents bringing a far higher premium to their spot value than the MS63 Saints do. I'd rather have the single saint than a heavy sack of wheat cents to tote around. The circ and MS63 Morgans bring a much higher premium as well. And if you want BU rolls of 1958 wheaties I'm sure the premium to circs is much, much higher. The $20 Saint is just about the cheapest "old" thing out there when compared to intrinsic metal value.
Some modern gold PCGS 70s are undervalued right now in my opinion and not selling for a large premium over the raw coins. In some instances, I expect the premium to return. --Jerry
Back in '05 when gold was in the $490 or so range I was buying Saints from Heritage in lots at $515 or so. After prices started moving onward, I moved onto Libs and then stopped buying altogether because the premiums were significantly more than melt.
Tir nam beann, nan gleann, s'nan gaisgeach ~ Saorstat Albanaich a nis!
<< <i>Back in '05 when gold was in the $490 or so range I was buying Saints from Heritage in lots at $515 or so. After prices started moving onward, I moved onto Libs and then stopped buying altogether because the premiums were significantly more than melt. >>
For those saints back in 2005 you paid a 5% premium. That's what you could probably get them for today with a little looking and negotiating.
$20 Saints are not 0.90 oz of gold. That's their purity (90/10 gold-copper). They weigh more than an ounce and net out at 0.9675 oz. of pure gold. At $1390/oz gold it works out to be a $45 deduction. Not all that much. Use -3% to keep it simple.
<< <i>If you were looking to buy 3 or 4 ounces of gold to hold onto for years (min 15 years) would you buy 1oz age's or pay the small premium for pcgs ms63 saints? >>
<< <i>Back in '05 when gold was in the $490 or so range I was buying Saints from Heritage in lots at $515 or so. After prices started moving onward, I moved onto Libs and then stopped buying altogether because the premiums were significantly more than melt. >>
For those saints back in 2005 you paid a 5% premium. That's what you could probably get them for today with a little looking and negotiating.
$20 Saints are not 0.90 oz of gold. That's their purity (90/10 gold-copper). They weigh more than an ounce and net out at 0.9675 oz. of pure gold. At $1390/oz gold it works out to be a $45 deduction. Not all that much. Use -3% to keep it simple.
roadrunner >>
Thanks, RR! I learned something I'd still buy the AGE's if I was just wanting 4oz of gold.
With such a low difference between bullion and Saints right now, I feel the Saints are the better deal. If gold bubbles and crashes, the Saints will hold value better. If gold climbs upward, you are still set to make big gains. When gold stagnates for six or eight months, Saints will creep upward. Some clever people with good timing trade back and forth between raw bullion and Saints or Liberty $20s, gradually building by profiting off each trade and reinvesting it--i.e. trading a generic date Saint for 1.3 ounces of gold, and then trading 1.2 ounces of gold for another generic Saint of the same grade and certifier a few months later, coming out ahead by 1/10th of an ounce of gold.
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Comments
Tom
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
PCGS Registries
Box of 20
SeaEagleCoins: 11/14/54-4/5/12. Miss you Larry!
For MS63 Saints they cost about 14% above melt on the retail end. It would not be too hard to find them from other sources (such as BST) for only 10% above spot. Imo that's a pretty small premium for an 80 yr old choice BU collectible gold coin vs. a slug of gold. It's actually a fairly small premium considering they were run up to 50% above spot during the November 2009 run to $1225/oz gold.
I frequently make the analogy to circ wheat cents bringing a far higher premium to their spot value than the MS63 Saints do. I'd rather have the single saint than a heavy sack of wheat cents to tote around. The circ and MS63 Morgans bring a much higher premium as well. And if you want BU rolls of 1958 wheaties I'm sure the premium to circs is much, much higher. The $20 Saint is just about the cheapest "old" thing out there when compared to intrinsic metal value.
roadrunner
Many members on this forum that now it cannot fit in my signature. Please ask for entire list.
Why not buy two of each and report back to us in 15 years and tell us how it shook out?
$20 Saint = .900 oz of gold
Personally I want as much gold as possible.
Now if I collected Saints my answer would be different I'm sure
<< <i>Back in '05 when gold was in the $490 or so range I was buying Saints from Heritage in lots at $515 or so. After prices started moving onward, I moved onto Libs and then stopped buying altogether because the premiums were significantly more than melt. >>
For those saints back in 2005 you paid a 5% premium. That's what you could probably get them for today with a little looking and negotiating.
$20 Saints are not 0.90 oz of gold. That's their purity (90/10 gold-copper). They weigh more than an ounce and net out at 0.9675 oz. of pure gold. At $1390/oz gold it works out to be a $45 deduction. Not all that much. Use -3% to keep it simple.
roadrunner
<< <i>If you were looking to buy 3 or 4 ounces of gold to hold onto for years (min 15 years) would you buy 1oz age's or pay the small premium for pcgs ms63 saints? >>
I'd get two of each and relax for a decade.
<< <i>
<< <i>Back in '05 when gold was in the $490 or so range I was buying Saints from Heritage in lots at $515 or so. After prices started moving onward, I moved onto Libs and then stopped buying altogether because the premiums were significantly more than melt. >>
For those saints back in 2005 you paid a 5% premium. That's what you could probably get them for today with a little looking and negotiating.
$20 Saints are not 0.90 oz of gold. That's their purity (90/10 gold-copper). They weigh more than an ounce and net out at 0.9675 oz. of pure gold. At $1390/oz gold it works out to be a $45 deduction. Not all that much. Use -3% to keep it simple.
roadrunner >>
Thanks, RR! I learned something