<< <i>I'll add a little story of my own. I had a few unopened proof sets I placed on ebay. They were from 1950-1955. No reserve, all sold quickly. I kept one each for myself. They were 100% orginal and authentic; they were passed down by a relative who purchased them new. One buyer bought two sets and immediately came back and stated they were not original, been taken out of mint packaging. etc. He called me a crook. I was pissed and opened all of my own sets; as expected, they were spot on. I questioned the guy, and after doing so, it was obvious he had switched the coins. I refused to refund him knowing I would lose, and I did. When I received the return, it was easy to see he switched on me. Bottom line: as a seller you are basically out of luck, with few exceptions. >>
<< <i>I have not replied since his last message 20 minutes ago....
now he sends me this......
I have a Question, are you going to put the money in my account first before I send them back? How do I know that you will credit my account when you recieve the coins. Or should i go through ebay's resolution center to solve this situation? >>
Ok if this was me, as the seller i would take the negative and tell him to shove it-i see a negative in your future no matter what you do to make it right also i see a bag of rocks in place of the silver,i have had this scam pulled on me several times and no matter what i did to make it right i still got the shaft,you at the mercy of bad buyers and Ebay too.
<< <i>That sucks, sorry to hear this is happening. I want to believe like Mark posted, but I am thinking he may have been trying to get money back and keep the items. >>
He's gonna neg you no matter what. Your response about not refunding the return shipping sealed that deal. Let him open a case.....he won't get his return shipping even if he wins. Also, if he doesn't use delivery confirm when he sends them back, claim he never sent them back.......that way, you can take him down with you.
<< <i>So are you going to pay the shipping, because I am not at fault with this. I was born at night, but not last night. I would have loved to keep these coins and not gone through all this hassle >>
Note that eBay defines a full refund as the buyer paying return shipping link
"A full refund is one that covers the cost of the item and original shipping. If you've received an item and want a full refund, you'll usually need to send the item back to the seller. Buyers are responsible for paying return shipping unless the buyer and seller have reached a different agreement. In unusual circumstances, eBay may pay return shipping."
<< <i>He's gonna neg you no matter what. Your response about not refunding the return shipping sealed that deal. Let him open a case.....he won't get his return shipping even if he wins. Also, if he doesn't use delivery confirm when he sends them back, claim he never sent them back.......that way, you can take him down with you. >>
I don't think I could do that and feel good about what I did. Even though the creep probably deserves it. It's like 2 wrongs to make a right.
successful BST deals with Meltdown, Broadstruck, lordmarcovan, MisterTicToc, JINX86, BXBOY143, MBCOINS and others
Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
"Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor ... Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there."
Sounds like feedback extortion to me. Save that email.
<< <i>"Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor ... Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there."
Sounds like feedback extortion to me. Save that email. >>
and with 5 feedback.
one has to wonder if he's got more experience than his 5 feedback shows. perhaps he had a past life on eBay...
<< <i>Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
- matthewprymak >>
Got him by the b*lls now. Feedback extortion. Send the emails on to ebay (call first) and you will not be negged. bob
Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
He is admitted the slabs are sealed. He seems to be accusing NGC of switching the coins. One good thing about that last email is he is admitting the slabs are sealed, so he can't filed a claim saying they aren't...
<< <i>"Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor ... Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there."
Sounds like feedback extortion to me. Save that email. >>
Yep. Mate in 2 moves. Forward to ebay, wait for reply. Game over. --jerry
<< <i>He is admitted the slabs are sealed. He seems to be accusing NGC of switching the coins. One good thing about that last email is he is admitting the slabs are sealed, so he can't filed a claim saying they aren't... >>
....no, I think he's still saying the "containers" were tampered with.....by a "3rd party"...........I think
Yep....he was trying to screw you. Feedback extortion too. Hopefully he sent that through the ebay mail system (a reason to always send correspondence through them if you suspect any problems).
Call ebay (I know some folks around here have the number; if I did, I would post it for you). Explain and show them the mail. The guy SHOULD be unable to return and SHOULD NOT be able to leave feedback, or, if he does leave negative, ebay SHOULD remove it due to extortion threat.
Yup, When you see that one eBay auction he won ya should have known you where in trouble. Keep too your guns with the offer you made and if the neg comes leave a response to it and people will understand. This may get worst before it gets over. Good Luck
<< <i>Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. >>
This is gold. CALL eBay--don't email them--and don't email the buyer back until you hear from them on the phone. Get them to tell you in writing that they recognize this as feedback extortion and ask them to make a note of the call. You can probably get them to either favor your not allowing the return, or certainly covering your back if you get a neg. You definitely should be out of the return shipping offer at this point.
<< <i>I would pay the shipping both ways, after the coins that I sold them were returned in the same condition as I shipped them. I would also demand that the coins be shipped insured and tell them that the package will be opened in front of your Postal clerk upon arrival. I have done this before and so far no erroneous contents. Regardless, if this person is a crook or stupid you are at his mercy with ebay. I would make the best of a bad situation. Best of luck. Jim >>
Why is it important to open the package in front of a postal clerk? I would not expect them to be an expert witness in court.
I think you will be okay now that he dug his hole. It is a good thing you only have to deal with a few of these per 500 to 1000 transactions.
Mark NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!! working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
<< <i>Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
- matthewprymak >>
Report this email to eBay then tell this bastage to go #$%^ off!
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
He obviously can't see $42 per eagle is not a bad deal, considering they are in NGC slabs, and marked as Early Releases.
I agree with reimbursing him the return shipping costs and be done with him. Block him from bidding on future auctions of yours. Let him know you'll refund his purchase price after you receive the coins back from him. That way you're assured their return and he doesn't keep the coins after getting his refund.
<< <i>Why is it important to open the package in front of a postal clerk? I would not expect them to be an expert witness in court.
I think you will be okay now that he dug his hole. It is a good thing you only have to deal with a few of these per 500 to 1000 transactions. >>
Opening the package in front of a postal clerk on delivery would further validate your claim if you need to file mail fraud charges with the postal inspectors if there is a discrepancy with the item returned (like if he sends you a box of rocks).
<< <i>Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
- matthewprymak >>
Report this email to eBay then tell this bastage to go #$%^ off! >>
No kidding! THis is akin to being in an automobile accident, and the other person saying "Just pay me cash for damages, and we won't claim it on insurance." because that guy HAS NO insurance and doesn't want to get in trouble. At this point, I'd risk the Neg and report him.
Best regards, Dwayne F. Sessom Ebay ID: V-Nickel-Coins
In reporting him to ebay for feedback extortion, and for possibly tampering with the merchandise, please be sure to mention that he is very likely to have used other previous ebay aliases, and maybe even other personal account names, and who already probably has a bad record.
<< <i>I would pay the shipping both ways, after the coins that I sold them were returned in the same condition as I shipped them. I would also demand that the coins be shipped insured and tell them that the package will be opened in front of your Postal clerk upon arrival. I have done this before and so far no erroneous contents. Regardless, if this person is a crook or stupid you are at his mercy with ebay. I would make the best of a bad situation. Best of luck. Jim >>
Why is it important to open the package in front of a postal clerk? I would not expect them to be an expert witness in court.
I think you will be okay now that he dug his hole. It is a good thing you only have to deal with a few of these per 500 to 1000 transactions. >>
Gee, it is kind of obvious. He can verify BEFORE he hands it to you that it isn't damaged. Also if it doesn't leave the clerk's sight BEFORE you open it, then he can verify that you didn't modify/tamper with the package in any way so what is in it is what he sent. Therefore if it is rocks, then he sent you rocks. If it is the coins, they will be in their original slabs as sent or in slabs which have been compromised.
<< <i>Coinguy1, do you still think this buyer is simply uneducated?
It is admirable to afford most everyone the benefit "honest until proven otherwise", but this guy is clearly a crook. >>
No. But until he tried to get a lower price under the threat of negative feedback, my preference was to give him the benefit of the doubt. Nothing was risked in doing so, and in corresponding with him a a polite fashion.
Apparently he showed it to someone he trusts and they told him he did well with his purchase. Glad you didn't get a neg.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>I'd guess that the buyer is an absolute scammer and not really as uneducated as some would like to believe. Unfortunately, this is the world we live in. So since we're in the real world and not fantasy land all I can say is this mrs BLOCKED...
Actually, maybe he's really unhappy with his last purchase: A Mens Thong...Bet he tries to return that too... >>
Im guessing someone from here emailed him through ebay and swayed him or showed him this thread and he changed his mind. Still blocked by me though. I don't need the hassle!
Awarded the coveted "You Suck" Award on 22 Oct 2010 for finding a 1942/1 D Dime in silver, and on 7 Feb 2011 Cherrypicking a 1914 MPL Cent on Ebay!
Comments
<< <i>I'll add a little story of my own. I had a few unopened proof sets I placed on ebay. They were from 1950-1955. No reserve, all sold quickly. I kept one each for myself. They were 100% orginal and authentic; they were passed down by a relative who purchased them new. One buyer bought two sets and immediately came back and stated they were not original, been taken out of mint packaging. etc. He called me a crook. I was pissed and opened all of my own sets; as expected, they were spot on. I questioned the guy, and after doing so, it was obvious he had switched the coins. I refused to refund him knowing I would lose, and I did. When I received the return, it was easy to see he switched on me. Bottom line: as a seller you are basically out of luck, with few exceptions.
That could be this guy.
We'll see.
<< <i>I have not replied since his last message 20 minutes ago....
now he sends me this......
I have a Question, are you going to put the money in my account first before I send them back? How do I know that you will credit my account when you recieve the coins. Or should i go through ebay's resolution center to solve this situation? >>
Ok if this was me, as the seller i would take the negative and tell him to shove it-i see a negative in your future no matter what you do to make it right also i see a bag of rocks in place of the silver,i have had this scam pulled on me several times and no matter what i did to make it right i still got the shaft,you at the mercy of bad buyers and Ebay too.
<< <i>That sucks, sorry to hear this is happening.
I want to believe like Mark posted, but I am thinking he may have been trying to get money back and keep the items. >>
Many members on this forum that now it cannot fit in my signature. Please ask for entire list.
<< <i>So are you going to pay the shipping, because I am not at fault with this. I was born at night, but not last night. I would have loved to keep these coins and not gone through all this hassle >>
Note that eBay defines a full refund as the buyer paying return shipping link
"A full refund is one that covers the cost of the item and original shipping. If you've received an item and want a full refund, you'll usually need to send the item back to the seller. Buyers are responsible for paying return shipping unless the buyer and seller have reached a different agreement. In unusual circumstances, eBay may pay return shipping."
<< <i>He's gonna neg you no matter what. Your response about not refunding the return shipping sealed that deal. Let him open a case.....he won't get his return shipping even if he wins. Also, if he doesn't use delivery confirm when he sends them back, claim he never sent them back.......that way, you can take him down with you. >>
I don't think I could do that and feel good about what I did. Even though the creep probably deserves it.
It's like 2 wrongs to make a right.
Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
- matthewprymak
Sounds like feedback extortion to me. Save that email.
ok
he's whacked.
<< <i>"Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor ... Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there."
Sounds like feedback extortion to me. Save that email. >>
and with 5 feedback.
one has to wonder if he's got more experience than his 5 feedback shows. perhaps he had a past life on eBay...
<< <i>It sounds like the slabs were already opened by the buyer. >>
and if they're not, it sounds like he's capable.
MsMorrisine
you have a couple pm's
<< <i>Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
- matthewprymak >>
Got him by the b*lls now. Feedback extortion. Send the emails on to ebay (call first) and you will not be negged.
bob
<< <i>"Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor ... Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there."
Sounds like feedback extortion to me. Save that email. >>
Yep. Mate in 2 moves. Forward to ebay, wait for reply. Game over. --jerry
<< <i>He is admitted the slabs are sealed. He seems to be accusing NGC of switching the coins. One good thing about that last email is he is admitting the slabs are sealed, so he can't filed a claim saying they aren't... >>
....no, I think he's still saying the "containers" were tampered with.....by a "3rd party"...........I think
......I collect old stuff......
then ask him why he thinks tamper proof containers can be tampered with....
Call ebay (I know some folks around here have the number; if I did, I would post it for you).
Explain and show them the mail. The guy SHOULD be unable to return and SHOULD NOT be able to leave feedback, or, if he does leave negative, ebay SHOULD remove it due to extortion threat.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
for someone that is very confident in his ability to tell a MS69 from one that isn't,
I find it odd the person doesn't know the deal with tamper proof slabs.
I'm gonna call it a day now but just want to thank all of you for your advice and support....you are the best of the best......
These crooks just think they are going one on one with there targets, in reality they are taking on some of the sharpest folks in the hobby...
.....the folks on these boards.....
I want to block them!
<< <i>What is this person's eBay name?
I want to block them! >>
Dennis, Eric posted it
" matthewprymak " is the jerk doing this to him.
Eric, definitely relax, try not to think about it tonight, and then get with ebay in the morning and tell this guy to take a hike.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
in trouble. Keep too your guns with the offer you made and if the neg comes leave a
response to it and people will understand. This may get worst before it gets over.
Good Luck
<< <i>Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. >>
This is gold. CALL eBay--don't email them--and don't email the buyer back until you hear from them on the phone. Get them to tell you in writing that they recognize this as feedback extortion and ask them to make a note of the call. You can probably get them to either favor your not allowing the return, or certainly covering your back if you get a neg. You definitely should be out of the return shipping offer at this point.
<< <i>I would pay the shipping both ways, after the coins that I sold them were returned in the same condition as I shipped them. I would also demand that the coins be shipped insured and tell them that the package will be opened in front of your Postal clerk upon arrival. I have done this before and so far no erroneous contents. Regardless, if this person is a crook or stupid you are at his mercy with ebay. I would make the best of a bad situation. Best of luck.
Jim >>
Why is it important to open the package in front of a postal clerk? I would not expect them to be an expert witness in court.
I think you will be okay now that he dug his hole. It is a good thing you only have to deal with a few of these per 500 to 1000 transactions.
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
<< <i>Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
- matthewprymak >>
Report this email to eBay then tell this bastage to go #$%^ off!
The name is LEE!
He obviously can't see $42 per eagle is not a bad deal, considering they are in NGC slabs, and marked as Early Releases.
I agree with reimbursing him the return shipping costs and be done with him. Block him from bidding on future auctions of yours. Let him know you'll refund his purchase price after you receive the coins back from him. That way you're assured their return and he doesn't keep the coins after getting his refund.
<< <i>Why is it important to open the package in front of a postal clerk? I would not expect them to be an expert witness in court.
I think you will be okay now that he dug his hole. It is a good thing you only have to deal with a few of these per 500 to 1000 transactions. >>
Opening the package in front of a postal clerk on delivery would further validate your claim if you need to file mail fraud charges with the postal inspectors if there is a discrepancy with the item returned (like if he sends you a box of rocks).
Pry is his middle name.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>
<< <i>Well I just got home from work...and a stop to get a couple beers....anyway I was hoping this guy would show his true self in print....he did.....
from the buyer.......
Dear beers3740,
I looked at the site you gave me, and it explains clearly that items sold in the tamper proof containers are true to the grading. But doesn't explain to me anything about how to handle a situation when a third party member has tampered with the container. Other than personal knowledge telling me to write an honest feedback which will not be in your favor. I have a trust issue now, because how do I know that when I send the coins back you will refund my money. Lets compromise where I pay melt value plus $2.00 an oz. and no feed back has to be written and end it there. I will then re-pry them open, and send you back the containers, because the coins in there now are not MS69. Then go our seperate ways.
- matthewprymak >>
Report this email to eBay then tell this bastage to go #$%^ off! >>
No kidding! THis is akin to being in an automobile accident, and the other person saying "Just pay me cash for damages, and we won't claim it on insurance." because that guy HAS NO insurance and doesn't want to get in trouble. At this point, I'd risk the Neg and report him.
Dwayne F. Sessom
Ebay ID: V-Nickel-Coins
<< <i>
<< <i>I would pay the shipping both ways, after the coins that I sold them were returned in the same condition as I shipped them. I would also demand that the coins be shipped insured and tell them that the package will be opened in front of your Postal clerk upon arrival. I have done this before and so far no erroneous contents. Regardless, if this person is a crook or stupid you are at his mercy with ebay. I would make the best of a bad situation. Best of luck.
Jim >>
Why is it important to open the package in front of a postal clerk? I would not expect them to be an expert witness in court.
I think you will be okay now that he dug his hole. It is a good thing you only have to deal with a few of these per 500 to 1000 transactions. >>
Gee, it is kind of obvious. He can verify BEFORE he hands it to you that it isn't damaged. Also if it doesn't leave the clerk's sight BEFORE you open it, then he can verify that you didn't modify/tamper with the package in any way so what is in it is what he sent. Therefore if it is rocks, then he sent you rocks. If it is the coins, they will be in their original slabs as sent or in slabs which have been compromised.
It is admirable to afford most everyone the benefit "honest until proven otherwise", but this guy is clearly a crook.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
<< <i>Coinguy1, do you still think this buyer is simply uneducated?
It is admirable to afford most everyone the benefit "honest until proven otherwise", but this guy is clearly a crook. >>
No. But until he tried to get a lower price under the threat of negative feedback, my preference was to give him the benefit of the doubt. Nothing was risked in doing so, and in corresponding with him a a polite fashion.
Update in 1st post......
The name is LEE!
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>I'd guess that the buyer is an absolute scammer and not really as uneducated as some would like to believe. Unfortunately, this is the world we live in. So since we're in the real world and not fantasy land all I can say is this m
Actually, maybe he's really unhappy with his last purchase: A Mens Thong...Bet he tries to return that too...
There was nothing thong with that.
Successful BST Transactions!SIconbuster, Meltdown, Mission16, slothman2000, RGjohn, braddick, au58lover, allcoinsrule, commemdude, gerard, lablade, PCcoins, greencopper, kaz, tydye, cucamongacoin, mkman123, SeaEaglecoins, Doh!, AnkurJ, Airplanenut, ArizonaJack, JJM,Tee135,LordMarcovan, Swampboy, piecesofme, Ahrensdad,
<< <i>Matthew PRY mak
Pry is his middle name. >>