<< <i>It's not nepotism, it's environment, love and DNA.
The second generation has a headstart merely on the basis of having a worKing numismatist in the house.
Kleinsteuber is very sharp; he works for Tim Carroll, though Tim says Matt thinks it's the opposite. Ryan Carroll is uniquely positioned with natural talent, home-schooling, PCGS grader experience, excellent post-graduate tutelage, and the Heritage financial and distribution platforms. >>
How idealistic of you. Just so you know, I said that somewhat in jest in that I am a second generation coin dealer and part of the sub-30 crowd. Yes I have been doing this my whole life but I would likely not be in this business if not for my family connection. Especially with the economy as it is, a lot more 2nd generation people are entering the business. I think within the sub-30 and even the sub-40 crowd, there are a lot of up and coming dealers but few if any future numismatic scholars. >>
I'm reallly not very idealistic at all.
If you learned numismatics (and the coin business, a very different thing) at your daddy's knee, you have an incredible head-start.
If, after a (short) lifetime not knowing about how dad pays the bills, you get a job because of nepotism, not because of "the love which dares not speak its name" (because people laugh at you), you stand a very good chance of being broke a year or two after dad retires.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - Geo. Orwell
<< <i>Keep in mind that there's a big difference between "coin dealers" and people that are just buyers that have a secret sauce in the crack-out game... >>
Let's differentiate 1) crack out artists (better graders than you and eat your heart out) 2) coin doctors (better chemists and/or physicists than you as well as, with a very high degree of probabilty, better graders than you).
A crack-out dealer's secret sauce is the years and years of intensive training which not only tunes his "eye" but informs his understanding of what the gestalt of the coin is. These trained and disciplined perceptions, informed by information and perspectives those more ignorant don't even imagine exist, set off the "gradar" (where's that tiny "tm" symbol LA uses?).
It's not secret sauce. It's mojo.
It's losing money on coins you love. And what you learn from it And how you use it.
A dealer friend, seeing a glorious 1911 10c PF68 NGC fattie in an auction, asked a very very prominent East Coast Dealer if that dealer was interested. He got what many recognize as the ECD Auction(wholesale) Party Line (channeling John Pittman): "Don't even bother to put your hand up. I'm buying it."
ECD came in 4th to three dealers with better foresight and better eyesight and better eyes. 1911 10c PF68 NGC. Bought at under 12K all-in.
Six weeks later. ECD buys 1911 10c PF69 NGC. Schweeeeeeet.
Best proof Barber 10c I've ever seen - 35K.
The crack-out story - priceless
And all made possible because ECD took on the role of enabler. Hey, everyone has to have a business plan.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - Geo. Orwell
<< <i>Keep in mind that there's a big difference between "coin dealers" and people that are just buyers that have a secret sauce in the crack-out game... >>
Let's differentiate 1) crack out artists (better graders than you and eat your heart out) 2) coin doctors (better chemists and/or physicists than you as well as, with a very high degree of probabilty, better graders than you).
A crack-out dealer's secret sauce is the years and years of intensive training which not only tunes his "eye" but informs his understanding of what the gestalt of the coin is. These trained and disciplined perceptions informed by information and perspectives those more ignorant don't even imagine exist, set off the "gradar" (where's that tiny "tm" symbol LA uses?).
It's not secret sauce. It's mojo. >>
I'm not arguing at all that both 1 and 2 have better eyes than I...However, the problem is that many crack-out guys have learned that the easy way is to chemically enhance their coins, which PCGS has figured out (or at least finally pursued).
The reference was to "crack-out dealers with secret sauce". I differentiate between crackers and doctors precisely because of the doctor controversy. I'll stop if you will. I know I helped get things off topic. Sorry all.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - Geo. Orwell
<< <i>How are we defining " "new" great dealers" and what makes them great?
Their sales volume? Their ability to pick out the rare variety in a junk box? Their ability to upgrade coins from the bourse that no one else thought could upgrade? By any means possible? Their contributions to the hobby (ie. mentoring new collectors, teaching courses at national shows and at the ANA summer seminars, writing books and artciles, etc.)? Their stepping up to fight the unseemly elements in numismatics (outing counterfeits and frauds on ebay, testifying against crooked telemarketers, etc.)? Just being pleasant and knowledgeable on the bourse and in chatrooms? >>
I think its the ability to earn a liviing. I had ryan carroll earns 7 figures.
I manage money. I earn money. I save money . I give away money. I collect money. I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Comments
<< <i>
<< <i>It's not nepotism, it's environment, love and DNA.
The second generation has a headstart merely on the basis of having a worKing numismatist in the house.
Kleinsteuber is very sharp; he works for Tim Carroll, though Tim says Matt thinks it's the opposite. Ryan Carroll is uniquely positioned with natural talent, home-schooling, PCGS grader experience, excellent post-graduate tutelage, and the Heritage financial and distribution platforms. >>
How idealistic of you. Just so you know, I said that somewhat in jest in that I am a second generation coin dealer and part of the sub-30 crowd. Yes I have been doing this my whole life but I would likely not be in this business if not for my family connection. Especially with the economy as it is, a lot more 2nd generation people are entering the business. I think within the sub-30 and even the sub-40 crowd, there are a lot of up and coming dealers but few if any future numismatic scholars. >>
I'm reallly not very idealistic at all.
If you learned numismatics (and the coin business, a very different thing) at your daddy's knee, you have an incredible head-start.
If, after a (short) lifetime not knowing about how dad pays the bills, you get a job because of nepotism, not because of "the love which dares not speak its name" (because people laugh at you), you stand a very good chance of being broke a year or two after dad retires.
I know that several openly "work" on coins...what does everyone think about that?
<< <i>Keep in mind that there's a big difference between "coin dealers" and people that are just buyers that have a secret sauce in the crack-out game... >>
Let's differentiate
1) crack out artists (better graders than you and eat your heart out)
2) coin doctors (better chemists and/or physicists than you as well as, with a very high degree of probabilty, better graders than you).
A crack-out dealer's secret sauce is the years and years of intensive training which not only tunes his "eye" but informs his understanding of what the gestalt of the coin is. These trained and disciplined perceptions, informed by information and perspectives those more ignorant don't even imagine exist, set off the "gradar" (where's that tiny "tm" symbol LA uses?).
It's not secret sauce. It's mojo.
It's losing money on coins you love.
And what you learn from it
And how you use it.
A dealer friend, seeing a glorious 1911 10c PF68 NGC fattie in an auction, asked a very very prominent East Coast Dealer if that dealer was interested. He got what many recognize as the ECD Auction(wholesale) Party Line (channeling John Pittman): "Don't even bother to put your hand up. I'm buying it."
ECD came in 4th to three dealers with better foresight and better eyesight and better eyes. 1911 10c PF68 NGC. Bought at under 12K all-in.
Six weeks later. ECD buys 1911 10c PF69 NGC. Schweeeeeeet.
Best proof Barber 10c I've ever seen - 35K.
The crack-out story - priceless
And all made possible because ECD took on the role of enabler. Hey, everyone has to have a business plan.
<< <i>
<< <i>Keep in mind that there's a big difference between "coin dealers" and people that are just buyers that have a secret sauce in the crack-out game... >>
Let's differentiate
1) crack out artists (better graders than you and eat your heart out)
2) coin doctors (better chemists and/or physicists than you as well as, with a very high degree of probabilty, better graders than you).
A crack-out dealer's secret sauce is the years and years of intensive training which not only tunes his "eye" but informs his understanding of what the gestalt of the coin is. These trained and disciplined perceptions informed by information and perspectives those more ignorant don't even imagine exist, set off the "gradar" (where's that tiny "tm" symbol LA uses?).
It's not secret sauce. It's mojo.
>>
I'm not arguing at all that both 1 and 2 have better eyes than I...However, the problem is that many crack-out guys have learned that the easy way is to chemically enhance their coins, which PCGS has figured out (or at least finally pursued).
I know guys with amazing eyes who had to be told what acetone does or don't even know how to dip a coin.
<< <i>How are we defining " "new" great dealers" and what makes them great?
Their sales volume?
Their ability to pick out the rare variety in a junk box?
Their ability to upgrade coins from the bourse that no one else thought could upgrade? By any means possible?
Their contributions to the hobby (ie. mentoring new collectors, teaching courses at national shows and at the ANA summer seminars, writing books and artciles, etc.)?
Their stepping up to fight the unseemly elements in numismatics (outing counterfeits and frauds on ebay, testifying against crooked telemarketers, etc.)?
Just being pleasant and knowledgeable on the bourse and in chatrooms? >>
I think its the ability to earn a liviing. I had ryan carroll earns 7 figures.
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.