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Inefficiencies Cited in US Mint’s Bullion Coin Programs

MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 36,594 ✭✭✭✭✭
Inefficiencies Cited in US Mint’s Bullion Coin Programs

<< <i>This is the result of the legislative requirement that precious metals for the coins must come from newly mined U.S. deposits. >>



I've not seen that in the law, but maybe it does exist.


Clark concluded his statement on the US Mint's bullion coin programs by providing three recommendations to Congress:
    1. Authorize the Mint to produce both proof and uncirculated versions of the Gold and Silver Eagle Coins, regardless of hte demand requirements of the bullion coins, to ensure uninterrupted supply of the market;
    2. Direct the General Accountability Office to undertake a review of the Mint's procurement process for blanks, and seek its recommendations on what can be done to improve it; and
    3. Require that the Mint procure the blanks for its bullion programs from sources within the United States by no later than 2014.


Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions

Comments

  • SmittysSmittys Posts: 9,876 ✭✭✭✭✭
    US made blanks yes, but produce to meet demand, why?
    The US Mint is not a broker for precious metals.
  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 36,594 ✭✭✭✭✭
    that is in the law.

    and maybe the law does need to change.

    After all, proofs of the bullion versions are invested in as well, and they have a higher markup.

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • Steve27Steve27 Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭


    << <i>US made blanks yes, but produce to meet demand, why?
    The US Mint is not a broker for precious metals. >>



    The US Mint is not a broker, but a supplier of precious metals. They saw demand for the Krugerrand soar in the early eighties, and after a false start, they have become the premier supplier in the US.

    "It's far easier to fight for principles, than to live up to them." Adlai Stevenson
  • RWBRWB Posts: 8,082
    I watched the hearing. Clark’s comments and Moy’s also were incomplete.

    Moy mentioned that getting fabricated planchets was not always possible. What he left out is that the Mint had entertained proposals from multiple domestic companies who claimed to be able to supply planchets. But samples that most provided did not meet specifications. Further, some suppliers demanded huge future commitments that the Mint could not responsibly accept – the bullion pieces are demand driven, and as we have seen, predicting what the public wants is an inexact process.

    Clark also carried forward the palladium proposal, but neglected to mention that there is only one producer in the US, and that there is a very limited commercial market for the metal. Further, that market is shrinking. His organization is there to promote its agenda, not what is best. As far as the gold planchets being made in Australia, the cost per planchet (from US gold) is still less than any US supplier quoted. Competition.

    Remember, as a Government agency, the US Mint cannot advocate, so it cannot compete with private industry groups or lobbyists who represent ONLY their interests.
  • BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 31,427 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>US made blanks yes, but produce to meet demand, why?
    The US Mint is not a broker for precious metals. >>



    Apparently, a lot of the blanks aren't made here.
    theknowitalltroll;
  • BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 31,427 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>that is in the law.

    and maybe the law does need to change.

    After all, proofs of the bullion versions are invested in as well, and they have a higher markup. >>



    Why not just break the law; happens all the time?
    theknowitalltroll;
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This entire issue (no proofs last year - maybe none this year) just does not have the ring of truth. I am sure the bullion program not only supplied demand, but there were excess planchets to begin this year. Yes, proof planchets are different (or so I have been told), however, there is no reason that they could not have been procured and provided. I do not know what the true issue is behind this mess, however, I do not accept that which has been offered. Cheers, RickO
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,969 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>This entire issue (no proofs last year - maybe none this year) just does not have the ring of truth. I am sure the bullion program not only supplied demand, but there were excess planchets to begin this year. Yes, proof planchets are different (or so I have been told), however, there is no reason that they could not have been procured and provided. I do not know what the true issue is behind this mess, however, I do not accept that which has been offered. Cheers, RickO >>



    I have been told, though I do not know if it is true, that for many years the Mint's purchasing specifications for American Eagle planchets has required all planchets to be good enough to use for Proofs, so that the Mint does not have to go through shipments of planchets to pick out the nicest ones to use for Proofs.

    "IF" this is so, it seems to be a bit wasteful. They could order one batch of, say, 125% of their expected Proof mintage to the higher standard, and just kick any rejects in that batch down to regular production. The rest of the planchets could have a few nicks on them, though of course some of the picky-picky people on this forum would object if they got a coin with a planchet flaw on it that survived the strike.

    TD
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Author "The Enigmatic Lincoln Cents of 1922," due out late 2025.
  • RWBRWB Posts: 8,082
    The mint had backorders for bullion pieces. They were (are) required by law to fulfill that market. Collectors' proofs are not part of the law, that's why Moy asked Congress to change the law to permit proofs even if there were unmet bullion demand.
  • BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 31,427 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>This entire issue (no proofs last year - maybe none this year) just does not have the ring of truth. I am sure the bullion program not only supplied demand, but there were excess planchets to begin this year. Yes, proof planchets are different (or so I have been told), however, there is no reason that they could not have been procured and provided. I do not know what the true issue is behind this mess, however, I do not accept that which has been offered. Cheers, RickO >>



    I have been told, though I do not know if it is true, that for many years the Mint's purchasing specifications for American Eagle planchets has required all planchets to be good enough to use for Proofs, so that the Mint does not have to go through shipments of planchets to pick out the nicest ones to use for Proofs.

    "IF" this is so, it seems to be a bit wasteful. They could order one batch of, say, 125% of their expected Proof mintage to the higher standard, and just kick any rejects in that batch down to regular production. The rest of the planchets could have a few nicks on them, though of course some of the picky-picky people on this forum would object if they got a coin with a planchet flaw on it that survived the strike.

    TD >>



    Mule muffins. If the requirements are different they should be made to spec. Proof blanks meet proof specs and bullion blanks should meet bullion blank spec. No sorting should be needed. Frankly, I don't know why the mint doesn't make their own.
    theknowitalltroll;
  • 19Lyds19Lyds Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭
    Personally, I do not think the blanks are different from proof to bullion.

    What is different is the preparation process prior to minting.

    As for the time limits on when the gold was pulled out of the ground, from the Gold Bullion Act of 1985:

    image
    I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.



    The name is LEE!
  • RWBRWB Posts: 8,082
    Proof blanks have to be polished before use, otherwise the mirror surface on the die will quickly degrade.

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