The best ever Super Bowl winning quarterbacks
sportscardtheory
Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭
I did this just for fun. I only allowed QBs with at least one Super Bowl victory with at least one appearance in a top ten all-time stat category and every QB with two Super Bowl victories. They received 10 points for a Super Bowl victory, -3 points for a Super Bowl loss, 5 points for a Super Bowl MVP Award, 4 points for a League MVP Award, 4 points for every top-five finish in an all-time stat category, 2 points for every top-ten finish in an all-time stat category, 2 points for being number one all-time in any all-time stat category and 1 point every time he led the league in any meaningful stat category. This is what I came up with.
1. Joe Montana (4SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(10TTx2)+(17LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(3SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 100
2. Peyton Manning (1SBx10)+(5T5x4)+(14TTx2)+(19LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(4LMVPx4)+(1#1ATx2)= 97
3. Steve Young (1SBx10)+(2T5x4)+(7TTx2)+(34LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 79
4. Brett Favre (1SBx10)+(3T5x4)+(7TTx2)+(22LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(3LMVPx4)+(4#1ATx2)= 75
5. Johnny Unitas (1SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(2TTx2)+(33LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(3LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 59+(2xNFL World Championx5)= 69
6. Tom Brady (3SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(8TTx2)+(10LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 67
7. Drew Brees (1SBx10)+(4T5x4)+(10TTx2)+(14LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(1#1ATx2)= 67
8. Bart Starr (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(1TTx2)+(13LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 49+(3xNFL World Championx5)= 64
9. Len Dawson (1SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(2TTx2)+(27LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 47+(3xAFL Championx5)= 62
10. Terry Bradshaw (4SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(7LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 61
11. Kurt Warner (1SBx10)+(1T5x4)+(8TTx2)+(22LL)+(2SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 59
12. John Elway (2SBx10)+(3T5x4)+(4TTx2)+(5LL)+(3SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 45
13. Troy Aikman (3SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(4LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 39
14. Roger Staubach (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(1TTx2)+(14LL)+(2SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 35
15. Ben Roethlisberger (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(3TTx2)+(4LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 30
16. Bob Griese (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(5LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 22
17. Jim Plunkett (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(1LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 21
According to this criteria, Peyton Manning will become the "best" QB in NFL history with a victory on Sunday. (That didn't go as planned, lol.)
Edited to add "Super Bowl winning" to title and to add Drew Brees and update Peyton Manning.
1. Joe Montana (4SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(10TTx2)+(17LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(3SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 100
2. Peyton Manning (1SBx10)+(5T5x4)+(14TTx2)+(19LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(4LMVPx4)+(1#1ATx2)= 97
3. Steve Young (1SBx10)+(2T5x4)+(7TTx2)+(34LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 79
4. Brett Favre (1SBx10)+(3T5x4)+(7TTx2)+(22LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(3LMVPx4)+(4#1ATx2)= 75
5. Johnny Unitas (1SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(2TTx2)+(33LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(3LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 59+(2xNFL World Championx5)= 69
6. Tom Brady (3SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(8TTx2)+(10LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 67
7. Drew Brees (1SBx10)+(4T5x4)+(10TTx2)+(14LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(1#1ATx2)= 67
8. Bart Starr (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(1TTx2)+(13LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 49+(3xNFL World Championx5)= 64
9. Len Dawson (1SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(2TTx2)+(27LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 47+(3xAFL Championx5)= 62
10. Terry Bradshaw (4SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(7LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 61
11. Kurt Warner (1SBx10)+(1T5x4)+(8TTx2)+(22LL)+(2SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 59
12. John Elway (2SBx10)+(3T5x4)+(4TTx2)+(5LL)+(3SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 45
13. Troy Aikman (3SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(4LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 39
14. Roger Staubach (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(1TTx2)+(14LL)+(2SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 35
15. Ben Roethlisberger (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(3TTx2)+(4LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 30
16. Bob Griese (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(5LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 22
17. Jim Plunkett (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(1LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 21
According to this criteria, Peyton Manning will become the "best" QB in NFL history with a victory on Sunday. (That didn't go as planned, lol.)
Edited to add "Super Bowl winning" to title and to add Drew Brees and update Peyton Manning.
0
Comments
Additionally, Aikman was not better than Staubach (put it this way.....how many Super Bowls would Staubach's Cowboys have won if it hadn't been for the Steel Curtain?). This also affects Bradshaw, as he was the benefactor of the Steel Curtain.
Steve
Edited to fix a typo
super bowl wins are way overrated. sadly voters for the hall of fame fawn over it. if jerry rice had been drafted by tampa bay or the st. louis cardinals he would not have had the numbers he had but he would not have been any less great.
there are a dozen receivers better than lynn swann that are not in the HOF.
Steve
<< <i>I would have to say the tops 3 are Marino, Favre, Manning (Peyton not Eli or Archie). Mainly because they hold, have held, or will hold all of the records. >>
Then again this is coming from an armchair QB whose main sport is Baseball.
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Ralph
QBs
1-Johnny Unitas
2-Joe Montana
3-Peyton Manning
4- Otto Graham
5- Brett Favre
6- Dan Marino
7- John Elway
8- Sammy Baugh
9- Tom Brady
10-Roger Staubach
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>My personal top 10, regardless of what happens Sunday.
QBs
1-Johnny Unitas
2-Joe Montana
3-Peyton Manning
4- Otto Graham
5- Brett Favre
6- Dan Marino
7- John Elway
8- Sammy Baugh
9- Tom Brady
10-Roger Staubach >>
This is a good list. I might knock off Staubach and put in Young though.
<< <i>I did this just for fun. I only allowed QBs with at least one Super Bowl victory with at least one time in a top ten stat category and every QB with two Super Bowl victories. They received 10 points for a Super Bowl victory, -3 points for a Super Bowl loss, 5 points for a Super Bowl MVP Award, 4 points for a League MVP Award, 4 points for every top-five finish in an all-time stat category, 2 points for every top-ten finish in an all-time stat category, 2 points for being number one all-time in any all-time stat category and 1 point every time he led the league in any meaningful stat category. This is what I came up with.
1. Joe Montana (4SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(10TTx2)+(17LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(3SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 100
2. Peyton Manning (1SBx10)+(5T5x4)+(14TTx2)+(19LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(4LMVPx4)+(1#1ATx2)= 100
3. Steve Young (1SBx10)+(2T5x4)+(7TTx2)+(34LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 79
4. Brett Favre (1SBx10)+(3T5x4)+(7TTx2)+(22LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(3LMVPx4)+(4#1ATx2)= 75
5. Tom Brady (3SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(8TTx2)+(10LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 67
6. Terry Bradshaw (4SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(7LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 61
7 Johhny Unitas (1SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(2TTx2)+(33LL)+(SBLx-3)+(SBMVPx5)+(3LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 59
8. Kurt Warner (1SBx10)+(1T5x4)+(8TTx2)+(22LL)+(2SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(2LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 59
9. Bart Starr (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(1TTx2)+(13LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(2SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 49
10. John Elway (2SBx10)+(3T5x4)+(4TTx2)+(5LL)+(3SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(1LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 45
11 Len Dawson (1SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(2TTx2)+(27LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 43
12. Troy Aikman (3SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(4LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 39
13. Roger Staubach (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(1TTx2)+(14LL)+(2SBLx-3)+(1SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 35
14. Ben Roethlisberger (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(3TTx2)+(4LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 30
15. Bob Griese (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(5LL)+(1SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 22
16. Jim Plunkett (2SBx10)+(0T5x4)+(0TTx2)+(1LL)+(0SBLx-3)+(0SBMVPx5)+(0LMVPx4)+(0#1ATx2)= 21
>>
Good list. I think for a qb you should have won at least one championship to be considered one of the greatest. No one remembers who came in 2nd place.
<< <i>Try the Sports Talk forum ALT >>
ALT ALT ALT ALT ALT You sound like a broken record. And FOR the record, stop making baseless and libelous accusations towards me or I will take it up with the people who run this board. Just because you have been here longer, does not give you the right to continuously harass me and slander my name. You better lay off, buddy. I'm not joking around with you.
<< <i>
<< <i>My personal top 10, regardless of what happens Sunday.
QBs
1-Johnny Unitas
2-Joe Montana
3-Peyton Manning
4- Otto Graham
5- Brett Favre
6- Dan Marino
7- John Elway
8- Sammy Baugh
9- Tom Brady
10-Roger Staubach >>
This is a good list. I might knock off Staubach and put in Young though. >>
Yeah for some Young love. Interestingly, Young's career rushing numbers are almost identical to Gale Sayers!
Solid list Jason. My list looks like this:
#1 - Johnny Unitas
#2 - Otto Graham
#3 - Peyton Manning
#4 - Joe Montana
#5 - Dan Marino
#6 - John Elway
#7 - Tom Brady
#8 - Sammy Baugh
#9 - Brett Favre
#10 - Sid Luckman
I agree w/ Jason's list.... Being a HUGE Marino fan, I always want to rate him higher than most because he never played with the talent that most other great quarterbacks did. Just because he never won a SB doesn't warrent him from being dropped into oblivion...
Rgs,
Greg M.
References:
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E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
Where do you rank YA Tittle? I've always thought that he was underrated. He played 17 years in an era when most players lasted less than 10. He threw a high ratio of TD to Int, but was tough as nails and I believe that he retired as the passing yardage and TD champion.
But once again, he never won a championship which was a black mark against him. He was the Jim Kelly / Frank Tarkenton of his day....(losing multiple championship games).
Rgs,
Greg M.
References:
Onlychild, Ahmanfan, fabfrank, wufdude, jradke, Reese, Jasp, thenavarro
E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
I'm surprised Fran Tarkenton didn't make the list with three SB losses and some great stats from '67-78 (SB era).
My Top 20 would be:
1. Montana
2. Graham
3. P. Manning
4. Starr
5. Unitas
6. Staubach
7. Young
8. Baugh
9. Favre
10. Brady
11. Marino
12. Tarkenton
13. Jurgensen
14. Elway
15. Bradshaw
16. Tittle
17. Fouts
18. Layne
19. Luckman
20. Dawson
*edited to expand to 20 QB's*
<< <i>That's an interesting way to rate the Qb's in the Super Bowl era. At least the QB's who made the Super Bowl.
I'm surprised Fran Tarkenton didn't make the list with three SB losses and some great stats from '67-78 (SB era). >>
Tarkenton falls off the list due to all of his recent snide remarks about Favre
Steve
it would be libel, and not slander.
And while I applaud you for coming up with a formula to try and quantify the unquantifiable, it is in the end just that. It lacks in certain areas.
<< <i>SCT,
it would be libel, and not slander.
And while I applaud you for coming up with a formula to try and quantify the unquantifiable, it is in the end just that. It lacks in certain areas. >>
I'm fairly certain most people knew what I meant... but thanks for telling me what I already know. I also take it you missed where I mentioned that I did the list for fun. If there is a better way to rank SB winning QBs, by all means, thrill us.
<< <i>
<< <i>SCT,
it would be libel, and not slander.
And while I applaud you for coming up with a formula to try and quantify the unquantifiable, it is in the end just that. It lacks in certain areas. >>
I'm fairly certain most people knew what I meant... but thanks for telling me what I already know. I also take it you missed where I mentioned that I did the list for fun. If there is a better way to rank SB winning QBs, by all means, thrill us. >>
It is this exact reason you are so disliked around these boards. You look for drama in every post, and assume everyone is against you.
You take a post, like mine, that is complimenting your contribution to these forums and is in no way attempting to discredit you, and instantly make it a "the world vs SCT" post. I'm sick of you're attitude.
While I'm sure Bill is to blame for some of this, it is plain to see that you're attitude is contributing to the problem as well.
When you're done playing the victim and thinking everyone here is out to get you, then maybe you will realize that it is possible to carry on civil, lively debate here. Until then, you'll just alienate other posters like myself who are put off by your pompous and holier-than-thou attitude.
Good day.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>SCT,
it would be libel, and not slander.
And while I applaud you for coming up with a formula to try and quantify the unquantifiable, it is in the end just that. It lacks in certain areas. >>
I'm fairly certain most people knew what I meant... but thanks for telling me what I already know. I also take it you missed where I mentioned that I did the list for fun. If there is a better way to rank SB winning QBs, by all means, thrill us. >>
It is this exact reason you are so disliked around these boards. You look for drama in every post, and assume everyone is against you.
You take a post, like mine, that is complimenting your contribution to these forums and is in no way attempting to discredit you, and instantly make it a "the world vs SCT" post. I'm sick of you're attitude.
While I'm sure Bill is to blame for some of this, it is plain to see that you're attitude is contributing to the problem as well.
When you're done playing the victim and thinking everyone here is out to get you, then maybe you will realize that it is possible to carry on civil, lively debate here. Until then, you'll just alienate other posters like myself who are put off by your pompous and holier-than-thou attitude.
Good day. >>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>SCT,
it would be libel, and not slander.
And while I applaud you for coming up with a formula to try and quantify the unquantifiable, it is in the end just that. It lacks in certain areas. >>
I'm fairly certain most people knew what I meant... but thanks for telling me what I already know. I also take it you missed where I mentioned that I did the list for fun. If there is a better way to rank SB winning QBs, by all means, thrill us. >>
It is this exact reason you are so disliked around these boards. You look for drama in every post, and assume everyone is against you.
You take a post, like mine, that is complimenting your contribution to these forums and is in no way attempting to discredit you, and instantly make it a "the world vs SCT" post. I'm sick of you're attitude.
While I'm sure Bill is to blame for some of this, it is plain to see that you're attitude is contributing to the problem as well.
When you're done playing the victim and thinking everyone here is out to get you, then maybe you will realize that it is possible to carry on civil, lively debate here. Until then, you'll just alienate other posters like myself who are put off by your pompous and holier-than-thou attitude.
Good day. >>
It's funny that you explain pretty well why I get so defensive, yet you attack me while knowing what you just typed in the previous sentence. It is true that a select few have made my time here miserable, and you see that, yet you side with them. Maybe if you didn't "correct" my somewhat purposeful mis-usage of a word, I would not have been so abrasive with you. Good day indeed.
APPLY THAT TO BASEBALL AND WS WINS...THEN ERNIE BANKS MUST REALLY SUCK.
AS A BIGTIME RAIDER FAN...I THINK WE CAN DROP JIMBO OFF THE LIST.
1948-76 Topps FB Sets
FB & BB HOF Player sets
1948-1993 NY Yankee Team Sets
<< <i>LIST OF GREAT QB'S FOR SURE.
APPLY THAT TO BASEBALL AND WS WINS...THEN ERNIE BANKS MUST REALLY SUCK.
AS A BIGTIME RAIDER FAN...I THINK WE CAN DROP JIMBO OFF THE LIST. >>
It's really not that cut and dry. It's a division of opinions that some people think a truly great QB should have won at least 1 SB, and some people don't care. I think a truly great QB should have at least 1 SB... it's just my opinion. And you know the baseball comparison is weak. Baseball players don't take every offensive pitch and directly affect the outcome of the game like a QB who takes every offensive snap.
<< <i>
<< <i>LIST OF GREAT QB'S FOR SURE.
APPLY THAT TO BASEBALL AND WS WINS...THEN ERNIE BANKS MUST REALLY SUCK.
AS A BIGTIME RAIDER FAN...I THINK WE CAN DROP JIMBO OFF THE LIST. >>
It's really not that cut and dry. It's a division of opinions that some people think a truly great QB should have won at least 1 SB, and some people don't care. I think a truly great QB should have at least 1 SB... it's just my opinion. And you know the baseball comparison is weak. Baseball players don't take every offensive pitch and directly affect the outcome of the game like a QB who takes every offensive snap. >>
Your analysis, while effective for the Super Bowl era, does not take into account those QB's that played before the Super Bowl. Johnny Unitas and Otto Graham won championships PRIOR to the Super Bowl, but no points are given to them in your equation. There's nothing wrong with that, but it demonstrates that there is a flaw in your analysis UNLESS you either apply it to ONLY modern QB's OR include NFL and AAFL Championships.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>LIST OF GREAT QB'S FOR SURE.
APPLY THAT TO BASEBALL AND WS WINS...THEN ERNIE BANKS MUST REALLY SUCK.
AS A BIGTIME RAIDER FAN...I THINK WE CAN DROP JIMBO OFF THE LIST. >>
It's really not that cut and dry. It's a division of opinions that some people think a truly great QB should have won at least 1 SB, and some people don't care. I think a truly great QB should have at least 1 SB... it's just my opinion. And you know the baseball comparison is weak. Baseball players don't take every offensive pitch and directly affect the outcome of the game like a QB who takes every offensive snap. >>
Your analysis, while effective for the Super Bowl era, does not take into account those QB's that played before the Super Bowl. Johnny Unitas and Otto Graham won championships PRIOR to the Super Bowl, but no points are given to them in your equation. There's nothing wrong with that, but it demonstrates that there is a flaw in your analysis UNLESS you either apply it to ONLY modern QB's OR include NFL and AAFL Championships. >>
My analysis was only for NFL QBs during the SB era. I thought that was abundantly clear.
<< <i>My analysis was only for NFL QBs during the SB era. I thought that was abundantly clear. >>
The title is: "The best ever NFL quarterbacks"
EVER means ALL. While Super Bowl era only may have been your intention, it was not obvious to many of us which can easily be seen by our inclusion of the likes of Otto Graham, Sammy Baugh, Sid Luckman and the questioning of the low ranking of Johnny Unitas.
<< <i>
<< <i>My analysis was only for NFL QBs during the SB era. I thought that was abundantly clear. >>
The title is: "The best ever NFL quarterbacks"
EVER means ALL. While Super Bowl era only may have been your intention, it was not obvious to many of us which can easily be seen by our inclusion of the likes of Otto Graham, Sammy Baugh, Sid Luckman and the questioning of the low ranking of Johnny Unitas. >>
I'm just going to agree with everyone on here from now on since you can't handle anything else.
You are right. Clearly I meant all QBs and simply forgot to add all the other QBs from the pre-Super Bowl era... my mistake. You are correct.
I just cant think of any possible way to clearly compare an Otto Graham to a Tom Brady, the eras that they played in were drastically different as was the game so I prefer by Decade.
There is no definite answer making anyone right or wrong, it is simply a matter of opinion I think.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>My analysis was only for NFL QBs during the SB era. I thought that was abundantly clear. >>
The title is: "The best ever NFL quarterbacks"
EVER means ALL. While Super Bowl era only may have been your intention, it was not obvious to many of us which can easily be seen by our inclusion of the likes of Otto Graham, Sammy Baugh, Sid Luckman and the questioning of the low ranking of Johnny Unitas. >>
I'm just going to agree with everyone on here from now on since you can't handle anything else.
You are right. Clearly I meant all QBs and simply forgot to add all the other QBs from the pre-Super Bowl era... my mistake. You are correct. >>
Another tantrum? Relax Francis! Aside form your attempt at sarcasm, please know that we all make mistakes, but how we handle them defines who we are. The last time I called someone out and was wrong, I posted a separate public thread with the specific apology. I stick to my guns when I'm right and will admit when I'm wrong. I won't act like a spoiled child and pull the stunts and spew the venom that you are putting forth. Grow up!
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>My analysis was only for NFL QBs during the SB era. I thought that was abundantly clear. >>
The title is: "The best ever NFL quarterbacks"
EVER means ALL. While Super Bowl era only may have been your intention, it was not obvious to many of us which can easily be seen by our inclusion of the likes of Otto Graham, Sammy Baugh, Sid Luckman and the questioning of the low ranking of Johnny Unitas. >>
I'm just going to agree with everyone on here from now on since you can't handle anything else.
You are right. Clearly I meant all QBs and simply forgot to add all the other QBs from the pre-Super Bowl era... my mistake. You are correct. >>
Another tantrum? Relax Francis! Aside form your attempt at sarcasm, please know that we all make mistakes, but how we handle them defines who we are. The last time I called someone out and was wrong, I posted a separate public thread with the specific apology. I stick to my guns when I'm right and will admit when I'm wrong. I won't act like a spoiled child and pull the stunts and spew the venom that you are putting forth. Grow up! >>
Thank you, you are right. I think you are wiser than your years, kind sir. Keep fighting the good fight!
<< <i>No one remembers who came in 2nd place. >>
wrong! everyone knows i came in 2nd/lost four straight super bowls - jim kelly
As Dr Lee would say "Something is not right"
Mike Boogs
Ripken in the Minors * Ripken in the Minors Facebook Page
<< <i>This is always a fun topic - personally I think it is a good idea to break down skill position players by either "Super Bowl" era or better yet by Decade.
I just cant think of any possible way to clearly compare an Otto Graham to a Tom Brady, the eras that they played in were drastically different as was the game so I prefer by Decade.
There is no definite answer making anyone right or wrong, it is simply a matter of opinion I think. >>
I certainly agree. Although every QB on the op list were great and deserving. In the early 80's Plunkett was almost unstoppable and he went against some pretty good teams. And he made alot of great plays during big games.
Elway - Best clutch passer ever with most comeback wins. extremely strong arm.
Aikman/ Staubach - I still cant decide on which one was better
Rothlisberger - on elway's trail for comeback wins and tough competitor
Brady - Just as good as Manning imo
Bradshaw - Best deep passer in the history of the game
Tarkenton - not on the list but was fun to watch. amazing competitor
Fouts - Not on the list but was an amazing talent. His playoff win against miami in 81 might be the best playoff game ever. His defenses were horrible.
1. Manning...When it's all said and done, he will be regarded as #1
2. Johnny U...Tough as nails winner that even his meanest opponents respected
3. Otto Graham...read up on him and you'll wonder why nobody ever mentions him too often
4. Montana....4 rings for maybe the most clutch QB ever
5. Farve....tough as nails gun slingin throwback
6. Marino....never winning a ring should overshadow his rocket arm
7. Young...greatest left hand QB could have played in any era
I always read before I post.
Clear Skies,
Mark
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
<< <i>Johnny U... hands down. >>
He's an interesting case by the standards of this thread. Both Super Bowl era and not Super Bowl era. Three different decades. I think I want him to be No. 1 and have been trying to make the case but not sure if I can do it yet. Prior to the Bowl, he had three championship game appearances. If you treat Championship games like Super Bowls, he was 3-2 while not not playing fully in two of the games. 4 MVPs. Put up some great numbers before QB numbers really took off. Got my first 57 Topps Unitas in the last month which I have wanted since I was about 10 and still a little giddy.
<< <i>
<< <i>Johnny U... hands down. >>
He's an interesting case by the standards of this thread. Both Super Bowl era and not Super Bowl era. Three different decades. I think I want him to be No. 1 and have been trying to make the case but not sure if I can do it yet. Prior to the Bowl, he had three championship game appearances. If you treat Championship games like Super Bowls, he was 3-2 while not not playing fully in two of the games. 4 MVPs. Put up some great numbers before QB numbers really took off. Got my first 57 Topps Unitas in the last month which I have wanted since I was about 10 and still a little giddy. >>
I've always considered Unitas to be #1. He put up over 40,000 yards in a 12 game and rushing dominated era. Unreal if you ask me. Lately though, I've been considering Otto Graham. The Browns and Graham dominated the AAFC and then the NFL for 10 years. Graham put together some impressive numbers in an era before the offense was opened up for pass oriented plays.
Also, Roethlisberger shouldn't even be part of this discussion. If so, you may as well start including Jim Everett.
Why are great stats in the regular season worth so much, but winning games is not; while winning games in the playoffs worth so much, but great stats during those games worth nothing?
Why do I feel like that was a completely incorrect use of a semi-colon?
Why make zero adjustments for teammates and rule changes and game conditions? A high completion percentage and lots of yards and TD passes after roughing the quarterback changed to touching the quarterback is a lot different than before
Montana
Favre
Unitas
Elway
Marino
Manning is no worse than fourth and almost certain to end his career at least second. I would even bet he'll be number soon enough. Ranking everything they did, Graham could be fifth or so, Baugh just behind him. Based only on QB play, though, they fall out of the top 10. Brady and Tarkenton next, with Brady close enough that he will move up. Young and Starr complete the top 10 (or 12)
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I certainly agree. Although every QB on the op list were great and deserving. In the early 80's Plunkett was almost unstoppable and he went against some pretty good teams. And he made alot of great plays during big games.
Elway - Best clutch passer ever with most comeback wins. extremely strong arm.
Aikman/ Staubach - I still cant decide on which one was better
Rothlisberger - on elway's trail for comeback wins and tough competitor
Brady - Just as good as Manning imo
Bradshaw - Best deep passer in the history of the game
Tarkenton - not on the list but was fun to watch. amazing competitor
Fouts - Not on the list but was an amazing talent. His playoff win against miami in 81 might be the best playoff game ever. His defenses were horrible. >>
Not to bash anyones opinion, but I'm really not sure what information you are using to come up with these one liners...I will add my opinions which are based on watching the games and game film of these players throughout their careers...Its a very common mistake that players get misremembered as being better or worse than they really are...
Elway - Best clutch passer ever with most comeback wins. extremely strong arm....LOTS of turnovers...LOTS of turnovers during clutch situations. Do you remember that Elway got blown out in his first 3 Super Bowl apperances...
Aikman/ Staubach - I still cant decide on which one was better,,Aikman was the better pure passer and had outstanding accuracy, Staubach was the complete QB...Could do it all, play any style.
Rothlisberger - on elway's trail for comeback wins and tough competitor...Agreed..Both players were/are known for holding the ball a too long to improvise..Sometimes works out, sometimes doesnt...
Brady - Just as good as Manning imo..WOW...Manning might have more choke moments, but I gotta tell ya, if you've watched any of their games over the past 10 years, Brady is great, put Manning is the best pure passer I've ever seen. And his ability to improvise and audible is unmatched since Johnny U.
Bradshaw - Best deep passer in the history of the game...Ummm..No...Great deep passer, but NO ONE had the gun that Joe Namath had..PERIOD...Watch the games.
Tarkenton - not on the list but was fun to watch. amazing competitor...Definitely one of the greatest QB scramblers of all time. Wasn't the most accurate and didnt have a huge arm.
Fouts - Not on the list but was an amazing talent. His playoff win against miami in 81 might be the best playoff game ever. His defenses were horrible. Fouts was not a good decision maker..He had a rocket and played in an offense that played to his strengths. But him on the 49ers or Dolphins of that era and he's no where NEAR as highly regarded.
Just want to make sure we keep focused on reality here...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.