Do you trust Stacks' grading of raw coins?

Bayard1908 · December 1, 2008 1:28PM

I've never bought from Stacks; however, I have looked through their catalog. I see a coin described as Proof 65 that I wouldn't pay 62 money for. What do you think of Stacks' grading of raw coins.

Cam40 · December 1, 2008 1:30PM

maybe it was a coin that technically would grade a 62 but! would bring 65 $$$ ...

Goldbully · December 1, 2008 1:33PM

Well, 4 of 5 raw coins graded dead on with PCGS!!!!

Bayard1908 · December 1, 2008 1:36PM

<< Well, 4 of 5 raw coins graded dead on with PCGS!!!! >>

Not bad, what happened with coin number 5?

MrEureka · December 1, 2008 2:02PM

Do you trust Stacks' grading of raw coins?

A more relevant question:

If you haven't seen the coin in person, how can you possibly compete intelligently against bidders that have?

clackamas · December 1, 2008 2:03PM

No, I have had 3 body bags on "Stacks" gem coins

mozin · December 1, 2008 2:05PM

NO!!!

Wil2008 · December 1, 2008 2:05PM

Hi.

I have purchased 6 raw coins from Stacks Auctions. I submitted them
to PCGS through thier collectors club service. All 6 cam back slabbed at or better
than the Stacks grade.

I would say I have had excellent results with Stacks. I guess I'm just lucky.

Wil

Bayard1908 · December 1, 2008 2:09PM

<< If you haven't seen the coin in person, how can you possibly compete intelligently against bidders that have? >>

Seeing the coin in person is overrated compared to the direct expense and opportunity cost of travelling to the auction site.

Bayard1908 · December 1, 2008 2:10PM

<< I have purchased 6 raw coins from Stacks Auctions. I submitted them
to PCGS through thier collectors club service. All 6 cam back slabbed at or better
than the Stacks grade.

I would say I have had excellent results with Stacks. I guess I'm just lucky. >>

Are these circulated coins?

Cam40 · December 1, 2008 2:12PM

edited, nevermind

MrEureka · December 1, 2008 2:32PM

<< If you haven't seen the coin in person, how can you possibly compete intelligently against bidders that have? >>

Seeing the coin in person is overrated compared to the direct expense and opportunity cost of travelling to the auction site.

That could be true if you were not planning on spending a lot of money AND you couldn't get a qualified numismatist to look at the coin for you.

However, if you can't get someone to help, you're probably better off just skipping the auction. At least that has been my experience.

Al21 · December 1, 2008 2:37PM

I've had mixed results on inexpensive coins. If it is an expensive coin you should see it in person or have someone you trust examine it.

Frankcoins · December 1, 2008 2:40PM

Even with certified coins, at ANY auction, you are better passing if you can't view in person or through your agent. Those who view in person will overbid you on the good stuff and leave you with the dogs.

Bayard1908 · December 1, 2008 2:52PM

<< Even with certified coins, any ANY auction, you are better passing if you can't view in person or through your agent. Those who view in person will overbid you on the good stuff and leave you with the dogs. >>

Maybe this is true for dealers. I don't think it's true for collectors.

MrEureka · December 1, 2008 2:55PM

<< Even with certified coins, any ANY auction, you are better passing if you can't view in person or through your agent. Those who view in person will overbid you on the good stuff and leave you with the dogs. >>

Maybe this is true for dealers. I don't think it's true for collectors.

Trust us on this. We've attended lot of auctions and we've seen how the mail bidders do. You're simply wrong.

Bayard1908 · December 1, 2008 3:01PM

<< Trust us on this. We've attended lot of auctions and we've seen how the mail bidders do. You're simply wrong. >>

I regularly buy attractive coins from Heritage and other auctions. So do many other collectors.

MikeInFL · December 1, 2008 3:28PM

"Do you trust Stacks' grading of raw coins?"

I don't trust anyone's grading of raw coins. Why should Stacks' be any different?

"What do you think of Stacks' grading of raw coins. "

I think if I were asking that question I would seek out someone who can (a) grade expertly and (b) can view the coins in-hand before considering bidding. Raw coins in Stacks' auctions is a minefield for the inexperienced.

Respectfully but cautiously yours...>Mike

MikeInFL · December 1, 2008 3:32PM

<< 

<< Trust us on this. We've attended lot of auctions and we've seen how the mail bidders do. You're simply wrong. >>

I regularly buy attractive coins from Heritage and other auctions. So do many other collectors. >>

I used to think that way too, before I got stuck with some dogs with no return recourse. But hey, it's your money and time......Mike (who thinks that Andy and Frank are 100% right. but recognize we each have to make our own decisions)

Elcontador · December 1, 2008 6:15PM

Imo, many of Stack's raw coins are raw for a good reason. I make a point of avoiding them. I'm not keen on some of their slabbed coins, either.

Placid · December 1, 2008 6:40PM

No.

LeeG · December 1, 2008 7:49PM

They got it right on this coin:

but not this one:

RYK · December 1, 2008 8:24PM

Do you trust Stacks' grading of raw coins?

In fairness, let's just say it's not a matter of trust, per se, but it has not worked out for me in the past, and I will not be bidding on these in the future.

Seeing the coin in person is overrated compared to the direct expense and opportunity cost of travelling to the auction site.

That could be true if you were not planning on spending a lot of money AND you couldn't get a qualified numismatist to look at the coin for you.

However, if you can't get someone to help, you're probably better off just skipping the auction. At least that has been my experience.

That's been my experience, as well.

coinnuttius · December 1, 2008 10:10PM

No. I'd stay away from the raw coins like the plague (if you cannot inspect them yourself). The photos are also not particularly representative of the coins either.

boiler78 · December 1, 2008 10:14PM

Longacre · December 1, 2008 10:18PM

Hire a professional to view the coins in person for you. The very modest fee that they charge is worth it.

Torrero · December 1, 2008 10:18PM

"Do you trust Stacks' grading of raw coins?"

IGWT · December 1, 2008 11:01PM

Where is the thread by BigE on the 1862 $1 Liberty Seated that he bought raw out of a Stack's auction (I think in May or June '07)? I can't find it.

Barndog · December 1, 2008 11:21PM

unless it's a rare die marriage, I won't bid on raw coins at Stack's. I'm hesitant to bid on certified coins there unless I have a floor representative (who bids in person) that has viewed the coin in person.

Every now and then I will bid on raw medals at Stack's

Wil2008 · December 8, 2008 2:36PM

hi

as far as my experience with stacks and imaging..

the raw coins i won were pretty much spot on with the image they presented.

and someone asked if the coins were circulated?... they are a mix of both MS and circulated.

As mentioned in my previous post, stacks was 6 for 6 with thier grade and the grade PCGS gave them.

Im just lucky i guess

Wil

abitofthisabitofthat · December 8, 2008 8:45PM

If you happen to live close enough, or can get to a Stack's auction in NY, it can be a great educational experience. View all of the lots - not just the ones that you are interested in. Especially the raw ones. Try to see which ones have isues, which you think are PQ. Go to the live auction and see how your ideas of grade and eye appeal and value match up against the prices paid by experienced dealers. PQ coins will have active bidding from multiple dealers (if the reserves are not too high), problem coins or dogs in holders will open to utter silence and close immediately without a bid. Many lots will actually get a good chuckle out of the room at the ridiuclously high reserve prices. You can learn an awful lot spending a day with Stack's this way.

TwoSides2aCoin · December 8, 2008 10:03PM

Grading and trusting are subjective.

RYK · December 8, 2008 10:12PM

A senior executive at Stack's advised me not to buy their raw coins if I expect to get them into holders. So I no longer look at them.

IrishMike · December 8, 2008 10:22PM

My first and only experience buying an expensive coin through an auction venue was not a good experience to say the least. It was a 66 PL Morgan graded 67 by PCGS. I sold it within 6 months of owning it to a Morgan specialist at my cost. It might or might not have been graded correctly but I didn't like it. So no I would not bid for on a raw coin in auction without seeing it. The only exception would be an inexpensive coin that in my mind all contingencies were taken into account in my bid amount.

To me it was an invaluable lesson.

coinmickey · December 8, 2008 10:24PM

I've bought raw from Stacks and had the coins go into PCGS holders at the grade I graded them at, not Stack's. So it's best to know how to grade the series you're buying, otherwise you're asking for trouble and disappointment.

lcoopie · December 8, 2008 10:30PM

I don't think that if you crack a PCGS or NGC coin out,
you can be sure of it grading the same again, or even grading at all.

less sure with raw coins.

RBinTex · December 8, 2008 10:32PM

H - e - double hockey sticks - NO!!!

ziggy29 · December 8, 2008 11:15PM

<< A senior executive at Stack's advised me not to buy their raw coins if I expect to get them into holders. >>

I actually agree with that. If it's critical to have a coin that will "slab," buy a slabbed coin...

Aegis3 · December 9, 2008 8:18AM

I do not fully trust anyone's grading of raw coins (and probably not even my own's (granted, I also think that grading is overrated, but I'm an obscurity snob)). Let me note that slabbing companies are in the end entities that grade raw coins. What follows should be clear.

dizzyfoxx · December 9, 2008 8:22AM

My only question would be, why are they raw???

Bayard1908 · December 9, 2008 8:24AM

<< My only question would be, why are they raw???

>>

Exactly what I was thinking.

Unknown · December 9, 2008 9:11AM

This content has been removed.

Bear · December 9, 2008 9:21AM

"TRUST NO ONE. SUSPECT,.....EVERYONE!".

Barndog · December 9, 2008 9:22AM

<< My only question would be, why are they raw???

>>

bought this raw. Stack's graded it VF-30. I thought it was a bit better

PCGS agreed with my assessment.

pennyannie · December 9, 2008 9:46AM

I am with Dizzy on this. WHY is Stacks selling raw to start with? I do not follow Stacks actions but would bet they bring comparable money to the slabbed ones. WHY take the chance?

Bear · December 9, 2008 9:57AM

Stacks has long prided themselves as the continuation of

OLD TIME COIN DEALERS. As such, the do not need TPGs

to tell them the grades of coins they buy and sell.To some degree,

I believe that this confidence is ,perhaps, overly exaggerated. I believe

that there are significant opportunities for collectors to end up on the

losing end of the stick.

Aegis3 · December 9, 2008 11:10AM

<< My only question would be, why are they raw???

>>

And yet we never seem to ask, "why are they slabbed?" with the same level of cynicism. (We should.)

Halfhunter06 · December 9, 2008 11:11AM

i'm still very pessimistic about Stacks. I wont buy it unless its holdered

lava · December 11, 2009 2:20AM

A year has passed, on this question is fresh on my mind.

I normally never buy raw, but I just bid on some coins in Stacks' latest auction. Not only are they raw, but they were not pictured, I did not see them, and no agent working for me saw them. It may be one of those "a fool and his money are soon parted" stories, but we'll see.

Stuart · December 11, 2009 3:17AM

Coincidentally, just this week I purchased my first coin from Stack's in a couple of years, since their merger with ANR. While not raw the following coin is in an ICG XF-40 holder, the acquisition risk of which I perceive to be somewhere between Top Tier TPGS and Raw since I was not able to examine the coin in person.

Although it's a Darksider almost from the Dark Ages period, I thought that the "Coolness Factor" was high enough to warrant a photo post on this Stack's topical thread. I'll also post it on the dark side thread for more in depth discussion...

1612 German States - Saxe-Weimar - Johann Ernst (1605-1626) Eight Brothers Taler - ICG XF-40

fc · December 11, 2009 3:34AM

i trust that stack's duty is to optimize the amount of money their auctions
bring in and nothing much else.

Do you trust Stacks' grading of raw coins?

Comments

Leave a Comment