Straight-up question: What constitutes an Obverse from a Reverse on US coins?

STONE · November 19, 2009 8:48AM

Is it just a matter of where the date is placed? The portrait? How the coin was struck (Hammer vs Anvil style)? Location of Denominatoin? Just Public Perception? Other?

For all of the above examples/ideas (with the exception of "Other"), I can fairly confidently raise a situation where the perceived logic is at least somewhat faulty for a minimum one US Coin series.
Is there really a set definition of what constitutes an obverse and what constitutes a reverse?
I checked the 2009 Red Book, and here's how it defines the difference:

"Obverse - The front or face side of a coin"
"Reverse - The back side of a coin"

Thank you Red Book for solving that dilemma...NOT!
Neither definition really gives a confident explanation between the two, whereby leaving it vague, arbitrary, and seemingly up to Joe/Jane Public/the Media to make the call.
Tomorrow I may wake up and start calling the Laurel Wreath side of the Large Cent as the Obverse and the Portrait Side as the Reverse. You'd all think I'm nuts, but would I really be incorrect?

So, where do you stand on this issue? How would you define an all-encompassing term of "Obverse" and "Reverse"?

DieClash · November 19, 2009 8:50AM

I've always thought that the Heads side was the obverse and the non-heads side was the reverse. And usually the date appears on the obverse.

For instance, the Statehood Quarters program, the date is on the non-heads design side, but I consider that the reverse, with the portrait of Washington the obverse, but I could be mistaken?

Edited: to add, let the Canadian collectors speak up. Which side of the coin is the obverse in Canada, considering the date, with few exceptions appears on the non-queen side of the coin

diamondman · November 19, 2009 8:55AM

Heads (obv) or Tails (rev), but this is only done after consuming large amounts of alcohol.

STONE · November 19, 2009 8:57AM

<< Heads (obv) or Tails (rev), but this is only done after consuming large amounts of alcohol.

>>

But not all US Coins have Heads and/or Tails on them!

ponderit · November 19, 2009 9:03AM

As in a Wisconsin Commem. It's got some sort of rodent (sorry I'm from Columbus Ohio and it's the whole Big Ten thing) on one side and an arm and hand grasping a pick... Good question and yes I know it's a Badger! It probably makes more sense than a Buckeye

ctf_error_coins · November 19, 2009 9:32AM

Gemineye · November 19, 2009 9:43AM

<< Straight-up question: What constitutes an Obverse from a Reverse on US coins? >>

.....

......Gee...!!!...I was raised in Brooklyn, N.Y. and used to pitch ole' Lincoln cents against the wall...If'n I remember correctly.. now old Abe was on the front which is the obverse and them wheatie thingies were on the reverse..!!...Now it wasn't hard to tell which was which when the mint put that big old building on the Back of the cent now was it..Oh yeah..the date was on the front...if I remember..!!!.......

Now if they put the date on the side of the coin...I can't tell ya who's on first....!!!!....

Quarternut · November 19, 2009 9:53AM

The best answer would be the side that has the date.

However, I know that there are instances where a coin either doesn't have a date, or is dated on both sides. In those cases the side that is the most important, be it a head of a ruler or such, would be the obverse...although these are more like guidelines than steadfast rules...

QN

LindeDad · November 19, 2009 10:03AM

Other than trines I would say the side that contains the the depiction of the series name is the obverse.
And as for the trimes nobody knows any more.

DieClash · November 19, 2009 10:25AM

Shield Nickels are confusing too, no "head".

Perhaps the true Reverse is the side that displays the denomination and the obverse does not.

Let's see if THAT theory holds up. Notwithstanding trimes of course.

<< Other than trines I would say the side that contains the the depiction of the series name is the obverse.
And as for the trimes nobody knows any more.

>>

claychaser · November 19, 2009 10:27AM

Heads or tails on this trime?

DieClash · November 19, 2009 10:30AM

<< Heads or tails on this trime?

>>

Heads is the date-side and tails is the denomination side.

And as to my previous post with regards to the statehood quarter, that means that the date side with the statehood design is the obverse and the washington side is the reverse because that's the side the contains the denomination. If I'm correct, I believe this definition will standup against all U.S. series coins.

Bear · November 19, 2009 10:31AM

I thought that the side with

the date was the obverse.

DieClash · November 19, 2009 10:36AM

Reading the Red Book with regards to the question of Heads vs. Tails on the Statehood quarters:

<< The obverse side depicting President George Washington...." >>

I believe this to be technically wrong. Just because the 1932-1998 Quarters depicted Washington on the obverse, doesn't necessarily mean that Washington could not be transferred to the reverse for the statehood quarters. Further, I would argue that the denomination is the defining character of a "reverse" of a coin. And in the statehood Quarters series, the words Quarter Dollar are on the Washington bust side of the coin, hence the reverse.

Now can anyone come up with any other U.S. minted coin where the reverse is not the side depicting the denomination?

DieClash · November 19, 2009 10:44AM

With Red Book firmly in hand, I propose the following guidelines for determining Obverse vs. Reverse and duly note that not all obverses are with heads and not all reversese are headless or tails; here we go.

1) Reverse is the side with the denomination
2) absent a denomination, obverse depicts the head.
3) in the absence of 1) or 2) the obverse contains the date

Cheers!

DieClash · November 19, 2009 10:51AM

<< I thought that the side with

the date was the obverse. >>

Bear, I flipped through every page in my Redbook. The side with the date doesn't always hold up as the obverse. Unless the edge of the Prexy coins should be considered the obverse?

The only other instance where the date side is not considered the obverse is with the Statehood and Territorial quarters. Here I think the RedBook is inaccurate. I wonder if the U.S. Mint has anything to add to this topic?

Edited: According to the U.S. Mint website the Reverse of the Statehood quarters cointains the date, and the non-head statehood design. So, it seems that the Statehood quarters are the only exception to the rules posted previously.

messydesk · November 19, 2009 10:54AM

Isn't the obverse/reverse often specified in enabling legislation?

DieClash · November 19, 2009 11:01AM

<< Isn't the obverse/reverse often specified in enabling legislation? >>

What I am curious about is if there are any other coins minted by the U.S. where the denomination is depicted on the obverse and the date is on the reverse?

Billet7 · November 19, 2009 3:29PM

I think there is always one side of the coin that looks like the "butt." Then I conclude that the other side must be the "heads." It isn't a perfect system...and it doesn't always work when judging people either

Billet7 · November 19, 2009 3:30PM

That was crude...sorry...still true though.

CoinJunkie · November 19, 2009 3:42PM

The side that PCGS usually puts face up in the holder is the obverse!

On a coin with a portrait on one side, that is the obverse universally, I do believe. Coins with no
portrait are less cut and dried. (see rule 1 above)

ocon4008 · November 19, 2009 4:04PM

What about gold liberty dollar coins? Liberty in on one side and denomination and date on the other? Is this the exception to the rule?

or the Lewis and clark; heads on both sides one with date and one with denomination.

or is it as simple as the golden rule: whoever owns the gold coins decideds?

amiller · November 19, 2009 11:14PM

I'm with the "denomination on the reverse" crowd. The quarters of 1999- are no exception, Washington is on the reverse. I never hear people refer to quarters made 1999- as being Washington Quarters, but rather State/Territories/Natl Parks Quarters. The Washington series ended in 1998 when the denomination was moved to the portrait side.

I can't think of any exceptions to the rule, at least with US coins. What series is titled by it's denomination side?

Walmann · November 20, 2009 12:05AM

Thought it was a matter of the denomination being shown on the reverse.

The date may not always appear on the obverse, look at the presidental dollars.

STONE · November 20, 2009 12:13AM

An interesting discussion, and I'm liking DieClash's diagnostics, albeit taking those points lightly.

I don't think that a solid, 100%, definition of what constitutes an obverse and/or reverse, can be firmly created...although I'd like further attempts

OKbustchaser · November 20, 2009 12:24AM

<< What constitutes an Obverse from a Reverse on US coins? >>

Basically, tradition.

ricko · November 20, 2009 12:33AM

Interesting... well, actually, what is interesting is that a FORMAL, WRITTEN DEFINITION, by some authority does not seem to exist. And, if one were to be issued now, there would be exceptions no matter how it is worded. So, we live with ambiguity, and all except the hair-splitting, nervous nellies here will leave it at that. Cheers, RickO

Ciccio · November 20, 2009 12:42AM

Susan Headley explains it a little better, imho.

Link

derryb · November 20, 2009 12:51AM

Obverse is always the side that comes up when I call "tails."

Billet7 · November 20, 2009 2:08AM

<< Obverse is always the side that comes up when I call "tails." >>

And we have a WINNER!!!!! No better explaination!

CoinJunkie · November 20, 2009 2:42AM

<< Susan Headley explains it a little better, imho.

Link >>

If we accept her rule #2, then the portrait of Washington is actually the reverse of a state quarter.
I don't have a problem with that, actually, although it negates the latter part of my earlier post.

(Note that I've seen them mostly holdered Washington side down, but initially figured that was because
no one really wanted to see the "obverse" by default with those coins.)

DieClash · November 22, 2009 4:57AM

<< 

<< Susan Headley explains it a little better, imho.

Link >>

If we accept her rule #2, then the portrait of Washington is actually the reverse of a state quarter.
I don't have a problem with that, actually, although it negates the latter part of my earlier post.

(Note that I've seen them mostly holdered Washington side down, but initially figured that was because
no one really wanted to see the "obverse" by default with those coins.) >>

The enabling legislation for the statehood quarters defines the obverse as the side bearing Washington's portrait.

Link

JedPlanchet · November 22, 2009 5:08AM

<< I'm with the "denomination on the reverse" crowd. The quarters of 1999- are no exception, Washington is on the reverse. I never hear people refer to quarters made 1999- as being Washington Quarters, but rather State/Territories/Natl Parks Quarters. The Washington series ended in 1998 when the denomination was moved to the portrait side. >>

despite what the law says,

krueger · November 23, 2009 2:41PM

I did this chart for a presentation at the Philipiine Collectors Forum club during the ANA show Baltimore 2003. This is not the whole presentation. There is controversy and some disagreement concerning these facts.

STANDARD OBV. REVERSE COMMENTS

Krause world coin catalog Royalty / Bust of rulerRepublic / Name of country OppositeOpposite Takes the date and denomination
out of it.

European Face Cross Royalty

Latin Emblem of Country Bust Republic

United States Date Denomination 1873 Coinage law

Philippines 1903-1945 Date Denomination Philippine Coinage act of 1902, Sec.76

Philippine coins as manufactured
by the U.S. Mint Denomination (figure) Date (eagle/shield) See discussion following this chart. (partial collar strike examples)

GRADING SERVICES for Philippine Coins
PCGS Denomination Date Date side up on label side by request
NGC Denomination Date Date side up on label side by request
ICG Denomination Date Date side up on label side by request
ANACS Denomination Date Date side up on label side by request

Krueger

krueger · November 23, 2009 2:50PM

Sorry, the chart completely jumbled when I hit reply, and it won't let me re-edit it.

Krueger

Straight-up question: What constitutes an Obverse from a Reverse on US coins?

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