Ike Off Center Error on Smaller Planchet Update: Coin in Hand
ctf_error_coins
Posts: 15,433 ✭✭✭✭✭
Boy what a hornets nest I got into. I scan ebay ever day for error coins. This is an extreme amount of HARD WORK. I buy error lots all the time. So I see a good deal and I buy it. I am not sure if the coins in question were real or not. I ask for help, am told repeatedly that they are fake, until two error experts chime in (ty by the way to Mike and Fred) and then everything changes. Plus note that I am a very small time error coin dealer and found myself way out of my league. Then (in my honest opinion, have no facts tho) someone contacted the seller and offered more. The seller then tried to cancel the auction (12 hours later) that I won and had paid in full. I thought this to be very unethical and CONSIDERED hiring a lawyer for a Binding Contract if the seller backed out. At this point, I wanted to keep ALL of my Options open. It is not so much that he seller wanted to back out that upset me, what did is the fact that someone USED my EXTENSIVE RESEARCH that I do everyday to try to get the coin from the seller. This I found extremely unethical, that is what got to me the most.
I also had a long phone conversations with Fred about the coin, the error coin business, ethics, and replies to forum threads. Fred, I thank you very much for the calls and you guidance as I trust your greatly, you sure are a stand up guy. I have also had email conversations with Mike and I thank him for his wisdom and diagnostics of the piece, again another expert whom I have a great deal of respect for. I trust these two experts and take comfort in their words.
Some say I ripped the seller. IMO that would be the case If I had a retail store and the coins were brought to me and I low balled an offer. This is not the case. The seller priced the auction. All I did was click buy it now.
The coin did show up and is now in the safety deposit box. I am a collect first, very small time dealer second. At this point the coin goes into my private collection to be passed down to my children. I did not sell the coin so I do not have a huge financial gain (yes the coin has value). I will not discuss the financial details of this transaction as they are private. I do want to thank the seller for following through on the deal.
I have learned SO MANY valuable lessons on this one. I had to do some soul searching as well. I have made some very good contacts by this episode. I thank all of you who supported me and all the great advice that I have received.
.....................
Description: The coin is a true mint error and is an off center Ike Dollar struck on a 6 gram foreign planchet. When I got the coin in hand, it was the size of a quarter, but had no copper core. So I then had it weighed at it came in at exactly 6 grams. This was unexpected. A truly unique piece.
Research: with help from Mike directing me to the proper resource, I was able to determine after a few hours of research, that This coin was Struck on a Taiwan (ROC) 6 gram 25 mm planchet which were minted in 1973 and 1974 at Denver.
Conclusion: Fred said that PCGS would certify this as a : Mint Error ND IKE $1 Off Center on a Taiwan 6 gram planchet. I was not planning on getting it slabbed, but may reconsider it.
For you the IKE experts , can you tell from the die characteristics of this coin, if it is either a 1973 or 1974 issue? It would not be certified with the date, but I'm just curious and it would help validate that it is a Taiwan planchet.
......................
My thanks to all of you again and I hope we all learned some lessons here, (I sure did) , Chris
I also had a long phone conversations with Fred about the coin, the error coin business, ethics, and replies to forum threads. Fred, I thank you very much for the calls and you guidance as I trust your greatly, you sure are a stand up guy. I have also had email conversations with Mike and I thank him for his wisdom and diagnostics of the piece, again another expert whom I have a great deal of respect for. I trust these two experts and take comfort in their words.
Some say I ripped the seller. IMO that would be the case If I had a retail store and the coins were brought to me and I low balled an offer. This is not the case. The seller priced the auction. All I did was click buy it now.
The coin did show up and is now in the safety deposit box. I am a collect first, very small time dealer second. At this point the coin goes into my private collection to be passed down to my children. I did not sell the coin so I do not have a huge financial gain (yes the coin has value). I will not discuss the financial details of this transaction as they are private. I do want to thank the seller for following through on the deal.
I have learned SO MANY valuable lessons on this one. I had to do some soul searching as well. I have made some very good contacts by this episode. I thank all of you who supported me and all the great advice that I have received.
.....................
Description: The coin is a true mint error and is an off center Ike Dollar struck on a 6 gram foreign planchet. When I got the coin in hand, it was the size of a quarter, but had no copper core. So I then had it weighed at it came in at exactly 6 grams. This was unexpected. A truly unique piece.
Research: with help from Mike directing me to the proper resource, I was able to determine after a few hours of research, that This coin was Struck on a Taiwan (ROC) 6 gram 25 mm planchet which were minted in 1973 and 1974 at Denver.
Conclusion: Fred said that PCGS would certify this as a : Mint Error ND IKE $1 Off Center on a Taiwan 6 gram planchet. I was not planning on getting it slabbed, but may reconsider it.
For you the IKE experts , can you tell from the die characteristics of this coin, if it is either a 1973 or 1974 issue? It would not be certified with the date, but I'm just curious and it would help validate that it is a Taiwan planchet.
......................
My thanks to all of you again and I hope we all learned some lessons here, (I sure did) , Chris
0
Comments
<< <i>
.....................
Description: The coin is a true mint error and is an off center Ike Dollar struck on a 6 gram foreign planchet. When I got the coin in hand, it was the size of a quarter, but had no copper core. So I then had it weighed at it came in at exactly 6 grams. This was unexpected. A truly unique piece.
Research: with help from Mike directing me to the proper resource, I was able to determine after a few hours of research, that This coin was Struck on a Taiwan (ROC) 6 gram 25 mm planchet
>>
I am pretty sure it was struck in Taiwan too.
<< <i> I am pretty sure it was struck in Taiwan too. >>
No, that is not what happened.
It was struck in Denver.
Congrats!, and I'm glad the seller
completed the Ebay Transaction.
Good for you ! You now have a
Unique Off Metal/Wrong Planchet
Ike Dollar Error - oh, and it's Off-
Center to boot !!
If I were you, I would get it slabbed to make it easier to sell for fair value by you or whoever the coin passes on to.
Also, I know some people have posted actual dies. They are of course defaced in some way. Could it be that someone got a hold of a die that had a small "X" on it or something and used the "good" part of the die to create this? Thinking out loud...
<< <i>Take me through how this planchet gets struck in Denver.... Mint employee? >>
All of the 6 gram Taiwan coins struck at the U S mint those years were done in Denver.
Now as to how, (mint employee), well that can not be determined and this coin is considered a true mint error.
We'll use our hands and hearts and if we must we'll use our heads.
I would also get it in a PCGS slab and do whatever they need to get Freds description on the holder.
Mostly because it's such a unique piece, it's better in a holder with the details.
WOW! Good for you! You need to send that to PCGS for authentication (not NGC). The small fee, relative to the value, of that error necessitates it. Plus the piece of mind is worth it. No offense to Fred, of course, but Fred may not be there when you try and sell it. Ironically, Fred may be the person who authenticates it for PCGS.
Again...GOOD FOR YOU! You must be living right.
Okay...for your next great find...don't post anything until you have coin in hand, dude!
Lane
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
"Question your assumptions."
"Intelligence is an evolutionary adaptation."
Lawyer and all.
I have no respect for you.
JMHO
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
<< <i>All the hoopla involved over this and your just gonna stick it in a SDB? >>
Yes it is in the SDB.
I am an Error Coin Collector First and this goes into my private collection.
I do sell error coins that are in my inventory that are not in my private collection.
It is that simple.
Congrat's and happy it worked out for you.
.
CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
.
Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
.
More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC FOR SALE
To anyone who thinks this coin is fake, you have a lot to learn about errors and how to authenticate them. What an incredible coin!
it looked like you hit the BIN within 15 minutes of posting
if I am reading the auction correctly
(but hard to tell as eBay is imroving their program to make it better)
slab it and sejo has that $10K offer in PCGS you could use as a back-up if things go bad
Since this is such a unique coin, get it certified and let a dealer/ANA display this particular error at a show or shows. Let everyone who is interested have a gander at it. Get it independently insured in case of loss. To be stuck in a SDB is doing no one any good.
(Hint: To have this coin displayed in a public domain, will increase the value)
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
<< <i>What kind of rip are we talking about here? I know the OP paid $300, whats the coin worth? A few thousand? Five figures? Help me understand why this was such a hot topic over the past week. >>
Sego offered $10k for it.
<< <i>
Okay...for your next great find...don't post anything until you have coin in hand, dude!
Lane >>
And don't make wild accusations unless you have some proof. That is what most of us were criticizing you about. You current post still leaves you in an accusatory mode.
<< <i>
<< <i>What kind of rip are we talking about here? I know the OP paid $300, whats the coin worth? A few thousand? Five figures? Help me understand why this was such a hot topic over the past week. >>
Sego offered $10k for it. >>
I think that was because it may have been struck on a nickel or quarter planchet.
Being a foreign planchet, it may not be worth $10k.
Nice error!
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>What kind of rip are we talking about here? I know the OP paid $300, whats the coin worth? A few thousand? Five figures? Help me understand why this was such a hot topic over the past week. >>
Sego offered $10k for it. >>
I think that was because it may have been struck on a nickel or quarter planchet.
Being a foreign planchet, it may not be worth $10k.
Nice error! >>
I would think it would be worth more, no?
-Paul
<< <i>I think that was because it may have been struck on a nickel or quarter planchet.
Being a foreign planchet, it may not be worth $10k. >>
It really doesn't matter anymore, now does it?
Value is what the market makes of it, and if this won't be coming on the market for a while, if ever, then it's priceless!
I also suppose it would be possible to make a guess on which year after comparing minute deatail of what is showing on the obv and reverse but its kinda pointless.
The best way to go about it would be to figure out when the Taiwan coins were struck and use that as a possibility but since that information is for disussion only and would never get put on a slab it would be only for you.
Having a date period when this was produced is small potato's compared to the coin itself.
As an aside, have it slabbed by PCGS and submit it under Express/Mint Error so you or your heirs won't ever have to debate it's authenticity.
BTW, I would not have hesitated to hit the BIN on that auction.
The name is LEE!
These are examples of some Shanghai specials...
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
<< <i>I'm thinking you might want to get it slabbed just to eliminate all doubt.
These are examples of some Shanghai specials...
Wow, that is one scary photo.
My coin has tarnish on it
Yes, I am quickly being convinced to send it into PCGS, Now how do I go about this. Walk it into the Long Beach Show??
Conclusion: Fred said that PCGS would certify this as a : Mint Error ND IKE $1 Off Center on a Taiwan 6 gram planchet. I was not planning on getting it slabbed, but may reconsider it.
I'm thrilled for you that this worked out as I've been in your shoes before wondering if things will pan out on a lucky purchase...
at the same time I'm also very envious!
As a collector this is a huge score and your investment is minuscule so I'm glad to hear your keeping it!
It never hurts as it's an error which is very liquid for a profit should you ever tire of it?
I would however proceed to have it certified by PCGS and would expect the estimated value to be far higher as it's now an off center on a foreign planchet, so you might want to max out the USPS Registered Mail Insurance of $25K!
<< <i>Congrats on a happy ending!
If I were you, I would get it slabbed to make it easier to sell for fair value by you or whoever the coin passes on to. >>
<< <i>Take me through how this planchet gets struck in Denver.... Mint employee?
Also, I know some people have posted actual dies. They are of course defaced in some way. Could it be that someone got a hold of a die that had a small "X" on it or something and used the "good" part of the die to create this? Thinking out loud... >>
It's legit. Years ago the ANA Summer Seminar students got to walk the floor of the Denver Mint. One time when I was escorting a group of students, I wandered over to a wall where there were a bunch of empty hoppers lined up. I started looking in them, and in the fourth one spotted a planchet stuck in the exit gate. I am told that it happened all the time.
TD
<< <i>- oh, and it's Off-
Center to boot !! >>
You know Fred, I'd give anything to see an Ike struck on a quarter-sized planchet that WAS centered!
<< <i>This has to be at least a 1974 since the 1973 coins only showed up in mint sets. 1973 DOES have some unique custom error's but those came out of San Francisco so I think its safe to rule 1973 out.
I also suppose it would be possible to make a guess on which year after comparing minute deatail of what is showing on the obv and reverse but its kinda pointless.
The best way to go about it would be to figure out when the Taiwan coins were struck and use that as a possibility but since that information is for disussion only and would never get put on a slab it would be only for you.
Having a date period when this was produced is small potato's compared to the coin itself.
As an aside, have it slabbed by PCGS and submit it under Express/Mint Error so you or your heirs won't ever have to debate it's authenticity.
BTW, I would not have hesitated to hit the BIN on that auction. >>
Lee, I thank you very much, which means this coin is a 1974 D, even tho it would certify as a ND. Always good to have extra information. Research isn't so bad if you ask the right people and are directed to the right resources, Kinda Fun actually.
Thank you again, chris
I dislike doing this from pictures rather than the coin itself. But I will walk you through my reasoning and see if you folks agree.
Type 3 was first used in late 1972. One of the characteristics was two craterlets within the second largest crater located by LLA of DOLLAR.
These were sharp in comparasion to later years. 1977 and 1978 were weak. 1973 was such a small mintage, I assume they looked like the 1972's. This coin looks intermediate and the only year that used this design that I have left is 1974.
It looks like a genuine reverse. I can see the flag and flagpole on the moon to the right of FG in your pictures.
Perhaps I should have mentioned that 1972 type 3's were not struck at Denver.
When gold and silver move together, it signals the coming end of fiat money.
<< <i>Guess I'm one that thinks you should send the woman a nice Check, she made a mistake by listing it to low and damned if you'd let her out of it.
Lawyer and all.
I have no respect for you.
JMHO >>
Food for thought, no? Is everyone OK with how this worked out? I don't really know what to think of it, actually.
<< <i>You Suck!!!!!
Whatever you are, be a good one. ---- Abraham Lincoln
it being either a 73 or 74 Denver issue).
I'll throw in a little more support for the 74-D by saying I have (2) Ike's on foreign planchet....
They are both struck on planchets made for Phillipine coins. One is a 72-D and the other is a 74-D.
They are both fairly well known, and also very scarce. The 72-D is about twice as scarce as a 74-D.
So, I'll vote for it being a 74-D as well. I'm glad everything turned out well for you and the coin did end
up where it was supposed to be.
Brian
I Love
Go here for the latest in Ike DIVA data!
edited to fix link....
Glad to hear things worked out for you in the end!
<< <i>
<< <i>Guess I'm one that thinks you should send the woman a nice Check, she made a mistake by listing it to low and damned if you'd let her out of it.
Lawyer and all.
I have no respect for you.
JMHO >>
Food for thought, no? Is everyone OK with how this worked out? I don't really know what to think of it, actually. >>
Coin was listed with a BIN. OP bought it. What more could a person want? Other than some of the two faced hypocrites that post their spew occasionally.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Guess I'm one that thinks you should send the woman a nice Check, she made a mistake by listing it to low and damned if you'd let her out of it.
Lawyer and all.
I have no respect for you.
JMHO >>
Food for thought, no? Is everyone OK with how this worked out? I don't really know what to think of it, actually. >>
Coin was listed with a BIN. OP bought it. What more could a person want? Other than some of the two faced hypocrites that post their spew occasionally. >>
From the famous 01-S barber old man taker
Gotta love GREED
<< <i>Guess I'm one that thinks you should send the woman a nice Check, she made a mistake by listing it to low and damned if you'd let her out of it.
Lawyer and all.
I have no respect for you.
JMHO >>
Let the buyer beware. What happened to 'Let the seller beware'. Ignorance is no excuse. Legal and moral do not always line up! That's the facts. Life is not fair. If the buyer made that mistake and a knowledgable dealer was the buyer, what would be different. Just my not so humble opinion.
Gary
Posting a coin listed on ebay that you bought or are planning to before you have the coin in hand is a horrible idea. Several of the so called moral preachers of this board are the same ones who will snipe a coin from you right under your nose or like in this case offer the seller more money after the fact. There are alot of Mr know it alls on this board that post in every thread and always seem to know everything and are talking about what others should do in there buisness dealings. Keep your buisness private and dont post coins until you have them in hand or choose who you share them with before hand very carefully.