<< <i>I had no idea you could do that and with what I sent in it really didn't matter as I insured going and leaving PSA at the price I thought they would be worth post graded. So in my case I covered myself coming and going.
Steve >>
That's the opposite of what I did, Steve. I always insured them for the value of what I paid (and presumably, replacement value). Just because they get slabbed doesn not necessarily mean that the value goes up. This was up until a couple of years ago, the last time I submitted. Nowadays, I feel even more strongly about that since I crack out most of the slabbed cards that I buy.
<< <i>wow this is very scary...im am so sorry to hear that and i hope your cards come in...this does sound really fishy but someone should be responsible...i was going to send in a nice sub with some nice vintage but now im very worried about this...i hope someone will do something about this as you have it insured...good luck >>
I just want to make it known publicly that... My intentions are not to discourage people from sending their cards to Psa, I am just trying to look out for you guys and eliminate any chance that someone will make the same mistake I made, which was undervaluing what I felt my cards where really worth, because it was my very first submission, and people are usually disappointed when they find out the condition there cards are actually in, and because they would be shipped back registered mail, and there was no chance that a registered mail item could be lost or stolen.
<< <i>If I understand what happened here the PO is at fault.
I have read 2 or 3 different versions here so I am unsure as to what really happened.
PSA shipped your parcel via USPS registered mail? Once the PO takes the item it give PSA a receipt.
During the time the PO had it it became lost?
IF so, what is the problem? 30 days has to go by I assume and then they (PO) pays you up to the insured value. You may have to prove value.
Is that basically it? Why all the assumptions?
Steve >>
Steve, here is the part that really gets your blood flowing and makes you believe that something really fraudulent is going on, and that it is not just a standard example of pieces of mail being lost or stolen. The post office says that the items were not scanned as registered mail items, and that they were not insured. However, Psa has provided me with a receipt which shows the items accepted and insured by the post office as registered mail items. The head people at my local post office say that in 20 years, they have never seen something like this. It has to be something extremely concerning to them because I highly doubt that they would be able and willing to drop what they were doing, and spend 3 hours talking to me at a time. It gets even better, the postal inspection service tells me to call Psa and file a claim, and that it only has to be 15 days from when the items were mailed out. (including Saturday's and Sunday's). The next day I get a follow up call from the U.S. Post office Customer Relations Dept. and they tell me that I cannot file a claim because the items were not insured, and that you can't file a claim unless an item is insured. I think it has something to do with the way Psa sends out there bulk shipments or something with the way the items are accepted and scanned in at the Newport beach post office. Because Psa told me something about problems they have been having with the Newport Beach post office, and that it would literally take someone going there from Washington to approve, fix, or update something. Not sure if that’s referring to the post offices software, equipment, or what.
MMYNC thanks for clarifying the situation. If PSA has a receipt stating that your parcel was insured and the PO did not scan it in I still think they are liable. Of course they want to say they are not. It is up to you to fight them I guess.
The problem is PSA should demand that every parcel they ship gets scanned.
Laziness on the PO clerks part is what led to this dilemma.
As it is now the PO can try and say the receipt PSA has is from a different order
however that would mean that the receipt was scanned in at some
If PSA has the proper paperwork, they will help mmync with filing the claim.
If PSA does NOT have the proper paperwork, PSA needs to dive-in head first and figure out what happened. UCC says PSA needs to receive/provide the standard documentation to show that the merch was ACCEPTED by the carrier. If they do not have the docs, they are likely subject to a claim of some liability.
I cannot - DO NOT - believe that PSA is handing over merch without getting the proper receipts.
Registered Mail does vanish, but it is SUPER rare and the USPS does not stop with the detective work until somebody is cooked.
Folks Who Bite Get Bitten. Folks Who Don't Bite Get Eaten.
Just get a receipt from PSA showing proof it was registered and insured.
Forward that to your USPS contact.
Go from there and then tell us what happens.
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
PSA most likely uses a shipping manifest, in which PSA lists how many of each type of parcel are being shipped. The receiving carrier compares the number of parcels and signs the sheet. Each individual parcel number is not necessarily listed on the sheet. That would explain why the tracking number would show as expected for shipping but would not show as entered into the USPS mailstream.
It is possible for registered mail to disappear. Someone dishonest along the mail path would have to notice a bad habit of the person just ahead of them on the mail path. In my office, the truck driver who brings the mail knows that I am honest and would never steal. She has me sign the slip and then she always tosses it in the trash on the way out. Since she is the last one to sign for it, if I didn't scan the registered as arrived and I got rid of all the evidence I could steal whatever it is, and the trail would end with her. She would be financially responsible for whatever it is and she would lose her job. The postal inspectors would search her car, house, etc and it would just be a pretty bad day for her.
If there is a dishonest employee somewhere between newport beach and michigan, who has a careless employee directly ahead of them on the mail stream, they could steal that package.
In this case - it's more likely that the parcels are sitting in a white burlap bag on the wrong shelf in the registry room, somewhere in Michigan. The PI will have to follow the paper trail from newport beach to michigan. I think the mail path would be carrier to clerk, to reg clerk at the distribution center nearest Newport Beach, to shipping clerk to truck driver. It then goes to an airport to michigan. Then back to truck drivers and clerks. I've seen a reg room with more than a thousand parcels. It's possible for one to get misplaced.
I can't see 6 parcels disappearing at the same time. A truck driver isn't going to take them. They have signed for a reg bag, they have a stamped ring holding the bag closed, and they have to deliver a reg bag when they get off the truck. The truck gets loaded at one dock and then unloaded at each office along the route. It would be really unlikely for a truck driver to steal a reg bag.
A dishonest clerk could steal a parcel. If the clerk had a driver who always tossed the slip, he could wait for the driver to toss the slip and leave. He could grab the slip out of the trash, to lose the paper trail. Then he could take a chance and run outside and stick the package in his trunk. If it was small enough he could hide it in his pocket. 6 parcels from PSA aren't going in his pocket or out the back door to his car.
I remember one case of a lost registered. We had a PMR substitute postmaster. I attempted delivery on a registered and the folks weren't home. Brought it back and gave it to the PMR. He put it in the safe on the wrong shelf. They couldn't find it the next morning and there was a panic until they got in contact with that PMR. I haven't seen or heard of any other lost or stolen registered. It just isn't worth the risk.
USPS requires proof of packaging and proof of value for almost all ins claims. USPS is generally an expert in packaging and shipping, and can tell when improper packaging contributes to damage. They're generally fair, shippers don't like the answer when a claim gets refused. A big problem is that shippers can't see how mail is processed, and sometimes have unrealistic expectations as to the handling of the item they shipped. I had a seller tell me a few days ago that he was shocked that a PWE wasn't enough, since he wrote "do not bend" on the envelope. Mail processing equipment can't read. We process over a million letters a day. You can write "do not bend" on flat envelopes and that will sometimes lead carriers to not bend them in the casing equipment or in the mailbox but the machines don't care.
USPS is not an expert on the values of what is shipped. USPS doesn't know a psa 10 from a pro 10, or a reprint from an original. We move things for people. Because USPS is not an expert, they need proof that what was damaged is worth the amount of the claim. If they didn't have that requirement there would be a problem with overinsurance on fragile items, with people insuring cheap items for more than their value and hoping for damage. The burden of proof isn't outrageous but if you take a baseball card commonly sold for $1 and tell them it was worth $500 there's going to be a problem. I would think a current SMR will end up being the value maker. If the card isn't listed in SMR then it's possible that the OP can sign up for VCP and provide average selling prices for the other items. Unfortunately there's no proven market value for low pop cards. Also by the low pop card being graded, it changes the previous market for that card. Instead of being a pop1, it's now a pop2. You can't use a previous sale as a price point, because there are now more of that card in existence and also one less buyer in the marketplace. We've all seen what happens when ultra low pop becomes low pop.
I think the OP is going to have to wait for the postal inspector to conclude his investigation before his insurance claim will be addressed. There's a chance the cards will be found, and if they're going to be found it'll be the PI that gets the search going. If the PI finds an end to the paper trail somebody will be in trouble and that somebody will probably not be the one who took or lost the cards.
If PSA has been having a problem with USPS and can't get the problem corrected then somebody at PSA didn't complain enough or to the right person. PSA could easily switch to UPS or FedEx and both companies would love to have them. I can't see anything service related that PSA could request that USPS wouldn't do. They need to talk to the right person, and maybe this mess will speed up that conversation.
Jim, here is the sheet that Psa sent me. I deleted any information I thought would be private to Psa, or anyone else on the list, so that is why it will look a little funny. I know that you work for the USPS, so don't feel obligated in sharing anything that might jeopardize your job in any way.
We don’t have any of the specific details, but it appears that our cards where stolen while in the possession of the United States Postal Service. Since it is a federal crime involving the U.S. Government, I doubt we will ever know what happened. But, I can tell you that Psa had absolutely nothing to do with this, and that Sandy (Psa’s shipping manager) really went to bat for us, and I ended up getting my check in the mail today. Sure, it would have been nice to get a check for more than what I insured the cards for, but at the same time, Psa ended up handling the whole thing from start to finish, and in my case, that more than makes up for the difference. So a big thumbs up to Sandy, and everyone else at Psa!!
That's a lot of grief over $150 worth of cards. Any money you got above that amount was a gift. Your 1995 Sliver Die Cut Nolan Ryan wouldn't sell for nearly as much as you think- $75 at most.
Only to play devil's advocate here, how is PSA not responsible for this item in any way? I know they did make good, to an extent, on this item, but I hear that the "seller is responsible" so much on these boards regarding an ebay sale that didnt make its final destination through no fault of the seller and I wonder how this isnt the case here?
PSA "sold" an item (ie grading) and shipped the item and it did not make the destination. How is it then, that they are not responsible since it was out of their possession when every ebay argument ends with "its the sellers responsibility"?
I understand that "after the fact" it was determined that the cards were stolen, but how would this differ if an ebay purchase was stolen?
It is ultimately PSAs responsibility they contracted with the shipper. The way it would work the USPS will refund PSA and PSA will refund the customer.
Had the OP used their own Fed Ex account they would be the contracter and PSA would have no responsibility any refund paid by the shipper would be paid to the OP.
I recently had a 172.20 dollar derek jeter auto lost by the postal service. The seller who is in hawaii sent it out insured and with a tracking number. The post office said they attempted delivery but i never got a slip stating so. They then never tried to re-deliver it..... Very strange indeed. It was supposed to be at the post office to pick up but when i got there they said it was not there and that it should be to contact the driver. The driver had no idea. Eventually I got my money back via paypal but the card never showed up. It was a 2005 Upper Deck Ultimate Signature Decades Derek Jeter #2/99 auto. UGH!! A recent one went for 202.50. Everyone keep your eyes peeled if ya see this card..its MINE. Paypal even said if it were to show up its mine anyway...it was just cause im such a good customer (ADDICT) they refunded my purchase.
<< <i>That's a lot of grief over $150 worth of cards. Any money you got above that amount was a gift. Your 1995 Sliver Die Cut Nolan Ryan wouldn't sell for nearly as much as you think- $75 at most. >>
I must be the last person that you think about before you go to bed, and the first person that you think about when you wake up in the morning. Do you realize how much time you dedicate everyday thinking about me? I don't know if your just immature, or if it's because you view me as competition, but you and all of the other board members know that the cards are worth more then $150. The two Bernie Nicholls rookies, and the Gretzky card are worth $150 alone, and they all had a strong chance of getting a bump, so grow up!
If you make a police report for the lost/stolen items can you give that report to PSA and they can list those cert #s as lost/stolen in case someone tries to register them? Similar to a list police would have for stolen autos. Does anyone know if PSA keeps a "hot" list?
<< <i>That's a lot of grief over $150 worth of cards. Any money you got above that amount was a gift. Your 1995 Sliver Die Cut Nolan Ryan wouldn't sell for nearly as much as you think- $75 at most. >>
I must be the last person that you think about before you go to bed, and the first person that you think about when you wake up in the morning. Do you realize how much time you dedicate everyday thinking about me? I don't know if your just immature, or if it's because you view me as competition, but you and all of the other board members know that the cards are worth more then $150. The two Bernie Nicholls rookies, and the Gretzky card are worth $150 alone, and they all had a strong chance of getting a bump, so grow up! >>
One correction, Lee (CDNUTS) doesnt wake up or go to bed, he stays up all night playing poker and posting on these boards...he spends 20 minutes a day cat-napping and day dreaming, trying to come up with more wise arse comments....
Hey dufus, you have no clue about the market so you really don't want to get into this argument. The Nicholl's PSA 8 is a $5 card at best, and the Gretzky is $25-$30. Your Nolan Ryan's would probably hammer at around $20-$30. His post retirement cards are not in high demand, even for low pop PSA 10s. For a guy who comes on the boards asking what 1994 Classic Glow in the Dark cards are worth, you seem to think you know your stuff but obviously haven't a clue. Of course, your collection manager could've told you all this, but I guess he's on vacation.
<< <i>Only to play devil's advocate here, how is PSA not responsible for this item in any way? I know they did make good, to an extent, on this item, but I hear that the "seller is responsible" so much on these boards regarding an ebay sale that didnt make its final destination through no fault of the seller and I wonder how this isnt the case here?
PSA "sold" an item (ie grading) and shipped the item and it did not make the destination. How is it then, that they are not responsible since it was out of their possession when every ebay argument ends with "its the sellers responsibility"?
I understand that "after the fact" it was determined that the cards were stolen, but how would this differ if an ebay purchase was stolen? >>
About 99% of the "situations" we discuss here are related to EBAY transactions.
Thus, when we talk about "seller responsibilities" we are largely referencing EBAY and PayPal rules and policies. THOSE "rules" can differ substantially from the rules that govern commerce in the real world.
If you google this litigation......... and read the footnotes to the Court's decisions, you will learn why/how/when the Uniform Commercial Code (UCC) applies AND why the EBAY/PayPal rules are NONSENSE.
JACQ WILSON et al., Plaintiffs and Respondents,
v.
BRAWN OF CALIFORNIA, INC., Defendant and Appellant.
A105461, A106368 (San Francisco County Super. Ct. No. 404454)
Outside of the PayPal fantasy-world, the buyer better make sure he pays to insure his items. And, in the instant case of the lost/stolen cards, the buyer DID pay to insure his items.
Folks Who Bite Get Bitten. Folks Who Don't Bite Get Eaten.
I'm still very excited to hear how you're gonna get $150 out of two PSA 8 Bernie Nicholls RCs and a PSA 8.5 Gretzky 6th year. If you can do that, I will send you a 59 Fleer Ted Williams pack.
<< <i>If you can do that, I will send you a 59 Fleer Ted Williams pack. >>
Oh snap!
So basically my kid won't be able to go to college, but at least I'll have a set where the three most expensive cards are of a player I despise ~ CDsNuts
Obviously your instincts about cards are non-existent. Anybody with half a brain would think there's some type of error there, and if you took the time to click one of the actual links you'll see that they mistakenly put Steve Yzerman's OPC RC on the page meant for Bernie Nicholls.
OK, how about this mmync: I'll trade you straight up as many PSA 8-9 Bernie Nicholls Topps RCs for an equal amount of PSA 8-9 Yzerman RCs and I'll even throw in $10 per card. That's like free money to you.
Yes, it's gold. Pure gold. That lot of 100 will sell for at least $5k. Either that or mmync will win it with an opening bid of 99 cents. I'm not sure which.
Comments
<< <i>I had no idea you could do that and with what I sent in it really didn't matter as I insured going and leaving PSA
at the price I thought they would be worth post graded. So in my case I covered myself coming and going.
Steve >>
That's the opposite of what I did, Steve. I always insured them for the value of what I paid (and presumably, replacement value). Just because they get slabbed doesn not necessarily mean that the value goes up. This was up until a couple of years ago, the last time I submitted. Nowadays, I feel even more strongly about that since I crack out most of the slabbed cards that I buy.
<< <i>wow this is very scary...im am so sorry to hear that and i hope your cards come in...this does sound really fishy but someone should be responsible...i was going to send in a nice sub with some nice vintage but now im very worried about this...i hope someone will do something about this as you have it insured...good luck >>
I just want to make it known publicly that... My intentions are not to discourage people from sending their cards to Psa, I am just trying to look out for you guys and eliminate any chance that someone will make the same mistake I made, which was undervaluing what I felt my cards where really worth, because it was my very first submission, and people are usually disappointed when they find out the condition there cards are actually in, and because they would be shipped back registered mail, and there was no chance that a registered mail item could be lost or stolen.
Many of the cards I send in i have almost nothing into them.
Steve
I have read 2 or 3 different versions here so I am unsure as to what really happened.
PSA shipped your parcel via USPS registered mail? Once the PO takes the item it give PSA a receipt.
During the time the PO had it it became lost?
IF so, what is the problem? 30 days has to go by I assume and then they (PO) pays
you up to the insured value. You may have to prove value.
Is that basically it? Why all the assumptions?
Steve
<< <i>If I understand what happened here the PO is at fault.
I have read 2 or 3 different versions here so I am unsure as to what really happened.
PSA shipped your parcel via USPS registered mail? Once the PO takes the item it give PSA a receipt.
During the time the PO had it it became lost?
IF so, what is the problem? 30 days has to go by I assume and then they (PO) pays
you up to the insured value. You may have to prove value.
Is that basically it? Why all the assumptions?
Steve >>
Steve, here is the part that really gets your blood flowing and makes you believe that something really fraudulent is going on, and that it is not just a standard example of pieces of mail being lost or stolen. The post office says that the items were not scanned as registered mail items, and that they were not insured. However, Psa has provided me with a receipt which shows the items accepted and insured by the post office as registered mail items. The head people at my local post office say that in 20 years, they have never seen something like this. It has to be something extremely concerning to them because I highly doubt that they would be able and willing to drop what they were doing, and spend 3 hours talking to me at a time. It gets even better, the postal inspection service tells me to call Psa and file a claim, and that it only has to be 15 days from when the items were mailed out. (including Saturday's and Sunday's). The next day I get a follow up call from the U.S. Post office Customer Relations Dept. and they tell me that I cannot file a claim because the items were not insured, and that you can't file a claim unless an item is insured. I think it has something to do with the way Psa sends out there bulk shipments or something with the way the items are accepted and scanned in at the Newport beach post office. Because Psa told me something about problems they have been having with the Newport Beach post office, and that it would literally take someone going there from Washington to approve, fix, or update something. Not sure if that’s referring to the post offices software, equipment, or what.
was insured and the PO did not scan it in I still think they are liable. Of course they
want to say they are not. It is up to you to fight them I guess.
The problem is PSA should demand that every parcel they ship gets scanned.
Laziness on the PO clerks part is what led to this dilemma.
As it is now the PO can try and say the receipt PSA has is from a different order
however that would mean that the receipt was scanned in at some
previous point in time.
I think you will win this.
Why hasn't Jim replied to this thread?
Steve
If PSA does NOT have the proper paperwork, PSA needs to dive-in
head first and figure out what happened. UCC says PSA needs to
receive/provide the standard documentation to show that the
merch was ACCEPTED by the carrier. If they do not have the docs,
they are likely subject to a claim of some liability.
I cannot - DO NOT - believe that PSA is handing over merch
without getting the proper receipts.
Registered Mail does vanish, but it is SUPER rare and the USPS does not
stop with the detective work until somebody is cooked.
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////
The shipper is supposed to DEMAND the scanning. I have to do it
almost everytime I visit the PO.
Forward that to your USPS contact.
Go from there and then tell us what happens.
It is possible for registered mail to disappear. Someone dishonest along the mail path would have to notice a bad habit of the person just ahead of them on the mail path. In my office, the truck driver who brings the mail knows that I am honest and would never steal. She has me sign the slip and then she always tosses it in the trash on the way out. Since she is the last one to sign for it, if I didn't scan the registered as arrived and I got rid of all the evidence I could steal whatever it is, and the trail would end with her. She would be financially responsible for whatever it is and she would lose her job. The postal inspectors would search her car, house, etc and it would just be a pretty bad day for her.
If there is a dishonest employee somewhere between newport beach and michigan, who has a careless employee directly ahead of them on the mail stream, they could steal that package.
In this case - it's more likely that the parcels are sitting in a white burlap bag on the wrong shelf in the registry room, somewhere in Michigan. The PI will have to follow the paper trail from newport beach to michigan. I think the mail path would be carrier to clerk, to reg clerk at the distribution center nearest Newport Beach, to shipping clerk to truck driver. It then goes to an airport to michigan. Then back to truck drivers and clerks. I've seen a reg room with more than a thousand parcels. It's possible for one to get misplaced.
I can't see 6 parcels disappearing at the same time. A truck driver isn't going to take them. They have signed for a reg bag, they have a stamped ring holding the bag closed, and they have to deliver a reg bag when they get off the truck. The truck gets loaded at one dock and then unloaded at each office along the route. It would be really unlikely for a truck driver to steal a reg bag.
A dishonest clerk could steal a parcel. If the clerk had a driver who always tossed the slip, he could wait for the driver to toss the slip and leave. He could grab the slip out of the trash, to lose the paper trail. Then he could take a chance and run outside and stick the package in his trunk. If it was small enough he could hide it in his pocket. 6 parcels from PSA aren't going in his pocket or out the back door to his car.
I remember one case of a lost registered. We had a PMR substitute postmaster. I attempted delivery on a registered and the folks weren't home. Brought it back and gave it to the PMR. He put it in the safe on the wrong shelf. They couldn't find it the next morning and there was a panic until they got in contact with that PMR. I haven't seen or heard of any other lost or stolen registered. It just isn't worth the risk.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
USPS requires proof of packaging and proof of value for almost all ins claims. USPS is generally an expert in packaging and shipping, and can tell when improper packaging contributes to damage. They're generally fair, shippers don't like the answer when a claim gets refused. A big problem is that shippers can't see how mail is processed, and sometimes have unrealistic expectations as to the handling of the item they shipped. I had a seller tell me a few days ago that he was shocked that a PWE wasn't enough, since he wrote "do not bend" on the envelope. Mail processing equipment can't read. We process over a million letters a day. You can write "do not bend" on flat envelopes and that will sometimes lead carriers to not bend them in the casing equipment or in the mailbox but the machines don't care.
USPS is not an expert on the values of what is shipped. USPS doesn't know a psa 10 from a pro 10, or a reprint from an original. We move things for people. Because USPS is not an expert, they need proof that what was damaged is worth the amount of the claim. If they didn't have that requirement there would be a problem with overinsurance on fragile items, with people insuring cheap items for more than their value and hoping for damage. The burden of proof isn't outrageous but if you take a baseball card commonly sold for $1 and tell them it was worth $500 there's going to be a problem. I would think a current SMR will end up being the value maker. If the card isn't listed in SMR then it's possible that the OP can sign up for VCP and provide average selling prices for the other items. Unfortunately there's no proven market value for low pop cards. Also by the low pop card being graded, it changes the previous market for that card. Instead of being a pop1, it's now a pop2. You can't use a previous sale as a price point, because there are now more of that card in existence and also one less buyer in the marketplace. We've all seen what happens when ultra low pop becomes low pop.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the OP is going to have to wait for the postal inspector to conclude his investigation before his insurance claim will be addressed. There's a chance the cards will be found, and if they're going to be found it'll be the PI that gets the search going. If the PI finds an end to the paper trail somebody will be in trouble and that somebody will probably not be the one who took or lost the cards.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If PSA has been having a problem with USPS and can't get the problem corrected then somebody at PSA didn't complain enough or to the right person. PSA could easily switch to UPS or FedEx and both companies would love to have them. I can't see anything service related that PSA could request that USPS wouldn't do. They need to talk to the right person, and maybe this mess will speed up that conversation.
I know that you work for the USPS, so don't feel obligated in sharing anything that might jeopardize your job in any way.
Thanks
PSA "sold" an item (ie grading) and shipped the item and it did not make the destination. How is it then, that they are not responsible since it was out of their possession when every ebay argument ends with "its the sellers responsibility"?
I understand that "after the fact" it was determined that the cards were stolen, but how would this differ if an ebay purchase was stolen?
Had the OP used their own Fed Ex account they would be the contracter and PSA would have no responsibility any refund paid by the shipper would be paid to the OP.
Loth
<< <i>That's a lot of grief over $150 worth of cards. Any money you got above that amount was a gift. Your 1995 Sliver Die Cut Nolan Ryan wouldn't sell for nearly as much as you think- $75 at most. >>
I must be the last person that you think about before you go to bed, and the first person that you think about when you wake up in the morning. Do you realize how much time you dedicate everyday thinking about me? I don't know if your just immature, or if it's because you view me as competition, but you and all of the other board members know that the cards are worth more then $150. The two Bernie Nicholls rookies, and the Gretzky card are worth $150 alone, and they all had a strong chance of getting a bump, so grow up!
<< <i>
<< <i>That's a lot of grief over $150 worth of cards. Any money you got above that amount was a gift. Your 1995 Sliver Die Cut Nolan Ryan wouldn't sell for nearly as much as you think- $75 at most. >>
I must be the last person that you think about before you go to bed, and the first person that you think about when you wake up in the morning. Do you realize how much time you dedicate everyday thinking about me? I don't know if your just immature, or if it's because you view me as competition, but you and all of the other board members know that the cards are worth more then $150. The two Bernie Nicholls rookies, and the Gretzky card are worth $150 alone, and they all had a strong chance of getting a bump, so grow up! >>
One correction, Lee (CDNUTS) doesnt wake up or go to bed, he stays up all night playing poker and posting on these boards...he spends 20 minutes a day cat-napping and day dreaming, trying to come up with more wise arse comments....
<< <i> The two Bernie Nicholls rookies, and the Gretzky card are worth $150 alone, and they all had a strong chance of getting a bump, so grow up! >>
Honestly, the last sale on a PSA 9 Gretzky was aboot $35 and the Nichols can be bought raw in PSA 8 condition for $5.
It's not personal.
Mike
Kirby Puckett Master Set
<< <i>Only to play devil's advocate here, how is PSA not responsible for this item in any way? I know they did make good, to an extent, on this item, but I hear that the "seller is responsible" so much on these boards regarding an ebay sale that didnt make its final destination through no fault of the seller and I wonder how this isnt the case here?
PSA "sold" an item (ie grading) and shipped the item and it did not make the destination. How is it then, that they are not responsible since it was out of their possession when every ebay argument ends with "its the sellers responsibility"?
I understand that "after the fact" it was determined that the cards were stolen, but how would this differ if an ebay purchase was stolen? >>
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
About 99% of the "situations" we discuss here are related to EBAY transactions.
Thus, when we talk about "seller responsibilities" we are largely referencing EBAY
and PayPal rules and policies. THOSE "rules" can differ substantially from the rules
that govern commerce in the real world.
If you google this litigation......... and read the footnotes to the Court's decisions,
you will learn why/how/when the Uniform Commercial Code (UCC) applies AND
why the EBAY/PayPal rules are NONSENSE.
JACQ WILSON et al., Plaintiffs and Respondents,
v.
BRAWN OF CALIFORNIA, INC., Defendant and Appellant.
A105461, A106368 (San Francisco County Super. Ct. No. 404454)
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Outside of the PayPal fantasy-world, the buyer better make sure he pays to insure his items.
And, in the instant case of the lost/stolen cards, the buyer DID pay to insure his items.
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
Positive Transactions - tennesseebanker, Ahmanfan, Donruss, Colebear, CDsNuts, rbdjr1, Downtown1974, yankeeno7, drewsef, mnolan, mrbud60, msassin, RipublicaninMass, AkbarClone, rustywilly, lsutigers1973, julen23 and nam812, plus many others...
<< <i>If you can do that, I will send you a 59 Fleer Ted Williams pack. >>
Oh snap!
<< <i>seriously - who is bernie nichols? >>
Apparently he was so good that his RCs will sell for $60 in PSA 8 according to the dreamworld mmync is living in.
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
Positive Transactions - tennesseebanker, Ahmanfan, Donruss, Colebear, CDsNuts, rbdjr1, Downtown1974, yankeeno7, drewsef, mnolan, mrbud60, msassin, RipublicaninMass, AkbarClone, rustywilly, lsutigers1973, julen23 and nam812, plus many others...
<< <i><< seriously - who is bernie nichols? >>
Apparently he was so good that his RCs will sell for $60 in PSA 8 according to the dreamworld mmync is living in. >>
<< <i> Since it is a federal crime involving the U.S. Government, I doubt we will ever know what happened. >>
Wow! This ranks right up there with the whole JFK assassination conspiracy.
Good luck!
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
<< <i>
<< <i> Since it is a federal crime involving the U.S. Government, I doubt we will ever know what happened. >>
Wow! This ranks right up there with the whole JFK assassination conspiracy.
Good luck! >>
Maybe we can get Willie O'Keefe to testify and tell us what he saw. But dont piss off Guy Bannister...he'll pistol whip you.
link
<< <i>
<< <i><< seriously - who is bernie nichols? >>
Apparently he was so good that his RCs will sell for $60 in PSA 8 according to the dreamworld mmync is living in. >>
Where does it say the person/players name you are researching?
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
Positive Transactions - tennesseebanker, Ahmanfan, Donruss, Colebear, CDsNuts, rbdjr1, Downtown1974, yankeeno7, drewsef, mnolan, mrbud60, msassin, RipublicaninMass, AkbarClone, rustywilly, lsutigers1973, julen23 and nam812, plus many others...
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
Positive Transactions - tennesseebanker, Ahmanfan, Donruss, Colebear, CDsNuts, rbdjr1, Downtown1974, yankeeno7, drewsef, mnolan, mrbud60, msassin, RipublicaninMass, AkbarClone, rustywilly, lsutigers1973, julen23 and nam812, plus many others...
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
whose buying what now.....