Is PCI being auctioned off?

pcgs69 · December 16, 2007 8:40AM

On page 42 of the December 24th issue of coin world...

SilverEagles92 · December 16, 2007 8:41AM

Do I hear $100?!

*crickets chirping*

Barndog · December 16, 2007 8:43AM

if they have decent equipment, it might be worth the five grand cashier's check required

pharmer · December 16, 2007 8:44AM

Does it come with JT's autograph?

291fifth · December 16, 2007 8:47AM

The holders are actually quite nice.

MrEureka · December 16, 2007 8:49AM

Although I am not a fan of PCI, this is not something to laugh about. The company would probably not be for sale if Brian Beardsley had not passed away this year.

PerryHall · December 16, 2007 8:53AM

Why would anyone buy a slabbing service's equipment unless they were planning to start a new slabbing service? CAC---here's your chance.

prooflike · December 16, 2007 9:04AM

new slabbing service? CAC---here's your chance.

That would be a big, thick slab - to slab a slab.

StampAlarm · December 16, 2007 9:07AM

Is PCI still accepting coins? Their website hasn't been updated in
awhile. Nothing about going out of business or being up for sale.

Seems like total meltdown. A prominent board member recently mentioned
he had not been paid for his part in the new attribution program initiated
by Stanton. I wonder what now.

Jerry

jonathanb · December 16, 2007 9:38AM

<< Why would anyone buy a slabbing service's equipment unless they were planning to start a new slabbing service? >>

The auction is for "all tangible and intangible items". It's entirely possible that the intangibles have more value than the physical equipment. People pay good money for mailing lists...

Myqqy · December 16, 2007 10:14AM

If I had the money, I would buy the company and completely re-invent it- maybe even bring back the old photo holders... I know it would be a super long shot, but the challenge would be interesting...

coinpictures · December 16, 2007 10:16AM

I smell an opportunity for Centsles...

edix2001 · December 16, 2007 10:30AM

I received the only two PCI slabs I own this year - a counterstamped (w/handpainted letters) Washington dollar from smalldollars.com and a 1996 "Holiday Peace Medal" by the Gallery Mint Museum that was previously owned by JT stanton, and signed by him on the label.
Now I suppose they are collectors items on their own.

Frankcoins · December 16, 2007 10:50AM

I talked to a close friend of the Beardsley family at the Fort Worth show today. He said that PCI had lost 90% of their income after the ebay ban.

Bochiman · December 16, 2007 11:16AM

<< I talked to a close friend of the Beardsley family at the Fort Worth show today. He said that PCI had lost 90% of their income after the ebay ban. >>

This is what I was thinking as well.....the ebay ban did this.

291fifth · December 16, 2007 11:16AM

<< I talked to a close friend of the Beardsley family at the Fort Worth show today. He said that PCI had lost 90% of their income after the ebay ban. >>

I wonder if there has been a similar effect on SEGS?

Coinosaurus · December 16, 2007 11:20AM

I've heard the SEGS folks complain about it, don't know if it is a 90% deal like PCI tho.

MORGANHUNTER2 · December 16, 2007 11:25AM

I thought EBAY was just a 'venue'

WHO paid them to kick off competition?

amazing that companies like PCI and SEGS have to put up with crap like this.

Again- buy the damn coin not the plastic- if you over pay on one then you can not blame the grading company for your stupidity.

fc · December 16, 2007 11:28AM

lol. a fitting end for a crappy tpg.

as for ebay ruining their business.. um, that is one lame excuse!

BBN · December 16, 2007 11:34AM

<< 

as for ebay ruining their business.. um, that is one lame excuse! >>

I disagree. I firmly believe in caveat emptor. Sure the slab may or may not give an accurate grade, but the pics are there and the buyer should damn well be educated in what they're buying before they pay the money.

fc · December 16, 2007 11:38AM

but the pics are there

you can still sell these fangled dangled pci slabs on ebay...
not like it was a total ban.

what changed was you cannot lie/market them to uneducated boobs
and get full billing along with the main tpgs via the search feature.

so therefore, the main users of pci have stopped using them! hey if
pci cannot be used for near fraud.. they are useless now eh?

BBN · December 16, 2007 11:44AM

I just wish ebay would take such a proactive approach to scammers. How many scammers do we all try in vain to get hammered on ebay?

Unknown · December 16, 2007 11:49AM

This content has been removed.

ArizonaJack · December 16, 2007 12:02PM

<< I just wish ebay would take such a proactive approach to scammers. How many scammers do we all try in vain to get hammered on ebay? >>

KAA CHINNNGGGG You win the prize today for best reply to a post

WTCG · December 16, 2007 1:01PM

This is actually the first I've heard of the liquidation of PCI. Since the bidding deadline is after the FUN convention there may be some buzz on the floor about dealers and others who are interested in aquiring some of the assets of the company.

I believe that the combination of the death of Brian Beardsley and EBay's amended policies sealed the fate of PCI.

BlindedByEgo · December 16, 2007 1:05PM

I'm sad to hear of anothers' misfortune, but like all businesses, the owners made their own choices. To have a business model so dependent on Ebay (to the tune of 90% loss of revenues) seems folly.

Seems cruel to laugh at somebody else's suffering, though.

keets · December 16, 2007 1:46PM

if it's true that the eBay change is at least partially responsible for this it says volumes about the sham we knew as PCI, a one time legitimate service. in fact, it would actually place them no better than a service such as SGS, a slab that seems nothing more than a vehicle to sell raw coins on eBay. my crystal ball vision in #3 was based on the simple fact that i believe collectors are pretty smart and can only be fooled for so long. i don't expect SEGS or ANACS to be able to hold on for very much longer, and although competition is healthy, the form it's taken with regard to the many grading services has been very damaging to our hobby.

BBN · December 16, 2007 2:07PM

what ever happened to ACG? Are they long defunct also?

Frankcoins · December 16, 2007 3:55PM

<< 

you can still sell these fangled dangled pci slabs on ebay...
not like it was a total ban.

>>

Can't list the grade, the name of the grading company, or the price where it can be found.

That's like a newspaper classified section saying they haven't banned Chevrolet. You just can't
mention Chevrolet, or the model, or the price, or the mileage. "car, see photo."

It's a de facto ban.

seatedcoins · December 16, 2007 4:33PM

<< 

<< 

you can still sell these fangled dangled pci slabs on ebay...
not like it was a total ban.

>>

Can't list the grade, the name of the grading company, or the price where it can be found.

That's like a newspaper classified section saying they haven't banned Chevrolet. You just can't
mention Chevrolet, or the model, or the price, or the mileage. "car, see photo."

It's a de facto ban. >>

Interesting point.

PerryHall · December 16, 2007 7:56PM

If I remember correctly, Hallmark grading service (Bower's company) sold their equipment to PCI who originally had a large photo slab. They were fairly conservative and did a good job (green label). Then PCI was sold and their grading standards loosened (gold label). If someone buys the equipment to start a grading service, I'm sure they will change the name since PCI now has a less than stellar reputation.

Connecticoin · December 16, 2007 8:31PM

<< 

<< I talked to a close friend of the Beardsley family at the Fort Worth show today. He said that PCI had lost 90% of their income after the ebay ban. >>

I wonder if there has been a similar effect on SEGS? >>

The SEGS equipment would be worth buying. Those slabs are the tougher than PCGS.

shorecoll · December 16, 2007 9:28PM

If I was PCGS or NGC, I'd submit a reasonable low-ball bid, just to make sure it stayed dead. If you can run a scam with a complete no-name, it has to be easier to scam using a "used-to-be-real" name. If eBay ever changes their policy back and you have an old-time real service you got for $10k...

coppercoins · December 16, 2007 9:36PM

There were a number of factors that led to the demise of PCI, but the largest financial problem and the final blow was eBay negating them as a professional grader. I hope they sue eBay because they would probably win. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks of PCI, eBay's decision to negate all but a couple of grading services is purely wrong. It's tantamount to a state refusing to register anything but their favorite car makers because some of the richest people don't want to have to share the road with the other car makers. Sales of all the other car makers would suddenly come to a halt in that state, and dealers of those cars would be out of business in a heartbeat. Take that nationwide and it could put even GM or Ford out of business overnight. What eBay is doing is just wrong, and in my opinion, illegal.

SeaEagleCoins · December 16, 2007 9:45PM

<< There were a number of factors that led to the demise of PCI, but the largest financial problem and the final blow was eBay negating them as a professional grader. I hope they sue eBay because they would probably win. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks of PCI, eBay's decision to negate all but a couple of grading services is purely wrong. It's tantamount to a state refusing to register anything but their favorite car makers because some of the richest people don't want to have to share the road with the other car makers. Sales of all the other car makers would suddenly come to a halt in that state, and dealers of those cars would be out of business in a heartbeat. Take that nationwide and it could put even GM or Ford out of business overnight. What eBay is doing is just wrong, and in my opinion, illegal. >>

Following this line of reasoning...wouldn't it follow that Heritage and Teletrade are wrong, as well?

They have limited the TPG's that can be listed there all along...what's the difference?

All through the retail businesses, in every form of retail, there are stores that offer certain brand names to the exclusion of others. There is no legal requirement for any business to give access to any brand name that wants that access. It is at the discretion of the store/venue.

At least, that's how I see it...

coinkat · December 16, 2007 9:47PM

perhaps this is a chance for ICCS... the Canadian Grading service to keep their own name, buy the rights to slab and slabbing equipment and get rid of the PCI name. If ICCS put their graded coins in slabs instead of flips, well, I think they could increase their market share.

keets · December 16, 2007 9:54PM

eBay didn't ban PCI per se, they just excercised some control over what's allowed in the auction title based upon numerous complaints. if push really came to shove i think PCI would certainly be the big loser in it all. again, my understanding about eBay's change is only in the auction title listing and also in stating a grade either in the title or description, can someone verify that with a link please??

Chuck, let's not twist this whole thing with some disinformation that makes eBay the bad guy after all the damage the scum-tier services have done via eBay. while you may consider that venue as a 500 pund gorilla, they have done more good than bad. can the same be said for PCI, SGS, NCGS, NTC, and on and on and on. the eBay change wasn't directed at PCI in particular and really singled out who was allowable, not who was allowed, right??

if i'm wrong, please correct me and good riddance to PCI.

Barry · December 17, 2007 12:33AM

<< I talked to a close friend of the Beardsley family at the Fort Worth show today. He said that PCI had lost 90% of their income after the ebay ban. >>

They got what they deserved.

Longacre · December 17, 2007 12:38AM

Not to be harsh, but not every business has a mandate to remain in business if their business model isn't one that the public supports, accepts, and spends money with.

I am not an expert in the TPG business, but a company does not go out of business for a single reason. Rather, it is more likely a series of decisions that causes the business not to succeed.

TwoSides2aCoin · December 17, 2007 12:44AM

It should be listed on eBay for more exposure, if it isn't already.
On a side note:
PCI graded gold half eagle Indian $5 pieces I submitted to PCGS crossed at the same grade.
NONE of the NGC graded half eagles ever crossed at the same grade. Some were downgraded and some were just sent back to me in the NGC holders, which were subsequently sold.

Food for thought.

Opinions are opinions and facts are facts.

StampAlarm · December 17, 2007 2:31AM

For what it's worth. I emailed PCI over the weekend and asked if they are still accepting coins.

I received a reply this morning.

"Yes, business as usual"

I guess the auction is for a working company and not a liquidation sale.

Jerry

messydesk · December 17, 2007 3:01AM

<< 

<< 

you can still sell these fangled dangled pci slabs on ebay...
not like it was a total ban.

>>

Can't list the grade, the name of the grading company, or the price where it can be found.

That's like a newspaper classified section saying they haven't banned Chevrolet. You just can't
mention Chevrolet, or the model, or the price, or the mileage. "car, see photo."

It's a de facto ban. >>

Your analogy isn't quite right. It would be like a newspaper saying you can't sell a used Chevrolet as a certified used car unless it actually is a factory certified used car. Wait a minute, they already do that. If, on the other hand, the car has been reconditioned to better than new condition by some other party, you'd have to mention it in the details (along with the mileage, model, and price), and the service records and reputation of the shop used would affect the value. If the shop had a good reputation, it would enhance the value. If not, it wouldn't.

ModernCrapNut · December 17, 2007 3:58AM

There will probably be a Chinese buyer. Then they can slab their counterfeits and scam on.

Bochiman · December 17, 2007 4:14AM

<< For what it's worth. I emailed PCI over the weekend and asked if they are still accepting coins.

I received a reply this morning.

"Yes, business as usual"

I guess the auction is for a working company and not a liquidation sale.

Jerry >>

Did you also mention you saw the impending sale? If all you asked was if they were still accepting coins, I would still be worried.
I haven't/won't submit to them anyway, but can you imagine someone having coins there, with all the best of intentions of being slabbed, at the time of sale? Maybe you will get your coins back, maybe you won't.

dorkkarl · December 17, 2007 4:15AM

seriously, what are theyre assets worth? anyone have a educated guess?

K S

fc · December 17, 2007 4:22AM

dorkkarl,

i imagine one would start by calling this company and asking for
prices. http://www.ultrasonicseal.com/

might as well know what the gear will cost brand new before buying used.
better yet find out the name of the gear they use and call that company.

as for the plastic. the maker of the sonic sealer could easily recommend the
company who could design the holder and what type of plastic is best.

then call HP for a nice printer and do a bit of research on stable archive
paper and inks.

what else could their possibly be? lights and tables? :-|

ca0100000 · December 17, 2007 4:53AM

http://gravittauction.com/auction_detail.php?ID=375763
Dosen't look like much is there. Maybe they should have sold all the items on ebay.

mrpotatoheadd · December 17, 2007 5:05AM

<< Dosen't look like much is there. Maybe they should have sold all the items on ebay. >>

Maybe they wanted to, but eBay wouldn't let them put their name in the listing?

Barry · December 17, 2007 5:07AM

<< seriously, what are theyre assets worth? anyone have a educated guess?

K S >>

Whatever fair market value of the equipment is minus goodwill (in their case, their name is a negative.)

WaterSport · December 17, 2007 5:08AM

What we have not seen yet, is one of the less accurate grading companies getting it turned around. How hard could that be? Right fees, right service, not BB every other Copper coin submitted, even offer %50 of value for mis grade or buy back (Even PCGS does not Buy back at full BV) a registry program with consistent, easy understood numeric numbering system with unrealistic coins set aside in their own mega set, your sets are only listed when you pay an annual fee, no fee, no set, but any slab can be listed, problem coins only authenticated, variety/vam ID, True View like Pic on the reverse for validation. I guess the rest of you could add to this want list. If anyone here is considering a run along these lines of starting a new business, count me in for a $1000 investment.

WS

relicsncoins · December 17, 2007 5:48AM

I say we as forum member all pitch in and buy it and create "PCGS Lite". Specializing in authentication of problem coins.

JJ

Is PCI being auctioned off?

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