ebay & bad coins
renue
Posts: 5
OK...this is my first post and I am very new to coin collecting (started 3 weeks ago).
I've bought the red book and blue book as well as a few other books.
I have a few questions:
What is the average coin collection size in pieces & worth?
I've bought $250 in the last 3 weeks (4 silver eagles, a morgan, a walking liberty, GW coin cover and 2000,2005,2006,2007 silver proof sets)
My main concern is how much I'm spending so soon on ebay. Almost addicted to it.
As a hobby...how much is the average person spending?
No wise-crack answers like I've seen before "spend as much as you can afford..."
Also...I see a lot of talk about ebay and 'bad coins.' or 'trash coins' So what exactly are 'trash coins?'
Kevin
I've bought the red book and blue book as well as a few other books.
I have a few questions:
What is the average coin collection size in pieces & worth?
I've bought $250 in the last 3 weeks (4 silver eagles, a morgan, a walking liberty, GW coin cover and 2000,2005,2006,2007 silver proof sets)
My main concern is how much I'm spending so soon on ebay. Almost addicted to it.
As a hobby...how much is the average person spending?
No wise-crack answers like I've seen before "spend as much as you can afford..."
Also...I see a lot of talk about ebay and 'bad coins.' or 'trash coins' So what exactly are 'trash coins?'
Kevin
0
Comments
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
Kevin,
Welcome to the forums. Before you bid in the future, please feel free to post a link and get the opinions of fellow board members. It will save you much money.
Buying on eBay can be addicting but try to learn before you buy! Your off to a good start with the books...this board has been a great source of knowledge for me!
And 'Welcome!!' to the boards!
Kevin
roadrunner
find your passion. which series do you like theee best.
become an expert on it fast. ask several (hundred) questions here.
study ha.com archives. look on ebay at selling prices. etc..
so many ways to approach the knowledge gathering stage.
good luck!
Better to have an area of interest. Or, are you trying for a type collection? A set of ASE's? Are you purchasing purely to collect? Or are you going to resell?
I don't think there is such an animal as an average collection. Every one of them is as different as it's owner.
It is an addiction, just ask my husband....
Everyone's pocketbook is a little different, my opinion is spend only your money that is disposable. Don't spend the rent money on coins...
Trash coins....don't quite know, maybe just something to fill the hole in the album. The mindset here is to wait and buy the best you can afford. Something that is "original". We all don't always follow that rule...
I think I'll try a set of ASE's first since I have 3-4 now.
I did start an Excel worksheet with all the coins I have, purchase date, grade, price paid, etc.
If I ask stupid questions...be kind.
Kevin
Numismatics is a very personalized hobby. Some people like some series of coins and other people like other series. To each his own. The same goes for the price of coins that you buy and the value of your collection. I know people that have probably spent no less than $500 on coins in their lifetime yet have thousands upon thousands of coins. I know other people that have spent $10,000,000 on a batch of 20 coins.
There is no average total value of collections. There is no average total number of coins in a collection. You collect what you find interesting. For some people this means hoarding lincoln cents, for others it means buying heavily toned Morgans.
When starting out, I suggest you buy the broadest variety of of material as possible so you can find what you really like. But don't push yourself into liking something. It took me over 8 years to discover what I really liked--territorial gold. Usually territorial gold coins start out at around $3,000 (although some have sold for roughly $1 million). I know people who really loved worn barber coinage--which starts at around $2. To each his own.
What I'm trying to get at is that, if you are really devoted to the hobby, you should spend as much as what doesn't strain your budget. If you get a $1000 paycheck take that money and pay the mortgage, pay the electric bill, pay the water bill, put some of it away, and then what is left--your "spending money"-- should be devoted to what you enjoy (coins).
Collection sizes vary in size and value as wide as you can imagine. Some may only keep a few coins or a narrow focused set, but they could be worth many thousands each, while others have cent collections that can include bags of common wheats gathered along the way which puts your number of coins into the thousands pretty quick.
There are many websites that have lots of helpful information, one is coins.about.com
Maybe some other members here can point a few others out for you.
Russ, NCNE
As far as how much money people spend or how much their collections are worth -- don't worry about that. Many people here spend less money than you have over a three week period, and many spend far more than you do.
Bad coins or trash coins are either coins that have problems, such as being cleaned, whizzed, artificially toned (complex to explain, you'll learn more about it over time, especially if you stick around here
Good ideas on the books you purchased. Read whatever you can on the subject, find what you like about coins, what type(s) draw your interest, and learn about those. You will find there is a huge variety of collectors. Some collect errors, some collect only specific types, some will strive to finish one set, sell it, then try for a different one, etc. Find what drives your interest, learn about it, then go for it. There is a lot to love about this hobby, but be careful with your money. If there is anything this hobby can be, it is a huge money sink. Don't neglect your personal life responsibilities for coins (as tempting as it can be!).
<< <i>Spend as much as you can afford.
Russ, NCNE >>
The Maddy Rae Collection
CURRENT BST OFFERINGS
Find a focus...ASE are as good as any other as a starting place.
Read all you can: here, the NGC forums, Numismatic News, Coin World, reference books, magazines.
Set and stick to a budget until you have some knowledge of what you are buying.
Hoard the keys.
Here's a few suggestions.
You can avoid the two biggest rookie mistakes: (1) buying junk (2) overpaying
Your best bet to avoid buying junk (cleaned, damaged, etc) is to stick with PCGS and NGC coins only (government sealed sets are OK too)
Your best bet at avoiding overpaying is to stick to a price guide -- PCGS guide is fine, just know that this is the high end of retail, so should really be your top end.
If you'll follow these two suggestions, you can buy a wide variety of coins in a variety of grades, and learn a lot in the meantime -- you won't be buried in anything.
Just some thoughts... oh, and HAVE FUN!
Rex
With that said...
I have an eclectic "collection" myself, and would never be considered a "serious collector" due to the fact that I have (A) no serious money invested & (B) I have no series/type/set that I follow (yet)... I admire those that have "found their calling", but I like variety too much to stay focused on anything for the long-haul... LOL
I would suggest that your style of coin collecting is going to be dependant on two primary factors: (1) goals (pecuniary/intrinsic) & (2) personal (interests/personality type) .
There really is no "right" (or wrong) way... and no rules (except the ones that you make for yourself) - however; there are accepted standards, protocols, methods, practices & other miscellany, that you will be exposed to and learn more about pertaining to many different areas of coin collecting as a whole.
And yes, coin collecting can be addictive (just so your wife knows
Enjoy yourself ~
Raquel
<< <i>Well....I'm a workaholic (60-70 hours per week at my ad agency)....so my wife suggested a hobby like coin collecting. Now I'm a coin-aholic with no focus.
I think I'll try a set of ASE's first since I have 3-4 now.
I did start an Excel worksheet with all the coins I have, purchase date, grade, price paid, etc.
If I ask stupid questions...be kind.
Kevin >>
Welcome and that's a good start.
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The advice people have offered so far, ie., buying PCGS and NGC slabbed coins, is excellent for newcomers who want to acquire coins with minimal risk as newbies to the hobby. I'd say buy these slabbed coins and check the prices you pay against the prices listed in the PCGS price lists. In general, try to beat the listed retail value by 10-20% and you are doing well buying PCGS-slabbed coins at this stage. It is a good general strategy for most people buying coins. However, some coins regularly retail for more than PCGS listed prices. When you become familiar with grading and can judge whether a coin is graded properly and is original (not cleaned), then you may want to wonder into the rugged frontier of raw coins. Learning to grade coins properly is essential for any collector! A great way to learn how to grade coins is to buy some grading books and become a member of Heritage Auctions or Teletrade Auctions and search their database of coins in different grades to get a sense of the wear criteria for each grade. Download pictures and compile a reference library of photos of each grade.
If you want to branch out into 19th or 18th century coins, buying PCGS or NGC-slabbed coins offers a large degree of assurance that what you are buying are properly-graded, quality coins that will be eagerly sought after when you wish to sell them.
Learn as much as you can about the pitfalls in the hobby by reading books and reading boards such as this one. Many of the people here are top notch dealers and collectors. Don't be put off if they seem to be short with you, pompous or condescending at times. They have been in the business a long time, are good at what they do, and you really want to know the stuff they know. They will be glad to help you if you are honest and straight-forward with them.
Again, welcome aboard!
Read and re-read all the previous posts; there's lots of good counsel there.
I'll just add my suggestion that you look through your redbook and when you see a coin series that chings your chimes more than some others do, do further research into that series through a Google search for articles, keyword search on this forum for past posts on the subject, coin books and magazines at your local library, and so on.
The advice on buying only professionally graded i.e., "slabbed" coins is fine as far as it goes , but you will still need to learn how to grade coins at least fairly well by yourself and as soon as possible. Buy a copy of a "Photograde" book and/or the "Official A.N.A. Grading Standards For United States Coins".
Meanwhile, attend a local or regional coin show (or several) near your city, and see if there's a coin store near you that has a "bid board" night, when many other collectors will be there for you to gain knowledge from.
Knowledge and experience rule in coin collecting just as in all other areas of life.
- Jim
Only you (and maybe your spouce) can determine how much you can afford to spend on coins.....
My rule for spending...for what its worth.
1. Only buy coins when all other bills are payed. and I mean ALL the bills (actually this is my wife's rule)
2. Take your time, I know it seems like there are not enough coins on the market, but the reality is your just not looking in the right places. Trust me there is not a person in the world that can buy and hold all the coins at once, the Hunt brothers tried it with silver and it didn't work.....
3. Keep it fun, take time to get to know some dealers & other collectors, join a local coin club, I've been learning about coins since I was 6, thirty one years later I feel like I've just scratched the surface.
4. Sometimes you just have to break rule #1.............lol
AL
Many tellers will look around and might say "Well, I have four half dollars and a roll of Dollars". Be polite and ask if you can buy them. Many tellers are glad to get the oddball stuff out of their tills, less to count and one less column to fill out for that denomination (I worked at a bank for years).
If they have stuff you are not particularly interested in, I suggest you buy it anyway because they will learn your face quick as the guy who only takes stuff now and then and will likely blow you off if you do it to often.
I bought two rolls of halves from the Wells Fargo in Safeway. I got like 8 or so 1964 halves 90% silver and a whole roll almost of Pre 1970 halves at 40% silver.
After you aquire these coins at face value, buy the Cherrypickers guides for the higher denomination coins (newest edition released not long ago). The other Cherrypickers guide for lower denomination coins is older, I forget the edition, but get that too.
Sit down and check out your new coins. Look for obvious errors, higher quality coins (BU), ones you like, or anything you want and save them. The rest can be spent or saved and rolled.
Do not take the coins back to the same bank you bought them from, roll them and take them to another bank and put them in your account that way.
This is my best advice. You get coins at face value, you read the guides, you learn the grades and you never know. You might have a teller hand you a 1921 peace dollar in F/XF condition like I got one day. Not a great high dollar coin, but it was given to me by the teller for a dollar, and she was glad to get rid of it.
Have fun, read this forum as often as you can and WELCOME.
When I was in the military and didn't have a very big coin budget, I would still go to shows just to look at coins and sharpen my grading skills. I would ask to look at alot of slabbed coins even though I had no intentions of purchasing them. I would study an MS-63 coin, and try to find what kept it out of an MS-64 holder etc. I know, it sounds borring, but it is a good way to see alot of coins and work on your grading skills.
JJ
kidding, kidding!.
dont spend the bill money on coins. take a breath, take it slow.
Educate yourself a bit more before you buy a lot of junk.
<< <i>I've bought $250 in the last 3 weeks (4 silver eagles, a morgan, a walking liberty, GW coin cover and 2000,2005,2006,2007 silver proof sets) >>
I don't keep track of the prices on these but that doesn't sound outrageous to me. Most of those are moderns which aren't going to be problem coins so if you didn't pay way over market, you should be ok. In the beginning practice a combination of limiting your purchases and limiting the dollar investment of each purchase until you know what you're doing.
For NCLT moderns like the ASE and silver SHQs, you typically won't find problem coins but the potential risk is that the market will collapse and prices will fall. This is because production runs are huge and the vast majority of them will remain pristine because they are not circulated. Start off avoiding TPG 70s, that is coins in PCGS or NGC slabs with a grade of PR70, PF70 or MS70. Generally 70s have high premiums and more risk. Understand the risk before you get into that market.
For classics like the Morgan and WLH, there are a lot of problem coins sold to the unsuspecting both in slabs and out of slabs. Raw coins (anything outside of a PCGS/NGC/ICG/ANACS holder) should be considered highly suspect as they are likely to have problems. If you post pictures of raw coins on eBay here, people will most likely find problems in the coins for you. Once you get good at identifying problem-free coins, you can buy them on with relative safety but learn first because a large number of these will have problems. While you are much much safer with one of the Big Four TPGs, there are reasons to to be weary here as well. Some coins are over graded (a much lamented topic on these forums), some have their market acceptability questioned (color, designations like FBL for Frankies, etc.), some are net graded problem coins, etc. You can start buying some cheaper TPG slabbed coins but I recommend doing a lot of reading on these boards and ATS before spending a lot of money on a coin, even a TPG slabbed coin.
So basically what a lot of others have already said, do a lot of reading/studying, follow these boards a lot, limit your dollar expenditures in the beginning, learn to identify problem coins, etc.
I've been collecting for over 20 years (started off with mostly proof sets) and my collection is still lacking a strong focus. I have always had an interest in older coins, but think its rather daunting to try to acquire a complete series of many of the older coins. I've purchased a large set of pieces over the years on ebay and am in the process now of selling off pieces that I'm not so fond of and ones that I probably shouldn't have purchased because I didn't have the available cash. Many of these coins were purchased without any real knowledge of what I was buying and the dynamics of the market.
I am still in the process of trying to find a focus for my collection and I'm closer now than I've ever been. To keep up with newer stuff from the mint, I collect proof and Mint sets and to enjoy the older coins, I've decided to begin a type set (one example of each design for each denomination).
Welcome to the forum, buy some more books and take the time to read and enjoy them!
Eric
why are you buying? compulsive? OCD?. the big issue is why?? Your wife says you need a hobby because.....
answer that and move forward.
For me it occupies some of my OCD and at least I have something to show for my purchases.