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Was this an "Ethical Dilemma" or was I a fool?
jmski52
Posts: 23,968 ✭✭✭✭✭
Last year, I was tracking every 2004 Platinum Proof that came up for sale. I happened to hit on a slew of 2004 Platinum Proof Sets for sale - all being offered for something like $2,200 each, and all of them were being sold from, of all places - the Vatican.
I figured - OK, let's just see what these all sell for, thinking of course that it was an obvious scam. Then, lightning struck! Another set came up for sale as a Buy-It-Now, for $2,200.00 as I recall. The seller was using the Vatican sets as his pricing guide. Wham! I really wasn't in the market for another set, but I debated whether or not to scoop up the buy of the decade.
My next thought was - aw crap. I knew what I had to do. I bought the set and started trying to contact the seller. He wasn't at that phone number, but I got through to his Mom, who was thrilled that the set had sold already. When the guy returned my call later, he proceeded to tell me that he was selling his father-in-law's holdings because his mother-in-law needed the cash.
I told him that the set was worth $8,000.00 and that I couldn't take the set from him like that. I told him that I would void the auction and he could re-list it. He asked me if I wanted it, and I told him that I wasn't really in the market for it.
He re-listed the set and sold it for something like $8,000.00. He sent me a 1986 3-coin Statue of Liberty Unc Set from his father-in-law's estate, as a reward.
Now the Editiorial Comment - In another thread, the issue of ethical conduct on ebay coin sales has been pretty much dismissed by some, such as Red Tiger, who seems to believe that the Jungle is the Jungle.
So, my question is - am I a fool? Or was this an "Ethical Dilemma?" Or, are both statements true?
* Note - for all you skeptics out there, yeah, it can be found on my feedback record. The guy called me the most honest guy on ebay. After the crap that I got from my other thread, I'm not sure that I'd be such a nice guy again. I'd probably just ignore it.
I figured - OK, let's just see what these all sell for, thinking of course that it was an obvious scam. Then, lightning struck! Another set came up for sale as a Buy-It-Now, for $2,200.00 as I recall. The seller was using the Vatican sets as his pricing guide. Wham! I really wasn't in the market for another set, but I debated whether or not to scoop up the buy of the decade.
My next thought was - aw crap. I knew what I had to do. I bought the set and started trying to contact the seller. He wasn't at that phone number, but I got through to his Mom, who was thrilled that the set had sold already. When the guy returned my call later, he proceeded to tell me that he was selling his father-in-law's holdings because his mother-in-law needed the cash.
I told him that the set was worth $8,000.00 and that I couldn't take the set from him like that. I told him that I would void the auction and he could re-list it. He asked me if I wanted it, and I told him that I wasn't really in the market for it.
He re-listed the set and sold it for something like $8,000.00. He sent me a 1986 3-coin Statue of Liberty Unc Set from his father-in-law's estate, as a reward.
Now the Editiorial Comment - In another thread, the issue of ethical conduct on ebay coin sales has been pretty much dismissed by some, such as Red Tiger, who seems to believe that the Jungle is the Jungle.
So, my question is - am I a fool? Or was this an "Ethical Dilemma?" Or, are both statements true?
* Note - for all you skeptics out there, yeah, it can be found on my feedback record. The guy called me the most honest guy on ebay. After the crap that I got from my other thread, I'm not sure that I'd be such a nice guy again. I'd probably just ignore it.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
I knew it would happen.
I knew it would happen.
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But I salute you for not doing it
(Priest) BLASPHEMY he said it again, did you hear him?
You will certainly have some good karma enroute...
My icon IS my coin. It is a gem 1949 FBL Franklin.
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Neither. An ethical dilemma exists when you must choose one of two equally unethical alternatives. Choosing between right and wrong can sometimes be difficult, but it's not a dilemma. Good for you!
<< <i>I'm afraid if you need other people to be proud of your honesty, then something else is missing. >>
why?
hi, i'm tom.
i do not doctor coins like some who post in here.
I knew it would happen.
Isn't it the same thing????
Ike Specialist
Finest Toned Ike I've Ever Seen, been looking since 1986
<< <i>How do we classify those folks that scoop up a deep cameo coin in a proof set for proof set money????
Isn't it the same thing???? >>
Similar, IMO, but not quite the same. Finding a raw potential gem in a proof set requires a little more specialized information than looking at the established market value for that set. It would be more like offering a 1999 silver proof set at, say, $100.
Now that is about the most negative conclusion I can imagine someone drawing from that post. And totally unjustified IMO.
Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum
is the record of our good and noble deeds. Within such
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Camelot
<< <i>I'm afraid if you need other people to be proud of your honesty, then something else is missing. Now that is about the most negative conclusion I can imagine someone drawing from that post. And totally unjustified IMO. >>
jmski52, I added my 2 cents to another post of yours about a jerk who sold you a Liberty Head nickel. In that case I listed the reasons why I thought there was little that you could do other than put the incriminated coin in a frame and look at it each time you make a bid on EBay. FYI I have a coin on my desk that I paid $179 for as a raw uncirculated 1880-P VAM 9. The coin came back as an MS62 VAM 10 which PCGS does not slab. My fault, my lesson.
In this case you did the right thing. Ethics are precious and frequently ignored or brushed off in today's world in which a lot of people think they are J.R. Ewing of Dallas fame and dirty tricks are more the rule than the exception.
That seller got the amount he deserved and you can look at yourself in the mirror knowing you did the right thing. Whether people here approve or not is not really important. We are our own most severe judges. That nasty little voice that says "you shouldn't have done that" is very difficult to get rid of if you have a conscience.
Collecting since the 1980's
Morgan Dollars Circ. Strikes
- Basic Set - Varieties - Prooflike Basic Set - Date Set
- Carson City - Early S Mint Short Set - Mintmark Type Set
Morgan Dollars Proof
- Basic Set - Varieties
Peace Circ.
<< <i>I'm afraid if you need other people to be proud of your honesty, then something else is missing.
Now that is about the most negative conclusion I can imagine someone drawing from that post. And totally unjustified IMO. >>
I do not know if that is negative, analytical, or an attempt at trying to understand the original poster's intent.
Acceptance is what appears to be the attempt of the original thread. It's a good story, nonetheless. The story calls out another forum member and I would think this creates "sides"...sorta like my name.
No ethics, no dilemma, no foolishness...
I think the thread title invites people to pass judgement
Maybe that's why lanlord made his comment. He got invited .
Who paid 8 grand ?
I need pics
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>How do we classify those folks that scoop up a deep cameo coin in a proof set for proof set money????
Isn't it the same thing???? >>
I'd argue no. There's a difference between being mistaken over common retail price of a generic item and using expertise to spot a rare item.
Buying proof sets and taking a chance on making a top pop is one thing, but buying something for what you know is about only a quarter of its value from someone who was misled is entirely different.
When you wake up every day you wake up an honorable person, no one can take that from you. Ever.
Rob the Newbie
Camelot
<< I'm afraid if you need other people to be proud of your honesty, then something else is missing. >>
Those who make these comment are the one's missing something!
You did a fine thing.
-JRR Tolkien
<< <i><< I'm afraid if you need other people to be proud of your honesty, then something else is missing. >>
Those who make these comment are the one's missing something!
I agree, people post lots of negative things and ask for pitty and I never see anyone ragging on them.
Why should it be any different here. If he would have posted saying he bought this for a BIN at $2200 and sold it for $8000 everyone would be saying congrats.
<< <i>Why should it be any different here. If he would have posted saying he bought this for a BIN at $2200 and sold it for $8000 everyone would be saying congrats. >>
Actually, what a lot of people would be saying is YOU SUCK!
<< <i>
<< <i>Why should it be any different here. If he would have posted saying he bought this for a BIN at $2200 and sold it for $8000 everyone would be saying congrats. >>
Actually, what a lot of people would be saying is YOU SUCK!
Those were the words I was looking for.
Some people always want to be critical of others. Ignore them.
I've found you to be a very forthright and honest person. To a fault, possibly, but that is not a bad thing.
You did, for this seller, what I am sure you felt was the right thing to do and something you would hope others would do for you (or your family/friends...or anybody).
You could have just done the BIN, walked away $6000 richer (minus fees) after flipping, and people would have given you a "you suck". Instead, you wondered WHY there was such a discrepancy and took the extra step. That is awesome of you to do! If there was a reason that they had to sell (financial/medical reasons/etc), you made their life a bit easier. Enjoy that fact.
Kudos to you!
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment