HOW DO YOU KNOW A DEALER IS LYING TO YOU?

Scioto · January 21, 2007 3:50AM

compromonedas · January 21, 2007 3:50AM

Sweet talk?

Cladiator · January 21, 2007 3:51AM

His/Her nose grows.

mrpaseo · January 21, 2007 3:51AM

When you don't get the "High" he promised from the smack he's selling?

Hyperion · January 21, 2007 3:52AM

is this like one of those lawyer jokes ?

"when his/her lips are moving?"

keets · January 21, 2007 3:54AM

is this a trick question?

mrpaseo · January 21, 2007 3:55AM

Alright, you got the joke answers, now that they are out of the way... what is your question?

The answer to the question you already wrote is: You know the truth and he/she is telling you otherwise...

Now, if there is something inpaticular that you need to know lets hear it

Ray

Scioto · January 21, 2007 3:56AM

<< is this a trick question? >>

No. How can YOU tell when a dealer is lying to you?

123cents · January 21, 2007 3:57AM

I see their lips start moving.

BigE · January 21, 2007 3:59AM

You can't, if you could they wouldn't be dealers

------------------BigE

Bobk · January 21, 2007 4:02AM

123 is correct. Also look them in the eye. Bob

PrivateCoinCollector · January 21, 2007 4:04AM

His lips are moviing?

fcloud · January 21, 2007 4:06AM

Who cares.

RYK · January 21, 2007 4:07AM

Perhaps I am naive, but I have never known a dealer to lie to me.

dizzyfoxx · January 21, 2007 4:08AM

When they speak out loud.

nankraut · January 21, 2007 4:10AM

<< Who cares. >>

DUIGUY · January 21, 2007 4:11AM

When he calls two weeks after you have sealed a deal for an NGC 66 1881cc GSA and says he made a mistake, they have no such animal on inventory .

Of course the one I had was sold for funds going towards the upgrade.

Coin Finder · January 21, 2007 4:12AM

The same way they know when you are lying to them.....body language plays a part.

keets · January 21, 2007 4:14AM

Perhaps I am naive, but I have never known a dealer to lie to me.

you're kidding, right???!!!???

ricko · January 21, 2007 4:17AM

I suggest you take the John Reid course on interviewing and interrogation.... Highly recommended, and it is scientifically based - it works. Cheers, RickO

DennisH · January 21, 2007 4:17AM

I'm not certain about dealers lying to me all that often, but when it happens it usually involves one or more of the following things:

-- Grade assessment of a coin they're trying to sell.
-- Grade assessment of a coin they're trying to buy.
-- Surface originality and or problems assessment of a coin they're trying to sell.
-- Surface originality and or problems assessment of a coin they're trying to buy.
-- What they think my knowledge of coins is, period.
-- What they think their knowledge of coins is in my specialty series.

At times it can be either sad, hilarious, pathetic, or offensive... usually offensive, because my approach to life is that it's too short to deal with crooks, cheats or liars. There are too many good dealers in this hobby to put up with any of that.

RYK · January 21, 2007 4:18AM

<< Perhaps I am naive, but I have never known a dealer to lie to me.

you're kidding, right???!!!??? >>

No, quite truthfully, I cannot recall being told an out-and-out lie by a dealer and being able to verify that this was so. Perhaps, I do not get out enough.

clw54 · January 21, 2007 4:23AM

<< 

<< Perhaps I am naive, but I have never known a dealer to lie to me.

you're kidding, right???!!!??? >>

No, quite truthfully, I cannot recall being told an out-and-out lie by a dealer and being able to verify that this was so. Perhaps, I do not get out enough. >>

I had one tell me my raw 1955 DDO was VF. It's now in a PCGS AU55 slab. This guy was lying. If he simply couldn't grade, he'd have AU coins for sale marked as VF.

itsnotjustme · January 21, 2007 4:23AM

I once showed a dealer a beautiful toned 1986 PCGS MS65 Morgan. He pretended to show some interest, then pulled out his cell phone. "Hi Bill, I have a man at my table with an absolute rainbow Morgan, PCGS 5. Absolute rainbow. Really, no more than sheet. IS that right. OK. Get's off the phone and tells me he can only offer $100, basically sheet at the time. I decline. Than he offers to trade 3 circulated 1972-P T2 Ikes. No thanks. I think his name was Brian Beardsley or something close to that.

mgoodm3 · January 21, 2007 4:24AM

mouth is open?

Mesquite · January 21, 2007 4:25AM

The only way I know how to avoid being taken advantage of in ANY aspect of life is to know as much or more than the next guy. If you can grade and know the market you're in - then you know if someone is telling as it is or blowing smoke. There is no substitute for ageless saying "buy the book before you buy the coin".

dthigpen · January 21, 2007 4:25AM

<< mouth is open? >>

I was thinking this was like one of those lawyer jokes, too.

keets · January 21, 2007 4:25AM

good post Dennis. it's important to remember that we should never go into a transactioon looking "Gullible" because a smart dealer can spot that.

ElmerFusterpuck · January 21, 2007 4:25AM

When they have a price on a coin that says $300, you're interested and try to haggle it down to $275 and the dealer says, "I've got $290 in it!" Yeah, right...

fcloud · January 21, 2007 4:26AM

<< I once showed a dealer a beautiful toned 1986 PCGS MS65 Morgan. He pretended to show some interest, then pulled out his cell phone. "Hi Bill, I have a man at my table with an absolute rainbow Morgan, PCGS 5. Absolute rainbow. Really, no more than sheet. IS that right. OK. Get's off the phone and tells me he can only offer $100, basically sheet at the time. I decline. Than he offers to trade 3 circulated 1972-P T2 Ikes. No thanks. I think his name was Brian Beardsley or something close to that. >>

Wow. A 1986 Morgan has to have a mintage of 1.

compromonedas · January 21, 2007 4:29AM

<< I once showed a dealer a beautiful toned 1986 PCGS MS65 Morgan. He pretended to show some interest, then pulled out his cell phone. "Hi Bill, I have a man at my table with an absolute rainbow Morgan, PCGS 5. Absolute rainbow. Really, no more than sheet. IS that right. OK. Get's off the phone and tells me he can only offer $100, basically sheet at the time. I decline. Than he offers to trade 3 circulated 1972-P T2 Ikes. No thanks. I think his name was Brian Beardsley or something close to that. >>

Looks like a good deal. The 3 ikes were older than your 1986 morgan

itsnotjustme · January 21, 2007 4:36AM

I though that word replica on the back looked odd! The guy I bought it from said it was Latin for republic.

PerryHall · January 21, 2007 4:36AM

Ever have a dealer volunteer what he paid for a coin while negotiating to buy the coin?

Cladiator · January 21, 2007 4:40AM

<< Ever have a dealer volunteer what he paid for a coin while negotiating to buy the coin?

>>

Yup sure have. I've also had that same dealer talk himself up on a coin he was buying from me.

Conversation went something like this;

Me: Might you be interested in this (handing over coin)
Dealer: Yeah, that's pretty nice. What do you want for it (looking at coin)
Me: I'd like to get $100 out of it ($100 is sample amount only, not the actual amount)
Dealer: Ok, I can give you $125. Deal?
Me: Um..... ok.
Dealers Wife: HAHAHAHAa, You're a boob! (said to her husband in a jovial manner)

BlindedByEgo · January 21, 2007 5:23AM

<< 

<< I once showed a dealer a beautiful toned 1986 PCGS MS65 Morgan. He pretended to show some interest, then pulled out his cell phone. "Hi Bill, I have a man at my table with an absolute rainbow Morgan, PCGS 5. Absolute rainbow. Really, no more than sheet. IS that right. OK. Get's off the phone and tells me he can only offer $100, basically sheet at the time. I decline. Than he offers to trade 3 circulated 1972-P T2 Ikes. No thanks. I think his name was Brian Beardsley or something close to that. >>

Looks like a good deal. The 3 ikes were older than your 1986 morgan

>>

Hey, take it easy on the guy. He's in Belgium, you know.

storm888 · January 21, 2007 5:46AM

"John Reid course on interviewing and interrogation.... "

///////////////////////////////

Not a bad suggestion.

But, if you know grading and pricing, it really does not
matter if a given dealer is lying. There are lots of dealers;
just move on if you feel one is not being honest.

pbfloyd · January 21, 2007 5:55AM

No, quite truthfully, I cannot recall being told an out-and-out lie by a dealer and being able to verify that this was so. Perhaps, I do not get out enough.

Salesmanship and lying walk a fine line.

410a · January 21, 2007 6:03AM

They open their mouth is my first thought and you all beat me to it, but the truth is lies goe something like this. "it is what it is" old car dealer line, "show me a profit over what I got into it, show me $5. over my cost" "I don't feel guilty about charging you $6500 for that Barber Half"
When they say they don't believe me they do. It is all up to you as a collector what can you afford? What will the coin do for your collection? Forget the sizzle you have to live with the coin. Who cares if you think it's a lie? It is your coin when you buy it and it fits your needs or not. Pass or Play. The meeting of minds and $$ creates this kind of market.
Cavet emptor; If you need to think this way? Then walk.

Advice given here is opinion. Others may differ. Market conditions and coins may vary considerably as do opinions which at times creates a whole mess of fun around here.

JapanJohn · January 21, 2007 6:08AM

Lawyer.

Used Car Salesman.

Coin / Book / Art Dealer.

Enough said.

Joflax · January 21, 2007 6:15AM

Just assume it and you cannot go wrong!!

WTCG · January 21, 2007 6:42AM

The same way you tell if anybody else is lying to you.

stman · January 21, 2007 7:01AM

When they say "Trust Me." Heh heh

TwoSides2aCoin · January 21, 2007 7:01AM

The sign on the door says : "Hours of Operation : Monday through Friday , 8:00 A.M. to 6:00 P.M.
It's 10 o'clock A.M. , the door's locked and nobody's in sight.

roadrunner · January 21, 2007 9:31AM

I'm sure I've had as many collectors lie to me as dealers. It's all part of the human condition.

Funny thing about that "talk up" pricing. I did just that with a forum member last week. Felt the coin was priced under what I felt was fair to both sides and gave him another $50. Just call me a boob.

roadrunner

Flyfishguy · January 21, 2007 10:00AM

The whole idea of a dealer lying offends me. If you meet a dealer that lies, move on to another dealer.

I once knew a dealer that I thought was a pretty straight shooter. Then one day he showed me a $500 coin he bought for only $10 and was proud of it. I never bought another coin from him.

LincolnCentMan · January 21, 2007 10:13AM

If you're an informed buyer, it doesnt matter if the dealer is lying.

-David

IGWT · January 21, 2007 10:20AM

<< If you're an informed buyer, it doesnt matter if the dealer is lying. >>

I don't much like it when someone takes aim at me even if he shoots wide.

WTCG · January 21, 2007 2:23PM

<< The whole idea of a dealer lying offends me. If you meet a dealer that lies, move on to another dealer.

I once knew a dealer that I thought was a pretty straight shooter. Then one day he showed me a $500 coin he bought for only $10 and was proud of it. I never bought another coin from him. >>

He didn't actually lie to you, he just implied to you that he is a crook.

RYK · January 21, 2007 2:37PM

<< 

<< The whole idea of a dealer lying offends me. If you meet a dealer that lies, move on to another dealer.

I once knew a dealer that I thought was a pretty straight shooter. Then one day he showed me a $500 coin he bought for only $10 and was proud of it. I never bought another coin from him. >>

He didn't actually lie to you, he just implied to you that he is a crook. >>

I actually think that the term "lying" has been used pretty broadly in this context, and that is the point that I was trying to make in my earlier reply. You can be cheated, scammed, and deceived by a dealer without him/her actually lying.

stman · January 21, 2007 2:53PM

<< You can be cheated, scammed, and deceived by a dealer without him/her actually lying. >>

I feel better now!

Barndog · January 21, 2007 2:56PM

when I am no longer doing business with the dealer?

HOW DO YOU KNOW A DEALER IS LYING TO YOU?

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