EBAY: Is this legal?

mrpaseo · January 15, 2007 7:35AM

Add 4% for Paypal fees?

I thought this was a no no on ebay.

Teach me

Russ · January 15, 2007 7:35AM

It is a no no.

Russ, NCNE

mrpaseo · January 15, 2007 7:41AM

Thanks Russ, I did try to search to find the rule but could not... I wanted to inform the seller so he/she will not lose the listings (People already bid on the auctions).

Any chance of a link to where this rule is written?

Ray

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 7:55AM

Just inform ebay, they'll tell the seller.

rec78 · January 15, 2007 7:58AM

Just inform ebay, they'll tell the seller
Yes they will- right after they cancel the auctions.

Here is the link.

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 7:59AM

<< Just inform ebay, they'll tell the seller
Yes they will- right after they cancel the auctions. >>

Which any seller doing something against Ebay rules deserves. You don't throw a party in someone else's house and then piss on their rug.

mrpaseo · January 15, 2007 7:59AM

<< Just inform ebay, they'll tell the seller
Yes they will- right after they cancel the auctions. >>

Thats what I was trying to avoid, this seller is new and I don't want to assume that he/she knows the rule and is purposly breaking it. I just sent a message to the seller.

Thanks,
Ray

WinPitcher · January 15, 2007 8:03AM

LOL

The seller has bought from our pal..........Jeffreydsparks!

Boy is the world small.

Steve

quattrocoins · January 15, 2007 8:07AM

Ray,

Try this.

Click on "Show" in Some Examples to see:

Not permitted:

*

Charging an extra fee to use a credit card instead of a check.
*

Charging an extra fee to use PayPal.

Don, ZQZE

mrpaseo · January 15, 2007 8:11AM

<< Ray,

Try this.

Click on "Show" in Some Examples to see:

Not permitted:

*

Charging an extra fee to use a credit card instead of a check.
*

Charging an extra fee to use PayPal.

Don, ZQZE

>>

Thank you very much. Imagine someone could have actually made an honest mistake... no, then again, lets assume the worst in people and chastize them before giving them a chance to fix themselves... Ya thats how we do it these days right?

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 8:20AM

Reporting them to ebay is not chastising them. Their auction will be cancelled and they can relist it within the Ebay rules.

storm888 · January 15, 2007 8:26AM

"Which any seller doing something against Ebay rules deserves.
You don't throw a party in someone else's house and then p***
on their rug."

/////////////////////////////////////

"Imagine someone could have actually made an honest mistake... no, then
again, lets assume the worst in people and chastize them before giving
them a chance to fix themselves... Ya thats how we do it these days right?"

///////////////////////////

Yup.

Some new folks do need a little help. Only time tells whether or not they
were deserving of such help.

LALASD4 · January 15, 2007 8:26AM

Those Ebay rules were made to profit Paypal which is own by Ebay. I think the seller should have the option to set their own rule for payment, just like some gas station that had a lower cash price for gas.

Is it against Ebay rules to give a discount for check or MO or cash ?

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 8:35AM

<< Is it against Ebay rules to give a discount for check or MO or cash ? >>

Good question, many cheap retailers (usually catering to specialty markets) will give a discount for Cash to curtail the TOS of most Credit Card Processing companies.

rec78 · January 15, 2007 8:36AM

Those Ebay rules were made to profit Paypal which is own by Ebay. I think the seller should have the option to set their own rule for payment, just like some gas station that had a lower cash price for gas.

Ebay did not set up this rule for themselves-It is illegal to add charges for use of credit cards. Since paypal can use credit cards it is also illegal to add extra charges for paypal usage.

Is it against Ebay rules to give a discount for check or MO or cash ?
No. Giving a discount for MO or check or cash is not illegal or against ebay rules. While it may seem like the same thing, legally it is not. Bob

Classof67 · January 15, 2007 8:41AM

<< Add 4% for Paypal fees?

I thought this was a no no on ebay.

Teach me

>>

Reported!

JT

cosmicdebris · January 15, 2007 8:42AM

Something is wrong at eBay. I tried to report the auction but it won;t let me. It keeps saying the auction item number is invalid.

LALASD4 · January 15, 2007 8:42AM

Ebay did not set up this rule for themselves-It is illegal to add charges for use of credit cards. Since paypal can use credit cards it is also illegal to add extra charges for paypal usage.

Yes, that is correct. But the rule on if someone accepts Paypal, they do not have the option on not accepting from cc was only setup to profit Ebay.

Bochiman · January 15, 2007 8:47AM

I don't think the terms "legal" or "illegal" apply here.
Now, "against policy" would certainly apply.

Seller even made it easy for ebay by BOLDING in large type font the "4% if using paypal".

Not that smart of a move....and, if one is going to sell on ebay, one should try to learn the rules before playing.

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 8:48AM

<< 

<< Add 4% for Paypal fees?

I thought this was a no no on ebay.

Teach me

>>

Reported!

JT >>

See mrpaseo, as I'm sure you intended, all you had to do was post the auction here instead of just asking the question without doing so to get the auction reported.

mrpaseo · January 15, 2007 8:52AM

<< 

<< 

<< Add 4% for Paypal fees?

I thought this was a no no on ebay.

Teach me

>>

Reported!

JT >>

See mrpaseo, as I'm sure you intended, all you had to do was post the auction here instead of just asking the question without doing so to get the auction reported. >>

This is why your forum failed.

mrpaseo · January 15, 2007 8:53AM

Here comes the drama.

rec78 · January 15, 2007 9:02AM

don't think the terms "legal" or "illegal" apply here.

They certainly do apply---Charging more for credit card use (paypal use) is illegal. Not only on ebay but everywhere. (in the USA)

storm888 · January 15, 2007 9:07AM

" ....don't think the terms "legal" or "illegal" apply here."

/////////////////////////////////////////

Many years ago, the credit-card companies were successful
in their lobbying efforts to make the surcharge practice
"illegal."

One can google to get the full details.

AUandAG · January 15, 2007 9:38AM

England does allow Paypal fees to be added to the auction price. However, this sell ain't in England!
Oh my.
bob

sonoranmonsoon · January 15, 2007 9:56AM

<< It is a no no.

Russ, NCNE >>

Russ is correct. It is not illegal, but does violate ebay policies. Before ebay bought Paypal, offering a discount to not use Paypal was accepted. For several years now, it has not been allowed. Ebay will pull the listing if they see it.

sonoranmonsoon · January 15, 2007 9:58AM

<< Those Ebay rules were made to profit Paypal which is own by Ebay. I think the seller should have the option to set their own rule for payment, just like some gas station that had a lower cash price for gas.

Ebay did not set up this rule for themselves-It is illegal to add charges for use of credit cards. Since paypal can use credit cards it is also illegal to add extra charges for paypal usage.

Is it against Ebay rules to give a discount for check or MO or cash ?
No. Giving a discount for MO or check or cash is not illegal or against ebay rules. While it may seem like the same thing, legally it is not. Bob[/Oops. I guess I should have read all the threads before commenting. I stand corrected. I guess it is illegal.

sonoranmonsoon · January 15, 2007 10:00AM

<< 

<< Those Ebay rules were made to profit Paypal which is own by Ebay. I think the seller should have the option to set their own rule for payment, just like some gas station that had a lower cash price for gas.

Ebay did not set up this rule for themselves-It is illegal to add charges for use of credit cards. Since paypal can use credit cards it is also illegal to add extra charges for paypal usage.

Is it against Ebay rules to give a discount for check or MO or cash ?
No. Giving a discount for MO or check or cash is not illegal or against ebay rules. While it may seem like the same thing, legally it is not. Bob[/Oops. I guess I should have read all the threads before commenting. I stand corrected. I guess it is illegal. >>

I STAND CORRECTED. I GUESS IT IS ILLEGAL. I should have read all the comments before responding.

Bochiman · January 15, 2007 10:07AM

<< don't think the terms "legal" or "illegal" apply here.

They certainly do apply---Charging more for credit card use (paypal use) is illegal. Not only on ebay but everywhere. (in the USA) >>

I'm talking about on EBAY and the "can't charge more for paypal use".
That is what the thread is about, right?

Now, for those that started taking it off topic and on a divergent path, with speculation, then there may be "legal" implications there. However, for the OP, I stand by my statement that I don't believe "legal" comes into play.

Russ · January 15, 2007 10:18AM

<< << don't think the terms "legal" or "illegal" apply here.

They certainly do apply---Charging more for credit card use (paypal use) is illegal. Not only on ebay but everywhere. (in the USA) >>

I'm talking about on EBAY and the "can't charge more for paypal use". >>

They are one and the same. PayPal is a credit card processing service. If they allowed surcharges they would be violating the law.

Russ, NCNE

storm888 · January 15, 2007 10:23AM

"I'm talking about on EBAY and the "can't charge more for paypal use".
That is what the thread is about, right?

Now, for those that started taking it off topic and on a divergent path,
with speculation, then there may be "legal" implications there. However,
for the OP, I stand by my statement that I don't believe "legal" comes into play.

////////////////////////////////////////

It is a bit confusing.

BUT, EBAY/PayPal claim that the reason they prohibit the "surcharge,"
is that buyers can/do pay with credit cards through PayPal. Because,
it is NOT legal to impose a surcharge on credit-card users, EBAY/PayPal
claim their policy was implemented to "comply" with the law(s)/regs.

pcgs69 · January 15, 2007 11:34AM

Sorry if this is changing the subject a bit... but I just ordered a coin from Premium Numismatics and they charged me an extra 3 or 4% for using my credit card... so they can't do that?

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 1:41PM

<< Sorry if this is changing the subject a bit... but I just ordered a coin from Premium Numismatics and they charged me an extra 3 or 4% for using my credit card... so they can't do that? >>

Nope, legally they cannot. You should complain to the credit card company, they will get you a refund and slam them with a fine.

derryb · January 15, 2007 1:48PM

Item no longer listed!

notwilight · January 15, 2007 1:52PM

<< Just inform ebay, they'll tell the seller Yes they will- right after they cancel the auctions. Here is the link.

>>

No that is incorrect.

They will cancel all the auctions and leave it to him to figure out. (unless they've gotten better since they did that to me a long time ago).

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 1:53PM

Well, fortunately mrpaseo already sent the seller a note, so he'll be aware of why the auctions were cancelled.

notwilight · January 15, 2007 1:57PM

So can we get more than one guy to state that they believe that offering a cash, check or Money order discount is legal/allowed by ebay? If so, I shall revise all my auctions post haste. --Jerry

dthigpen · January 15, 2007 1:58PM

<< So can we get more than one guy to state that they believe that offering a cash, check or Money order discount is legal/allowed by ebay? If so, I shall revise all my auctions post haste. --Jerry >>

Send ebay an email and ask them.

mrpotatoheadd · January 15, 2007 2:07PM

I don't know about eBay, but there's this...

U.S. Code collection

TITLE 15 > CHAPTER 41 > SUBCHAPTER I > Part D > § 1666f

§ 1666f. Inducements to cardholders by sellers of cash discounts for payments by cash, check or similar means; finance charge for sales transactions involving cash discounts

(a) Cash discounts
With respect to credit card which may be used for extensions of credit in sales transactions in which the seller is a person other than the card issuer, the card issuer may not, by contract, or otherwise, prohibit any such seller from offering a discount to a cardholder to induce the cardholder to pay by cash, check, or similar means rather than use a credit card.

storm888 · January 15, 2007 2:40PM

PayPal is currently the only payment method that I accept.
When I used to accept payments other than PayPal, I
often offered a 2% discount.

Adding a surcharge to a PayPal payment seems the same
as offering a discount for check/MO, BUT it is NOT.

A surcharge is an added-cost to the buyer, and deters the
use of cards via PENALTY. A discount for paper-payment is
a buyer incentive that is ONLY a de facto deterent to plastic.
The statutes/regs are not written to contemplate the fact
that the two offers are much akin.

The PayPal message board on EBAY can give more detailed
info. One can also call EBAY's live-help for more info. If they
give you an answer you do not like, ask for a supervisor.

You might also consider the following BOLD message near the
top of your listing:

"Attention Please EBAY Trust and Safety: The discount for
paper payments attendant to this listing are permitted
under EBAY's TOS. Please do not cancel this listing. Thank you."

storm

Smitty79 · January 15, 2007 3:29PM

Most of the time paypal fees are easy to recoup. Just tack it onto the shipping charges as 'handling' charges. As long as you don't get out of hand and end up charging unreasonable s+h this works like a charm.

notwilight · January 15, 2007 3:39PM

<< Most of the time paypal fees are easy to recoup. Just tack it onto the shipping charges as 'handling' charges. As long as you don't get out of hand and end up charging unreasonable s+h this works like a charm. >>

Really, You think I could hide $138 in paypal fees as "handling" on a one ounce coin?

--Jerry

Smitty79 · January 15, 2007 3:45PM

<< 

<< Most of the time paypal fees are easy to recoup. Just tack it onto the shipping charges as 'handling' charges. As long as you don't get out of hand and end up charging unreasonable s+h this works like a charm. >>

Really, You think I could hide $138 in paypal fees as "handling" on a one ounce coin?

--Jerry >>

No, I think that would fall under the "As long as you don't get out of hand and end up charging unreasonable s+h" part.

I'm just a casual seller and don't sell a lot of expensive stuff so the rule varies person to person.

stman · January 15, 2007 3:51PM

I understand it's not OK to charge extra for using Paypal on ebay, and folks on here run to go tell on them. However, it seems to be OK for folks on here to charge extra on our very own BST board for using Paypal, And nobody says a thing. Gotta love it!!!

notwilight · January 15, 2007 4:11PM

<< I understand it's not OK to charge extra for using Paypal on ebay, and folks on here run to go tell on them. However, it seems to be OK for folks on here to charge extra on our very own BST board for using Paypal, And nobody says a thing. Gotta love it!!!

>>

Yep, I charge extra for PP on the BST board. It seems very fair and ethical to me. It's an actual cost that the seller can choose to avoid if they want/can. Frankly, I see ebay as just promoting their own company paypal by not letting you charge extra. We must follow ebay's rules on ebay but there is no such rule on the BST board.

But if is indeed illegal, then perhaps I'll have to reword it to give a 3% discount for cash--or just list two prices...wonder which way this is interpreted.

--Jerry

storm888 · January 15, 2007 4:18PM

"However, it seems to be OK for folks on here to charge extra on
our very own BST board for using Paypal, And nobody says a thing."

/////////////////////////////////////////////

BST participants seem to allow the practice as a courtesy to each other.
The "correct" way to collect the fee is to simply include it in the agreed upon
sale price.

Absent EBAY's heavy-hand, the enforcement of the statutes/regs
require a consumer complaint directly to PayPal, or to the relevant
CC company. If you have your own website - which should be the
goal of EVERY seller "trapped" on EBAY - you are very unlikely to
be complained against. CC companies tend to allow one complaint
on the issue to pass with a stern warning; the second complaint
against a small seller usually results in the termination of the
merchant account. (Some sub-prime merchant accounts fine
violators fairly-heavily, but allow them to retain their accounts
even in the wake of multiple complaints.)

stman · January 15, 2007 4:25PM

I was only pointing out my observations, doesn't matter to me one way or the other. If I don't like what I see listed, or how it's listed and charges..... I simply pass it on by.

And I have indeed even offered to pay the fee's when it was appropriate. Like when Paypal is not listed as an option to pay, but that's how I would like to pay. I then feel it's kinda my obligation to pay the fee's.

mackdriver · January 15, 2007 6:29PM

IrishMike · January 15, 2007 9:31PM

It is an illegal practice to add a surchare on any credit card transaction and it certainly isn't off topic in this thread. By some of the comments its obvious that some folks were not aware of this. The thread title is "EBAY: Is this legal? and no its not and to expand it somewhat for the benefit of everyone's knowledge and then be chided for being off topic is just an example of good old stubborness. For pete's sakes some of you can never admit to not knowing everything.

And we wonder why folks are hesitant to share information.

BAJJERFAN · January 15, 2007 11:04PM

Do most eBay buyers use a credit card because they don't have a cash balance or enough $$$ in their checking account OR because they have recourse through the CC company if they end up gettin shanked?

BAJJERFAN · January 15, 2007 11:05PM

Is it ok to say in your listing that PayPal is accepted but not encouraged?

EBAY: Is this legal?

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