anyone who says they are a "collector"

hootchiegirl · September 10, 2006 11:03AM

and does not care about the value of their purchase is an out right liar. if you buy a coin for $10,000 and you love it and find out it is worth only $80 do you REALLY still love it and will your heirs love it too????? bunkie

cladking · September 10, 2006 11:07AM

Why buy an $80 coin for $10,000 when you could have bought 125 of them for the same price?

Leiana · September 10, 2006 11:08AM

I personally think your example is a tad extreme.

I collect what I like and what anything is "worth" really doesn't bother me. After all, anything is only worth what someone else is willing to pay for it in the long run.

So what if the buffalo nickel I paid 25 bucks for is only "worth" fifteen to the next guy? It was worth enough to me for me to buy it! And I got 25 dollars "worth" of enjoyment out of it.

"Worth" is relative. At least, to me.

-Amanda

bidask · September 10, 2006 11:08AM

I put up a thread recently concerning rare coins as an investment and I got pasted with tomatoes and pies. I felt like Alfalfa!

Russ · September 10, 2006 11:08AM

If you buy an $80 coin for $10K you probably ought to find another hobby.

Russ, NCNE

IGWT · September 10, 2006 11:11AM

I'm with Cladking. It's possible to care about buying a coin at the right price for reasons that have nothing to do with its future value.

hootchiegirl · September 10, 2006 11:12AM

the point is that everyone says they do not care about the coin market WHEN IT DIRECTLY EFFECTS THE VALUE OF THEIR PURCHASE and I belive they are lying to themselves if they do not feel their coins are an investment why really pay more than ten cents for a dime

TwoSides2aCoin · September 10, 2006 11:12AM

<< If you buy an $80 coin for $10K you probably ought to find another hobby.

Russ, NCNE >>

I just like following you around so I can laugh , Russ
.... LOL

FatMan · September 10, 2006 11:14AM

I am a collector and I think I speak for all collectors when I say that we all care about the value of our purchases when laying out the cash. No one finds fun in being ripped. I believe what you are referring to is that as a collector I am not concerned with whether my coins value increases or decreases over the years. I bought the coins with entertainment dollars and in my mind the money is spent. But sure, it is nice to know if I choose to quit collecting there might be a payday. I didn't get one when I quit golf.

DieClash · September 10, 2006 11:14AM

<< If you buy an $80 coin for $10K . . . >>

Can I interest you in some raw moderns?

I hear they're slabbing at terrific premiums.

IGWT · September 10, 2006 11:15AM

-- "if they do not feel their coins are an investment why really pay more than ten cents for a dime" --

Because it costs more than ten cents.

Coxe · September 10, 2006 11:31AM

Like buying a several thousand dollar coin for under thirty bucks. It's happened to mea few times now. Not sureif that makes me a collector or something else. All I know is that I apparently suck.

Russ · September 10, 2006 11:32AM

<< Like buying a several thousand dollar coin for under thirty bucks. It's happened to mea few times now. Not sureif that makes me a collector or something else. >>

It makes you my hero.

Russ, NCNE

michael · September 10, 2006 11:36AM

I think I speak for all collectors as i know many of them for decades and I believe what you are referring to is that as a collector they am not concerned with whether their coins value increases or decreases over the years. they bought the coins with entertainment dollars and in their minds the money is spent. But sure, it is nice to know if they choose to quit collecting there might be a payday. many didn't get one when they quit golf.

trolling strumpet

SamByrd · September 10, 2006 11:40AM

well, the coins I collect I really dont care that much even if its not a great deal. example I purchased a nice original grey 1860 seated quarter mid grade so I thought, it was advertised as a strong AU and the image was decent and I thought it was a nice xf 45 or so, it is really a vf35 resides in an anacs slab with the rest of my type set, I would of bought it for the ef45 price that was asked even if I knew for sure the correct grade, I love the coin and i paid too much around 7 years or so ago but was happy to do so the coin has the look and matches my set well. if it were a 1k coin instead of a 20 buck coin i might have a different view.

DNADave · September 10, 2006 11:41AM

<< I think I speak for all collectors as i know many of them for decades and I believe what you are referring to is that as a collector they am not concerned with whether their coins value increases or decreases over the years. they bought the coins with entertainment dollars and in their minds the money is spent. But sure, it is nice to know if they choose to quit collecting there might be a payday. many didn't get one when they quit golf.

trolling strumpet >>

Golf is an expensive hobby,
shooting is expensive,
fishing is expensive,
coin collecting is expensive

Its money spent and I've fired an awful lot of dollars down range and on expensive hole punching devices.

JRocco · September 10, 2006 11:43AM

You will never understand unless you are collecting something (coins for example) for the sheer joy of your hobby.

When I take the kids to Disney World and drop 15K on the vacation, its money lost once the vacation is over. What I get out of it is the memories and satisfaction knowing that my kids did something they will always remember--BUT THE MONEY IS GONE-- it is no longer mine.
When I buy a coin the money is gone also---what I have left is something that I enjoy. It isn't money anymore--the money is gone/spent.

Do I want to spend 15K on a vacation for a weekend at the Holiday Inn in Trenton New Jersey-No
Do I want to spend 10K on an $80 coin-No

But If I drop 10K on a 10K coin- I'm sure it was one I really wanted and COULD AFFORD.

Jcarney · September 10, 2006 11:47AM

Let's put it this way. Today I found out that the 2 coin silver Buffalo set is selling for way over $400. Last time I checked, they were selling for about $200. I bought a set from the Mint in 2001 for $50 some bucks. Will I sell it? No, I like the set and take it out once in awhile to look at it. Am I happy that it's worth about 8X more than what I paid for it? Sure, if I really needed the money down the road, it could come in handy.

bidask · September 10, 2006 11:51AM

<< You will never understand unless you are collecting something (coins for example) for the sheer joy of your hobby.

When I take the kids to Disney World and drop 15K on the vacation, its money lost once the vacation is over. What I get out of it is the memories and satisfaction knowing that my kids did something they will always remember--BUT THE MONEY IS GONE-- it is no longer mine.
When I buy a coin the money is gone also---what I have left is something that I enjoy. It isn't money anymore--the money is gone/spent.

Do I want to spend 15K on a vacation for a weekend at the Holiday Inn in Trenton New Jersey-No
Do I want to spend 10K on an $80 coin-No

But If I drop 10K on a 10K coin- I'm sure it was one I really wanted and COULD AFFORD. >>

But would you really buy, or have you ever bought a 10k coin. I think that is serious money and you would be watching its value. No?

DieClash · September 10, 2006 11:57AM

<< 
But If I drop 10K on a 10K coin- I'm sure it was one I really wanted and COULD AFFORD. >>

But would you really buy, or have you ever bought a 10k coin. I think that is serious money and you would be watching its value. No? >>

For sure

Unless of course dropping $10K on a coin for you is the equivalent of dropping $100 on a coin for me or others of modest means. Price is relative and the amount one is willing to spend depends on thier budget. I have a small budget and have never paid more than $1000K on any single coin in my collection. The most that I have ever paid is the $2610 that I shelled out to the US Mint for the GAE anniversary set. Any to answer your question, YES, I am definitely watching its value.

500Bay · September 10, 2006 12:10PM

<< If you buy a coin for $10,000 and you love it and find out it is worth only $80 do you REALLY still love it and will your heirs love it too????? bunkie >>

No one wants to be ripped off - that is what your analogy would seem to indicate.

I collect because I love to. I do hope that my collecting will at least hold its value. Maybe I'm a collector/investor?

lkenefic · September 10, 2006 12:14PM

<< I am a collector and I think I speak for all collectors when I say that we all care about the value of our purchases when laying out the cash. No one finds fun in being ripped. I believe what you are referring to is that as a collector I am not concerned with whether my coins value increases or decreases over the years. I bought the coins with entertainment dollars and in my mind the money is spent. But sure, it is nice to know if I choose to quit collecting there might be a payday. I didn't get one when I quit golf.

>>

Absolutely..

RedTiger · September 10, 2006 12:29PM

No one wants to be a mark. No one sees their every day car as an investment, but no one wants to pay two times retail for a common car. Same deal with a lot of other things not seen as an investment. It does pay to shop around. It also pays to shop for quality. However, for the average person attempting to time the markets usually results in buying near the highs and selling near the lows. The average person should only put "hobby" money into coins, not "investment" money--that's the big difference between collector and investor.

The average coin "investor" often does poorly financially, much worse than the average collector. Why? Because they don't know much about coins, many don't want to learn, and many get sold on a song-and-dance routine from dealers who often don't know that much about coins either, but are good at sales and hype.

hootchiegirl · September 10, 2006 12:34PM

what I am implying is there is a time to buy and a time to sell I don't care what you collect....it IS an investment so watch your step and keep on top of the market and all will be well , , , but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter

bidask · September 10, 2006 12:35PM

<< No one wants to be a mark. No one sees their every day car as an investment, but no one wants to pay two times retail for a common car. Same deal with a lot of other things not seen as an investment. It does pay to shop around. It also pays to shop for quality. However, for the average person attempting to time the markets usually results in buying near the highs and selling near the lows. The average person should only put "hobby" money into coins, not "investment" money--that's the big difference between collector and investor.

The average coin "investor" often does poorly financially, much worse than the average collector. Why? Because they don't know much about coins, many don't want to learn, and many get sold on a song-and-dance routine from dealers who often don't know that much about coins either, but are good at sales and hype. >>

So you are saying the average coin collector( please define) doen't care if his collection goes up or down in value.

Leiana · September 10, 2006 12:35PM

<< what I am implying is there is a time to buy and a time to sell I don't care what you collect....it IS an investment so watch your step and keep on top of the market and all will be well , , , but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter >>

I don't see my collection as a monetary investment, sorry.

-Amanda

dthigpen · September 10, 2006 12:36PM

<< 

<< what I am implying is there is a time to buy and a time to sell I don't care what you collect....it IS an investment so watch your step and keep on top of the market and all will be well , , , but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter >>

I don't see my collection as a monetary investment, sorry.

-Amanda >>

At least you have your priorities straight, Amanda. I don't either, I've never even bothered valueing my collection for insurance reasons.

Leiana · September 10, 2006 12:39PM

<< At least you have your priorities straight, Amanda. I don't either, I've never even bothered valueing my collection for insurance reasons. >>

I don't know which priorities you refer to, but I see my collection as a bit of history and a lot of fun and learning, if that's what you meant.

-Amanda

JRocco · September 10, 2006 12:42PM

<< 

<< what I am implying is there is a time to buy and a time to sell I don't care what you collect....it IS an investment so watch your step and keep on top of the market and all will be well , , , but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter >>

I don't see my collection as a monetary investment, sorry.

-Amanda >>

How come you said clearly in one line Amanda, what I couldn't say clearly in over a paragraph ??

originalisbest · September 10, 2006 12:44PM

Hey thiggy, I hope you're feeling OK. Best thoughts to you!

LincolnCentMan · September 10, 2006 12:46PM

anyone who says they are a "collector" and does not care about the value of their purchase is an out right liar.

It is often the case that people that make blaket statements are the ones that turn out to be the liar.

David

Leiana · September 10, 2006 12:46PM

<< How come you said clearly in one line Amanda, what I couldn't say clearly in over a paragraph ??

>>

I don't know, I just like to keep it short and sweet and to the point.

-Amanda

bidask · September 10, 2006 12:49PM

<< 

<< what I am implying is there is a time to buy and a time to sell I don't care what you collect....it IS an investment so watch your step and keep on top of the market and all will be well , , , but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter >>

I don't see my collection as a monetary investment, sorry.

-Amanda >>

As you grow from being a young numismatist to a professional numismatist dealer, you will, and as your income level grows and you buy more coins, you will.

DieClash · September 10, 2006 12:54PM

<< 

<< what I am implying is there is a time to buy and a time to sell I don't care what you collect....it IS an investment so watch your step and keep on top of the market and all will be well , , , but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter >>

I don't see my collection as a monetary investment, sorry.

-Amanda >>

Please define: "Investment".

Some would say that you must purchase TPG slabbed coins in order to qualify as an investment. At least the TPGs sell their services and guarantees to support the coin investment activity. While I don't own slabs (except for two Morgans), I consider my coin purchases both a hobby and an investment. Not an investment in the SEC definition per se, but one that I expect will appreciate in value over time and definitely not lose value, if I can help it.

I expect that my $.03 cent valued high circulated grade Lincoln Wheat-back cent will be worth much more in 25 years when I retire from the rat race. Any money that I spend on the hobby is both for enjoyment, historical enrichment and with an eye toward the long-term; somewhat of an investment by my definition. I expect my collection to at least keep up with inflation. And if we can recuruit a lot more YNs to the hobby like Amanda, maybe there will be a capital gain at the end of the rainbow for us Baby Boomers.

KC

JRocco · September 10, 2006 12:54PM

<< 

<< 

<< what I am implying is there is a time to buy and a time to sell I don't care what you collect....it IS an investment so watch your step and keep on top of the market and all will be well , , , but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter >>

I don't see my collection as a monetary investment, sorry.

-Amanda >>

As you grow from being a young numismatist to a professional numismatist dealer, you will, and as your income level grows and you buy more coins, you will.

>>

Nah-- she will grow up like me and only spend money she does not need for anything else on her hobby. Stay in school kiddo and make lots of money so you have lots to spend on toys-- like coins.

If every last one of my coins (in my collection) were to drop to a value of zero- it would not change anything in my, or my family's life.

Leiana · September 10, 2006 12:56PM

<< As you grow from being a young numismatist to a professional numismatist dealer, you will, and as your income level grows and you buy more coins, you will.

>>

You think so? I do not think I would enjoy pondering the economics of having fun.

-Amanda

dlimb2 · September 10, 2006 12:57PM

"but if you hold on to the biterr end the end will be bitter"

This is only true if you don't know what you are doing...Many key coins will not lose their value alll common coins will...you buy coins or bars just for their metal content you will lose when the market falls...but rare coins will retain much of their value....the reason is because they are rare...this is what you need to learn.

bidask · September 10, 2006 12:58PM

[-Amanda >>

As you grow from being a young numismatist to a professional numismatist dealer, you will, and as your income level grows and you buy more coins, you will.

>>

Nah-- she will grow up like me and only spend money she does not need for anything else on her hobby. Stay in school kiddo and make lots of money so you have lots to spend on toys-- like coins.

Even the 10k coin??!!

DieClash · September 10, 2006 1:00PM

<< 

<< As you grow from being a young numismatist to a professional numismatist dealer, you will, and as your income level grows and you buy more coins, you will.

>>

You think so? I do not think I would enjoy pondering the economics of having fun.

-Amanda >>

Sorry, I can't resist. Can you say DisneyLand? Considering that the U.S economy is now a service econonmy and not a manufacturing economy, I'd say the economics of having fun is a most profitable market sector. Basically, whenever you make a decision to spend money on your hobby you are making a decision not to spend money on a vacation to Disneyland. Both are fun. The hobbyist just chooses one form of fun over another. Discretionary spending. So even your non-investment grade specimens that you collect do indeed include the economics of having fun, even if one doesn't consciously ponder about their choice of spending for one form of fun over another at the time of the exchange.

I love this forum!

originalisbest · September 10, 2006 1:00PM

Rare coins are purely a luxury, hardly needed for life - and putting money you can't afford to lose into them is generally not the best of ideas.

dthigpen · September 10, 2006 1:01PM

<< 

<< At least you have your priorities straight, Amanda. I don't either, I've never even bothered valueing my collection for insurance reasons. >>

I don't know which priorities you refer to, but I see my collection as a bit of history and a lot of fun and learning, if that's what you meant.

-Amanda >>

That's exactly what I was refering to. Keep those priorities into adulthood and just spend what you can afford to lose on coins, it'll make it a MUCH more enjoyable hobby in the end.

bidask · September 10, 2006 1:04PM

<< 

<< As you grow from being a young numismatist to a professional numismatist dealer, you will, and as your income level grows and you buy more coins, you will.

>>

You think so? I do not think I would enjoy pondering the economics of having fun.

-Amanda >>

Pondering the economics of having fun, well ....can be fun!

Leiana · September 10, 2006 1:08PM

JRocco, of course I will stay in school.

That's where I belong right now!

Bidask, if I had 10K to spend on a coin that was "worth" 10K to me, I would do it.

Dieclash, to me a monetary investment is an investment where one expects a certain percentage of return from one's investment. I do not expect any sort of monetary return on my collection.

I do use my collection as an investment in history and personal enrichment. I have made many friends through numismatics. I have learned a whole lot through numismatics. I say my returns on my investment have been great!

Disney World, however, is very corporate. I would not make worthwile friends from a short trip to Disney World, nor would I learn about our nation's history through some of the best story tellers--coins.

If you ask me, coins are a far better "investment."

dthigpen- thanks, I will certainly try!

-Amanda

mach19 · September 10, 2006 1:09PM

<< Rare coins are purely a luxury, hardly needed for life - and putting money you can't afford to lose into them is generally not the best of ideas. >>

Well said

DeusExMachina · September 10, 2006 1:10PM

I have read many recent threads about coins as an investment. I find it interesting that people keep pushing coins as investments. OK, fine. Anything can be an investment, I guess.

So the next logical response is, how do you value a coin as a investment?

bidask · September 10, 2006 1:12PM

<< I have read many recent threads about coins as an investment. I find it interesting that people keep pushing coins as investments. OK, fine. Anything can be an investment, I guess.

So the next logical response is, how do you value a coin as a investment? >>

Over time.

BlindedByEgo · September 10, 2006 1:15PM

Perhaps the example used in the question was a bit extreme, but the basic question is nonetheless valid. I would ask "what dollar loss on a coin for your collection would cause you discomfort, if you had to liquidate the coin relatively quickly?". I believe that somewhere in the world collectors, heirs and hoarder/accumulators face that decision every day, all with different expectations.

coinnut86 · September 10, 2006 1:16PM

<< If you buy an $80 coin for $10K you probably ought to find another hobby.

Russ, NCNE >>

DieClash · September 10, 2006 1:26PM

<< Dieclash, to me a monetary investment is an investment where one expects a certain percentage of return from one's investment. I do not expect any sort of monetary return on my collection.

I do use my collection as an investment in history and personal enrichment. I have made many friends through numismatics. I have learned a whole lot through numismatics. I say my returns on my investment have been great!

Disney World, however, is very corporate. I would not make worthwile friends from a short trip to Disney World, nor would I learn about our nation's history through some of the best story tellers--coins.

If you ask me, coins are a far better "investment."

-Amanda >>

Well put. And quite a mature perspective for a YN.

While I don't necessarily expect a certain percentage return on my collection as a whole, Coin values do indeed fluctuate with the market forces of supply and demand and in the majority of cases, over time one's collection value will exceed the cost of accumulating the collection, so in a very real sense coin collecting is both a hobby and an investement. And so I agree with this threads originator that coin values are indeed inherent in the decision making process of whether to buy one coin to add to your collection or pass it up for a more desired specimen. We make these decisions every day, whether they are eye appeal, an investment in history, personal enrichement or for monetary gain.

Keep collecting

Leiana · September 10, 2006 1:44PM

<< Well put. And quite a mature perspective for a YN.

While I don't necessarily expect a certain percentage return on my collection as a whole, Coin values do indeed fluctuate with the market forces of supply and demand and in the majority of cases, over time one's collection value will exceed the cost of accumulating the collection, so in a very real sense coin collecting is both a hobby and an investement. And so I agree with this threads originator that coin values are indeed inherent in the decision making process of whether to buy one coin to add to your collection or pass it up for a more desired specimen. We make these decisions every day, whether they are eye appeal, an investment in history, personal enrichement or for monetary gain.

Keep collecting

>>

Thanks, I plan to.

-Amanda

fountainheadgold · September 10, 2006 1:50PM

i have allways thought how, if my coins became worthless, i could enjoy my coins more, i would never have to consider selling them.

anyone who says they are a "collector"

Comments

Leave a Comment

anyone who says they are a &quot;collector&quot;

Comments

Leave a Comment

anyone who says they are a "collector"