A full page Coinworld ad for a 1960-D nickel?
ColonialCoinUnion
Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭
I saw that Bowers is running a full page, inside front cover ad for the 'unique' full steps 1960-D Jefferson in their December auction.
So how much is something like that likely to sell for?
So how much is something like that likely to sell for?
0
Comments
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>P.T.Barnum is laughing in his grave.
I disagree with remarks like this.....
a 60d in Full Steps in high grade is very scarce....
And there are those that desire this coin....
I tell you what, I paid 13.5k for a 53s Frankie in a MS65FBL, some would use the same lame remark found above, but so what.
I buy what I want to buy and thats it...
The 60d mentioned will make a collector out there very proud to own it....
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
How much is a full page coin world ad ?
The coin will bring more than 20 K
Lucy will buy it !!!!!
Stewart
This the equivalent to "Location, Location, Location" in the real estate industry.
After all a 55 DDO is just a penny until someone:
A) Identifies it
The buyer is the one who sets the price.
First Place Winner of the 2005 Rampage design contest!
Being that only one set in the Registry can be 100% complete with full steps, quite a bit I would imagine.
U.S. Nickels Complete Set with Major Varieties, Circulation Strikes
U.S. Dimes Complete Set with Major Varieties, Circulation Strikes
Dan
First Place Winner of the 2005 Rampage design contest!
I paid $15.53 for my first share of CLCT and just under $12 for my last one. ... some here think it is insanity. But, when the cost of the share is less than the cost of getting a few coins graded... ahhhh, nevermind.
Lucy is right. To someone , somewhere...it's worth a fortune.... Perry, you are right too..... I would not pay more than a hundred for that nickel, but I paid a grand for a 72DDO Lincoln in a PCGS slab graded MS66.
...and I am seriously considering the current CHEERIOS SACAGAWEA listed on ebay as my next INVESTMENT (investment being the operative word, for me)
Joe
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>It is quite rediculous- ain't it!
The grading services did not create the market for moderns or for high grade. These markets pre-dated the
services. Indeed, both major services took steps in their early days to suppress these markets or at least
to suppress registering the coins.
These markets are quite small because there is not much money in them. How many $1000+ '60-D nickels
exist? But the number of collectors is not insubstantial. There are thousands of collectors who can appreciate
quality and rarity even if it's not two hundred years old. The typical dealer may have no use for this coin in
or out of the holder but those with no interest have no effect on its value.
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
<< <i>Am I the only one who thinks its foolish to pay big money for a coin where 99% of the value is in the label? What would this coin bring in a major auction if it were raw? >>
No. Probably almost all of us agree to a greater or lesser extent.
The value of this coin resides in its grade, not it's holder. The coin raw would bring a similar price to what a comparable classic would bring to a knowledge buyer.
I guess no one ever heard of this upstart "Bowers" and it's a good idea to be on the look out.
the 60-d would have commanded 4 figures easily 10 years before any tpg existed. 5 figures today doesn't surprise me in the least.
<< <i>big premiums on full step nickels go back to 1977, and there were 800 members of the pak fs 5c club by 1980. the registry demand and pop reports have put the spotlight on the very thin supply of many jeff 5c dates. >>
Well, when I was young, I was building a set of BU Jeffs, and when I could find them, I preferred full steps and they didn't seem to sell for much of a premium. No way I'd pay 10x the price for one with full steps, though, let alone 10,000x the price.
Yet you'd happily pay $5000 for a coin that would only bring $4000 if you cracked it out.....right?
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
<< <i>IMHO..... I would never pay $1,000 for a coin in a slab that if I broke out would only get $5 for.... >>
There is no substantiation for such a wild claim. The fact that the corner dealer might not
offer $5 for this coin out of the holder has no bearing on its value in or out of the holder.
This same argument has been presented numerous times and shot down numerous times
in numerous ways in threads in which you've responded. Can you really believe that one
can make a $10,000 collectible from a common $5 coin? Maybe there are opportunities in
classics of which I'm not aware but there are no such opportunities in moderns.
Well, except that one can find raw coins for $5 that are worth $10,000. Eat your heart out.
<< <i>IMHO..... I would never pay $1,000 for a coin in a slab that if I broke out would only get $5 for.... >>
I think the point being made here is that the coin we're discussing is an investment in plastic & pops. If it weren't for a TPG and their pop report that displayed "1" in the "Total" column....... it would be a 5¢ coin. Crack it out and that's what it is.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
Isn't this just another version of my dog is better than your dog, my nickel has more steps than yours??
In the end it's still a 1960 nickel and there are plenty of them around. Of course condition is important but in this case is it worth thousands more? Are we just splitting hairs......eh I mean steps?
Who would pay anywhere near this price level if they weren't expecting a greater fool to show up later.
<< <i>
<< <i>IMHO..... I would never pay $1,000 for a coin in a slab that if I broke out would only get $5 for.... >>
I think the point being made here is that the coin we're discussing is an investment in plastic & pops. If it weren't for a TPG and their pop report that displayed "1" in the "Total" column....... it would be a 5¢ coin. Crack it out and that's what it is. >>
It's odd that some bashers never respond to logical argument and fact and simply make the same statements again and again.
Perhaps someone needs to put some thought into "Why Not Collect Old Coins?".
the 60-d would have commanded 4 figures easily 10 years before any tpg existed. 5 figures today doesn't surprise me in the least. >
This reply is the most accurate of the replies so far IMO.
There is a demand for well struck Jefferson nickels, believe it or not. Some dates are very rare with full steps. These coins are valuable raw. It is not the same thing as the minute difference between a 1892 PF 68 Ultra Cam Quarter and one in PF 69 Ultra Cam. There is a coin I wouldn't want to break out of the holder.
Most of you still have trouble coming to terms with the first fool, let alone the greater one.
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
<< <i>Am I the only one who thinks its foolish to pay big money for a coin where 99% of the value is in the label? What would this coin bring in a major auction if it were raw? >>
No. Keep in mind that probably 99% of dealers wouldn't even consider paying a premium for it if offered to them.
When selling, however, it would be a very different story.
I have a hard time owning something there are so many of - increases the chance another one, or two as nice, with FS will show up some day. But gosh, Jefferson nickels are fugly anyway!!!
OK....which one of you was trying to tell him.
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
So I take it you won't be a buyer then?
I happen to like Jefferson nickels.
Wasn't this debate settled with the 45-P Mercury Dime in Full Bands?
Surely as more 45-P's in FB got slabbed their price didn't go down, in fact people developed even more desire to own one.
In the same manner I would suspect that even if more 60-D were found/slabbed with FS more people would want to own one.
The price of a coin will be dectated by consumers' appetite to own it. And given the 45-P example, and making a supposition that more people collect Jefferson Nickels than Mercury Dimes, I would venture to say that an FS 60-D will be no different, if not even more so sought after.
Just my 2 nickels
The assertion I LOVE is that the registry "game" will magically go away. When specifically will PCGS cease to impact the market? They've been around 20+ years now.
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
<< <i><big premiums on full step nickels go back to 1977, and there were 800 members of the pak fs 5c club by 1980. the registry demand and pop reports have put the spotlight on the very thin supply of many jeff 5c dates.
the 60-d would have commanded 4 figures easily 10 years before any tpg existed. 5 figures today doesn't surprise me in the least. >
This reply is the most accurate of the replies so far IMO.
<< <i>
Agreed. I was a full-stepper in 1977, and I recall one the founders of collecting, like Sistis and Weiss, having a standing bounty for a 60D FS in 4 figures. I'd pay some bucks for the coin. But the fact that it's a pop 1, only FS in PCGS for the date, I'm sure will drive the premium past my comfort level.
Clad King - Go back and re-read the posts so far. Not one post pits modern vs. classics, and some even make a point of clarifying that. Yet you respond 4 times with insinuations of classics snobbery in action. You need to come up for air!
But it is also true that the registries have educated the hobby on exactly HOW RARE many of these well struck dates really are. This is a key component. Lets face it, naysayers have had nearly two decades to make their "killing" by slabbing their prized coins since they "certainly exist." As time goes on, the truth becomes more evident. Sure, there might be a few more 1960-D nickels out there in the top grade, but additional company quite often INCREASES DEMAND!
I choose not to play it...I can't afford to.
Say that I have 4 rocks.......3 green and 1 red.
25 people want the green rocks......and they're gonna bid up the rocks till they own one.
My 1 red rock is the only one of its kind, but NOBODY wants it!
What's it worth???......
NOTHING.....even though it's the only one.
Supply and Demand....plain and simple..........
There may never be another green rock to come along, but.........what if they do?
What if a lot of them do????
I ain't that rich to gamble on something like that.
Pete
Actually, many truly serious and dedicated Jeff collectors (especially those working on the best FS set they can build) pursue these difficult issues without regard to the "registry", the "pop 1" or the "FS" designation from what I have seen. Indeed, I believe the #1 MS FS PCGS Jeff set in the land did not pursue this coin the first time it was auctioned off by Bowers (last year I believe) - so "Registry" or "pop 1" is not always a factor. Since this is an ongoing auction, I will reserve further comments to after the auction is completed. I did have a chance to lot view the entire Jefferson collection yesterday and the set contains numerous lovely coins. Good luck in the auction.
Wondercoin.
<< <i>You need a big ad to startle all the brain dead people into bidding on it-----------------BigE >>
OK. Coin prices are determined by demand. They are not determined by age, condition, rarity,
what the corner coin shop offers, or what other people think they are worth. Unless someone
is buying (creating demand) or selling (decreasing demand) their estimation of value is worth far
less than what many people think this coin is worth. Ultimately it is collector demand that deter-
mines prices because speculative demand usually disappears at the first sign of trouble or the
first hint that something is overbought. Hype is used to stir up speculative demand but one never
hears charges of hype when ad after ad comes along to stir up interest in the latest classic coin
to hit the market. Flowery language and claims of great rarity are made about common classics
and they bring hundreds of thousands and many speak of the great strenght of the market and
the wisdom of buying classic rarities.
But let someone just try to sell a modern and we get threads like this. Don't get me wrong, I love
threads like this. Sure I get a little exasperated at times with the same empty arguments but this
kind of thread has got to make the moderns controversial. It makes them dangerous and just a lit-
tle more exciting. It's got to be good for recruiting collectors. Newbies must wonder why so many
people detest the coins so much. What exactly makes a copper nickel three cent piece a fine under-
rated collectible but an even scarcer copper nickel quarter is crap?
Indeed, anything can set off a thread about what junk moderns are. A new discovery, which service
is best, the registry, even a thread about something found in circulation.
No one needs to like these coins and I certainly understand why many don't. Remember, back in '65
I was their biggest detractor and this didn't change for years. But when people make statements
that they are crap and use dubious "facts", insults, or non-sequitor to back it up then I enjoy making
posts like this if for no other reason than to highlight it.
We the brain dead salute you.
While this may have been the very first time a 1960's dated coin (let alone a Jefferson nickel) achieved a full page advertisement in connection with a major auction, it certainly will not be the last. Indeed, the "sister coin" to this 1960(d) Jeff the last time it was auctioned off by Bowers last year was the 1961(d) Jeff in PCGS-MS65FS - a truly remarkable coin - IMHO probably the rarest and most desireble MS Jeff out there with the possible exception of one, maybe two Jeffs from the 1940's-50's. Without question (IMHO), a true gem FS 1961(d) Jefferson nickel is rarer than an MS65 1926(s) Buffalo nickel (even if it is 1/3 the price even today). In time, the 1960's coins will be regarded as "classics" in their own right. I commentedt on these boards maybe 4-5 years ago that a coin like a 1963(d) Lincoln Cent in true MS67RD (still pop -0- at PCGS) is as scarce as any regular issue Lincoln cent going back to 1931. A true gem FS 1960(d) Jefferson nickel (if one is ever graded) would also fall into the category of a treasured rarity (along with the 1961(d) Jeff). The 1963(p) Roosie in true MS67FB is also a "sleeper" (true MS68FB quality an unquestionable great rarity) , not to mention a true high quality MS67 1961(d) quarter (few exist I believe). And, one of the rarest of them all might be the 1969(p) Washington Quarter in true quality MS68 quality - I would be surprised if even one was graded in the next 10 years. Bottom line - expect to see more full page ads showcasing great 1960's rarities in the years ahead as these coins slowly become regarded as "classics".
Wondercoin.
<< <i>Without question (IMHO), a true gem FS 1961(d) Jefferson nickel is rarer than an MS65 1926(s) Buffalo nickel (even if it is 1/3 the price even today >>
Sort of comparing apples and oranges aren't you? The 26-s is very scarce in mint state. A pop 10 coin in 65 at pcgs with 5 at ngc plus one higher. And only a pop 111 in 64 at pcgs and 78 at ngc.
As for the 61-d in ms65, not FS, the pops don't matter since they aren't worth grading. Heritage's archive shows that an ngc in 67 not FS sold for less than $600 last summer.
Only the FS designation makes a difference. But why steps and not windows? What about those windows on Monticello? Why don't they count?
Sort of makes one have to rethink whether it make sense to base your collection on a miniscule design detail strike designation that does not assure one of a coin that has good eye appeal or even a good strike overall, and that often cannot be ascertained with certainty under a 10X loupe. And of course the same can be said of the FB Merc the FH Standing Lib and the FBL Frankie.
CG