Can a dealer tell a "newbie" just by looking at them?

Geoman · November 23, 2005 3:00AM

Are dealers good at "reading" a person? Do dealers sit there and watch people, and can they tell if a person walking up to their table is a "newbie" or a seasoned collector without that person saying anything? For example, are there certain actions that give away a "newbie" over a seasoned collector?

I was thinking back to when I first started collecting coins, and I went with my Dad to a small dealer's shop. I walked in all giddy and excited about buying my first coins. I got stung by the dealer I have since learned. However, do you think the dealer saw right away I was a newbie and saw $$$ on my face?

mhammerman · November 23, 2005 3:02AM

YES

PerryHall · November 23, 2005 3:02AM

If they are carrying a Red Book and a grading guide under their arm, the dealer will assume they are a newbie.

BlindedByEgo · November 23, 2005 3:03AM

<< If they are carrying a Red Book and a grading guide under their arm, the dealer will assume they are a newbie. >>

And a tattered, well used hand me down Greysheet.

Bingo.

DennisH · November 23, 2005 3:18AM

Don't dealers know everything?

Or am I just making a wild and unfair generalization based on one or two isolated observations?

Russ · November 23, 2005 3:27AM

I always pretend I'm a newbie when I see a new dealer at a show. Stuff like "what's that ugly tarnish on that Morgan?", or "is there any way to get that hazy stuff off that proof Franklin?", or "I don't know anything about them, but it looks kind of nice."

Russ, NCNE

RedTiger · November 23, 2005 3:32AM

Negotiating is a skill most successful dealers have. Sizing up people quickly is part and parcel of negotiating. The old joke comes to mind, "for you a special price," meaning an extra high rip-off price to a newbie.

A few dealers have a soft spot for newbies and give them good deals hoping for lifelong customers. It helps a lot if the newbie looks under 12 years old. However, just as many dealers, perhaps more, see newbies, especially young adults, as easy prey and an opportunity for a quick buck.

vega1 · November 23, 2005 3:39AM

*Any* average salesperson can size up their customer quickly based on their own experience and initial perception. What they do with that info is what makes them either a good dealer or a bad dealer IMO.

2bits · November 23, 2005 3:43AM

Just as dealers learn to spot the Newbie, its just as easy to learn to spot the ripoff dealers, and if you cant tell by looking a couple of well asked questions will soon tell you the character of ANY dealer !!

Rick

PerryHall · November 23, 2005 3:44AM

<< I always pretend I'm a newbie when I see a new dealer at a show. Stuff like "what's that ugly tarnish on that Morgan?", or "is there any way to get that hazy stuff off that proof Franklin?", or "I don't know anything about them, but it looks kind of nice."

Russ, NCNE >>

Great idea!!! You can find out real quick if the dealer is honest or the typical dealer crook.

FatMan · November 23, 2005 3:48AM

<< 

<< I always pretend I'm a newbie when I see a new dealer at a show. Stuff like "what's that ugly tarnish on that Morgan?", or "is there any way to get that hazy stuff off that proof Franklin?", or "I don't know anything about them, but it looks kind of nice."

Russ, NCNE >>

Great idea!!! You can find out real quick if the dealer is honest or the typical dealer crook. >>

But once the dealer learns you were not exactly honest in your initial presentation, what does that do to the future relationship possibilities?

Russ · November 23, 2005 3:52AM

<< But once the dealer learns you were not exactly honest in your initial presentation, what does that do to the future relationship possibilities? >>

It makes for excellent relationships. I once picked up a toned Morgan from a dealer with the tarnish line for $80. Sold it for $147. I've bought several coins from him since. He thinks he trained me.

Russ, NCNE

seanq · November 23, 2005 3:53AM

<< 

<< I always pretend I'm a newbie when I see a new dealer at a show. Stuff like "what's that ugly tarnish on that Morgan?", or "is there any way to get that hazy stuff off that proof Franklin?", or "I don't know anything about them, but it looks kind of nice."

Russ, NCNE >>

Great idea!!! You can find out real quick if the dealer is honest or the typical dealer crook. >>

I have to agree with Russ, in most instances I want a dealer to think I know as little as possible. I'll ask a simple question or two and listen carefully to his response. It makes it much easier for me to judge his character and expertise.

That always worked for me until one dealer recognized my name from the forum and said to his partner, "Look out for this guy, he really knows his stuff."

Sean Reynolds

atarian · November 23, 2005 4:08AM

the one or 2 coin places i go to . i really look the part of a fool. i look like a kid who really shouldnt be into coins. i dont show emotions much anyway. ( at least on my face). so they can talk and i listen and try to judge them that way. yet, i think the major issue for the one i used to go to was that they just pushed cheap stuff on me and i normally stood there unamused. then again sell me a 1908 $20 gold coin i would probably have the same expression on my face ( at least till i get to the car and am around the block). but that one dealer in clifton never was able to figure me out.

i guess also i dont look like the type to ever have real money to spend.

But definately dealers classify people who walk into their store. some are shoot this one knows whats what. and some are dumb as a post. i like being called dumb and then they need to eat their words. nothing better than to walk in emotionless. them plop a page of circ IHC or VF at best Morgans to pawn them off on you . you take a half step to the right and ask to see a $5 gold piece PCGS slabbed MS63. the clifton dealer just did a double take.

291fifth · November 23, 2005 4:11AM

The skillful ones can. They also have x-ray vision and can tell how much money the potential customer has in his wallet.

foodude · November 23, 2005 4:36AM

"what's that ugly tarnish on that Morgan?", or "is there any way to get that hazy stuff off that proof Franklin?", or "I don't know anything about them, but it looks kind of nice."

streeter · November 23, 2005 5:13AM

As long as I can remember I have looked at a transaction--no matter what it involves-as 50% product & 50% person. Judge each component of the transaction independently of the other and you will avoid a lot of problems.

<<Can a sharp salesman JUDGE a newbie?>> It's really not important but a good salesman can qualify a potential customer for ability and attitude with a couple of quick questions. Don't wrestle with a pig unless you want to get dirty, cause the pig enjoys it.

sellsatan · November 23, 2005 5:14AM

C'mon folks, dealers aren't an alien species. They're human, for better or worse, just like the rest of us. Some people are excellent judges of character and composition, some are not. I'd wager that this holds true for dealers the same as everyone else.

RedTiger · November 23, 2005 5:40AM

<< C'mon folks, dealers aren't an alien species. They're human, for better or worse, just like the rest of us. Some people are excellent judges of character and composition, some are not. I'd wager that this holds true for dealers the same as everyone else. >>

Just like everyone else, except they meet lots of customers and negotiate transactions all the time. Practice does sharpen certain skills. Those that are not good at it, usually find another line of work, or work for someone else who can do the negotiating. Coin dealers get to practice skills that the buying or selling collector may only use once a month, or once a year, or less. Other salespeople may or may not have similar skills depending on what they sell, how many customers they deal with, how much room for negotiation there is, and so on.

Unlike many other sales professionals, some coin dealers have a reputation for poor or non-existent customer service and friendliness. I doubt that many are poor at negotiating.

The judge of character thing is often self-fulfilling, especially on the negative side. If a dealer is convinced that I am not going to buy from him/her and treats me that way, he/she is usually right.

Cnitas · November 23, 2005 6:05AM

<< If a dealer is convinced that I am not going to buy from him/her and treats me that way, he/she is usually right. >>

AMEN!

Boom · November 23, 2005 6:24AM

They are pretty swoof at sizing people up, particularly once they've opened their mouths. That is unless the buyer is playing the dealer as Russ indicated.

BBN · November 23, 2005 6:49AM

Makes me appreciate my delaer here In Marion more and more everyday. The first time I walked into his shop six years ago as a 29 yr old complete newbie it was obvious. I wasn't asking for certain coins. I asked to see things in general and asked questions like "are mercury dimes worth alot?"

I walked away that day with some circulated crap that totaled about $30. The kicker is the stuff added up to about $40 on what he had written on the 2x2s. As he would sort through what I had selected he'd look at something and say "seven dollars? We can knock that down to five. $4.50? Let's try $4." I told him he didn't have to do that and he said he could tell I was new and he always cut the prices for new or young collectors.

Craton · November 23, 2005 8:23AM

I think that most dealers treat all new customers like newbies untill they catch on that you might know a little more then they think. Some dealers will still treat you like crap though because they think that since they are dealers that they know more then you no matter what.

I got this coin in a mint set for $40 dollars (the whole mint set). The dealer said "Hey, I already looked at all of those for cameo's" and he said it in a way to try to make me feel/look stupid.
Check out what it came back from PCGS as:

Bwahahahahahahaaaaa......... Who's the newbie now beyatch!!!!

MikeInFL · November 23, 2005 8:25AM

The good dealer/salesman acts with integrity in selling. They may be able to "size" the person up but don't use this against the person. In return they a satisfied and return customer. There's more to life than making a buck taking advantage of people. It is sad that many in the coin game, and life more generally, don't subscribe to this credo...Mike

BBN · November 23, 2005 11:11PM

<< The good dealer/salesman acts with integrity in selling. They may be able to "size" the person up but don't use this against the person. In return they a satisfied and return customer. >>

Yes and because of my dealer's honesty and integrity I've returned the favor and have spent thousands of $$$ in his shop.

WTCG · November 24, 2005 2:57AM

Many dealers can tell if someone is new.

Factors are not just what the person says, but their physical actions such as how they hold a coin and the technique they use when they're trying to grade that coin.

JSsson · November 26, 2005 4:43PM

I would guess that most coin dealers can tell if someone is a newbie or not just like how most car dealers can tell if someone knows cars or not just by looks alone.

Can a dealer tell a "newbie" just by looking at them?

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Can a dealer tell a &quot;newbie&quot; just by looking at them?

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Can a dealer tell a "newbie" just by looking at them?