Crossover Results In, Sad Results on Ikes

moosesr · October 10, 2005 9:56AM

I submitted several NGC Ikes for crossover and only got 1 for 6

What a waste of money! I thought at least 3 had a real good chance of crossing in particular the 1972 Type 2 which had real clean fields, but one pretty good mark on the cheek. Shows you what I know about grading Ikes

1 22079100 1972 $1 Type 1 NGC MS65 USA DNC
2 22079101 1972 $1 Type 2 NGC MS65 USA DNC
3 22079102 1974 $1 NGC MS66 USA DNC
4 22079103 1976-D $1 Type 1 NGC MS66 USA DNC
5 22079104 1976-D $1 Type 1 NGC MS65 USA MS65
6 22079105 1976-D $1 Type 2 NGC MS66 USA DNC

Date Received: 09/14/2005
Date Shipped: 10/10/2005

Charlie

Cameonut · October 10, 2005 10:09AM

I know you think it a waste of money, but consider it an investment in your coin education. Try to figure out why the coins did not cross and why the one did. That should help you the next time you submit.

Russ · October 10, 2005 10:11AM

<< <i>Try to figure out why the coins did not cross >>

Quota was met early this month.

Russ, NCNE

MikeInFL · October 10, 2005 10:18AM

Why not crack them out before you send to PCGS? From what I hear this seems to be much more successful. I have a few I plan on crossing in the upcoming months, and that's the way I plan on doing it...Mike

CarlWohlforth · October 10, 2005 10:19AM

You are a cynic, Russ!

Are those Ikes worth much more in PCGS holders? Some coins are worth the attempt, but since you say you wasted money I'm guessing one cross doesn't pay for the other attempts...

I haven't tried in a while but I was happy to cross 2 of 6 Jeffs in 67 FS because that did more than pay for the grading fees. But it didn't make up for the time I tried a bunch of S mint Mercury dimes in 67 FB and none crossed.

CarlWohlforth · October 10, 2005 10:22AM

<Why not crack them out before you send to PCGS?>

I see a lot of people say this but there is a risk PCGS will bag the coin or grade it lower. Lots of folks end up with a lower grade than they expect and the coin is worth more in the old holder. Most NGC 65s are worth more than PCGS 64s... I had a coin that was holdered but it got bagged after I cracked it and tried it...

bgrice · October 10, 2005 10:26AM

That is a rough submission, but a good learning experience I guess to see what PCGS is looking for on a particular series. If the coins are not expensive and you can take the chance then cracking them out might be worth it to see what you are missing by allowing them to net grade the coins and not send them back DNC. The best learning experience I had on the Walking Liberty Halves series was 10 coins I sent to NGC raw when I first started dabbling in MS coins. They were good reference coins as they came back MS62-MS64. It proved how little I knew, but also sharpened up my skills at grading the series and bypassing coins that did not merit the TPG holders they were in.

Russ · October 10, 2005 10:27AM

<< <i>Are those Ikes worth much more in PCGS holders? >>

There's a pretty hefty value spread in Gem or better Ikes.

Russ, NCNE

Rampage · October 10, 2005 10:46AM

Charlie,

Good luck on sending the other coins in if you decide to crack them. Every gem graded NGC IKE I have seen has been overgraded compared with PCGS standards on the series. I think I know of only a couple who have successfuly crossed a couple of IKEs. One was an NGC 1971D MS67 that crossed to PCGS MS67.

Bochiman · October 10, 2005 10:48AM

<< <i>

<< <i>Are those Ikes worth much more in PCGS holders? >>

There's a pretty hefty value spread in Gem or better Ikes.

Russ, NCNE >>

Uh-oh....that's Russ' way of saying the Kennedy field is almost tapped out and he has been studying the Ikes

If you guys wanted to cherrypick Ikes, you better get cracking as Russ is ready to enter the market

clevegreg · October 10, 2005 10:54AM

I once submitted a fair number of Ikes from original rolls, picked out the best, and ALL of them came back MS64 LOL.

DHeath · October 10, 2005 11:47AM

Sounds like an above average roll.

clevegreg · October 10, 2005 12:10PM

Well I had about 20-25 rolls to pick from...

ziggy29 · October 10, 2005 12:37PM

There are certain "hit the wall" grades in various series which are VERY easy to almost get to, but the TPGs are VERY tight about giving.

For Ikes, that means making a 65, at least with PCGS. For other coins where 65s may be more common, a coin that has the technical stuff to make 65 might be a 64 if it's an Ike.

Any time you see a sudden, major jump in value from one grade to the next, you've found "the wall," and a coin has to be truly superb -- better than it should have to be, sometimes -- to make it over that wall.

RegistryNut · October 10, 2005 5:13PM

moosesr,
I've went 1 for 6 on crossovers once. My lesson turned out to be very valuable to me, however.
Gettum next time!

RegistryNut

LALASD4 · October 10, 2005 5:23PM

If you put a same grade PCGS ike and a NGC ike together you will notice the difference. Of all the NGC coin that I have seen, they should be one grade lower at PCGS.

22079104 1976-D $1 Type 1 NGC MS65 USA MS65 is a waste of money even if it did cross, that is a low price ccoin even if it is in a PCGS holder.

moosesr · October 10, 2005 11:17PM

Carl, Most of those coins that I sent in for crossover were once in PCGS MS65 holders that I thought were high end and had a chance at MS66. I cracked the coins out and sent them to NGC where they made MS66, so I sent them back to PCGS in the hopes they would cross. Although they didn't cross most of them are probably worth more in the MS66 NGC holder than they would have been in a PCGS MS65 holder. The bad thing about these crossover attempts is some of the PCGS MS65's I cracked out came back as MS64 from NGC which really hurt, especially two 1976-P T1 coins and one 1974-P! Once I got the coins in the NGC MS66 holders, I probably should have just been satisfied and not sent them back to PCGS. I know I said it was a wast of money, but I am not really sure it was, I just couldn't resist trying to get the 1972-P T2 in a PCGS MS65 holder.

Charlie

keets · October 10, 2005 11:42PM

further proof that NGC is softer on Eisenhower Dollars than PCGS. looking at eBay auctions, holdered coins at shops/shows and some of the listings at the BST Forum, this should be quite evident, especially if you pay attention to "watchers" and "prices realized" at eBay. i would assume that these are coins you didn't submit to NGC, but rather they are coins that you bought already in the NGC capsules at a significant discount to their PCGS counterparts while hpoing for the big score and big $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

it's probably better to learn how to grade and pay attention to what how PCGS/NGC grade the series than it is to roll the dice and hope to win big. perhaps this is a first step in that education.

moosesr · October 10, 2005 11:55PM

Keets, I didn't buy any of these crossover coins in NGC holders, most of those coins that I sent in for crossover were once in PCGS MS65 holders that I thought were high end and had a chance at MS66 whether PCGS or NGC. I cracked the coins out and sent them to NGC where they made MS66, so I sent them back to PCGS in the hopes they would cross.

NGC doesn't always grade softer than PCGS as evidenced by some of the PCGS MS65's I cracked out that came back as MS64 from NGC which really hurt, especially two 1976-P T1 coins and one 1974-P

I agree that NGC is usually softer on Ikes than PCGS, but not always and I think that usually a NGC MS66 Ike will be worth more than a PCGS MS65 Ike of the same date.

BillJones · October 11, 2005 12:56AM

When it comes to modern coins, PCGS rules.

That's the only area of the market where I would say that. Sadly NGC has traded their integrity for a few bucks too many times in the modern coin market. I’ve seen incidences where bulk submissions were NGC treated the coins like it was a bell shaped curve with what looked like random grades slapped on the slab. “Slab and ship ‘em, and get ‘em out fast seemed to be NCG’s strategy.

Act in haste … repent in leisure … TO BAD for NGC.

Gandyjai · October 11, 2005 1:23AM

My first batch of NGC Ike crossover was 0 for 6.

Then,....I got REAL picky on my next batch (a few weeks ago) and went 3 for 7....Including a 72-P Type 3 in 66

The other 2 that crossed were a 72-P Type 1 and a 72-P Type 3 both in 65.

So, it can be done.

Brian

I LOVE

Ikes!

MS Error Ike Set + Peg Legs & Pics

mercurydimeguy · October 11, 2005 1:35AM

Try to figure out why the coins did not cross and why the one did

This isn't rocket science. They were in NGC holders. Granted some will cross (about 5%-10%, at best) but most won't. Why? Both services grade differently...not better or worst, just different.

Buying coins in NGC holders thinking you will cross them to PCGS is a loosing proposition. You should buy coins as if they were raw (being plastic agnostic) and submit them to TPG's that way. It's harder to grade a coin in a holder than if it's raw. Can't see the rims, the flow of luster, etc...the holders are sometimes not in the best of shape, and then there is the whole bias perspective. It's like a boy coming to take out your baby girl on a date...the second that door opens you are (pre)judging.

Crossover Results In, Sad Results on Ikes

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