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The definition of "moderns" keeps evolving
oreville
Posts: 12,296 ✭✭✭✭✭
Sooner or later, the era of all clad coinage, post 1965 as being the era of modern coins may have to be revised sooner than later.
Here is an example:
In 1965, when I was actively collecting as a 12 year old, the era of "modern coins" was 1934 to date for most coin series. That was a spread of 31 years. Had I refused to collect modern coins at the time, I would have missed out on buying my first 1955 shift cent (now called doubled die cent), the 1942/1 overdate dime, etc. Even then, I could not afford the 1943 copper cent, only 22 years old at the time.
Today coins minted 31 years ago by the old time standard would take us back to 1974. So pre-1974 coinage are no longer "moderns" even usuing the old standard.
Thoughts?
Comments?
Here is an example:
In 1965, when I was actively collecting as a 12 year old, the era of "modern coins" was 1934 to date for most coin series. That was a spread of 31 years. Had I refused to collect modern coins at the time, I would have missed out on buying my first 1955 shift cent (now called doubled die cent), the 1942/1 overdate dime, etc. Even then, I could not afford the 1943 copper cent, only 22 years old at the time.
Today coins minted 31 years ago by the old time standard would take us back to 1974. So pre-1974 coinage are no longer "moderns" even usuing the old standard.
Thoughts?
Comments?
A Collectors Universe poster since 1997!
0
Comments
on occasion. It seems one of the defining characteristics of the term is that
collected ignore or tend to avoid the coins. This may not have been as impor-
tant a factor in 1964 with million collecting from circulation but it was a major
sea change in 1965 when modern collecting came to an abrupt halt.
We've already moved beyond this with the huge popularity of the states coins,
the new nickels and the Sac dollars. In fact I consider the post '98 issues to be
sufficiently different to be called "ultramoderns". You can call anything by any
name but terms that are descriptive are more useful.
<< <i>Move to Europe, start collecting and everything pre 18th century is considered modern. It is all relative. >>
I think you mean post 18th century.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Cool!!!
the forty year old coins included most of the Lincoln and Mercury dime series. People didn't
spend nice AU '31-S cents or '38-D halfs because they were too modern. The oldest coins
in circulation that one was likely to encounter were 1909 cents which weren't even fifty years
old yet!!! Today we think nothing of findind 1938 nickels or even cents from the teens even
quarters from the '60's are still common yet we think of the coins in circulation as being "new".
'Modern, modern' begins with the French Revolution. That event really did change the world.
I personally would say though that modern is a decimal currency. So in the US this is from 1793, in the UK this is 1971.
Moderns: 1948 to 1970.
Ultra moderns: 1971 to date.
The debate can now end.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Early moderns: 1909 to 1947.
Moderns: 1948 to 1970.
Ultra moderns: 1971 to date.
The debate can now end.
Russ, NCNE >>
He has spoken, lmao!
Zach
Check my ebay BIN or Make Offers!!
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Moderns are coins that I collect in mint state. Classics are coins that I collect in circulated condition.
Contantly changing with each new collector............
<< <i>Why does anyone have to define "moderns"? is there any reason, other than to disparage them? >>
We certainly need to agree on what we're calling crap. One person might say moderns are junk and
be referring only to coins made after 1970 and someone else who collects real coins like Morgans will
think that his coins are being called crap too. It's not fair to real collectors to not have an agreed up-
on definition.
Maybe we could just agree that anything we don't personally collect is either too expensive or mere crap.
The beauty of this is that almost all the moderns would be coins minted in the last few hundred years.
<< <i>and someone else who collects real coins like Morgans >>
Morgans aren't real coins, they're bullion.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>and someone else who collects real coins like Morgans >>
Morgans aren't real coins, they're bullion.
Russ, NCNE >>
I suppose they were minted at the behest of the silver miners and didn't really circulate freely. They
were a convenient way to obtain one dollar in silver and did replace the trade dollar which was even
demonetized.
This is exactly why we need some definitions. We wouldn't want to slam any good coins like shield
nickels or flying eagles.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Moderns = Coins born after me
Contantly changing with each new collector............ >>
There is a lot of truth here. It is hard for we old people to accept that coins minted during our lifetime could ever be considered anything but modern. So what is modern to an 80 year old may easily be considered classic to a 30 year old.
<< <i>Why does anyone have to define "moderns"? is there any reason, other than to disparage them? >>
For purposes of this forum, this is right on! "Modern" is a fine, descriptive word, but, concerning coin collecting, when faced with a constant barrage of disparaging remarks from those who have not done their research, and yet still spew venom, the word eventually lacks meaning. I like the catagories, as mentioned by Russ. The year distinctions are close to what we have discussed for a long time.
And so now I collect "UltraCrap".
Hmmm, "UltraCrap"... I can live with that.
<< <i>Early moderns: 1909 to 1947.
Moderns: 1948 to 1970.
Ultra moderns: 1971 to date.
The debate can now end.
Russ, NCNE >>
I see nothing wrong with this. After all this is the US coin forum.
The Dark Side forum may need to go much further back for thiers.
But I would ask. Why 1971 for ultra, instead of 1999?
Personaly I would say 48-98 modern, and 99-date ultra.
I wouldn't presume to argue with Russ, but would like to know why the 71 cut off?
pz
(Priest) BLASPHEMY he said it again, did you hear him?
Silver in US coins were from the byegone era. The era when our coinage had real intrinstic value.
It is possible that the new modern era might begin in 1982 or 83, the year our copper cent became the zinc cent.
But we still have our nickel!
<< <i>Morgans did circulate out west where people didn't trust paper money and they are real coins contrary to what some may believe. >>
I always felt moderns were post 1964. I'm thinking we should change that to 1999, the year all the custom coinage started.
I do like the State Quarter program, but I think it opened to door to some stupid things such as the Jefferson Nickel debacle (one year late & Virginia taking over forever),
SMS mint sets instead of the traditional sets, so on & so forth. And whatever stupid decisions they are sure to make for the anniversary of the Lincoln Cent.
<< <i>I suspect that Russ picked 1971 since it was the first year no US circulating coin had any silver left. >>
That was the thought process. Although I suppose the 1971 to date ultra modern category could be further subdivided by using some to be determined demarcation point.
Russ, NCNE
I am Looking to Buy California Tokens too.
<< <i>Early moderns: 1909 to 1947.
Moderns: 1948 to 1970.
Ultra moderns: 1971 to date.
The debate can now end.
Russ, NCNE >>
Ohmygosh, I agree with Russ!
If it's minted after me, it's modern. I was born just before Frankie was minted (1947).
If it was made during my lifetime, it's modern.
Hey, it works for me.
Collector since 1976. On the CU forums here since 2001.
Modern > 1950.
Dave
<< <i>
<< <i>and someone else who collects real coins like Morgans >>
Morgans aren't real coins, they're bullion. >>
Wait, I thought they were widgets...? I'm all confused now.
Sean Reynolds
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor