eBay seller sticking it to the "sealed proof set" scam artists!
Russ
Posts: 48,514 ✭✭✭
Gotta love this!
<< <i>Here on eBay you sell literally thousands of these sets sold each day - almost all of which have been opened, inspected and resealed. There are also some unscrupulous sellers here on eBay who buy envelopes and seal these sets themselves - these envelopes are bright orange and measure just a smidgen smaller than the original envelopes. However, these sellers continue to sell them and get outrageous prices - and the buyers think they are getting unsearched sets. Those buyers are NOT receiving truly unopened or unsearched sets - they are paying good, hard-earned money to these unconscionable sellers. >>
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Here on eBay you sell literally thousands of these sets sold each day - almost all of which have been opened, inspected and resealed. There are also some unscrupulous sellers here on eBay who buy envelopes and seal these sets themselves - these envelopes are bright orange and measure just a smidgen smaller than the original envelopes. However, these sellers continue to sell them and get outrageous prices - and the buyers think they are getting unsearched sets. Those buyers are NOT receiving truly unopened or unsearched sets - they are paying good, hard-earned money to these unconscionable sellers. >>
Russ, NCNE
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Comments
He's not being honest.
A few years ago I was lucky enough to buy a hoard of unopened proof sets from a jewelry store. There were about 30 sets total and I was hoping for a few magical cameos to appear. I started opening the sets and found them to be almost identical in every respect. I took sets from both ends and the middle, but they were all the same. In this case, every single set had a cameo nickel and cent so they were easy to identify. I actually gave away one of these sets on this board years ago. (my coin giveaway)
Anyway it's my guess that he's sampled this particular box and found no cameos. He probably replaced the samples with ones from another stack he's sampled and found to be worthless. You don't have to open every single set to know what's in the envelope if you're sure they are from the same run. In this case, they came from the same mint box so he can be sure he's not giving anything away.
<< <i>He's not being honest. >>
Aside from the fact that you have no way of knowing that and are just engaging in your usual mindless dealer bashing, who cares?
The auction is excellent for what it does. It says loud and clear to the eBay community that the place is crawling with slimeballs selling repacked junk as mint sealed.
Russ, NCNE
You crack me up. Champion one person for bashing dealers then attack another person for doing exactly the same thing. Do you now or have you ever known what you were talking about?
<< <i>
<< <i>He's not being honest. >>
Aside from the fact that you have no way of knowing that and are just engaging in your usual mindless dealer bashing, who cares?
... >>
I'm concerned about you Russ, you shouldn't hold back so much...
~g
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ...
and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
<< <i>Are you denying that in a box of unopened proof sets there's an easy way to tell if there are cameos inside? You cheer the fact that he's bashing other dealers for being unethical, (non-specific) then totally accepting that he didn't sample this box to find out if there were cameos inside??? How the hell did you figure THIS out???
You crack me up. Champion one person for bashing dealers then attack another person for doing exactly the same thing. Do you now or have you ever known what you were talking about? >>
Didn't you see on the shipping box where is said 25 sets!!!
You realize that you're the forum's biggest running joke, right?
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Didn't you see on the shipping box where is said 25 sets!!! >>
So much for honesty
<< <i><< Didn't you see on the shipping box where is said 25 sets!!! >>
So much for honesty >>
So much for actually looking at the box.
Russ, NCNE
Russ
I'm sure glad you decided to stick to substance rather than childish rhetoric...........
What I said is absolutely true. The dealer can take two sets from this stack and determine what the other sets look like. No one should be naive enough to assume that a buyer is going to get random sealed proof sets.
Russ might be off his meds, but anyone else who wants to bid on this lot should forget about finding a $1000 cameo. Not gonna happen.
<< <i>The dealer can take two sets from this stack and determine what the other sets look like. >>
Duh. But, again, who cares? My gawd, you're a dullard.
<< <i>but anyone else who wants to bid on this lot >>
Incoming clue: The auction already ended.
Russ, NCNE
How can someone so nasty and so full of hate enjoy coins?? Oh sorry I forgot, you're the troll that hides under the bridge between buyer and seller. (a dealer)
<< <i>How can someone so nasty and so full of hate enjoy coins?? >>
That's precious coming from you.
Russ, NCNE
In other words, how do we ever know whether or not a group of proof sets has been screened by the dealer before selling to us?
<< <i>In other words, how do we ever know whether or not a group of proof sets has been screened by the dealer before selling to us? >>
We don't. The vast majority of the stuff sold by dealers is either picked over and repacked, or spot checked. If you can find mint sealed shipping box deals, you might have a chance of actually getting unsearched material.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>How can someone so nasty and so full of hate enjoy coins?? >>
That's precious coming from you.
Russ, NCNE >>
Vietnam Vet 69-70 - Semper Fi
<< <i>How can someone so nasty and so full of hate enjoy coins?? Oh sorry I forgot, you're the troll that hides under the bridge between buyer and seller. (a dealer) >>
At least he wouldn't dip a lovely tarnished c....umm, toner.
<< <i>Iwog,
You realize that you're the forum's biggest running joke, right?
Russ, NCNE >>
Don't I come in at least a close second?
<< <i>Iwog,
You realize that you're the forum's biggest running joke, right?
Russ, NCNE >>
IWAD Or IWOG
Isnt this the same jerk that was mouthing an moaning about comm's not too long ago?
You should read his tripe about gold and silver
<< <i>Duh. But, again, who cares? My gawd, you're a dullard.
How can someone so nasty and so full of hate enjoy coins?? Oh sorry I forgot, you're the troll that hides under the bridge between buyer and seller. (a dealer) >>
Russ is not a dealer --- he's just a collector with a lot of duplicates!!!
<< <i>Here you have a real opportunity to find that Deep Cameo Proof 68 Kennedy - PCGS has that coin valued at $9,600.00. >>
Two questions come to mind...
Does PCGS grade coins in unopened Proof sets??
AND...I thought Russ owned that coin. Wasn't something about that posted a few days ago??
---
See I knew I could stop any more arguing on this thread...when I post, the thread normally dies like a stuck pig!!
If I only had a dollar for every VAM I have...err...nevermind...I do!!
My "Fun With 21D" Die State Collection - QX5 Pics Attached
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Proud Owner of
2 –DAMMIT BOY!!! ® Awards
<< <i>
<< <i>Iwog,
You realize that you're the forum's biggest running joke, right?
Russ, NCNE >>
IWAD Or IWOG
Isnt this the same jerk that was mouthing an moaning about comm's not too long ago?
You should read his tripe about gold and silver
I'm floored!!!!!
You finally made a post I agree with.
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
Russ says: We don't. The vast majority of the stuff sold by dealers is either picked over and repacked, or spot checked. If you can find mint sealed shipping box deals, you might have a chance of actually getting unsearched material.
Which is EXACTLY what you didn't find. Last time I checked, a mint sealed shipping box looked.......well sealed. The really funny thing is that when you applauded this dealer for trashing other dealers, then being a dealer yourself you got ticked off when I bashed a dealer who was bashing other BAD dealers while not acknowleging that he might be a bad dealer himself.......
Why would a dealer sell a group of unopened, unsearched proof sets, knowing that there is a possibility of finding a high grade expensive condition rarity? Wouldn't the dealer want to open the otherwise cheap set and certify the possible treasure?
You can't, that was my point. It's easy to spot check a box of proof sets for cameos before selling them on ebay. The seller that Russ was giving love to has "Here you have a real opportunity to find that Deep Cameo Proof 68 Kennedy - PCGS has that coin valued at $9,600.00." written in the ad. Now either the dealer is a scumbag no better than those he pretends to attack, OR he's incredibly stupid selling an entire unsampled pack for a few dollars extra per set when he might conceivably get THOUSANDS per set.
Now perhaps I'm a tad cynical, but I choose to believe that a high volume coin seller with over 11,000 feedback has CHECKED the coins. That's pretty much all I said (go back and check) before Russ had his nervous breakdown and called me names. <sniff>
I was gonna sacrifice another toned coin in Russ' honor tonight but I can't seem to find any around. Must have done them all in the great dipping attrocity of 2003. My appologies.
<< <i>Hmmmm........only about 40% of this thread is devoted to Iwog hate mail. I must be slipping. >>
the nights still young iwogie!
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
Russ, NCNE >>
----------------------------
haha,i though that was me.
littlejohn
<< <i>
Why would a dealer sell a group of unopened, unsearched proof sets, knowing that there is a possibility of finding a high grade expensive condition rarity? Wouldn't the dealer want to open the otherwise cheap set and certify the possible treasure?
You can't, that was my point. It's easy to spot check a box of proof sets for cameos before selling them on ebay. The seller that Russ was giving love to has "Here you have a real opportunity to find that Deep Cameo Proof 68 Kennedy - PCGS has that coin valued at $9,600.00." written in the ad. Now either the dealer is a scumbag no better than those he pretends to attack, OR he's incredibly stupid selling an entire unsampled pack for a few dollars extra per set when he might conceivably get THOUSANDS per set.
Now perhaps I'm a tad cynical, but I choose to believe that a high volume coin seller with over 11,000 feedback has CHECKED the coins. That's pretty much all I said (go back and check) before Russ had his nervous breakdown and called me names. <sniff> >>
Iwog.
I am a relatively new member and much of what you say does make a lot of sense. Perhaps others can enlighten me as to why there's a cloud of antagonism towards Iwog? It doesn't make any sense for a dealer NOT to check every single Proof set at this point in time! And as Iwog says, spot checking a lot like this, gives you all the information you need. Furthermore, IT PAYS TO BE CYNICAL in this frequently not so honest business. As a long time collector, I've been burned many times by unscrupulous dealers when I was a young and naive collector. I am not saying that this dealer in any way is deceiving anyone, however, the lot may have been picked through by a previous dealer and then passed on to this dealer, unbeknownst to him. Who the heck knows, but you aint getting any top grade deep cameos in that lot. If you do, then the dealer must be an exceptionally generous person who loves giving away valuable coins.
On a different note, a single Kennedy half can have a value of $9,600? Maybe I should check through some of my sealed proof sets that have never seen the light of day and pluck one out!
and not get burned in 1001 different ways on a weekday.
<< <i>Perhaps others can enlighten me as to why there's a cloud of antagonism towards Iwog? >>
Just do a search on his idiotic ramblings and all will be revealed.
Russ, NCNE
Just do a search on his idiotic ramblings and all will be revealed.
I hope no one was hoping for an actual answer from Russ.........
The reason is simple. I rock the boat. Dealers do NOT want people to know how they do business and therefore will go to great lengths to keep some of these practices secret. This thread is a perfect example. Russ was holding this seller up as the good guy simply because he bashed other dealers in his advertisement. Russ FAILED to point out that in boxed lots, the contents of a sealed proof set are easily determined. By telling potential buyers that they might make thousands of dollars, he was misleading at best and committing fraud at worst.
For one thing, the box was clearly OPEN. Either the seller opened it, or the person he bought the lot from opened it. WHOEVER opened it had a reason, and that reason was probably to sample 2 of the sets to determine if cameos were inside. As to why Russ got all upset and stomped his feet, you'll have to ask him why that is.
<< <i><< Perhaps others can enlighten me as to why there's a cloud of antagonism towards Iwog? >>
Just do a search on his idiotic ramblings and all will be revealed.
I hope no one was hoping for an actual answer from Russ.........
The reason is simple. I rock the boat.
You don't even have any oars in the water!
HUH?
<< <i>"The really funny thing is that when you applauded this dealer for trashing other dealers, then being a dealer yourself you got ticked off when I bashed a dealer who was bashing other BAD dealers while not acknowleging that he might be a bad dealer himself".......
HUH? >>
Iwog imagines things that don't exist.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>The reason is simple. I rock the boat. Dealers do NOT want people to know how they do business and therefore will go to great lengths to keep some of these practices secret. >>
Iwog,
While we're on the subject of less than honest sellers, how do you feel about "original" rolls, "guaranteed" unsearched? Even if the roll has its original bank wrapper with oxidized coins on each end, there is still room for suspicion, right?
And I CAN'T StAND when the "return for a full refund" line is supposed to make us feel better. I want my coins to be accurately and honestly described so I don't have to go through the EXCEPTIONALLY ANNOYING AND TIME-CONSUMING TASK OF RETURNING THEM.
C'mon Russ, I used the word "dealer" 6 times in one sentence. You didn't think it was funny? I was giggling when I typed it........