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Crossover for what purpose?
whoopig
Posts: 151
Why does everybody talk about crossing a coin out of an NGC holder to PCGS or vice versa. With all of the wannabe collectors talking about crossover and being shafted on grading and submitting coins 4 or 5 times to get one point higher grading. If it were a serious error or in a low end fly by night holder I could see it. If you look at all the money you spend on having coins regraded or crossed, what kind of coins could you have added for the same money? What happened to the saying "buy the coin not the holder"? It all boils down to money. When you get ready to sell you want the most for it, but when you get ready to buy you want to pay the least for it. I think this has taken all of the fun out of the collecting side of numismatics. If your income depends on it, then jump on it, but dont say you are doing it for the fun when it is all about the money and the "look what I got" third graders do.
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Only PCGS graded coins are allowed in the PCGS registry.
Admit it or not there ARE nice coins in NGC plastic.
Smoe folks just like a uniform "LOOK" to their collection.
I think the crackout artists look for coins to "upgrade" at the same service moreso than looking for coins to cross or coins to cross and upgrade at the same time tho I could be wrong on that point.
dizzyfoxx
<< <i>You make some good points. PCGS has established itself as the market leader, in Third party grading. As a dealer, I find that the discount on NGC coins, is often 20% plus. Even more so, when prices multiply, in the higher grades. >>
I think the concept of a so-called market leader is concieved by public ideals and conceptions of who is the best. Just because you do more doesn't make you best. I own a heat and air business and have found through experience that the most well known brands are not always the best. I buy my coins raw and have them certified. This serves me for purposes of authentication, long term storage, handling and preservation. Since you are a dealer you have an outside stake in it apart from the collecting side so you need to do it to put food on the table and pay the bills. Most collectors don't.
In the higher grades, PCGS grades much more conservatively than their closest competitor. This is demonstrated by the lower populations. Whether a dealer or collector, most people will eventually sell their collections. While it may not be true, in years to come. The PCGS holder maintains a price premium across virtually every series, and grade.
<< <i>
<< <i>You make some good points. PCGS has established itself as the market leader, in Third party grading. As a dealer, I find that the discount on NGC coins, is often 20% plus. Even more so, when prices multiply, in the higher grades. >>
I think the concept of a so-called market leader is concieved by public ideals and conceptions of who is the best. Just because you do more doesn't make you best. I own a heat and air business and have found through experience that the most well known brands are not always the best. I buy my coins raw and have them certified. This serves me for purposes of authentication, long term storage, handling and preservation. Since you are a dealer you have an outside stake in it apart from the collecting side so you need to do it to put food on the table and pay the bills. Most collectors don't. >>
Which is the most important factor, the majority obviously see PCGs as the leaders or they wouldn't pay the premiums and atempt crossovers.
"Senorita HepKitty"
"I want a real cool Kitty from Hepcat City, to stay in step with me" - Bill Carter
I even watch the hits on a auction of a Bust half in an Anacs slab and it's amazingly LOW. I love it. Would I rather have a
Bust half in an Anacs slab? Doesn't matter to me and I've picked up some nice original problem free pieces. At least for
the most part if they net-grade they put it on the slab. Can't say the same with the other big boys.
So y'all just keep looking for PCGS OK?
to screw unknowledgable coin buyers out of more money for the same coin .........different holder
Two years ago, I would have said the same re MS 66 FH SLQs, but not in the last two years re NGC graded material.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
<< <i>PCGS has a bunch of crap slabbed out there just like everyone else does. Cherry pick the slabs for the best stuff. >>
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
You bake a cake with horsechit and you get a horsechit cake. PCGS slabs crap cuz people submit crap. If PCGS can't find a legit reason to BB a coin then they pretty much have to grade and holder it since thats what the submitter is paying for. I don't think it would make good business sense to send a coin back with a note saying we don't want that gawd-awful looking POS in one of our holders.
The advent of certified grading, then slabs, in the 80s was a boon to the collector (and a bane to the dealer?) for 2 reasons: (1) it vastly diminished the number of fakes (counterfeits and alterations) in the marketplace and (2) removed much of the subjectivity of grading, thus making coins somewhat more "liquid" and reducing the "spread" between condition when buying (nearly always "gem") and selling (suddenly, it's a "slider"). That said, all the sillyness about resubmitting to crossover, yet alone for a possible extra "point", is seemingly a ploy by the services for repeat business (without it, it's a "one shot" proposition).
The "big 3" services are much alike IMO, and grade relatively consistently. Yes, they all make mistakes. As an example, I'm returning a recently purchased PCGS PF67 1936 satin proof buffalo nickel because it's a scratched "dog" that somehow got into a PCGS PF67 holder. With crud like this in PCGS slabs, I can't see it as the all encompassing "leader". Another personal example is a 1901 S quarter, my only crossover. It was in an ANACS "net good scratched" holder. I cracked it, sent it to PCGS, and in now reposes in a PCGS G06 holder. Go figure!
Another folly is the difference between slab "generations". Many of my coins are in early slabs, and I'm often told they should upgrade. Maybe so, maybe no. I'm content to leave them "as-is" and hope they may bring some premimum when it comes time to sell.
I'm a firm believer in the addage, "buy the coin, not the holder"!
I too, like my coins in similar holders so they are easier to store at the bank.
I have been successful in finding nice proof cameo coins in other TPG holders and crossing them to PCGS. They then sell for more money in the marketplace than their original holders would have garnered. In other cases, coins that would not get a cameo designation at PCGS have been cracked out and sent to NGC for the cameo designation. Although technically not a crossover, the point is to get the most valuable grade on the holder.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
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