Welcome Very Fine and your post is very fine indeed.
I think your key point -- that the 1916 is a separate variety from the 1917 bare breasted coins -- is getting overlooked in the heat over the relative values of the 1916 compared with the 1901-S.
The difference between the 1916 and the 1917 bare breasted coins is so strong that if you look at just the reverse of the four bare-breasted coins, you'll easily be able to pick out the 1916.
And even though the 1901-S is more expensive, I agree that the 1916 is the more interesting coin, both ...
-- for the political message it was meant to deliver: (the shield as a warning to Germany that Liberty would defend itself, and the bare breast as a symbol of peace and nurturing: the hard and the soft) ...
-- the beauty of the design ...
-- and the story (perhaps true, perhaps not) of why the design was changed
-- and because it's a true one-year type coin.
If all one was interested in was value, then certainly the overdate Standing Liberty trumps both the 1916 and the 1901-S as the most valuable 20th century quarter. And the overdate is also a very interesting coin to look in its own right. That overdate leeeeeeeeeeaps out at you.
Best wishes with your collecting,
Just Having Fun
Jefferson nickels, Standing Libs, and US-Philippines rock
<< <i>Sorry, but his key point was "1916 Standing Liberty quarter is THE 20th century key!".
Key?
Obviously not reality, at least in my world....
Dave >>
In my opinion, the 1916 slq is THE key of all 20th century coins, with the exception of gold. OK, how about KING of all 20th century coins. Does that sit well with you?
The 1901-s Barber quarter is THE key of all Barber coins.
<< <i>Welcome Very Fine and your post is very fine indeed.
I think your key point -- that the 1916 is a separate variety from the 1917 bare breasted coins -- is getting overlooked in the heat over the relative values of the 1916 compared with the 1901-S. >>
Thanks Just Having Fun. Excellent respponse, but I would like to elaborate a bit more on the differences.
1) The 1916 head of liberty has less detail with very delicate lines of hair. The 1917 has braided hair separating the face from hair. The 1917 original hair detail is much stronger in every way. The 1917 has two clearly defined strands of hair projecting from the back of Liberty's head. The head also cuts into the beaded coin border on the 1916. 2) The shield differences are like night and day. The central part of the 1916 shield is shorter and shaped differently. On the 1916 the beads at the perimeter of the shield rim are not sharp. On the 1917, one notes a very sharply defined ring of beads. Even on very low grade specimens, I can quickly differentiate a 16 from 17 because of the bead detail. On well worn coins, the upper right part of the shield usually shows some detail and the differences are still obvious. The appearance of the 1916 sheild make it look more convex and sculptural. The 1917 has a sharp, flat, and etched out appearance. 3)The gown near the foot is different since it touches that area differently on each issue. 4) The 1916 has soft blurry stars whereas the 1917 is extremely sharp in that area. 5)Overall, the 1917 obverse is much sharper in every detail
These differences are more dramatic when comparing uncircualted specimens but standing liberty lovers can tell a mile away even on dateless coins. Keep in mind that the differences have less to do with strike and more to do with original sculpted detail.
Even though the 1917 has a much more sharply designed hub, the 1916, in my opinion looks more beautiful. Artistically speaking, a full-head 1916 has a simpler, more elegant look to it. The 1917, as beautiful as it is, looks like they overdid the detail, much like the most recent washington quarter hair.
Those of you who own an au or higher 1916 slq know just what I mean. You know!
veryfine - good discussion on the 16 SLQ. I agree with you in almost every respect.
I purchased my 1916 SLQ VF+ from Jay "the beard" years ago and it will be one of the last coins I ever part with. It is the cornerstone of my complete collection of SLQ's in VF+ condition.
<< <i>A picture of a 1916 & 1917 so can see the differences referenced anybody?
Really those differences don't seem that big to me.....
And it is still not the key coin of the 20th century..... >>
Does a tiny "s" mintmark on the back of Barber coin really make it any different from your average run of the mill date? Apparently it makes a world of difference. How about micro "o" 1892 halves. That really matters? A 1922 no "D" cent due to a manufacturing defect? Who cares. As you know, many collectors care. To you, the 1916 vs 1917 Type 1 differences are insignificant, but to others, they are dramatic.
<< <i>veryfine - good discussion on the 16 SLQ. I agree with you in almost every respect.
I purchased my 1916 SLQ VF+ from Jay "the beard" years ago and it will be one of the last coins I ever part with. It is the cornerstone of my complete collection of SLQ's in VF+ condition. >>
An excellent choice. Date set collectors love the high vfs because the date is sharp and the detail is pleasing. It is not cheap, but after that, completing a great looking set is much more affordable. The The 1916 in that grade is always in demand. As you probably know, the 23-s can be really tough with a full clear date but it's worth every penny. The 18/7-s overdate really adds the finishing touch to this fantastic set. Actually, I have never seen it in person but I know I would love to own one. You must admit, for such a short series, there is so much variety; 1916, 1917 T1, 1917-1924 T2, 1925-1930 T3 and a rare overdate!
<< <i> Shifting to SLQ's, the stumbling block for that series has been locating a true FH example of the overdate and the 27-S. I feel that the 27-S in FH is harder to locate than a MS 01-S and its sold at multiples of what a 01-S would bring. With regard to the 1916 FH's, these coins should be in a seperate type unto themselves. They are now lumped with the 1917 Ty 1's ( which usually have incredible FH's) and it does an injustice to the 1916.
Interesting thread, thanks for starting it. >>
Thanks. Discussing the nuances of collecting is a lot of fun. I realize this is not a discussion on physics where every statement can be backed up with scientific data. Who knows, maybe those ridiculously priced full bell line franklin halves will be the most desirable coins in history, forcing the values even higher. Let's face it. We collect what we like.
As to your point about the 27-s fh. Now you're talking rare, but I have a slight problem with that coin and its full head status. It is usually a miserably struck coin in general. I've seen photos of FH specimens but the rest of the coin still looks relatively weak. As exceptionally rare as it is with a full head, for that exorbitant price, I would want ALL details to be razor sharp or nearly so. If one does turn up, the buyer would have to be very wealthy. I'd take a 27-s with a near full head or half a head with adequate details. That's rare enough for me. So, in this particalar case, I'll part company with some of my standing liberty striking detail pals. Strike is an important issue for me, but not THAT important. If I could afford to start an uncircualted date/mintmark set of standing liberty quarters, I would get the less expensive dates with full heads and the elusive ones in 1/2 or better head detail. It would still look impressive, don't you agree? As for the rare 1918/7-s, I'd take any uncirculated example, even if liberty's head were completely missing! FH specimens of these dates are something to dream about. Has anyone ever held one of these?
Yes, I agree with you about the unique type status of the 1916 slq. I discussed the issue in an earlier part of this thread.
Welcome to the boards VeryFine ... excellent thread ... sorry I missed most of it until now, but made for a great read. You make a great case and point regardless of whether we agree with you, and your love for the coin is obvious (and I think appreciated by all of us) ... this kind of passion is what makes collecting great.
Since I also collect both, in Choice AU grades, I'll throw in my two bits ... which has already been covered I think, but these are my opinions.
The 1916 is the more noticable and main-stream desirable coin. It has an outstanding design, a great story, a super low mintage ... and ultimately enough available examples to keep it in front of the general collecting population. Even some non-collectors know a little about it. However it is not (in my opinion) even close to the most difficult Standing Liberty to find in Choice AU and above (although this may be partially due to the price tag they carry), and certainly not the most difficult regular issue, non-error silver coin of the 20th Century (not even in the top ten in my opinion (again, could be because of the price)). Not including the overdate or the 27s, I can think of at least three other coins in the SLQ series in Choice AU or better that you'd have a much harder time finding, even if you were willing to pay up to get them. They just aren't out there or they are not for sale ... and like Mike (MFH) (and others I think) stated, we could have all have the pick of several 1916's tommorow if we had the cash.
The 01s Quarter is a different animal altogether. It is only really noticable to the studied numismatist, does not have a great publicity story, and there are certainly not enough examples to be able to give it the hype it could have otherwise. Unless you apprecaite the design for what it is ... well, it isn't a Standing Lib' I think I know of at least five serious collectors who would raise the cash if a Choice AU or better 01s came around ... they've been ready for some time, and still are. Unfortunately, the very few coins that are extant just are not available.
This is true for several Barber Dimes, Quarters and Halves for the 20th Century, as well as a couple Walkers and a couple of other SLQ's ... they might come out if they were priced beyond the moon (compared to where they are now), but I doubt it. They have never been available in quantity at the Choice AU and above level like the 16 is and has been.
Anyway ... hope to see more of you around here
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
<< <i>Not including the overdate or the 27s, I can think of at least three other coins in the SLQ series in Choice AU or better that you'd have a much harder time finding, even if you were willing to pay up to get them. They just aren't out there or they are not for sale ... and like Mike (MFH) (and others I think) stated, we could have all have the pick of several 1916's tommorow if we had the cash. >>
Thanks Todd, Yes I agree with you and others that the 16 slq is much more available than a variey of other coins but considering that fact, it still carries a high price tag. Even if you go back 20 or even 40 years, it was among the highest price regular issue 20th centurey key dates. As many seem to be implying, wasn't it "always available" in any condition back then too? If so, was the price artificially high as some seem to be saying? Several other standing liberty quarters blow this date away with regards to rarity, but only with certain qualifications; au or above condition, full date or full head, complete rivets and so on. These issues matter more to date/mintmark collectors but the 16 slq transcends that category. If the 1916 slq were competing with a 1916-s slq or 1916-d slq with higher mintages, the value would be much much less. Think about another coin series, the Peace dollar for example. The first year 1921 is not rare by any stretch of the imagination. It is unique as a regular issue, being a one year high relief type but should this coin be worth over one hundred dollars in au? Using the Barber collector's logic, there are so many of them, I can buy dozens at any time in most grades. Now I realize, the price on this is comparitively low next to the 1916 slq, but shouldn't I be paying, oh I don't know, maybe $20 for this coin? Obviousy there are other issues adding to the desirability of this beautiful coin. Now considering all the intelligent commetary thus far concerning availability of the 1916 slq, what SHOULD we be paying for this date? The Barber collector's feel the price is way too high so let's offer all 1916's for 50% off the current retail price. They would still be worth thousands in the higher grades, but the supply might quickly dry up. What would happen to the "availability" and price then? Remember your history; only a few years ago, dealers had trouble keeping these coins in stock but the prices are high enough now where many are selling. This cyclical phenomenon will never permanently affect this great coin.
<< <i>It took to page 4 before somebody that collects both pipes in with comparative first hand experience.....
Surprising in some regards..... >>
Mike (MFH), also gave his impressions and comparisons, for both series. I can't think of anyone, more qualified than Mike, to talk about the collecting woes of BOTH series, SLQ's and Barbers.....just look at his registry sets.
You can't argue with the beauty of the SLQ series, but being a collector of Barber halves and quarters, I really appreciate that extra effort that goes into completing a set of choice, original Barbers.
I'm really enjoying this thread, keep it going......
Ok, we've talked about and hashed out the merits of the 1916 SLQ, now will the people who are more adept than I, post images of either the coins they own or images of coins they'd like to own ( I have to call upon my friend Dave99B to post my coin's image for me. )
JHF: Could you post the image of your MS 67FH for us...I think my heart can take it.
I have a photo of a PCGS 66FH hanging in my office, and it always brings a smile to my face when I see it.
As Dan F. said, this is a great thread, lets keep it going.
Mike Hayes ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
As difficult as this is to do, I am temporarily getting off my 1916 slq high horse to ask you a Barber coin question. Yes, I really do like Barber coins, but I don't want to wait 100 years to complete the quarter set and go broke doing it. How about the half dollars? I think Barber halves are a great value in grades fine and above. Is it realistic for me to complete a nicely matched fine-very fine Barber half set at this point in time? I tried it once before and I fell victim to the almost fine syndrome, which was my sad attempt at saying to myself, "a vg-10 looks good enough." I also settled for some coins with negative eye appeal and rim problems. Rim dings seem to plague Barber halves all too often. Then, there was the original vs cleaned issue, another difficult mountain to climb. Going to local shows is always disappointing when it comes to Barbers because I am a very picky collector who likes his coins to be problem-free.
While not fine condition, I am working on a Barber Half Set currently and have 35/73 so far, this after about 6 months of going to shows and shops looking for coins. Also going to Vegas, so that slowed up the cash flow as well, so have not been out for the last 2 months that much..... The coins are out there in all grades, but you need patience to put together a Barber Set.....
If I don't like the look of the coin I don't buy it, don't buy dinged rim coins or cleaned coins either.....
You talk about the 1921 Peace Dollar and that might be a fair comparison to the 1916 Quarter, in that it is expensive comparison wise to the rest of the set, it is a first year coin and the design is a bit different. The 1921 is however not THE key to the Peace Dollar set, but a key for the set. This coin is also not a seperate type by most people.....
Collection under construction: VG Barber Quarters & Halves
Tom and Tyler need to chime in on the halves (in VF - XF).
I think they will tell you they are do-able, with a lot of looking. A LOT OF LOOKING. And when it comes to the semi-keys and keys, expect to pay 2x - 3x times Greysheet for legit examples.
Dave
Always looking for original, better date VF20-VF35 Barber quarters and halves, and a quality beer.
While not fine condition, I am working on a Barber Half Set currently and have 35/73 so far, this after about 6 months of going to shows and shops looking for coins. Also going to Vegas, so that slowed up the cash flow as well, so have not been out for the last 2 months that much..... The coins are out there in all grades, but you need patience to put together a Barber Set.....
If I don't like the look of the coin I don't buy it, don't buy dinged rim coins or cleaned coins either.....
You talk about the 1921 Peace Dollar and that might be a fair comparison to the 1916 Quarter, in that it is expensive comparison wise to the rest of the set, it is a first year coin and the design is a bit different. The 1921 is however not THE key to the Peace Dollar set, but a key for the set. This coin is also not a seperate type by most people..... >>
Thanks for the Barber half information. Patience is the operative word. I made the 1921 Peace dollar comparison mainly because it is popular, always available, but relatively high priced. I am also aware that the 28 is THE key to a circulated set and the 25-s, 28-s and 34-s are among the key gem uncircualted examples. I would, however argue the point that the 21 Peace is not a separate type. The relief was dramatically lowered for all subsequent dates. If I had to choose one Peace dollar for a type set, it would be the 21. Ideally, I would choose two, with one labeled high relief and the other labeled low. You may be right that most don't consider it a separate type but they really should. A few other comparisons to the 1916: The high relief 1921 is a low mintage Philadelphia only issue, as is the 16 slq. There are no branch mint counterparts to these dates. They are also both from the same coin era, which would include Mercury dimes, Buffalo nickels and Walking Liberty halves. The Peace dollar is considered one of the more artistic achievements in american coin history as is the slq. Finally, the 1921 Peace dollar was quickly redesigned and so was the 1916 quarter.
<< <i>I think they will tell you they are do-able, with a lot of looking. A LOT OF LOOKING. And when it comes to the semi-keys and keys, expect to pay 2x - 3x times Greysheet for legit examples.
Dave >>
Yes, I would imagine I'd have to pay well for some of these. That 1901-s Barber quarter you pictured is exceptional. That would be the perfect look for my possible Barber half collection. What do you think is the best source for purchasing Barbers? Online auctions, shows, dealers inventory or all of the above?
<< <i>Why would you argue that the '21 Peace is not a seperate type but the '16 Quarter is?
High Relief vs Low Relief is a big difference.....
This does make the St Gauden's $20 into different types..... >>
Actually, I didn't make myself too clear in that line you quoted. I meant to say that that the 21 Peace IS a separate type because of its high relief characteristics. I thought that you didn't consider it a separate type so I was arguing against your point. If you continue reading that paragragh, it clarifies my point of view a little better.
You need to get in touch with Tyler Child in Utah. He always finds nice mid range Barber Halves and puts them up on ebay, under the name tchild2. Dave99B and Jim Dimmick can be of great help as well. Dan F. and Cary / Cratylus can keep their eyes peeled for you too. They both know their Barbers. Send me a PM and I'll give you a larger list of serious Barber collectors who may have duplicates in the grades you want.
A suggestion: Join the Barber Coin Collectors Society...(BCCS.ORG and download their application...$15.00 annual membership; I just rejoined myself).
Okay folks...where are the other 1916's ?? ( Thanks Dave99B, I knew I could count on you ! )
Mike Hayes ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
Yes I agree with you and others that the 16 slq is much more available than a variey of other coins but considering that fact, it still carries a high price tag. Even if you go back 20 or even 40 years, it was among the highest price regular issue 20th centurey key dates. As many seem to be implying, wasn't it "always available" in any condition back then too? If so, was the price artificially high as some seem to be saying?
I think the 1916 was always available for a price ... certainly it was in 1988 when I started collecting as an adult. However (IMO) because it had such a low mintage (number 2 in the 20th Century regular issue Copper, Nickel and Silver series) it gained a "key-date" status early. Many years ago, before the population reports and the shared information in places like these, mintages were sometimes a cornerstone way to determine rarity. Couple that rarity factor with the fact it is a type unto itself, and a beatiful and storied design to boot ... then turn that into some marketing; and a legend was born.
Of course, as it turns out, there are many cases where mintages do not work out well in determining either availablity or price. Yes, absolute rarity is absolute rarity, but only if you know exactly how many pieces are still extant. All of those melted, destroyed, defaced would have to be considered ... and I doubt that very many 1916's were ever discarded in any such way. Turning to the Barber Quarters again, I think that hundreds of thousands (maybe millions)of specific dates may have been melted, destroyed or defaced, especially in light of what 80+% of the VF and below Barbers were worth as collectables when silver went upwards of 40. an ounce.
Oh, and before I go ... you have to win my vote for the best post by a new member since I've been here! This is a great thread!!
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
<< <i>Thanks for the Barber half information. Patience is the operative word. >>
Veryfine,
It can help tremendously, if you're able to pick up a number of coins, in one shot. Occassionaly, a set of Barber halves, in the F-VF, or VF-XF range, may be broken up, and the coins sold individually. If the coins are top quality, original, and evenly matched in appearance, this would be an ideal opportunity to make a quick dent in your collection. Without the opportunity to pick up multiple coins, in a single shot, trying to complete a full, evenly matched set, in F-VF, from scratch, is going to take a very, very long time.
Veryfine, how old are you? You might want to consider this before you start the set, especially if you're as picky as you say you are.
When you look at the great, circulated, Barber half sets that are out there, Cary's, Tyler's, Randy Holder's, to name a few, I'm quite certain that they were all able to make substantial dents in their collections, by taking advantage of opportunities and acquiring multiple coins at a time. If I'm wrong about this and this isn't the case, then I'm even more impressed with their collections then I was before.
Either way, it's a long process and will require untold patience. How these guys found, 73, top notch coins, in basically the same circ grade, and so evenly matched in appearance, is beyond me. If I can complete my Barber half set, in VF-AU grades, in choice, and original condition, (forget evenly matched in appearace), I'll be quite happy with my accomplishments.
I'm going back to the states shortly. No promises as I'm not going to be there long. But I'll try to get to the safety deposit box and scan it.
And that's a lovely 1916 you have. There isn't much chatter on it, even on the leading edge of the eagle's right wing. And it looks like a nice full nipple. Congratulations!
Best wishes,
Just Having Fun
Jefferson nickels, Standing Libs, and US-Philippines rock
I assume you are going to get scans of more than one coin; I have your 19-S PCGS 67FH's image in my "virtual - collection". If that coin could tell stories ! Ho Boy ! I wish someone would post images of your entire set onto your PCGS Registry set for you, as well as your error SLQ's. It would be one of the most satisfying coin experiences of my collecting life !
Thanks for the nice complement on my 16. I resubmitted it when I did the pedigree designation last January, hoping for a 64FH; no dice.
MFH
Mike Hayes ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
<< <i>Without the opportunity to pick up multiple coins, in a single shot, trying to complete a full, evenly matched set, in F-VF, from scratch, is going to take a very, very long time. >>
Very Useful information. Thanks Dan.
I do have patience and I am certainly young enough but I am also considering other Barber options, such as: a Barber Type set with one very scarce coin from the Half, quarter and Dime. The high au grades are very attractive and I already have a pcgs au-58 Barber half that I've had it for quite some time. Any date suggestions for the dime and quarter? I'm considering affordable scarce dates, not monster coins like 1901-s quarters.
I was away for a few days, but back now to continue where I left off. Since I started this thread, I did not expect to be thrown into this hornet’s nest of Barber heads! I did predict that the 1901-s quarter would be the primary weapon used against the beloved 1916 standing liberty quarter. What I did not predict was the impressive knowledge and passion so many of you have in regards to the Barber coins. It is very encouraging for the hobby in general.
Instead of using provocative phrases like THE key or key of all keys or key to the 20th century kingdom or the greatest key since sliced bread, I will continue here with the reasons I love the 1916 slq and the date/mintmark series so much.
The main point collectors seem to be making is the availability of coins and the supply/demand issue. As I mentioned to Dan F in my previous comment, I own a very attractive 1893-s pcgs au-58 Barber half dollar. Barber collectors know this to be one of the more difficult coins to find at any given time. It is also much rarer than the 16 slq in that particular grade and every grade higher! Will it ever come close in popularity and price to the 16? I wish it would, because I own this coin and I like my coins to soar in value. Anything is possible, but it is not likely that it will ever approach the value of the16slq. The standing liberty quarter is unique on so many levels. The detail is so intricate that it demands a second look every time. In my opinion, it is really best appreciated in the high au grades and above. The 1916 in particular, has such lightly impressed details that the slightest amount of wear obliterates the central shield detail. Unlike the Barber coins, it is not the most practical coin design. The argument that more Barbers were melted and probably not as many 1916 standing quarters might be true, but in the lower circulated grades, pre-1925 standing quarters often have no date. This limits the availability of decent looking coins for them as well. Barber coins in the grade of “good” have clear dates and even ag grades have readable dates. Have you seen an ag-g standing liberty? I think you get the idea. I particularly like the 16 because it breaks the rules. Isn’t it rather unusual that a Philadelphia introductory coin should have such a low mintage? I have also always liked its lone position as a date in that series. There are no branch mint issues competing with it. A date is more important to me than its mint origin, but that’s just me. It is also a date of mystery. There is plenty of information theorizing design changes from 17 type 1 to 17 type 2 but I have not seen anything on the changes from 16 to 17 type 1. I assume the change was partially a result of the 16 being too mushy in detail but why change the hairstyle and shield design? If you have been reading this thread, I have stated the other reasons I love this coin so I won’t repeat myself here. Let me sum up by saying that so many factors add to the value of a particular coin. There is a strong psychological element that is not easily defined or measured. It is not always fair or logical, but is a driving force in the hobby and always will be.
<< <i>I do have patience and I am certainly young enough but I am also considering other Barber options, such as: a Barber Type set with one very scarce coin from the Half, quarter and Dime. The high au grades are very attractive and I already have a pcgs au-58 Barber half that I've had it for quite some time. Any date suggestions for the dime and quarter? I'm considering affordable scarce dates, not monster coins like 1901-s quarters. >>
You certainly have a great start to your Barber type set, in AU. The 1893-s Barber half, in AU-58, certified by PCGS, is an excellent acquisition. That coin is on alot of Barber Half collector's, want list. The AU grades in general, for any of the Barber series, seems to be a very attractive grade for collectors. You can get the look of a nice MS-62/63 coin, but at a price that is usually much more affordable.
The 1901-s, is a nice choice for the Barber dime in your type set. It has a low mintage, has strong demand, and a nice, certified AU, will probably go for under $700.00, (a couple of months back, HLRC had a nice, 1901-s dime, graded AU-58 by NGC, that he was selling for around $650.00).
As far as the Barber quarter, you have a multitude to choose from. Ignoring the 1896-s, 1901-s, and 1913-s, there are least 10 really good dates to use for your Barber type set, in AU. I'll give 5 tough one's off the top of my head, the 1897-o, 1897-s, 1901-o, 1909-o, and the 1914-s. The 1909-o in AU, rivals the 1901-s in scarcity, for this grade. So as you can see, even a nice type set could be challenging, depending on what date's you're using and in what grade.
Any date suggestions for the dime and quarter? I'm considering affordable scarce dates, not monster coins like 1901-s quarters.
I'd look for nice 1912-S quarter. Much tougher than you would expect in XF or AU. I had to search for a long time to find an acceptable VF example for my set.
Dave
Always looking for original, better date VF20-VF35 Barber quarters and halves, and a quality beer.
Yes Dan and Dave, I can quickly see how difficult it is to find ANY of those dates, unless I settle for a heavily circulated type set. But since I already have the beautiful 93-s half in au-58, the dime and quarter need to match its quality. I will keep my eyes open. Thanks for the suggestions.
Aside from my favorite coin, the standing liberty quarter, with my favorite date, the 1916, I can see how much fun the Barber series can be.
Barber quarter collectors with complete sets f-12 through au-58 clearly have something special. I wouldn't dare attempt a complete date/mintmark set of that series. For me, it's a lesson in futility. Maybe if I tried 20 years ago when the prices were lower, but I can only take so much frustration. My goal of completing a Barber 3 coin scarce date type set is a comfortable compromise.
I could be wrong, but I'm starting to think you have serious "closet" Barber-tendencies. >>
You could be right, but the entire world loves standing liberty quarters and they aren't hiding in closets!
I've always liked the Barber series but I also like to be realistic. A complete date only set of quarters is a possibility but I'd sooner go for a complete date/mintmark set of dimes or halves before I do that. The type set with tough dates seems like the best way to go.
Well, when you want a real challenge, you'll come crawling back to the quarters...mark my words. And it won't be for any type set (yawn) interest either......trust me!
You are close to falling into the abyss already --- I can tell. Be careful.
Dave
Always looking for original, better date VF20-VF35 Barber quarters and halves, and a quality beer.
<< <i>Well, when you want a real challenge, you'll come crawling back to the quarters...mark my words. And it won't be for any type set (yawn) interest either......trust me!
You are close to falling into the abyss already --- I can tell. Be careful. >>
If I win the lottery, sell a few Rolex watches and give up that second yacht, I'll sit back and relax in my coin room. The coin room would be situated on the 10th floor of my mansion. At this point, I'll fetch my servants and order them to piece together a nicely matched undamaged, uncleaned Barber quarter set in au-55 or 58 within a 10 year period or they'll be fired!
Comments
I think your key point -- that the 1916 is a separate variety from the 1917 bare breasted coins -- is getting overlooked in the heat over the relative values of the 1916 compared with the 1901-S.
The difference between the 1916 and the 1917 bare breasted coins is so strong that if you look at just the reverse of the four bare-breasted coins, you'll easily be able to pick out the 1916.
And even though the 1901-S is more expensive, I agree that the 1916 is the more interesting coin, both ...
-- for the political message it was meant to deliver: (the shield as a warning to Germany that Liberty would defend itself, and the bare breast as a symbol of peace and nurturing: the hard and the soft) ...
-- the beauty of the design ...
-- and the story (perhaps true, perhaps not) of why the design was changed
-- and because it's a true one-year type coin.
If all one was interested in was value, then certainly the overdate Standing Liberty trumps both the 1916 and the 1901-S as the most valuable 20th century quarter. And the overdate is also a very interesting coin to look in its own right. That overdate leeeeeeeeeeaps out at you.
Best wishes with your collecting,
Just Having Fun
Key?
Obviously not reality, at least in my world....
Dave
<< <i>Sorry, but his key point was "1916 Standing Liberty quarter is THE 20th century key!".
Key?
Obviously not reality, at least in my world....
Dave >>
In my opinion, the 1916 slq is THE key of all 20th century coins, with the exception of gold. OK, how about KING of all 20th century coins. Does that sit well with you?
The 1901-s Barber quarter is THE key of all Barber coins.
Dave
<< <i>Welcome Very Fine and your post is very fine indeed.
I think your key point -- that the 1916 is a separate variety from the 1917 bare breasted coins -- is getting overlooked in the heat over the relative values of the 1916 compared with the 1901-S. >>
Thanks Just Having Fun.
Excellent respponse, but I would like to elaborate a bit more on the differences.
1) The 1916 head of liberty has less detail with very delicate lines of hair. The 1917 has braided hair separating the face from hair. The 1917 original hair detail is much stronger in every way. The 1917 has two clearly defined strands of hair projecting from the back of Liberty's head. The head also cuts into the beaded coin border on the 1916.
2) The shield differences are like night and day. The central part of the 1916 shield is shorter and shaped differently. On the 1916 the beads at the perimeter of the shield rim are not sharp. On the 1917, one notes a very sharply defined ring of beads. Even on very low grade specimens, I can quickly differentiate a 16 from 17 because of the bead detail. On well worn coins, the upper right part of the shield usually shows some detail and the differences are still obvious. The appearance of the 1916 sheild make it look more convex and sculptural. The 1917 has a sharp, flat, and etched out appearance.
3)The gown near the foot is different since it touches that area differently on each issue.
4) The 1916 has soft blurry stars whereas the 1917 is extremely sharp in that area.
5)Overall, the 1917 obverse is much sharper in every detail
These differences are more dramatic when comparing uncircualted specimens but standing liberty lovers can tell a mile away even on dateless coins. Keep in mind that the differences have less to do with strike and more to do with original sculpted detail.
Even though the 1917 has a much more sharply designed hub, the 1916, in my opinion looks more beautiful. Artistically speaking, a full-head 1916 has a simpler, more elegant look to it. The 1917, as beautiful as it is, looks like they overdid the detail, much like the most recent washington quarter hair.
Those of you who own an au or higher 1916 slq know just what I mean. You know!
Dave
I purchased my 1916 SLQ VF+ from Jay "the beard" years ago and it will be one of the last coins I ever part with. It is the cornerstone of my complete collection of SLQ's in VF+ condition.
Really those differences don't seem that big to me.....
And it is still not the key coin of the 20th century.....
<< <i>A picture of a 1916 & 1917 so can see the differences referenced anybody?
Really those differences don't seem that big to me.....
And it is still not the key coin of the 20th century..... >>
Does a tiny "s" mintmark on the back of Barber coin really make it any different from your average run of the mill date? Apparently it makes a world of difference. How about micro "o" 1892 halves. That really matters? A 1922 no "D" cent due to a manufacturing defect? Who cares. As you know, many collectors care. To you, the 1916 vs 1917 Type 1 differences are insignificant, but to others, they are dramatic.
<< <i>veryfine - good discussion on the 16 SLQ. I agree with you in almost every respect.
I purchased my 1916 SLQ VF+ from Jay "the beard" years ago and it will be one of the last coins I ever part with. It is the cornerstone of my complete collection of SLQ's in VF+ condition. >>
An excellent choice. Date set collectors love the high vfs because the date is sharp and the detail is pleasing. It is not cheap, but after that, completing a great looking set is much more affordable. The The 1916 in that grade is always in demand. As you probably know, the 23-s can be really tough with a full clear date but it's worth every penny. The 18/7-s overdate really adds the finishing touch to this fantastic set. Actually, I have never seen it in person but I know I would love to own one.
You must admit, for such a short series, there is so much variety; 1916, 1917 T1, 1917-1924 T2, 1925-1930 T3 and a rare overdate!
<< <i> Shifting to SLQ's, the stumbling block for that series has been locating a true FH example of the overdate and the 27-S. I feel that the 27-S in FH is harder to locate than a MS 01-S and its sold at multiples of what a 01-S would bring. With regard to the 1916 FH's, these coins should be in a seperate type unto themselves. They are now lumped with the 1917 Ty 1's ( which usually have incredible FH's) and it does an injustice to the 1916.
Interesting thread, thanks for starting it. >>
Thanks. Discussing the nuances of collecting is a lot of fun. I realize this is not a discussion on physics where every statement can be backed up with scientific data. Who knows, maybe those ridiculously priced full bell line franklin halves will be the most desirable coins in history, forcing the values even higher. Let's face it. We collect what we like.
As to your point about the 27-s fh. Now you're talking rare, but I have a slight problem with that coin and its full head status. It is usually a miserably struck coin in general. I've seen photos of FH specimens but the rest of the coin still looks relatively weak. As exceptionally rare as it is with a full head, for that exorbitant price, I would want ALL details to be razor sharp or nearly so. If one does turn up, the buyer would have to be very wealthy. I'd take a 27-s with a near full head or half a head with adequate details. That's rare enough for me. So, in this particalar case, I'll part company with some of my standing liberty striking detail pals. Strike is an important issue for me, but not THAT important. If I could afford to start an uncircualted date/mintmark set of standing liberty quarters, I would get the less expensive dates with full heads and the elusive ones in 1/2 or better head detail. It would still look impressive, don't you agree? As for the rare 1918/7-s, I'd take any uncirculated example, even if liberty's head were completely missing! FH specimens of these dates are something to dream about. Has anyone ever held one of these?
Yes, I agree with you about the unique type status of the 1916 slq. I discussed the issue in an earlier part of this thread.
Since I also collect both, in Choice AU grades, I'll throw in my two bits
The 1916 is the more noticable and main-stream desirable coin. It has an outstanding design, a great story, a super low mintage ... and ultimately enough available examples to keep it in front of the general collecting population. Even some non-collectors know a little about it. However it is not (in my opinion) even close to the most difficult Standing Liberty to find in Choice AU and above (although this may be partially due to the price tag they carry), and certainly not the most difficult regular issue, non-error silver coin of the 20th Century (not even in the top ten in my opinion (again, could be because of the price)). Not including the overdate or the 27s, I can think of at least three other coins in the SLQ series in Choice AU or better that you'd have a much harder time finding, even if you were willing to pay up to get them. They just aren't out there or they are not for sale ... and like Mike (MFH) (and others I think) stated, we could have all have the pick of several 1916's tommorow if we had the cash.
The 01s Quarter is a different animal altogether. It is only really noticable to the studied numismatist, does not have a great publicity story, and there are certainly not enough examples to be able to give it the hype it could have otherwise. Unless you apprecaite the design for what it is ... well, it isn't a Standing Lib'
This is true for several Barber Dimes, Quarters and Halves for the 20th Century, as well as a couple Walkers and a couple of other SLQ's ... they might come out if they were priced beyond the moon (compared to where they are now), but I doubt it. They have never been available in quantity at the Choice AU and above level like the 16 is and has been.
Anyway ... hope to see more of you around here
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
Surprising in some regards.....
<< <i>Not including the overdate or the 27s, I can think of at least three other coins in the SLQ series in Choice AU or better that you'd have a much harder time finding, even if you were willing to pay up to get them. They just aren't out there or they are not for sale ... and like Mike (MFH) (and others I think) stated, we could have all have the pick of several 1916's tommorow if we had the cash. >>
Thanks Todd,
Yes I agree with you and others that the 16 slq is much more available than a variey of other coins but considering that fact, it still carries a high price tag. Even if you go back 20 or even 40 years, it was among the highest price regular issue 20th centurey key dates. As many seem to be implying, wasn't it "always available" in any condition back then too? If so, was the price artificially high as some seem to be saying? Several other standing liberty quarters blow this date away with regards to rarity, but only with certain qualifications; au or above condition, full date or full head, complete rivets and so on. These issues matter more to date/mintmark collectors but the 16 slq transcends that category. If the 1916 slq were competing with a 1916-s slq or 1916-d slq with higher mintages, the value would be much much less.
Think about another coin series, the Peace dollar for example. The first year 1921 is not rare by any stretch of the imagination. It is unique as a regular issue, being a one year high relief type but should this coin be worth over one hundred dollars in au? Using the Barber collector's logic, there are so many of them, I can buy dozens at any time in most grades. Now I realize, the price on this is comparitively low next to the 1916 slq, but shouldn't I be paying, oh I don't know, maybe $20 for this coin? Obviousy there are other issues adding to the desirability of this beautiful coin.
Now considering all the intelligent commetary thus far concerning availability of the 1916 slq, what SHOULD we be paying for this date?
The Barber collector's feel the price is way too high so let's offer all 1916's for 50% off the current retail price. They would still be worth thousands in the higher grades, but the supply might quickly dry up. What would happen to the "availability" and price then? Remember your history; only a few years ago, dealers had trouble keeping these coins in stock but the prices are high enough now where many are selling. This cyclical phenomenon will never permanently affect this great coin.
<< <i>It took to page 4 before somebody that collects both pipes in with comparative first hand experience.....
Surprising in some regards..... >>
Mike (MFH), also gave his impressions and comparisons, for both series. I can't think of anyone, more qualified than Mike, to talk about the collecting woes of BOTH series, SLQ's and Barbers.....just look at his registry sets.
You can't argue with the beauty of the SLQ series, but being a collector of Barber halves and quarters, I really appreciate that extra effort that goes into completing a set of choice, original Barbers.
I'm really enjoying this thread, keep it going......
Connor Numismatics Website
JHF: Could you post the image of your MS 67FH for us...I think my heart can take it.
I have a photo of a PCGS 66FH hanging in my office, and it always brings a smile to my face when I see it.
As Dan F. said, this is a great thread, lets keep it going.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
As difficult as this is to do, I am temporarily getting off my 1916 slq high horse to ask you a Barber coin question. Yes, I really do like Barber coins, but I don't want to wait 100 years to complete the quarter set and go broke doing it. How about the half dollars? I think Barber halves are a great value in grades fine and above. Is it realistic for me to complete a nicely matched fine-very fine Barber half set at this point in time? I tried it once before and I fell victim to the almost fine syndrome, which was my sad attempt at saying to myself, "a vg-10 looks good enough." I also settled for some coins with negative eye appeal and rim problems. Rim dings seem to plague Barber halves all too often. Then, there was the original vs cleaned issue, another difficult mountain to climb. Going to local shows is always disappointing when it comes to Barbers because I am a very picky collector who likes his coins to be problem-free.
What are your thoughts?
While not fine condition, I am working on a Barber Half Set currently and have 35/73 so far, this after about 6 months of going to shows and shops looking for coins. Also going to Vegas, so that slowed up the cash flow as well, so have not been out for the last 2 months that much..... The coins are out there in all grades, but you need patience to put together a Barber Set.....
If I don't like the look of the coin I don't buy it, don't buy dinged rim coins or cleaned coins either.....
You talk about the 1921 Peace Dollar and that might be a fair comparison to the 1916 Quarter, in that it is expensive comparison wise to the rest of the set, it is a first year coin and the design is a bit different. The 1921 is however not THE key to the Peace Dollar set, but a key for the set. This coin is also not a seperate type by most people.....
Dave
I think they will tell you they are do-able, with a lot of looking. A LOT OF LOOKING. And when it comes to the semi-keys and keys, expect to pay 2x - 3x times Greysheet for legit examples.
Dave
<< <i>veryfine,
While not fine condition, I am working on a Barber Half Set currently and have 35/73 so far, this after about 6 months of going to shows and shops looking for coins. Also going to Vegas, so that slowed up the cash flow as well, so have not been out for the last 2 months that much..... The coins are out there in all grades, but you need patience to put together a Barber Set.....
If I don't like the look of the coin I don't buy it, don't buy dinged rim coins or cleaned coins either.....
You talk about the 1921 Peace Dollar and that might be a fair comparison to the 1916 Quarter, in that it is expensive comparison wise to the rest of the set, it is a first year coin and the design is a bit different. The 1921 is however not THE key to the Peace Dollar set, but a key for the set. This coin is also not a seperate type by most people..... >>
Thanks for the Barber half information. Patience is the operative word.
I made the 1921 Peace dollar comparison mainly because it is popular, always available, but relatively high priced. I am also aware that the 28 is THE key to a circulated set and the 25-s, 28-s and 34-s are among the key gem uncircualted examples. I would, however argue the point that the 21 Peace is not a separate type. The relief was dramatically lowered for all subsequent dates. If I had to choose one Peace dollar for a type set, it would be the 21. Ideally, I would choose two, with one labeled high relief and the other labeled low. You may be right that most don't consider it a separate type but they really should.
A few other comparisons to the 1916: The high relief 1921 is a low mintage Philadelphia only issue, as is the 16 slq. There are no branch mint counterparts to these dates. They are also both from the same coin era, which would include Mercury dimes, Buffalo nickels and Walking Liberty halves. The Peace dollar is considered one of the more artistic achievements in american coin history as is the slq. Finally, the 1921 Peace dollar was quickly redesigned and so was the 1916 quarter.
<< <i>I think they will tell you they are do-able, with a lot of looking. A LOT OF LOOKING. And when it comes to the semi-keys and keys, expect to pay 2x - 3x times Greysheet for legit examples.
Dave >>
Yes, I would imagine I'd have to pay well for some of these. That 1901-s Barber quarter you pictured is exceptional. That would be the perfect look for my possible Barber half collection. What do you think is the best source for purchasing Barbers? Online auctions, shows, dealers inventory or all of the above?
High Relief vs Low Relief is a big difference.....
This does make the St Gauden's $20 into different types.....
<< <i>Why would you argue that the '21 Peace is not a seperate type but the '16 Quarter is?
High Relief vs Low Relief is a big difference.....
This does make the St Gauden's $20 into different types..... >>
Actually, I didn't make myself too clear in that line you quoted. I meant to say that that the 21 Peace IS a separate type because of its high relief characteristics. I thought that you didn't consider it a separate type so I was arguing against your point. If you continue reading that paragragh, it clarifies my point of view a little better.
Veryfine:
You need to get in touch with Tyler Child in Utah. He always finds nice mid range Barber Halves and puts them up on ebay, under the name tchild2. Dave99B and Jim Dimmick can be of great help as well. Dan F. and Cary / Cratylus can keep their eyes peeled for you too. They both know their Barbers. Send me a PM and I'll give you a larger list of serious Barber collectors who may have duplicates in the grades you want.
A suggestion: Join the Barber Coin Collectors Society...(BCCS.ORG and download their application...$15.00 annual membership; I just rejoined myself).
Okay folks...where are the other 1916's ?? ( Thanks Dave99B, I knew I could count on you ! )
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
Sounds like very useful information. When I am ready to pursue the Barber half series, I'll have this as a reliable reference.
Much appreciated.
I think the 1916 was always available for a price ... certainly it was in 1988 when I started collecting as an adult. However (IMO) because it had such a low mintage (number 2 in the 20th Century regular issue Copper, Nickel and Silver series) it gained a "key-date" status early. Many years ago, before the population reports and the shared information in places like these, mintages were sometimes a cornerstone way to determine rarity. Couple that rarity factor with the fact it is a type unto itself, and a beatiful and storied design to boot ... then turn that into some marketing; and a legend was born.
Of course, as it turns out, there are many cases where mintages do not work out well in determining either availablity or price. Yes, absolute rarity is absolute rarity, but only if you know exactly how many pieces are still extant. All of those melted, destroyed, defaced would have to be considered ... and I doubt that very many 1916's were ever discarded in any such way. Turning to the Barber Quarters again, I think that hundreds of thousands (maybe millions)of specific dates may have been melted, destroyed or defaced, especially in light of what 80+% of the VF and below Barbers were worth as collectables when silver went upwards of 40. an ounce.
Oh, and before I go ... you have to win my vote for the best post by a new member since I've been here! This is a great thread!!
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
<< <i>Thanks for the Barber half information. Patience is the operative word. >>
Veryfine,
It can help tremendously, if you're able to pick up a number of coins, in one shot. Occassionaly, a set of Barber halves, in the F-VF, or VF-XF range, may be broken up, and the coins sold individually. If the coins are top quality, original, and evenly matched in appearance, this would be an ideal opportunity to make a quick dent in your collection. Without the opportunity to pick up multiple coins, in a single shot, trying to complete a full, evenly matched set, in F-VF, from scratch, is going to take a very, very long time.
Veryfine, how old are you? You might want to consider this before you start the set, especially if you're as picky as you say you are.
When you look at the great, circulated, Barber half sets that are out there, Cary's, Tyler's, Randy Holder's, to name a few, I'm quite certain that they were all able to make substantial dents in their collections, by taking advantage of opportunities and acquiring multiple coins at a time. If I'm wrong about this and this isn't the case, then I'm even more impressed with their collections then I was before.
Either way, it's a long process and will require untold patience. How these guys found, 73, top notch coins, in basically the same circ grade, and so evenly matched in appearance, is beyond me. If I can complete my Barber half set, in VF-AU grades, in choice, and original condition, (forget evenly matched in appearace), I'll be quite happy with my accomplishments.
Connor Numismatics Website
I'm going back to the states shortly. No promises as I'm not going to be there long. But I'll try to get to the safety deposit box and scan it.
And that's a lovely 1916 you have. There isn't much chatter on it, even on the leading edge of the eagle's right wing. And it looks like a nice full nipple. Congratulations!
Best wishes,
Just Having Fun
I assume you are going to get scans of more than one coin; I have your 19-S PCGS 67FH's image in my "virtual - collection". If that coin could tell stories ! Ho Boy ! I wish someone would post images of your entire set onto your PCGS Registry set for you, as well as your error SLQ's. It would be one of the most satisfying coin experiences of my collecting life !
Thanks for the nice complement on my 16. I resubmitted it when I did the pedigree designation last January, hoping for a 64FH; no dice.
MFH
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
<< <i>Without the opportunity to pick up multiple coins, in a single shot, trying to complete a full, evenly matched set, in F-VF, from scratch, is going to take a very, very long time. >>
Very Useful information. Thanks Dan.
I do have patience and I am certainly young enough but I am also considering other Barber options, such as: a Barber Type set with one very scarce coin from the Half, quarter and Dime. The high au grades are very attractive and I already have a pcgs au-58 Barber half that I've had it for quite some time. Any date suggestions for the dime and quarter? I'm considering affordable scarce dates, not monster coins like 1901-s quarters.
Instead of using provocative phrases like THE key or key of all keys or key to the 20th century kingdom or the greatest key since sliced bread, I will continue here with the reasons I love the 1916 slq and the date/mintmark series so much.
The main point collectors seem to be making is the availability of coins and the supply/demand issue. As I mentioned to Dan F in my previous comment, I own a very attractive 1893-s pcgs au-58 Barber half dollar. Barber collectors know this to be one of the more difficult coins to find at any given time. It is also much rarer than the 16 slq in that particular grade and every grade higher! Will it ever come close in popularity and price to the 16? I wish it would, because I own this coin and I like my coins to soar in value. Anything is possible, but it is not likely that it will ever approach the value of the16slq.
The standing liberty quarter is unique on so many levels. The detail is so intricate that it demands a second look every time. In my opinion, it is really best appreciated in the high au grades and above. The 1916 in particular, has such lightly impressed details that the slightest amount of wear obliterates the central shield detail. Unlike the Barber coins, it is not the most practical coin design. The argument that more Barbers were melted and probably not as many 1916 standing quarters might be true, but in the lower circulated grades, pre-1925 standing quarters often have no date. This limits the availability of decent looking coins for them as well. Barber coins in the grade of “good” have clear dates and even ag grades have readable dates. Have you seen an ag-g standing liberty? I think you get the idea.
I particularly like the 16 because it breaks the rules. Isn’t it rather unusual that a Philadelphia introductory coin should have such a low mintage? I have also always liked its lone position as a date in that series. There are no branch mint issues competing with it. A date is more important to me than its mint origin, but that’s just me. It is also a date of mystery. There is plenty of information theorizing design changes from 17 type 1 to 17 type 2 but I have not seen anything on the changes from 16 to 17 type 1. I assume the change was partially a result of the 16 being too mushy in detail but why change the hairstyle and shield design? If you have been reading this thread, I have stated the other reasons I love this coin so I won’t repeat myself here.
Let me sum up by saying that so many factors add to the value of a particular coin. There is a strong psychological element that is not easily defined or measured. It is not always fair or logical, but is a driving force in the hobby and always will be.
<< <i>I do have patience and I am certainly young enough but I am also considering other Barber options, such as: a Barber Type set with one very scarce coin from the Half, quarter and Dime. The high au grades are very attractive and I already have a pcgs au-58 Barber half that I've had it for quite some time. Any date suggestions for the dime and quarter? I'm considering affordable scarce dates, not monster coins like 1901-s quarters. >>
You certainly have a great start to your Barber type set, in AU. The 1893-s Barber half, in AU-58, certified by PCGS, is an excellent acquisition. That coin is on alot of Barber Half collector's, want list. The AU grades in general, for any of the Barber series, seems to be a very attractive grade for collectors. You can get the look of a nice MS-62/63 coin, but at a price that is usually much more affordable.
The 1901-s, is a nice choice for the Barber dime in your type set. It has a low mintage, has strong demand, and a nice, certified AU, will probably go for under $700.00, (a couple of months back, HLRC had a nice, 1901-s dime, graded AU-58 by NGC, that he was selling for around $650.00).
As far as the Barber quarter, you have a multitude to choose from. Ignoring the 1896-s, 1901-s, and 1913-s, there are least 10 really good dates to use for your Barber type set, in AU. I'll give 5 tough one's off the top of my head, the 1897-o, 1897-s, 1901-o, 1909-o, and the 1914-s. The 1909-o in AU, rivals the 1901-s in scarcity, for this grade. So as you can see, even a nice type set could be challenging, depending on what date's you're using and in what grade.
Good luck with your Barbers!
Connor Numismatics Website
I'd look for nice 1912-S quarter. Much tougher than you would expect in XF or AU. I had to search for a long time to find an acceptable VF example for my set.
Dave
Aside from my favorite coin, the standing liberty quarter, with my favorite date, the 1916, I can see how much fun the Barber series can be.
Barber quarter collectors with complete sets f-12 through au-58 clearly have something special. I wouldn't dare attempt a complete date/mintmark set of that series. For me, it's a lesson in futility. Maybe if I tried 20 years ago when the prices were lower, but I can only take so much frustration. My goal of completing a Barber 3 coin scarce date type set is a comfortable compromise.
I could be wrong, but I'm starting to think you have serious "closet" Barber-tendencies.
Dave
<< <i>Veryfine -
I could be wrong, but I'm starting to think you have serious "closet" Barber-tendencies.
You could be right, but the entire world loves standing liberty quarters and they aren't hiding in closets!
I've always liked the Barber series but I also like to be realistic. A complete date only set of quarters is a possibility but I'd sooner go for a complete date/mintmark set of dimes or halves before I do that.
The type set with tough dates seems like the best way to go.
You are close to falling into the abyss already --- I can tell. Be careful.
Dave
<< <i>Well, when you want a real challenge, you'll come crawling back to the quarters...mark my words. And it won't be for any type set (yawn) interest either......trust me!
You are close to falling into the abyss already --- I can tell. Be careful. >>
If I win the lottery, sell a few Rolex watches and give up that second yacht, I'll sit back and relax in my coin room. The coin room would be situated on the 10th floor of my mansion. At this point, I'll fetch my servants and order them to piece together a nicely matched undamaged, uncleaned Barber quarter set in au-55 or 58 within a 10 year period or they'll be fired!
Oh well, I guess I have to find some new help!