I'm Back and VERY Disappointed

RKKay · March 3, 2004 12:49AM

Lakesamman's question on the Q&A Board:

There was a thread recently which contained some good suggestions for a pattern registry. Can you tell us if any progress is being made for a PCGS registry, what it will contain and when we might see it?? Thanks.

David's response:

Maybe this year. Territorial gold and Colonials will come first.

JrGMan2004 · March 3, 2004 12:51AM

Welcome back Rick!!!

jbsteven · March 3, 2004 12:57AM

I read that and thought of you. bummer

kieferscoins · March 3, 2004 12:59AM

I asked a sample slab question this week and it wasn't even answered.

Cameron Kiefer

kranky · March 3, 2004 1:17AM

Rick, welcome back.

Don't you think it would be difficult to set up a pattern registry set? The vast majority of patterns have very few examples existing, so how do you determine what should go in a set? And if you do it by type, how would that be defined?

I'm not saying it's a bad idea, I just don't see how the items in the set would be determined.

cosmicdebris · March 3, 2004 1:29AM

Welcome back Rick. As for the pattern registry, it should have been done ages ago.

coinlieutenant · March 3, 2004 1:37AM

Patterns smatterns...

Merc · March 3, 2004 1:41AM

Patterns are too rare to be a registry set. Plus some are rare but have been damaged so they cannot be slabbed by PCGS.

boiler78 · March 3, 2004 3:32AM

At first glance the idea of a pattern registry seems like a daunting task but in reality it would not be all that difficult. PCGS has already assigned unique coin numbers for every coin in the Judd book so the next step would be to weight the individual coins. I would suggest simply using the rarity numbers assigned in the new Judd book. PCGS could even add a bonus point for rb/rd/cam/dcam.

The first set could be the complete set even though it is impossible to ever complete, it would allow every pattern collector the opportunity to list their collection and see where they stack up against their peers.

Once the PCGS system is programmed with the individual coin numbers and weighting the subsets could "evolve" over time. Andy Lustig pointed out some possible sets in this thread on the set registry forum. link

This doesn't require a lot of thought but the data entry would require a lot of time. IMHO

RKKay · March 3, 2004 5:07AM

I agree with Boiler. Check out Mr Eureka's ideas for possible sets. It's more difficult than most registries, but by no means impossible.

coinlieutenant · March 3, 2004 5:16AM

Patterns are for wimps!!!!!

wondercoin · March 3, 2004 5:16AM

Rick: Where were you for the past couple weeks? And, check your PM's

PCGS is very busy with EVERYONES requests. For example, it would be even easier to create the global 1932-1998 Wash quarter collection (combining the currently existing clad and silver Registry sets into one series - just like they already did with Jeff nickels). I believe there is/will be strong demand for the global Wash quarter collection. I hope PCGS takes care of this soon as well.

No question though that the demand for pattern registries is PASSIONATE in nature. We love our patterns

Wondercoin

coinlieutenant · March 3, 2004 6:14AM

Cant believe Rick (or Mark) has retorted. I expected a smack down from the 'old' pattern collectors...

You're using the old silent treatment huh? I see how it is....

MrEureka · March 3, 2004 6:37AM

Don't you think it would be difficult to set up a pattern registry set?

Yes, it would be a difficult job for PCGS. On the other hand, I could easily do it in a couple of days. Yes, HRH, that IS an offer!

RKKay · March 3, 2004 8:34AM

Cant believe Rick (or Mark) has retorted. I expected a smack down from the 'old' pattern collectors...

I know how it is with you gold guys. Too good for us lowly off metal collectors.

And what do you mean by "old," you young whipersnapper?

boiler78 · March 3, 2004 10:55AM

John- I guess we are just too "old" to be confrontational?

I would like to see PCGS focus attention on areas where virtually no registry sets exist before they spend their valuable time tweaking a series that already has substantial coverage.

I realize David and the rest of the fine folks at PCGS are up to their eyeballs in alligators. Why not take advantage of Andy Lustigs generous offer? Who is better qualified to work this project and make recommendations?

Robgetty · March 3, 2004 10:59AM

I would think that a pattern registry would be very difficult, but what the
heck. Anyone who has enough $$ to collect patterns deserves a place
to display the set!

boiler78 · March 3, 2004 8:19PM

Robgetty- It can't be all that difficult when one of the leading pattern experts in the country has volunteered to do the work and believes it can be done in a couple of days.

Seems like a no brainer for PCGS. I am surprised they haven't jumped on Andys offer.

RKKay · March 4, 2004 12:45AM

Again, Boiler is right. If Andy has made the offer, HRH would be crazy not to take him up on it. It would make a lot of his customers happy and wouldn't cost a thing. And, it would be done right.

coinlieutenant · March 4, 2004 1:56AM

Now that I got some attention I will respond seriously...

I agree that there should be some sort of registry for patterns. Seems fairly simple to do and if Andy volunteered...

Btw, Rick... I apologize about the old thing. You arent old. Mark is a different story......

RKKay · March 4, 2004 2:06AM

Btw, Rick... I apologize about the old thing. You arent old. Mark is a different story......

Now that makes sense.

Mark · March 4, 2004 5:01AM

Go Andy, go Andy, go Andy!!!!

More seriously, patterns would be a fun set to have on the registry, especially if collectors add pictures. A true treat of patterns is seeing what could have been. I think the more collectors that see that, the more collectors there will be of patterns...which is not necessarily a good thing.

One set I'd truly like to see is a complete set of standard silver. I'd be very interested in seeing the number of of these patterns that specific collectors have accumulated.

Mark

gemtone65 · March 4, 2004 6:47AM

It seems a shame that Patterns cannot get the same benefit as modern coins because they are too rare! We have fingerprinted 1963 cents selling for more than an Amazonian dollar simply because of the registry craze. Let's hope PCGS gives an assist to classic coins such as patterns and adds them to the registry.

To supplement Andy's excellent starting list of pattern sets, how about: the 1870 designs by Barber, the 1870 and 1871 designs by Longacre, regular die strikes in off metals, and the with-motto pieces of 1863-66.

Moreover, perhaps we can think a little outside the box here. Why does a pattern "set" have to be predetermined? Why not allow the owner himself to define the set, have general criteria for points based on the rarity and grade of the pieces, normalize by the number of pieces, and allow competition based on a range of the absolute number of pieces within a "set"?

coinlieutenant · March 4, 2004 7:13AM

You can buy an Amazonian dollar for less than 40000$? Am I just off on my prices but I thought that was a 100K coin?

LT

gemtone65 · March 4, 2004 9:55AM

Coinlieutenant: Good point you make. I guess I'm a little rusty on current Pattern prices. Perhaps I should have used in my analogy an Amazonian half dollar -- in copper!

oreville · March 4, 2004 4:35PM

Hey!!!!!!!!!!!! Give me the credit where credit is due!!!!

I suggested that MrEureka set up these PCGS registry sets (in the other thread) long before anyone else even suggested it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mark · March 4, 2004 11:37PM

If PCGS creates a pattern registry, what do you think will be the effect on the prices of patterns? Big increase, small increase, no effect, it would differ from one pattern to the next, or?

Mark

Lakesammman · March 5, 2004 1:55AM

Mark:

It would depend on how it was structured. If they allow all patterns and there is no hope of completing the set, then there would be little, if any, effect. If there was a set of 1877 halves and 2-3 people were bidding on the last coin in the set, it could have a big influence.

I sure like the idea of Andy helping out PCGS. Andy, how do you suggest "we" procede to get "their" attention??

MrEureka · March 5, 2004 4:33AM

Andy, how do you suggest "we" procede to get "their" attention??

I'm talking to HRH and will give it my best shot. I'll keep you posted. For now, better to focus your attention on sample slab bashing.

RKKay · March 5, 2004 4:42AM

How could HRH turn down those puppy dog eyes and that cold, wet, black nose?

cosmicdebris · March 5, 2004 5:11AM

How about German patterns?

MrEureka · March 5, 2004 5:21AM

How could HRH turn down those puppy dog eyes and that cold, wet, black nose?

MrEureka · March 5, 2004 5:27AM

How about German patterns?

Maybe if anyone collected them...

oreville · March 5, 2004 5:11PM

Hmmm, looked more like German Shepard than German patterns!

cosmicdebris · March 5, 2004 9:35PM

Andy a very funny man

I'm Back and VERY Disappointed

Comments

Leave a Comment