I shipped out the WRONG COIN!!! UPDATE - he's received it

my3cents · January 20, 2004 2:04PM

UPDATE- now he has received it

but he is mad at me for "threatening" to come to his house. Oh well... ya gotta do what you gotta do. I just keep wondering if his mail ran sometime between 11pm last night when the DAD called and 2am this morning when I got the e-mail from the SON saying he had the coin.

He says he'll be sending it back today so I should have it in about a week. I am FEDEXing his other coin now - the correct coin. I will probably get negged but I am planning on giving him a full refund plus shipping for his trouble.
Think I should do this based on the circumstances?

_________________________________________________

Okay - I admit it - I screwed up - I even told the guy that.

I had 2 ANACS coins up for sale on e-bay - both of them gold coins. Both were the same size and about the same grade - BUT - I sent the wrong one out to the wrong person. I left him positive feedback because he paid fast.

I realized my mistake the day after I sent it out and called the recipient. He said that when he got it he would send it back and e-mail me. He seemed to be understanding and a nice guy. I told him that when I heard from him, I would send out the correct coin. Everything was peachy.

That hasn't happened. In fact, he will not take my calls and he will not return my e-mails now.

I think he got the coin, opened it up and realized he would be ahead if he just did nothing. The difference in value is $200.

The guy is still bidding on stuff on e-bay even now so I know he's "around".

Sure - it's my fault for screwing up but I would think a guy with 124 feedback - all positive (well almost all) - would be an honest guy. Maybe I'm wrong.

I sent out the wrong coin LAST Monday - a week and a half ago. He is only 8 hours drive time from me - I usually get feedback from buyers in the Tampa area in just 4 days - so something is probably amiss.

Anyone willing to help me out in the Tampa area? You can PM me or just post here. I don't think the guy is a forum member - he mostly buys beer mugs. I was thinking a phone call or even a nice visit may help.

Any ideas????

Cladiator · January 20, 2004 2:07PM

get his address and visit him

my3cents · January 20, 2004 2:17PM

I have the address and the phone number.

clw54 · January 20, 2004 2:19PM

I suggest changing the title to describe the problem. Somebody who might have an answer to a problem like this is likely to just skip over it.

Boom · January 20, 2004 2:26PM

If he were a little closer I'm sure I could convince him to relinquish the coin! Hey clw what does Mr. Paseo stand for?

clw54 · January 20, 2004 2:28PM

He has a Paseo.

Gandyjai · January 20, 2004 2:46PM

Expose the shmuck AND keep calling him!
Maybe offer him a 12-pack or beer mug for his trouble?

He gave his word....Then backed out

If nothing happens in a couple of weeks......ROAD TRIP!!

Gandyjai

ms70 · January 20, 2004 3:34PM

Start with a polite phone call. If that doesn't work, file a theft report with the police in the town he lives in & see if they will help.

A friend of mine got scammed by an eBay seller. She lives in NJ & the seller in Texas. He took the money & sent nothing. Didn't
answer any form of contact. As a final resort she called the police in the town he lives in. The officer was extremely helpful and
went to the guys house. He told him that theft charges were coming if he didn't return the money. That was enough to get him
motivated to send the money back.

I don't know about Florida, but in most states theft laws encompass keeping items that are lost, mislaid, or received by mistake.

kenoshapete · January 20, 2004 3:44PM

I got took (for a little while) on E-bay after winning 2 Morgan Silver Dollars. I paid (in Mar 2003) and never heard anything..... I wound up filing a complaint with the USPS (for mail fraud - which may apply in your instance), the IFCC (Internet Fraud Complaint Center), the US Attorney General's Office, and the (in this case) Arizona State Attorney General's office... Sounds like a lot of work, but it wasn't really, just a lot of clicking on the Internet. At any rate, the AZ Attorney General's office tracked the person down and lo and behold in November, I got the 2 Morgan Dollars plus a full refund and letter of apology. I sent the refund back (as no compensation was required AND the coins) and (to make a long story short) the AZ-AG later closed the case.

I like the idea of filing a Theft report with the Police, and also contacting Florida's Attorney General's office. -- Again, sounds like a lot of work, but it isn't really, and you have much more invested in this then I did. Good luck and let us know the outcome.

KP

Jody526 · January 20, 2004 6:32PM

Unfortunatly, this would be considered "unordered merchandise". The customer has no obligation to return the item, or pay for it.
Personaly, I would return your coin, but it's the guy in Tampa's coin now, to do with as he chooses.

Sequitur · January 20, 2004 7:09PM

Unfortunatly, this would be considered "unordered merchandise". The customer has no obligation to return the item, or pay for it.

Respectfully, no. There is a provision for "unordered merchandise" in the federal statutes, but these provisions are intended to protect citizens from unscrupulous businesses that demand payment for products that were shipped, but never ordered. You can search the FTC's website for the relevant provisions. It is true for these types of scams, the products may be kept without remitting payment.

These provisions do not apply here. An item *was* purchased, however the wrong item was shipped. 3cents is entitled to the return of his higher-valued item.

In any event, your conclusion would lead to absurd results. Assume I've purchased a large cubic zirconia for $2,000 and request it be shipped to my home. A jeweler's assistant makes a mistake and instead sends me a real diamond valued at $200,000 (or even $2 million -- pick any number you want, for the principle holds true no matter the amount). It simply is not the case the jeweler must suffer a $198,000 loss, or even a whopping $1.98 million loss, merely because the jeweler made an innocent mistake.

- Edited for spelling.

Jody526 · January 20, 2004 7:45PM

Sequitur,
I also respect your position. And I agree that the person in Tampa should return the coin. However, I can find no legal reason for him to do so. Perhaps you can point me in the right direction.

ClausUrch · January 20, 2004 9:18PM

Refund the other buyer or see if he will take the other coin for a discount and take the loss. Be more cardful in the future.

291fifth · January 20, 2004 9:29PM

Did you make it clear to him that you were going to refund his shipping costs in full, or did you expect him to eat the shipping cost for YOUR mistake?

my3cents · January 20, 2004 10:04PM

I told him that I would be happy to payfor the inconvenience. If he would just ship it back and tell me how much time, money etc it took him, I would Paypal him double that.

darktone · January 20, 2004 10:29PM

Call him right away and in a nice manner tell him how concerned you are and that you have another buyer waiting for the coin. I think just a little bit of a sign that you are a real person and not just an internet image will let him no that this will cause him alot of trouble if he does not fix the problem. mike

meos1 · January 20, 2004 11:02PM

Everyone seems lawyered up these days. An unfortunate occurance has happened. Yes, he should be more responsive. But who's mistake is this? Not too sure you can file a report on this. If mailed through the US mail it may fall under the receiving a package which you did not request. You can keep it. Not certain but just maybe thats the case. Start with your postmaster. Explain what happened and make sure that this loophole is not valid BEFORE you file charges.

I can assure you a posse of people in the front yard is NOT going to get the response you are looking for. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar. You need to be prepared to suffer a loss on this. Consider it an expensive lesson it it does come to pass and let it go.

Good luck,

Dan

Shamika · January 20, 2004 11:28PM

"I was thinking a phone call or even a nice visit may help."

I think a "three-large-men-with-baseball-bats" visit would be more successful?

CarlWohlforth · January 20, 2004 11:34PM

I made the same mistake about two months back. Well not quite the same mistake. The coins were cheaper. The minute I realized I sent the wrong coin I sent along the right one. They both arrived the same day. The buyer sent back the wrong coin without even opening the package. Whew, I got lucky there! I wish you the best.

hookooekoo · January 21, 2004 12:15AM

For future reference if someone else sends the wrong thing, the recipient would not inccur ANY shipping charges if he does not open the package, mark it return to sender, and deposit it back in the mail.

Perhaps the buyer is waiting to receive the correct coin before sending the wrong one back. From the point of view of the buyer, since the seller is the one that made the mistake, I would want him to send me my correct merchanise before returning the in-correct item, sort of one of those "a bird in the hand" situations.

nepbrs44 · January 21, 2004 12:18AM

Send in Luca Brazzi!!

WWBillman · January 21, 2004 12:22AM

Probably going to have to suck it up and take the lose.

He made payment, you already left positive feedback and possession carries a lot of weight. I don’t see how $200 could be worth all the hassles you are going to encounter if this guy does not willingly cooperate.

If you are thinking about confronting him in person be vary cautious. It could easily develop into an explosive situation putting you in a bad position.

Tsimmerdown · January 21, 2004 12:30AM

Ask yourself the question: How badly does this $200 loss affect me? Base your actions to getting your coin back on the answer to that question. How much hassle do you want to put yourself through?

I would keep calling, keep emailing, every day. Call once in the evening, morning, and mid-day. Do not threaten him.

I don't know about your legal options here, since law isn't my expertise, but maybe someone else knows what your options are better than I.........

wayneme · January 21, 2004 12:30AM

i think your cooked on this deal offer him a deal to keep it and work a deal on the back side
or you'll lose them both my two cents three cents

wayneme · January 21, 2004 12:34AM

even if he's a crook if you make it the easy way they both may take it limiting your loss

Neptune · January 21, 2004 12:45AM

Here's what I would do - Call, write snail mail and email - label the top of the letter FINAL NOTICE - INVOICE - TO BE PAID IN FULL UPON RECEIPT. (or something similar - if you have an attorney friend, etc., I would ask them about wording.)

Dear Fellow eBayer - As previously discussed on *date*, I made a mistake and sent you the wrong coin. Please note that by not returning this coin, you are breaking the law, and if I do not hear back from you by *DATE*, then I will contact your local police dept, eBay, Attorney General, and *Whoever Else* to inform them of this situation and your unwillingness to return a coin that does NOT belong to you. I believe this is called theft in most places. I will pay complete shipping charges, and mail the correct coin to you, as previously discussed. IF you INSIST on keeping this coin, please remit *AMOUNT* in FULL IMMEDIATELY. If not received by *DATE*, again, I will contact your local police dept., eBay, Attorney General and *Whoever Else*.

Sincerely,
YOU

mommam17 · January 21, 2004 1:04AM

Hi. I have dealt with someone from Tampa who buys and sells coins and also collects beer mugs. He is very trustworthy. Not sure if it`s the same person or just a coinsidence. He has 137 positive feedbacks with 0 negs. nor any from you. You might want to check if you`re sending emails to right person. It might be coinsidence there`s 2 coin people from Tampa that collect beer mugs, but not likely. Good luck.

Dave99B · January 21, 2004 1:09AM

Threaten to drive over and kick his a$$. That worked for me once.

Some guy in Maryland (Rick Albright) stiffed me on a $500 PCGS Barber half. He cashed my check, and never sent the coin. Eight weeks later, after numerous failed attempts at contacting him, I send a registered letter telling him I'd be coming by to knock on his door, and settle this man-to-man.

Sure, it was tacky, but I got the coin three days later...

Dave

ms70 · January 21, 2004 1:49AM

If someone sends you something in the mail by mistake you have no right to keep it. Keeping something that is not intended
to be yours and intentionally depriving its rightful owner of it is called THEFT. Here's the New Jersey Law & I'm sure most other
states have one just like it:

2C:20-6. Theft of property lost, mislaid, or delivered by mistake.
A person who comes into control of property of another that he knows
to have been lost, mislaid, or delivered under a mistake as to the nature
or amount of the property or the identity of the recipient is guilty of theft if,
knowing the identity of the owner and with purpose to deprive said owner
thereof, he converts the property to his own use.

L.1978, c. 95, s. 2C:20-6, eff. Sept. 1, 1979.

Resource

Edited to add link.

lordmarcovan · January 21, 2004 7:26AM

Ouch.

I shipped the wrong coin, once, too. I had two certified Shield nickels; one was a high grade (but not UNC) 1866 with a repunched date. The other was a low-end MS 1869. The guy who bought the '66 paid up first, with PayPal, and I shipped him the '69 by mistake. Instead of a higher-circulated-grade 1866, he got a Mint State 1869. Fortunately the 1866 he'd paid for was still worth a little more money, in spite of the higher grade of the 1869. I was able to get it back from him and get him the correct coin in time, before the buyer of the of the 1869 had even sent payment. He was nice about it, thank God. But it was embarrassing.

ohbaby · January 21, 2004 8:11AM

Visit him with a magnum...and I ain't talkin' Champagne!

Seriously, I doubt there is much you can do. Lawyer? Not worht a lawyer's time. Small claims? Even if you win collecting is a hassle.

Call and beg, seriously.

Sad to see some are so hard up for a few bucks, not you my3cents, but the other guy.

wallstreetman · January 21, 2004 8:26AM

I knocked on the door of a guy in Florida(Im in California) at 3:30 in the morning after he failed to send a coin! I bet he doesnt do that again!

my3cents · January 21, 2004 11:37AM

First -
Thanks to all for the PM's with quotes from law books and everything else. Here is an update:

I sent the guy an e-mail through e-bays e-mail system letting him know that I really did expect to hear from him. I also told him I expected to hear from him TONIGHT.

Well - after all, it's only a 7 hour drive to Tampa and it's really cold here in Birmingham right now

A visit to sunny Florida could be in the offing!

He actually called me tonight. He is a police officer in Tampa and he does his E-bay biz through his son's account...interesting. Anyway, he said he (read - HIS SON) had not received the coin - EITHER coin - and that he would have his son e-mail me daily on whether it showed up or not.

He did seem sincere. I explained to him that it wasn't really the money but the 100% 315+ positive feedbacks I had that concerned me and there was another purchaser waiting on the coin I had accidentally sent to him. He seemed to understand and said he would keep me informed.

Here's the thing - he doesn't live with his son. This is the DAD calling. Apparently, the son got a little scared when he saw that I knew his adress and might actually visit him and called his daddy.

So - now I have to play the waiting game. Did his son get it and not tell daddy? It was sent from Alabama to Florida 9 days ago. Just for the geographically challenged - these states are neighbors. Hmmmm.....

I'll let you know what happens next.
Mike

Wondo · January 21, 2004 11:46AM

I'd like to see the guy's badge.

Placid · January 21, 2004 11:51AM

I hope you sent it so it required a signature.
If it was insured for more than $50 you can call the post office you sent it at and they can track it and tell you if it was delivered,when and who signed for it.

nolimitz · January 21, 2004 11:56AM

MS70
re: Start with a polite phone call. If that doesn't work, file a theft report with the police in the town he lives in & see if they will help.

I agree with the call, but a police report??? The seller screwed up not the buyer. He did not steal anything. get a grip
$200 bucks is probably a lesson well learned!
Pete

my3cents · January 21, 2004 10:04PM

ttt

Dog97 · January 21, 2004 10:17PM

Maybe you were a bit hasty & harsh with him when you didn't need to be.
Maybe being hasty & harsh is what shook him loose from the coin & kept you from getting shanked.
Glad it turned out ok and if you get negged then oh well, big deal.
I know it's easy to get messed up on mailing coins. I rarely sale on eBay but I pull my hair out when I go to match up the coins with the invoices and try to get the right coins with the right invoices in the right envelopes and it's usually late @ night when I do it after working all day.
Then I try to mail the coins to the people that paid me and not mail the coins to the people that haven't paid me yet.
It gets really confusing. I don't see how people that run 50-100 auctions by themselves do it.

BAJJERFAN · January 21, 2004 10:48PM

Put the coin that you are going to sell into the envelope that you are going to mail it in. Mark the envelope with the listing number and coin ID. When the listing ends put the envelope into a box marked paid or not paid and also write on the back how much insurance to buy.

EvilMCT · January 21, 2004 11:07PM

Well, glad to hear that everything appears to be working out.

<< <i>I will probably get negged but I am planning on giving him a full refund plus shipping for his trouble. >>

I don't think that I would give him a full refund, but that should keep you from getting a negative.

Ken

nencoin · January 22, 2004 3:12AM

Folks, this is why one should wait until a transaction is OVER before leaving feedback. The simple act of paying for an auction does not constitute its completion. By leaving feedback too soon, the seller has no feedback recourse if the buyer turns out to be a creep and keep the wrong coin (or file a false paypal reversal claim, or send the wrong coin back, or one of a dozen other unethical tricks bad buyers DO use to screw sellers). And now me, as an eBay seller, can potentially be screwed down the road by this guy, because he has a positive feedback(s) that he may not deserve (and I won't know about it).

chris

I shipped out the WRONG COIN!!! UPDATE - he's received it

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