eBay's New Authenticity Guarantee and a counterfeit coin & slab sold- My real experience...

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JDark
JDark Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

There are several threads here that have garnered so many responses they have become hard to follow imho. I have read plenty of speculation and what ifs, but this post is about my 1st completed example.

The subject of this post is a bad counterfeit 1881-CC "Morgan" in a fake NGC slab. Initially posted prior to the authenticity guarantee program I notified the seller it is a "double fake" and why. No actual response from him, I notified a friend at NGC and the cert was updated. The seller then ended the listing.

I actually did a segment on that week's Live Coin Q&A podcast; and then to my surprise 2 weeks later the seller relisted it under the authenticity guarantee:

So, I decided to purchase it and again message the seller. The back and forth and an interesting final note from him:

And the coin was mailed; I actually purchased it Sept2 and it traveled to sunny CA and had a review completed Sept 10.

eBay sent me the following note and the purchased updated, AND the listing removed "for a policy violation"...

So, it is my understanding the coin was being returned to the seller, but I was immediately credited my purchase price. Whether the authenticator actually looked at the coin or simply made the decision on the bad holder as they note in their language would be speculative on my part, but this is certainly a "double fake"!

And I have another interesting subject on the way to the authenticator since Sept 14, so maybe more to come...

Comments

  • DotStore
    DotStore Posts: 923 ✭✭✭✭
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    So the Authenticity Program worked perfectly -- they identified a fake and the buyer (you) got a full refund. And hopefully the seller understands the jig is up and any further fraudulent selling will only be rejected by the Authenticity Guarantee program (unless they start listing items in different categories to circumvent the process).

    Did I read that correctly that the seller claims they purchased this coin from the US Mint about a year ago?

  • MsMorrisine
    MsMorrisine Posts: 40,041 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    yes! the us mint!

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • BigFrankie
    BigFrankie Posts: 60 ✭✭✭
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    MsMorrisine,

    I appreciate you sharing this! What did you see that indicated that the holder was fake? I see the red lines and circles you noted, but can you provide details? I'd like the education.

  • golden
    golden Posts: 10,535 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Thanks so much for this thread.

  • DotStore
    DotStore Posts: 923 ✭✭✭✭
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    I wonder how Authentication would have gone if the Cert Lookup wasn't updated with the comment "POSSIBLE COUNTERFEIT HOLDER"

    I hope it would have still failed inspection.

  • Desert Moon
    Desert Moon Posts: 6,479 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    My online coin store - https://desertmoonnm.com/
  • JDark
    JDark Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
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    @DotStore said:
    I wonder how Authentication would have gone if the Cert Lookup wasn't updated with the comment "POSSIBLE COUNTERFEIT HOLDER"

    I hope it would have still failed inspection.

    Interesting point- I wonder if they actually look up the cert when they review the slab. If so, there are some where the cert is missing for one reason or another on the TPG's look-up like my next example going through the process B) ...

  • TrickleCharge
    TrickleCharge Posts: 497 ✭✭✭✭
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    @JDark said:

    @DotStore said:
    I wonder how Authentication would have gone if the Cert Lookup wasn't updated with the comment "POSSIBLE COUNTERFEIT HOLDER"

    I hope it would have still failed inspection.

    Interesting point- I wonder if they actually look up the cert when they review the slab. If so, there are some where the cert is missing for one reason or another on the TPG's look-up like my next example going through the process B) ...

    I've been curious about that one. I still think it passes without issue. Thanks for keeping us posted.

  • BigAl
    BigAl Posts: 1,279 ✭✭✭
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    Encouraging.
    Thank you for going through hassle, I think I speak for most here by saying that this is helpful and educational.

  • davewesen
    davewesen Posts: 6,982 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    I wonder what eBay will do if the seller relists this coin with lower price?

  • oih82w8
    oih82w8 Posts: 13,206 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    It appears that the registered trademark symbol ® is missing from the fake label insert next to NGC. It looks like a ciricle without the "R".

    oih82w8 = Oh I Hate To Wait _defectus patientia_aka...Dr. Defecto - Curator of RMO's

    BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
  • JDark
    JDark Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
    edited September 23, 2026 5:21AM
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    @davewesen said:

    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    I wonder what eBay will do if the seller relists this coin with lower price?

    I will definitely watch for that! Interestingly eBay did eventually remove his 1st listing as I noted in my message to him, but it did not deter him from relisting this time...

  • jmlanzaf
    jmlanzaf Posts: 43,046 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    Again, the imagined fee increase...

    All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.

  • DotStore
    DotStore Posts: 923 ✭✭✭✭
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    @JDark said:

    @davewesen said:

    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    I wonder what eBay will do if the seller relists this coin with lower price?

    I will definitely watch for that! Interestingly eBay did eventually remove his 1st listing as I noted in my message to him, but it did not deter him from relisting this time...

    Was that the only listing that seller had over $500? I noticed that seller doesn't have anything listed over $500 at the moment.

  • RandomSchmoe
    RandomSchmoe Posts: 73 ✭✭✭
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    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    I was wondering the same. Is there a threshold, like after x number of failed sales they get banned? It would be to ebay's benefit since it should reduce the number of fake coins they need to check.

    Rare-Change.com - Low listing fee

  • JDark
    JDark Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
    edited September 23, 2026 6:05AM
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    @DotStore said:

    @JDark said:

    @davewesen said:

    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    I wonder what eBay will do if the seller relists this coin with lower price?

    I will definitely watch for that! Interestingly eBay did eventually remove his 1st listing as I noted in my message to him, but it did not deter him from relisting this time...

    Was that the only listing that seller had over $500? I noticed that seller doesn't have anything listed over $500 at the moment.

    Made me look! Interestingly he sold a $50K 1889-CC Morgan for $2750. eBay went in and removed the listing. It was apparently before the authenticity program.



  • JDark
    JDark Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
    edited September 23, 2026 6:12AM
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    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    I have seen this inference in other posts on this topic; I am curious what you mean by "will cost honest vendors more fees"???

  • jmlanzaf
    jmlanzaf Posts: 43,046 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    @JDark said:

    @Desert Moon said:
    Did ebay remove the vendor for obvious fraudulent listings of the same coin twice? This has been going on, on ebay for decades and they put in this authenticity guarantee only now? Okay ebay, do something about it, you have a fraudulent vendor identified, remove them. Permanently. Otherwise, this new program, that will cost honest vendors more fees, is only partly doing what it should be doing.

    I have seen this inference in other posts on this topic; I am curious what you mean by "will cost honest vendors more fees"???

    He's insisting that ebay is gong to raise fees to pay for the program even though they never did for cards. It's just speculation masquerading as fact.

    All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.

  • JDark
    JDark Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
    edited September 23, 2026 8:37AM
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    @TrickleCharge said:

    @JDark said:

    @DotStore said:
    I wonder how Authentication would have gone if the Cert Lookup wasn't updated with the comment "POSSIBLE COUNTERFEIT HOLDER"

    I hope it would have still failed inspection.

    Interesting point- I wonder if they actually look up the cert when they review the slab. If so, there are some where the cert is missing for one reason or another on the TPG's look-up like my next example going through the process B) ...

    I've been curious about that one. I still think it passes without issue. Thanks for keeping us posted.

    if you are referring to the certified Henning I purchased with the guarantee, that did not go well...

    I plan to discuss it on tomorrow evening's Live Coin Q&A podcast.

  • cinque1543
    cinque1543 Posts: 611 ✭✭✭✭
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    If nothing else, the new eBay program has prompted a lot of posts on this forum!

  • JDark
    JDark Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
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    Anyone interested in my 2nd experience can see it live on FB Thursday evening on Live Coin Q&A:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vhBlBFfZVM

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