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At What Price Point Do You Employ Registered Mail When Shipping
Capgun
Posts: 946 ✭✭✭
Or is there a better method. Registered seems to take the forever route. Has to be a better way that you can insure for more than $5,000 with a quicker outcome. Appreciate any input. Shipping has become super expensive lately.
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Many of us have accounts with companies such as Hugh Wood, Inc and we use that insurance.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Thank you T I'll look into that. Appreciate it.
For numismatics, I use Registered Mail exclusively. I don’t want to deal with insurance, no matter how good it may be. Insurance implies a loss. And I don’t want to lose coins.
I believe that they require Registered mail use to cover shipments.
I dont use registered mail any longer for ebay shipments, takes too long, over the years have had too many packages take so long I had to refund the buyer, before it got there. They have no recourse in getting your funds back if thats the case,was succesfull on couple doing a package intercept, once the buyer sent me back payment, the other buyer stiffed me because he knew ebay couldnt do anything about it.
I either send via another service, or let GC handle those higher value sales.
Just this past week , on a regular package that went lost, i had to refund the buyer week earlier , when I went to file the claim at post office, it was denied because they located it, and was sending on its way. I contacted the ebay buyer, and he said he no longer wanted it , and he not resending payment, I called ebay and they said, nothing they could do , so I tried a package intercept, was missed the first time before put on on truck for delivery, however, because no one was home at time, it went back to station where I was able to get an agent on phone to secure it for return, thankfully
If that’s the case, things have changed since I used Hugh Wood, before joining Heritage. I was able to ship overnight packages. Hopefully, a current user can confirm the current options.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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Not sure I am 100% in the know, but my understanding is each plan is tailored.
As a collector, they insure value for me if I send Registered. Limits apply, of course.
I have heard dealer plans are different, which makes sense.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
Doesn't that lessen the value of the plan? The registered is already insured and, unless you violate the DMM, you've paid for that insurance.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
never had anything that needed it
https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipOnSKhNCHxkfJkKJ9rIMTZg9A7dzPlqv0bcR88x
Based on previous posts on the topic, some people don't mind doing that.
Yes, I know. That's why i mentioned it.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
You are correct. Hugh Wood's requirement for a collector policy (there are a few slight differences for dealers and/or customized policies) is that the package must be insured and all dimensions must be at least 1".
For practical purposes, most tracked US mail products which carry a $100 included insurance coverage will qualify. I typically ship US priority in padded flat rate envelopes with a box of some sort on the inside to make sure the thickness is >1".
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
Over about $800, I use registered and nothing else unless there is some special circumstance. 30 years,... zero lost Registered packages. I have experienced maybe three to four situations where a package took an extraordinarily circuitous route, shall we say, but never lost one.
Official PCGS account of:
www.TallahasseeCoinClub.com
I have a spreadsheet that approximates the charges and lets me choose. I also factor in transit time. Registered is fast for me from PHX to LA and DFW for example, but PHX to VA or FL takes several weeks.
Depends on the policy. They also allow UPS and FedEx (coverage reductions over the weekend for FedEx) up to certain amounts. I shipped one USPS Signature Confirmation and one UPS today.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
I use registered mail when the value is over $5000.00. Which for my coins is almost never.
Thanks, that is what I was questioning!
The first time I spent $5000 on a coin, the seller used Registered Mail. It took more than two weeks (it took a week just to get out of New York City). After that, I decided that it would take a lot more than that for me to want to use Registered Mail.
When I bought my CACG AU55 1916 SLQ, we used Registered Mail. When I bought my 1893-S PCGS VF25 Morgan dollar, I did not.
But I've always been the buyer with expensive coins, and the buyer is not legally responsible for a lost coin (proof, of course, is another matter). If I were the seller, I probably would use Registered Mail for any shipment worth more than about $2000.
Thanks, was questioning as a seller. Appreciate it.
I use registered mail when the cost is less than insured priority mail.
I use it at lower levels because of the indemnity limits on "bullion". There are some things you can't insure via priority mail.
I don't think there's any single answer to the OP's questions. The "break even" on insurance cost is somewhere between $2000 and $2500. But it is often not a question of cost but security.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
I've had six claims with Hugh Wood in the last ten or so years (we've used them for at least 20). Two were Registered, two were FedEx, and two were non-Registered USPS. If you ship a lot, definitely look into private insurance. I have been very happy with Hugh Wood (now Brown & Brown).
$800-1000 is where I start using Registered Rail. I think that's about where it becomes cheaper to use Registered Mail for that insured amount. I've only had a couple take unusually long to get to their destination. The vast majority of my Registered shipments are to PCGS, though.
Collector, occasional seller
That's a good point. My comment was based on shipping numismatic items, not bullion.
USPS insures up to $5,000 priority mail. Registered seems to be regular ground destination fee + $40.50 for a $5,000 package. Coverage above $5,000 is $3.10 per additional thousand or fraction of $1,000. These days I become a bit uncomfortable over $1,000 because, well I won't say. Wondered at what point others get that uncomfortable feeling.
Thanks!
Here's my charges from mailing this morning with the default $100 insurance.
I have my own private insurance through ShipAndInsure.com. I think it was $1.30 less for Ground Advantage.
Priority Mail® 1 $14.00
Newport Beach, CA 92658
Weight: 2 lb 13.00 oz
Expected Delivery Date
Mon 07/27/2026
Insurance $0.00
Up to $100.00 included
Registered Mail® $21.50
Amount: $100.00
Tracking #:
Total $35.50
Technically violates the DMM.
Also, for others, there is no point in upgrading to priority mail with registered mail. It travels the same way, whether it is ground or priority or express.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@jmlanzaf Asking for a friend, what is the DMM?
Domestic Mail Manual. It's the USPS Book of Rules.
As @MasonG responded, it's the domestic mail manual.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
As I recall, one or more of the private insurers did (and/or does) have shipping terms which conflicted with those of the Post Office.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Seems to me, it would be ethically iffy for private insurers to instruct customers to claim a value of $0 to the post office. And it would be just as ethically iffy to collect an insurance fee from those who declared full value to the post office without telling them that the fee they paid the post office included insurance on their shipment.
Can you tell the PO your box is valued at $50k but decline to purchase insurance from them? I'm making sure there's a distinction between the declaration of value and how much insurance is purchased.
OTOH, what harm can come from it? The sender isn't going to file a claim (or if they do for $100 default value). The PO can't claim you harmed them by failing to declare the full value. And then of course, valuation can be subjective.
It may be different for coins, but coverage with a policy for cards and other collectibles covers up to $2,500 with signature confirmation and USPS Priority Mail or up to $60,000 with signature confirmation and USPS Express Mail.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
I don't know why that is the rule, but it is. You may note that the DMM specifically says that having private insurance does not obviate the need to declare the full value of the shipment.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
It doesn't look like it. The form on the left is from 30 years ago. The one on the right is similar to the current one. Sometime in the past, the post office removed the option to ship valuable items by registered mail without also paying for insurance.
It doesn't appear the post office allows that. Note that the rule as posted above says "Only articles of no value may be mailed as Registered Mail without insurance."
UISPS is providing the service, they get to decide what their terms and conditions are and what it costs, you get to decide whether or not that works for you.
You mean like when people tell their third party insurance company the package is worth $5,000 and then tell the USPS it's worth $0? Yeah, I guess.
And my reply... Or what? And the answer is, nothing. They will still deliver it. Or lose it. You just can't make a claim against them if they do lose it. And if you're not buying insurance you're probably OK with that arrangement.
I don't think the point is to say that we (USPS) don't want to ship packages using this service level without selling any insurance or having the knowledge of how much you think it's worth. I'm pretty sure the insurance offering is a complete and separate accounting center and one does not rely on the other. It's all about liability and if you're not holding USPS accountable or liable, none of this matters.
No, like I say my grandpa's ashes are priceless (max value) and the USPS insists it's worthless carbon.
What do you think this means: "Only articles of no value may be mailed as Registered Mail without insurance."?
It seems pretty clear to me that nobody paying a third-party company to insure their package thinks their package has no value.
Whatever you think the DMM should say, it's VERY clear what it does say.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
After researching more, I've learned something which was caused by the way the USPS receipt presents the charges.
I had initially thought the insurance was a separate line item and indeed the USPS receipt shows a separate line for it but that line is associated with the purchase of Priority (or Ground Advantage), not the registered mail service. It seems in my case I technically received $100 of insurance from using Priority mail and $100 insurance for declaring $100 value which I had thought was the default amount. Apparently the fee would be $20.80 instead of $21.50 had I said my package was worth $0.
Regardless the whole entire purpose they want to know the value is so they can price in the insurance. And according to the DMM the clerk can refuse the package if you refuse to provide a value, likely because their computer system requires a value even if it is zero. I asked AI lawyer the ramifications of failing to declare true value and the conclusion was this:
The underpayment isn't ripping USPS off if you never intend make a claim (I don't) and of course would make it impossible to succeed with a claim.
Third party insurance, to my knowledge, has no problem with this. It would be redundant to insure 3rd party and USPS.
Yes the documents conflict but 3rd party insurers expect this - they don't expect you to double-insure your package.
What about this: "Private insurance carried on Registered Mail does not modify the requirements for declaring the full value."?
Or this: "Only articles of no value may be mailed as Registered Mail without insurance."?
Both statements seem to be pretty clear.
Of course they don't. They collect the insurance premium without the expense of providing security for the package in transit.
Just as the third party insurers don’t expect you to double-insure with the the PO, the PO probably expects you to insure with them for full value and not double-insure elsewhere.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I'm not arguing that it isn't against the rules. I'm arguing that there are no practical ramifications or consequences and further, that no one is harmed by this practice. I guess unless you want to be pedantic, the mint loses revenue because you chose to insure with someone else, but they are not incurring any liability either.
I guess I'm surprised that anyone would argue it's okay because you can get away with ignoring the rules without suffering any consequences.
While I assume that they have a company shipping insurance policy, HA just sent me a $5100 coin using FedEx 2 day. That is what I use to send stuff to PCGS but the most that I have ever sent that way is probably $25,000 total value to them or CAC.
You would have to ask one of the folks who send high value items to get advice at that level. I'd probably buy a first class airline ticket.
Of course, you probably have not just had a roof insurance claim denied by Liberty Mutual and had to pay $55k out of pocket (which would have been spent on coins), so are not really sour on insurance companies.
There's nuance that you're not acknowledging. Technically not OK but in all practicality it is if there's no harm done. Like running a red light late at night after you've stopped and have full visibility in all directions and the streets are deserted. Illegal? Yes. But does it harm anyone or add any risk to anyone else if you don't wait for a green? No. Not in that specific case.
If someone hired you to perform a job for them, would you consider it to be "no harm done" if you were only paid for a portion of the work you did?
edited to add... where is the nuance in these statements?
"Private insurance carried on Registered Mail does not modify the requirements for declaring the full value."
"Only articles of no value may be mailed as Registered Mail without insurance."
I'm not seeing it.
There have been many threads with this same issue where high dollar dealers discussed their approach, so I would look for them.
They might. They could also self insure.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
Maybe you can tell me where the harm is to USPS if they incur no liability for taking my package from point A to point B, even if they lose it along the way, just because they don't know the value of what's inside? That's the nuance.