None of those are actually surprising for the pre playoff era. VT is only good every now and then. Pac 12 schools never wanted to schedule SEC teams. Ole Miss was bad for a while until Kiffin turned the program around. ND makes their own schedule which is basically an ACC schedule with NAVY added. I guess Texas FSU is the closest to a surprise, Clemson Michigan just seems wrong and weird for a regular season game. Oklahoma would have nothing to gain playing Michigan State which is not a notable football program, they had a couple good years like 20 years ago and thats it
Michigan State had two excellent coaches… Biggie Munn and Duffy Daugherty. They were a National power from around 1949 through 1966. There is a very compelling football tradition that exists at Michigan State. Your simplistic overview of the MSU football program is just ignorant. And yes… we have had this discussion here before.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Michigan State had two excellent coaches… Biggie Munn and Duffy Daugherty. They were a National power from around 1949 through 1966. There is a very compelling football tradition that exists at Michigan State. Your simplistic overview of the MSU football program is just ignorant. And yes… we have had this discussion here before.
Its 2026. That argument is like saying that Army and Navy are premier programs because of their dominance during WW2, the Korean War and Vietnam. When you go over half a decade being irrelevant with only a few years of exception you arent a football power house or a blue blood or anything like that.
Michigan State is not a football school. Its a basketball school. More often than not Michigan State football is at the bottom of the conference. They were trash in the 70s,80s,90s, 2000s and now. Yes they had a couple years a decade ago where they were good but that was the outlier not the tradition
Michigan State has an excellent tradition in both football and basketball. In fact, MSU was ranked continuously over twenty straight seasons and finished in the top twenty for 15 of those seasons. And while the period from 1997 through 2021 does not match their earlier success, 9 seasons in the top twenty is noteworthy. From 1918 through 2025, MSU compiled a record of 616-420-30. If I bothered to do the math, I suspect you will find that either Ohio State or Michigan State was the premier Big Ten Football team from the time the Spartans joined the conference in 1950 through the end of the 1966 season.
Biggie Munn is the only coach that beat Frank Leahy’s Notre Dame teams for three straight years. And in the process, managed to win 28 straight games. These are the facts that create legends and traditions. Your statements reflect you do not seem to possess an interest or even an adequate understanding of College Football history… Otherwise you would show some respect for both Munn and Daugherty and the MSU football accomplishments.
Please don’t try and dig yourself out of the hole you created.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
I dont care about wins prior to WW2. Michigan counts wins against YMCA and High School teams in that period.
Dantonio gave them a short window in the 2010s and Perles had a short stretch in the late 80s early 90s.
Its a basketball school thats good sometimes. Just like Ole Miss is a baseball school that is good at football sometimes. VT wants to be a football school but like Michigan State isnt very good at it most of the time but have been good at baseball lately.
Michigan State is not a blue blood and a lot of their recent success which there hasnt been much like 2021 was a result of a very weak schedule.
Even before the transfer portal college rosters had a lot of turnover every couple of years. Some of the exceptions have been getting a little absurd with 6 and 7 year guys but anytime you go back further than that youre talking about a completely different team
I couldnt care less what teams did where no one from the team is alive anymore, Princeton and Yale are the biggest power houses in college football with the most titles if were going back that far
WW II ended in 1945. Munn’s first season as Head Coach was 1947, so we are clearly in the Post War Era. You really need to contemplate who played each other and when they played as your pre WW II comments are just not accurate. We previously had the discussion about Ole Miss and legendary coach football coach Johnny Vaught. You seem unable to accept that Ole Miss was also a National football power. I really do not see the need to re-litigate the SEC football championships won by Ole Miss as well as the number Sugar Bowl appearances. What I have written is historical fact… just because you couldn’t care less does not somehow change or diminish the great traditions of Michigan State and Ole Miss football even if we start at the Post War Era (1945 to the present).
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
WW II ended in 1945. Munn’s first season as Head Coach was 1947, so we are clearly in the Post War Era. You really need to contemplate who played each other and when they played as your pre WW II comments are just not accurate. We previously had the discussion about Ole Miss and legendary coach football coach Johnny Vaught. You seem unable to accept that Ole Miss was also a National football power. I really do not see the need to re-litigate the SEC football championships won by Ole Miss as well as the number Sugar Bowl appearances. What I have written is historical fact… just because you couldn’t care less does not somehow change or diminish the great traditions of Michigan State and Ole Miss football even if we start at the Post War Era (1945 to the present).
There is another discussion that can be had about the impact of WW2 and other drafts for war with the impact on talent going forward.
Our big disagreement is the time frames. Yes if we go back to the 40s and 50s and Ole Miss Vaught was what like 1970. They were overall bad till what Nutt came along in the 2000s then Freeze then a bad coach than Kiffin bot them back on track. I do expect them to regress with Kiffin gone.
I dont really have any strong feelings either way about Michigan State or Ole Miss football other than neither team is really a football school when you have to go back so far for it.
There need to be a cut off at some point. O;e Miss has been in the baseball playoffs basically every year the last 20 years and has been a baseball school. LSU baseball and football yea that one you can argue either way.
Hey basebal guy, what’s to discuss?? Most of what you post is “opinion” which you’re free to express, I only point out that it’s biased and tilted towards one specific conference. We all have our favorite teams and conferences but there a few members such as yourself who regurgitate the same things over and over.
At least try to be a little objective, the games haven’t even started yet.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin
@Maywood said:
Hey basebal guy, what’s to discuss?? Most of what you post is “opinion” which you’re free to express, I only point out that it’s biased and tilted towards one specific conference. We all have our favorite teams and conferences but there a few members such as yourself who regurgitate the same things over and over.
At least try to be a little objective, the games haven’t even started yet.
Records are actually indisputable facts, so are draft numbers, so are players in the NFL etc. You are right that the OSU people who root for rivals accuse others of doing what you actually do and ignore facts you dont like which does lead to a circle of things having to be repeated.
Michigan State had two excellent coaches… Biggie Munn and Duffy Daugherty. They were a National power from around 1949 through 1966. There is a very compelling football tradition that exists at Michigan State. Your simplistic overview of the MSU football program is just ignorant. And yes… we have had this discussion here before.
They were a phantom PI call away against ND from going undefeated in 2013.
Basebal guy probably doesn't know that MSU was the 10th member to join the conference, thus making it the ''BIG TEN'' conference in 1953. They won the National Championship as an independent the year before in 1952. So they were a National football power before, and after they became a BIG TEN member. During this time frame, they were riding a 28 game win streak.
So they were or they weren’t depending which side of the fence you’re on. But this must be a corner lot because there’s another side which just wonders why any of this might matter to anyone.
Michigan State had two excellent coaches… Biggie Munn and Duffy Daugherty. They were a National power from around 1949 through 1966. There is a very compelling football tradition that exists at Michigan State. Your simplistic overview of the MSU football program is just ignorant. And yes… we have had this discussion here before.
They were a phantom PI call away against ND from going undefeated in 2013.
Basebal guy probably doesn't know that MSU was the 10th member to join the conference, thus making it the ''BIG TEN'' conference in 1953. They won the National Championship as an independent the year before in 1952. So they were a National football power before, and after they became a BIG TEN member. During this time frame, they were riding a 28 game win streak.
What year is it. Last I checked its 2026 not the 1950s and the Korean war.
Again as stated if the entire time frame makes a national power then Princeton and Yale would be considered national powerhouses in football which is just so far beyond dumb not really sure theres even a word for it.
Also again rosters change every year. They havent even been bowl eligible the last 4 years and other than short spurts they are bottom of the barrel.
You want to use a team that has a strong tradition that hasnt been that good over the last decade its FSU. Southern Cal with Carrol and Kiffin in the early 2000s but again when you have to go back more than half a century thats not an argument
Michigan State had two excellent coaches… Biggie Munn and Duffy Daugherty. They were a National power from around 1949 through 1966. There is a very compelling football tradition that exists at Michigan State. Your simplistic overview of the MSU football program is just ignorant. And yes… we have had this discussion here before.
They were a phantom PI call away against ND from going undefeated in 2013.
Basebal guy probably doesn't know that MSU was the 10th member to join the conference, thus making it the ''BIG TEN'' conference in 1953. They won the National Championship as an independent the year before in 1952. So they were a National football power before, and after they became a BIG TEN member. During this time frame, they were riding a 28 game win streak.
What year is it. Last I checked its 2026 not the 1950s and the Korean war.
Again as stated if the entire time frame makes a national power then Princeton and Yale would be considered national powerhouses in football which is just so far beyond dumb not really sure theres even a word for it.
Also again rosters change every year. They havent even been bowl eligible the last 4 years and other than short spurts they are bottom of the barrel.
You want to use a team that has a strong tradition that hasnt been that good over the last decade its FSU. Southern Cal with Carrol and Kiffin in the early 2000s but again when you have to go back more than half a century thats not an argument
Michigan State had two excellent coaches… Biggie Munn and Duffy Daugherty. They were a National power from around 1949 through 1966. There is a very compelling football tradition that exists at Michigan State. Your simplistic overview of the MSU football program is just ignorant. And yes… we have had this discussion here before.
They were a phantom PI call away against ND from going undefeated in 2013.
Basebal guy probably doesn't know that MSU was the 10th member to join the conference, thus making it the ''BIG TEN'' conference in 1953. They won the National Championship as an independent the year before in 1952. So they were a National football power before, and after they became a BIG TEN member. During this time frame, they were riding a 28 game win streak.
What year is it. Last I checked its 2026 not the 1950s and the Korean war.
Again as stated if the entire time frame makes a national power then Princeton and Yale would be considered national powerhouses in football which is just so far beyond dumb not really sure theres even a word for it.
Also again rosters change every year. They havent even been bowl eligible the last 4 years and other than short spurts they are bottom of the barrel.
You want to use a team that has a strong tradition that hasnt been that good over the last decade its FSU. Southern Cal with Carrol and Kiffin in the early 2000s but again when you have to go back more than half a century thats not an argument
And Alabama hasn't won anything in 6 years.
Bama is top three for Nattys if we are going history
But yes I have said multiple times that Debour is not the right coach there. Hes going to take them a step back like Kelly did at LSU which Kiffin should make LSU a power again
Michigan State isn't exactly a dominant program but they HAVE won 11+ games six times in the last 16 years and 10 another. That's twice as many 11-win seasons as LSU. Triple the number from Texas.
I would like to commend LSU for remaining an accredited university even though they produce, indisputably, the stupidest graduates! Football school? Perhaps not. Idiot factory? Without a doubt.
@Tabe said:
Michigan State isn't exactly a dominant program but they HAVE won 11+ games six times in the last 16 years and 10 another. That's twice as many 11-win seasons as LSU. Triple the number from Texas.
Texas is a very good example of a program that back to back hired the wrong coaches and had to build themselves back up
LSU Oregon had a short leash, not sure how that would of turned out but after winning the Natty where every offensive starter signed with an NFL team the covid stuff happened and made it harder to reload. Either way Kelly was a terrible higher that set them back
@perkdog, there are at least two members who are dyed in the wool homers that will argue anything for the sake of their chosen conference and two others who just like to stir the pot. Add to that maybe 3-4 members who arrive late in the NCAA season if, and only if, their chosen team is in the playoff hunt. The end result is diminished actual discussion about what’s going on.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin
Comments
@Bullsitter
when does Mardi Gras start
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin
And yet out of the 28 since the BCS started the SEC has won 17 of them. Even if you dont count Oklahoma and Texas its still 15 which is over half.
Youre the one that brought up the draft
Fire AJ Preller
that's a fun fact. completely irrelevant but fun all the same. 15 outta 28. wow. hair be blown' back.
Ah bringing up years past to make it sound like the SEC is still relevant.
2025 SEC bowl record 4-10
SEC bowl record vs BIG TEN last two years 2-8
Youre the one that brought up years past but sure the conference with the most NFL players every year is somehow irrelevant
Fire AJ Preller
CRAZY that some of these football powers have never played each other.
2025 SEC bowl record 4-10
SEC bowl record vs BIG TEN last two years 2-8
None of those are actually surprising for the pre playoff era. VT is only good every now and then. Pac 12 schools never wanted to schedule SEC teams. Ole Miss was bad for a while until Kiffin turned the program around. ND makes their own schedule which is basically an ACC schedule with NAVY added. I guess Texas FSU is the closest to a surprise, Clemson Michigan just seems wrong and weird for a regular season game. Oklahoma would have nothing to gain playing Michigan State which is not a notable football program, they had a couple good years like 20 years ago and thats it
Fire AJ Preller
those top 2 are very hard to believe
@Basebal21
Michigan State had two excellent coaches… Biggie Munn and Duffy Daugherty. They were a National power from around 1949 through 1966. There is a very compelling football tradition that exists at Michigan State. Your simplistic overview of the MSU football program is just ignorant. And yes… we have had this discussion here before.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Its 2026. That argument is like saying that Army and Navy are premier programs because of their dominance during WW2, the Korean War and Vietnam. When you go over half a decade being irrelevant with only a few years of exception you arent a football power house or a blue blood or anything like that.
Michigan State is not a football school. Its a basketball school. More often than not Michigan State football is at the bottom of the conference. They were trash in the 70s,80s,90s, 2000s and now. Yes they had a couple years a decade ago where they were good but that was the outlier not the tradition
Fire AJ Preller
NCAA final AP poll ranking for MSU starting in 1948:
1948 -14; 1949 -19; 1950- 8; 1951-2; 1952- 1; 1953- 3; 1955- 2; 1956- 9;
1957- 3; 1959- 11; 1960- 15; 1961- 8; 1963- 9; 1965- 2; 1966- 2; 1974-12;
1978- 12; 1987- 8; 1989- 16; 1990- 16; 1997- 7; 2008- 24; 2010- 14; 2011- 14;
2013- 3; 2014- 5; 2015- 6; 2017- 15; 2021- 9
Michigan State has an excellent tradition in both football and basketball. In fact, MSU was ranked continuously over twenty straight seasons and finished in the top twenty for 15 of those seasons. And while the period from 1997 through 2021 does not match their earlier success, 9 seasons in the top twenty is noteworthy. From 1918 through 2025, MSU compiled a record of 616-420-30. If I bothered to do the math, I suspect you will find that either Ohio State or Michigan State was the premier Big Ten Football team from the time the Spartans joined the conference in 1950 through the end of the 1966 season.
Biggie Munn is the only coach that beat Frank Leahy’s Notre Dame teams for three straight years. And in the process, managed to win 28 straight games. These are the facts that create legends and traditions. Your statements reflect you do not seem to possess an interest or even an adequate understanding of College Football history… Otherwise you would show some respect for both Munn and Daugherty and the MSU football accomplishments.
Please don’t try and dig yourself out of the hole you created.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
I dont care about wins prior to WW2. Michigan counts wins against YMCA and High School teams in that period.
Dantonio gave them a short window in the 2010s and Perles had a short stretch in the late 80s early 90s.
Its a basketball school thats good sometimes. Just like Ole Miss is a baseball school that is good at football sometimes. VT wants to be a football school but like Michigan State isnt very good at it most of the time but have been good at baseball lately.
Michigan State is not a blue blood and a lot of their recent success which there hasnt been much like 2021 was a result of a very weak schedule.
Even before the transfer portal college rosters had a lot of turnover every couple of years. Some of the exceptions have been getting a little absurd with 6 and 7 year guys but anytime you go back further than that youre talking about a completely different team
I couldnt care less what teams did where no one from the team is alive anymore, Princeton and Yale are the biggest power houses in college football with the most titles if were going back that far
Fire AJ Preller
Nice to see the basebal guy still has his SEC homer instincts.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin
Youre welcome to contribute to the discussion to and actually dispute things if you want to. Or you can keep doing that
Fire AJ Preller
@Basebal21
WW II ended in 1945. Munn’s first season as Head Coach was 1947, so we are clearly in the Post War Era. You really need to contemplate who played each other and when they played as your pre WW II comments are just not accurate. We previously had the discussion about Ole Miss and legendary coach football coach Johnny Vaught. You seem unable to accept that Ole Miss was also a National football power. I really do not see the need to re-litigate the SEC football championships won by Ole Miss as well as the number Sugar Bowl appearances. What I have written is historical fact… just because you couldn’t care less does not somehow change or diminish the great traditions of Michigan State and Ole Miss football even if we start at the Post War Era (1945 to the present).
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
There is another discussion that can be had about the impact of WW2 and other drafts for war with the impact on talent going forward.
Our big disagreement is the time frames. Yes if we go back to the 40s and 50s and Ole Miss Vaught was what like 1970. They were overall bad till what Nutt came along in the 2000s then Freeze then a bad coach than Kiffin bot them back on track. I do expect them to regress with Kiffin gone.
I dont really have any strong feelings either way about Michigan State or Ole Miss football other than neither team is really a football school when you have to go back so far for it.
There need to be a cut off at some point. O;e Miss has been in the baseball playoffs basically every year the last 20 years and has been a baseball school. LSU baseball and football yea that one you can argue either way.
Fire AJ Preller
Hey basebal guy, what’s to discuss?? Most of what you post is “opinion” which you’re free to express, I only point out that it’s biased and tilted towards one specific conference. We all have our favorite teams and conferences but there a few members such as yourself who regurgitate the same things over and over.
At least try to be a little objective, the games haven’t even started yet.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin
I don’t care about Wins between Vietnam and the Gulf War that fall before the first harvest moon of Autumn.
basebal thinks Biggie Munn was a 90s rapper
Records are actually indisputable facts, so are draft numbers, so are players in the NFL etc. You are right that the OSU people who root for rivals accuse others of doing what you actually do and ignore facts you dont like which does lead to a circle of things having to be repeated.
Fire AJ Preller
They were a phantom PI call away against ND from going undefeated in 2013.
Basebal guy probably doesn't know that MSU was the 10th member to join the conference, thus making it the ''BIG TEN'' conference in 1953. They won the National Championship as an independent the year before in 1952. So they were a National football power before, and after they became a BIG TEN member. During this time frame, they were riding a 28 game win streak.
2025 SEC bowl record 4-10
SEC bowl record vs BIG TEN last two years 2-8
So they were or they weren’t depending which side of the fence you’re on. But this must be a corner lot because there’s another side which just wonders why any of this might matter to anyone.
Being honest I had no idea who he was either, but it would be a cool name for a rapper 😂😂😂
What year is it. Last I checked its 2026 not the 1950s and the Korean war.
Again as stated if the entire time frame makes a national power then Princeton and Yale would be considered national powerhouses in football which is just so far beyond dumb not really sure theres even a word for it.
Also again rosters change every year. They havent even been bowl eligible the last 4 years and other than short spurts they are bottom of the barrel.
You want to use a team that has a strong tradition that hasnt been that good over the last decade its FSU. Southern Cal with Carrol and Kiffin in the early 2000s but again when you have to go back more than half a century thats not an argument
Fire AJ Preller
And Alabama hasn't won anything in 6 years.
2025 SEC bowl record 4-10
SEC bowl record vs BIG TEN last two years 2-8
Bama is top three for Nattys if we are going history
But yes I have said multiple times that Debour is not the right coach there. Hes going to take them a step back like Kelly did at LSU which Kiffin should make LSU a power again
Fire AJ Preller
Michigan State isn't exactly a dominant program but they HAVE won 11+ games six times in the last 16 years and 10 another. That's twice as many 11-win seasons as LSU. Triple the number from Texas.
Less than 4 months left before OSU ends their losing streak.
How 'bout them Canes.
I would like to commend LSU for remaining an accredited university even though they produce, indisputably, the stupidest graduates! Football school? Perhaps not. Idiot factory? Without a doubt.
Texas is a very good example of a program that back to back hired the wrong coaches and had to build themselves back up
LSU Oregon had a short leash, not sure how that would of turned out but after winning the Natty where every offensive starter signed with an NFL team the covid stuff happened and made it harder to reload. Either way Kelly was a terrible higher that set them back
Fire AJ Preller
Did we figure out which conference deserves the most respect yet though? I'm pretty sure it's the SEC-10.
It's going to be disappointing if you guys run out of things to fight about once the season starts
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin
@perkdog, there are at least two members who are dyed in the wool homers that will argue anything for the sake of their chosen conference and two others who just like to stir the pot. Add to that maybe 3-4 members who arrive late in the NCAA season if, and only if, their chosen team is in the playoff hunt. The end result is diminished actual discussion about what’s going on.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin