Strike doubling on the edge lettering of a coin?

sellitstore · March 14, 2026 6:13AM

We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

lermish · March 14, 2026 8:38AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@sellitstore said:
Why do you quote from the separate thread that I started here in this thread?

I asked a technical striking question and you brought it back over here.

If you can't answer my tech question, started in another thread, please don't move my discussion here.

Was this a mistake or is there some other reason for hijacking this thread and not responding to my technical minting question?

Your response seems so inappropriate for a technical minting question. What's this about Washington and the Hessians? And we don't debate symbolism of coins in production, only proposed designs? How about past designs? What are you talking about?

I think you're confused as to which thread you're on.

There we go.

jmlanzaf · March 14, 2026 8:39AM

@lermish said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@sellitstore said:
Why do you quote from the separate thread that I started here in this thread?

I asked a technical striking question and you brought it back over here.

If you can't answer my tech question, started in another thread, please don't move my discussion here.

Was this a mistake or is there some other reason for hijacking this thread and not responding to my technical minting question?

Your response seems so inappropriate for a technical minting question. What's this about Washington and the Hessians? And we don't debate symbolism of coins in production, only proposed designs? How about past designs? What are you talking about?

I think you're confused as to which thread you're on.

There we go.

Now you're going to confuse him again. Lol

mr1931S · March 14, 2026 9:02AM

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

JBK · March 14, 2026 9:15AM

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

jmlanzaf · March 14, 2026 9:45AM

@JBK said:

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

Why can't it hop a little while going through the edge lettering machine?

JBK · March 14, 2026 9:51AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

Why can't it hop a little while going through the edge lettering machine?

Partial/skipped lettering as mentioned above.

They are under great pressure when rolled between the lettered and blank bar.

I don't see any "strike doubling" being possible. Would love to see photos if anyone thinks they've seen it.

jmlanzaf · March 14, 2026 10:21AM

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

Why can't it hop a little while going through the edge lettering machine?

Partial/skipped lettering as mentioned above.

They are under great pressure when rolled between the lettered and blank bar.

I don't see any "strike doubling" being possible. Would love to see photos if anyone thinks they've seen it.

I still don't see why a tiny hop or slip couldn't cause local SD. It wouldn't be on the whole legend, obviously.

TPring · March 14, 2026 10:24AM

You can also have "slide doubling." A form of strike doubling that is smooth rather than step-like. Not able to find a good pic so I am proxying with this mint mark [circled vertical] which may or may not qualify as slide doubling.

JBK · March 14, 2026 10:25AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

Why can't it hop a little while going through the edge lettering machine?

Partial/skipped lettering as mentioned above.

They are under great pressure when rolled between the lettered and blank bar.

I don't see any "strike doubling" being possible. Would love to see photos if anyone thinks they've seen it.

I still don't see why a tiny hop or slip couldn't cause local SD. It wouldn't be on the whole legend, obviously.

I don't see any chance for a "hop" and a "slip" where the lettered bar drags across the coin (or the coin drags across the bar) would not result in a doubled letter.

But billions of edge-lettered dollar coins have been struck so if MD/SD coins exist then let's see them.

jmlanzaf · March 14, 2026 10:29AM

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

Why can't it hop a little while going through the edge lettering machine?

Partial/skipped lettering as mentioned above.

They are under great pressure when rolled between the lettered and blank bar.

I don't see any "strike doubling" being possible. Would love to see photos if anyone thinks they've seen it.

I still don't see why a tiny hop or slip couldn't cause local SD. It wouldn't be on the whole legend, obviously.

I don't see any chance for a "hop" and a "slip" where the lettered bar drags across the coin (or the coin drags across the bar) would not result in a doubled letter.

But billions of edge-lettered dollar coins have been struck so if MD/SD coins exist then let's see them.

There's one on the other thread that looks like MD/SD

JBK · March 14, 2026 10:40AM

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

Why can't it hop a little while going through the edge lettering machine?

Partial/skipped lettering as mentioned above.

They are under great pressure when rolled between the lettered and blank bar.

I don't see any "strike doubling" being possible. Would love to see photos if anyone thinks they've seen it.

I still don't see why a tiny hop or slip couldn't cause local SD. It wouldn't be on the whole legend, obviously.

I don't see any chance for a "hop" and a "slip" where the lettered bar drags across the coin (or the coin drags across the bar) would not result in a doubled letter.

But billions of edge-lettered dollar coins have been struck so if MD/SD coins exist then let's see them.

There's one on the other thread that looks like MD/SD

Not to me. It appears to me to just be very deeply struck.

Besides, there would need to be an informed explanation as to how it happened within the minting process, as is the case with all alleged errors.

jmlanzaf · March 14, 2026 10:47AM

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@jmlanzaf said:

@JBK said:

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

What is a good point? The basic premise - that edge lettering strike doubling exists - seems to be faulty.

Edge lettering can be partial if the coin gets stuck in the castaing machine and skips some of the process (expect to see a messy depression in the edge where the bar with the lettering ground against the coin), it can be added twice if the coin goes through the machine a second time (the second set of lettering can be upside down or not), or it can be missing altogether.

The above scenarios apply to business strikes, not proofs, which use a collar with the lettering on it.

Why can't it hop a little while going through the edge lettering machine?

Partial/skipped lettering as mentioned above.

They are under great pressure when rolled between the lettered and blank bar.

I don't see any "strike doubling" being possible. Would love to see photos if anyone thinks they've seen it.

I still don't see why a tiny hop or slip couldn't cause local SD. It wouldn't be on the whole legend, obviously.

I don't see any chance for a "hop" and a "slip" where the lettered bar drags across the coin (or the coin drags across the bar) would not result in a doubled letter.

But billions of edge-lettered dollar coins have been struck so if MD/SD coins exist then let's see them.

There's one on the other thread that looks like MD/SD

Not to me. It appears to me to just be very deeply struck.

Besides, there would need to be an informed explanation as to how it happened within the minting process, as is the case with all alleged errors.

JBK · March 14, 2026 10:56AM

On my screen I am seeing extremely deep (and therefore wide) lettering, plus a gouge to the left of one of Rs.

JBK · March 14, 2026 11:03AM

This article has good photos of various edge-lettering errors.

I don't see anything I'd call MD/SD. One of the improperly spaced errors shows "dragged" letters.

https://minterrornews.com/features-7-31-07-george_washington_dollars.html

jmlanzaf · March 14, 2026 11:13AM

@JBK said:
This article has good photos of various edge-lettering errors.

I don't see anything I'd call MD/SD. One of the improperly spaced errors shows "dragged" letters.

https://minterrornews.com/features-7-31-07-george_washington_dollars.html

I think "dragged" letters would be the equivalent.

pursuitofliberty · March 14, 2026 1:30PM

To the OP ... are speculating for new coins, like the Washington Dollars being discussed in this and other threads recently, or are we talking about edge lettering imparted with a Castaing Machine?

These are entirely different methods, and done at a different sequence in the coining process (and for somewhat different reasons).

For Washington Dollars, maybe we should ask @MWallace to join the discussion. I think he has done quite a lot of research on the subject.

MWallace · March 14, 2026 4:52PM

@pursuitofliberty said:
To the OP ... are speculating for new coins, like the Washington Dollars being discussed in this and other threads recently, or are we talking about edge lettering imparted with a Castaing Machine?

These are entirely different methods, and done at a different sequence in the coining process (and for somewhat different reasons).

For Washington Dollars, maybe we should ask @MWallace to join the discussion. I think he has done quite a lot of research on the subject.

Unfortunately I don't have anything that I can add.

IkesT · March 14, 2026 8:05PM

@mr1931S said:

@sellitstore said:
We understand how strike doubling can happen from a single blow from the dies but how does strike doubling happen when the design isn't impressed by a single sharp blow, where the die may bounce and leave a second impression. How does this happen when the design is being rolled onto the edge, under pressure, for a short period of time? Do we know or can we speculate?

This is a good point.

MsMorrisine · March 14, 2026 8:53PM

strike doubling or mechanical doubling occurs when there's slop in the machines workings.

it is possible for a coin to slide around in a castaing machine. the lettering gets smeared like peanut butter. i have one like it. i sent i in under the error level ond only got a graded coin back. i'd show a picture but i'm too lazy to get the dollar plus it's in a pronged holder that still shows too little of the problems. you can tell it slid against the lettering and stars, plus there is a wide blank spot where lettering would be. there is obvious signs of metal movement

JBK · March 14, 2026 9:23PM

@MsMorrisine said:
strike doubling or mechanical doubling occurs when there's slop in the machines workings.

it is possible for a coin to slide around in a castaing machine. the lettering gets smeared like peanut butter. i have one like it. i sent i in under the error level ond only got a graded coin back. i'd show a picture but i'm too lazy to get the dollar plus it's in a pronged holder that still shows too little of the problems. you can tell it slid against the lettering and stars, plus there is a wide blank spot where lettering would be. there is obvious signs of metal movement

To me, that's an error. Missing letters.

jacrispies · March 16, 2026 9:58AM

I had photos of bust half edge lettering shelf-doubling that I deleted last night. It was an interesting phenomenon that I posted about on a forum, but am unable to find the thread discussion. The edge lettering was complete, but showed a machine doubling effect on the letters, not strike doubled.

If this topic is serious, which it isn't looking like it, I can pull out coins and retake photos of the edges of my bust halves.

sellitstore · March 17, 2026 3:18PM

Thanks to everyone who offered useful information.

lermish · March 18, 2026 7:17AM

@sellitstore said:
Thanks to everyone who offered useful information.

What about for those of us who reminded you that you owe an apology to @jmlanzaf because you got confused and chastised him incorrectly in an unrelated thread?

jmlanzaf · March 18, 2026 7:42AM

@lermish said:

@sellitstore said:
Thanks to everyone who offered useful information.

What about for those of us who reminded you that you owe an apology to @jmlanzaf because you got confused and chastised him incorrectly in an unrelated thread?

I'm good. But thanks for providing useful information on this thread!

sellitstore · March 19, 2026 6:06AM

Lermish is wrong yet again. Yes, I did apologize when I realized my mistake (in the other thread) but I also feel sorry for the miserable who can't help themselves from attacking others at every opportunity, as well as deliberately switching comments between the two threads. Why are you trying to sabotage this thread? You owe me an apology. And you haven't even tried to answer the question that I posed. How childish! I'm hardly the first person to notice and comment about the problem posters who spend they sorry lives hanging out here. I've invested my five minutes and and am done for the day. See how easy it is? Bye for now.

lermish · March 19, 2026 8:45AM

@sellitstore said:
Lermish is wrong yet again. Yes, I did apologize when I realized my mistake (in the other thread)

No, you didn't. Here are all of your posts since then...where is the apology?

I also feel sorry for the miserable who can't help themselves from attacking others at every opportunity, as well as deliberately switching comments between the two threads. Why are you trying to sabotage this thread? You owe me an apology.

I was just trying to correct your error as you were, and clearly still are, very confused. You insulted @jmlanzaf by mistake because you got confused about which thread you were on. I moved your comment here to the correct thread, essentially without comment.

I figured you would be classy and want to apologize once you realized your mistake. I was wrong about that. Your snarky comment about "thanks" made your intention and attitude clear. I guess I shouldn't expect any gratitude for the help any time soon.

EDITED to remove a comment or two which, while valid, detract from my point.

I am interested in @messydesk 's answer. I greatly enjoyed his interview with Cabbage Coins this morning.

jmlanzaf · March 19, 2026 9:56AM

Oh my

messydesk · March 19, 2026 10:10AM

Wondering if I should answer the OP's question or if we're beyond that now.

jmlanzaf · March 19, 2026 10:11AM

@messydesk said:
Wondering if I should answer the OP's question or if we're beyond that now.

Please answer

Strike doubling on the edge lettering of a coin?

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