Grading 19th C proof coins question

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ajaan
ajaan Posts: 18,005 ✭✭✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

What do TPGs look for when grading 19th C proof coins? I know there are a few members here with professional experience working at a TPG: do you mainly look at the coin as a whole and give it the 'eye test'? What makes this coin a PR62 and not a PF63 or 64? I'm not complaining about the grade, just wondering what you look for.

Seated half dime.avif


DPOTD-3
'Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery'

CU #3245 B.N.A. #428


Don

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  • tradedollarnut
    tradedollarnut Posts: 20,754 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    There appears to be very little original surfaces {highlighted}on this coin. The dead areas limit the grade.

    Early Dollar Set
  • MFeld
    MFeld Posts: 17,132 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Far more often than not, the extent of hairlines is the most likely factor. And that goes for later Proofs, as well.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • TomB
    TomB Posts: 23,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    For me the immediate and most obvious thing is the presence, intensity and placement of hairlines. After that everything else gets considered.

    Thomas Bush Numismatics & Numismatic Photography

    In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson

    image
  • BillJones
    BillJones Posts: 35,933 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I would be the opposite of TDN. I think that the dullnes which appears to be in the right oberse field lowers the grade. The figure of Ms. Liberty looks a bit "washed out."

    This 1836 Gobrect Dollar has the same issue. It's graded PCGS PR-62, CAC

    It's a different type and grading service, but this 1858 dime is graded PR-65.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • tradedollarnut
    tradedollarnut Posts: 20,754 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2026 2:13PM
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    Bill - I highlighted the ok areas to emphasize how much dullness encompasses the coin [particularly on the obverse] So we are in agreement about the right obverse field being grade limiting

    Early Dollar Set
  • epc
    epc Posts: 459 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2026 2:25PM
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    Your half dime appears to be a V-1, which is characterized by lumps in the obverse field, especially around Liberty's head, caused by die rust. The center of the obverse has a sandblasted appearance. Perhaps those "defects" were considered in the grading. But overall, aside from obvious contact marks and other damage, hairlines are a big part of the grading, as indicated by earlier responders. Here's mine for comparison. It's NGC PF64Cam, probably overgraded, as lots of hairlines are visible in my photo.

    And for comparison, here's my 1871 V-11, in NGC PF66Cam. In this coin, all those obvious lines on the obverse are die polish lines, not hairlines. There really shouldn't be any hairlines at 65-66 and higher.

    Collector of Liberty Seated Half Dimes, including die pairs and die states

  • ajaan
    ajaan Posts: 18,005 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2026 3:12PM
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    This PR64 has very little head detail. Should it be a PR62? So confusing.

    Seated dime.avif


    DPOTD-3
    'Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery'

    CU #3245 B.N.A. #428


    Don
  • tradedollarnut
    tradedollarnut Posts: 20,754 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Grading is an art, not a science

    Early Dollar Set
  • BillJones
    BillJones Posts: 35,933 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @ajaan said:
    This PR64 has very little head detail. Should it be a PR62? So confusing.

    Seated dime.avif

    The flat head would immediately preclude a grade higher than PR-64 IMO. As for the rest, I would have to see the coin in person to check the Proof mirrors under a strong light. The fields may be hairlined, or the toning might be a different in that area. There may cloudy to the left and right of the date or not.

    If I were a buyer, the flat head would be a problem on a Proof or even on a Mint State piece.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • jmlanzaf
    jmlanzaf Posts: 43,047 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @ajaan said:
    This PR64 has very little head detail. Should it be a PR62? So confusing.

    Seated dime.avif

    No

    All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.

  • Typekat
    Typekat Posts: 729 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    The “64” grade measures its state of preservation.
    Whether it would bring anywhere near ‘PR64’ money is a different question.

    30+ years coin shop experience (ret.) Coins, bullion, currency, scrap & interesting folks. Loved every minute!

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