@MetroD said:
I was curious about the mintage for 25DA (i.e., "Mintage Limit" = 12,000 vs. Reported Sales [9/7/25] ~ 8,000). So, I e-mailed the Mint, and inquired.
Note - I contacted the Mint directly, not the catalog people.
They just responded. Here is what they said:
Note - I realize that plans can, and do, change. Just sharing what they told me about their current plan.
I received the same type of reply when I contacted them. For some reason, people in this forum don't want to believe it. It sounded to me like they experienced production issues during the first run. Poor transparency by the Mint, but it's the Mint, so I never have high expectations.
Yeah. "For some reason."
I do understand that there is a first time for everything. I also understand that my experience and memory might not be as good as some others here. If so, hopefully someone will correct me.
That said, my "some reason" would be that if they actually follow through, it will be the first time they have ever done it. As I noted in a post above, they have a well established process to either pre-sell or accept back orders.
If they really had production issues, producing exactly 8K, the 8K they coincidentally loaded into ATS weeks before the on-sale date, would indeed be quite the coincidence. If the plan all along was to make 8K to gauge demand before striking 12K, they would have gone to Back Order immediately after the initial 8K were spoken for.
Didn't happen here. When things go Unavailable, they ordinarily only come back in quantity when the Mint cancels orders in quantity, as happened with the Army privy, or when customers cancel in quantity, as I recall happening at least once with, I think, an enhanced uncirculated set.
I have never seen them go back and make more of anything without taking Back Orders. Does anyone know if I am missing something? It not, that's "some reason," after the intentional misinformation shared with Coin World last year in connection with the gold and silver flowing hair releases.
Also, if the Mint is busy going back making up for short strikes, are they also doing so with the 2025 proof sets? The silver medals? I would LOVE to see them actually make up to the published limit if demand warrants. But the reaction of folks like @Raufus who bought in anticipation of an apparent short strike, as well as likely screaming from everyone who bought at elevated prices from the Mint's precious Big Boys, gives me another "some reason" to think this is just nonsense being spewed by someone answering inquiries at the Mint.
Because, again, people who want these want them now. They might not want them the day after tomorrow. If what the Mint told you is true, what is stopping them from accepting back orders, right now, as they have done before with other items when they ran out of inventory but knew they were making more?
As a result, after they have already destroyed their credibility, multiple times over the past year or so, "for some reason" I go with my lyin' eyes rather than what the Mint says. Not saying it can't happen, because, obviously, anything can happen. Just saying I'll believe it when it happens. YMMV. Good luck waiting for your coins.
I contracted with a dealer to buy another one. They said their ABBP order is on back order. Perhaps more will be minted. Hard to imagine that they’d mess with the big boys.
I’m with NJ on this one. I would like another and a couple silver versions though. Such a beauty in hand! But don’t hold your breath waiting on them to go back on sale.
@MetroD said:
I was curious about the mintage for 25DA (i.e., "Mintage Limit" = 12,000 vs. Reported Sales [9/7/25] ~ 8,000). So, I e-mailed the Mint, and inquired.
Note - I contacted the Mint directly, not the catalog people.
They just responded. Here is what they said:
Note - I realize that plans can, and do, change. Just sharing what they told me about their current plan.
on boobtube, "Son of a silver stacker" seems to have an insight into the US Mint stuff. He is either a cheerleader for US Mint or has some inside channels. Recently he 'surmised' that probably "later more Gold Sunflowers would be released". So this email response cross references his notion.
Why not? The technical analysis available indicated a good probability of Gold spot prices going up. The updated prices for any possible later released Gold Libs will also. Just business.
@Tomthemailcarrier said:
I contracted with a dealer to buy another one. They said their ABBP order is on back order. Perhaps more will be minted. Hard to imagine that they’d mess with the big boys.
Right. THEIR order is on Back Order. The rest of us are unable to place Back Orders.
It could also very well be that the Mint accepted too many ABPP orders. Hard to believe, but maybe there is actually a limit for them, given that fewer than 6K of 8K were made available to the public.
I'm a new member here and this is my first post. I know sss pretty well. He does not have inside connections at the U.S. Mint who would share such information. He follows their weekly and monthly sales data closely. He speculates based on the available empirical data. He's strictly guessing about future production of the 2025 American Liberty gold coins and silver medals. In my opinion if there was a firm plan to release a batch of a few thousand more gold coins at a future time ... given the price and popularity of this release ... we'd have already heard about it via Coinnews.net or directly from the U.S. Mint itself. By the way, I was the person who managed to buy the other 2025 American Liberty gold coin on Saturday, September 6th. I was on the U.S. Mint web site at 7:20am that morning all ready to go. I had missed on 5 other mornings when I managed to get the gold coin in my bag, finish the online ordering sequence, and hit the "Submit Order" button ... all within 8 seconds. Each time I found myself looking at the words (in red): "Please remove this item from your bag. The item is no longer available." Last Saturday at 7:30 am I refreshed the page. Nothing. I hit refresh again and again nothing. I did it a 3rd time and I thought my eyes were deceiving me. The "Add to Bag" button went red. I went through the same procedure as before but this time when I tapped the "Submit Order" button, it said "Please wait". Then I saw "Thank you for your order." I let out a loud scream and almost spilled my coffee. The coin arrived a few minutes ago (I had it shipped UPS 2nd day air). It's gorgeous. I hope they hold the total mintage at no more than 8,000 coins.
@delvinator said:
I'm a new member here and this is my first post. I know sss pretty well. He does not have inside connections at the U.S. Mint who would share such information. He follows their weekly and monthly sales data closely. He speculates based on the available empirical data. He's strictly guessing about future production of the 2025 American Liberty gold coins and silver medals. In my opinion if there was a firm plan to release a batch of a few thousand more gold coins at a future time ... given the price and popularity of this release ... we'd have already heard about it via Coinnews.net or directly from the U.S. Mint itself. By the way, I was the person who managed to buy the other 2025 American Liberty gold coin on Saturday, September 6th. I was on the U.S. Mint web site at 7:20am that morning all ready to go. I had missed on 5 other mornings when I managed to get the gold coin in my bag, finish the online ordering sequence, and hit the "Submit Order" button ... all within 8 seconds. Each time I found myself looking at the words (in red): "Please remove this item from your bag. The item is no longer available." Last Saturday at 7:30 am I refreshed the page. Nothing. I hit refresh again and again nothing. I did it a 3rd time and I thought my eyes were deceiving me. The "Add to Bag" button went red. I went through the same procedure as before but this time when I tapped the "Submit Order" button, it said "Please wait". Then I saw "Thank you for your order." I let out a loud scream and almost spilled my coffee. The coin arrived a few minutes ago (I had it shipped UPS 2nd day air). It's gorgeous. I hope they hold the total mintage at no more than 8,000 coins.
Congratulations on your score, and welcome to the forum.
Paragraphs help! 😀
I'm certainly no SSS, and have absolutely no inside information myself. I also don't pore over Mint sales reports, and then engage in idle speculation "based on the available empirical data. " Just a modicum of common sense informing an analysis.
If the Mint dumps 4K more coins on the market, one month plus after an 8K short strike sell out, that will destroy the Big Boy's ability to resell any future short strikes for premium prices. Can't have that.
If they are going to retain their ability to be opaque and not mint up to the published limit regardless of demand, no more coins will magically appear. Otherwise, they are just going to piss off everyone who likes the short strikes, in addition to everyone wanting transparency. When they run out of people to piss off, their problems creating excitement for their numismatic offerings will reach heights heretofore unimaginable.
If they do mint 4,000 more do I need to have one of that mintage also?
The USM did for some reason have issues with production this year. They stopped production of the silver proof set and recalled unsold inventory due to corrosion, and apparently from another post here the proof set must have had some kind of issue. Those of course were S mint.
@zeesh said:
if they release the rest without the HHL, how long are we thinking for the bigs to clear em out?
Yet another reason I don't think this is ever going to happen. If they ever had any intent to do this, the HHL would still be in place, given how many people were shut out on Day One. And, I've never seen them reinstate a HHL after lifting one.
That's right. Don't tell me that. Transparency and honesty is all I expect. Plans can change. Just tell me. Or don't. But don't disseminate information that turns out to the bad when "plans change," and then just leave it hanging out there because you think you have no obligation to be honest and transparent.
They did tell you the plan. The plan is to mint no more than 12k. That hasn't changed.
As you can see there is at least a notion of a second production run. The managers probably have to see if they can fit into to their production schedule. You never know what maintenance or logistical issues may have come up. I'm sure the production process is very fluid. For example, they probably have some capacity freed up if they decide to short run the rest of the Comic coins due to poor sales. You ascribe ill intentions and incompetence, but the reality is that running a production line is not trivial. You want more clarity but it's likely the mint doesn't even know, so perhaps a little grace is warranted.
If "the remaining balance of the "mintage limit" are being struck and will be offered for sale later this year," why are they not being offered for sale right now, on a Back Order basis? Why selectively release that information to @MetroD?
Easy. Uncertainty about being able to produce them. They don't want to write checks they can't cash, which is smart and prudent.
I happen to think that is nonsense. Superman was sold as a pre-order. Laser privy went to Back Order when they actually ran out of the initial quantity made, with an intent to make and sell more.
Quite possibly they were pre-orders and backorders due to production issues or backlogs. Stop pretending that you know their operations run flawlessly.
Maybe they are actually going to make more and put them on sale. Maybe not. But recent history really does suggest that anyone who relies on anything they say does so at their own risk. Because they are the opposite of transparent. And, apparently, "plans can, and do, change."
Ah, now you get it. But you can rely on the production limit. They tend not to exceed that number.
I do not know the 'identity/position' of the person responding.
It's AI. 🤣
All kidding aside, the fact that it's a canned, unsigned, generic response means it has as much weight as the notice on the web page saying that "We are currently out of this item, but it may be restocked later." Sure, they restock them a few at a time as returns come in.
If they actually had plans to make more, they'd accept back orders. They could always cancel them if the "unexpected" happens and their plans change. They have no plans. If they did, the HHL would still be in place, in order to give those who missed out the same shot at them everyone else had on release day.
As @ProofCollection so astutely notes above, "Uncertainty about being able to produce them. They don't want to write checks they can't cash, which is smart and prudent."
Which begs the question as to why the generic response states with certainty "The remaining balance of the "mintage limit" ARE BEING STRUCK AND WILL BE OFFERED FOR SALE LATER THIS YEAR" when that is clearly not the case, as evidenced by the fact that they are not accepting back orders.
It very well might be an AI response. If not, it's certainly not something anyone at the Mint is willing to attach a name to. So I treat it accordingly. YMMV.
C'mon guys, I know the truth is painful, but the fact is that there is no more struck for this coin. The train has left and you're LATE to the party. Just ACCEPT it
All kidding aside, the fact that it's a canned, unsigned, generic response means it has as much weight as the notice on the web page saying that "We are currently out of this item, but it may be restocked later." Sure, they restock them a few at a time as returns come in.
If they actually had plans to make more, they'd accept back orders. They could always cancel them if the "unexpected" happens and their plans change. They have no plans. If they did, the HHL would still be in place, in order to give those who missed out the same shot at them everyone else had on release day.
As @ProofCollection so astutely notes above, "Uncertainty about being able to produce them. They don't want to write checks they can't cash, which is smart and prudent."
Which begs the question as to why the generic response states with certainty "The remaining balance of the "mintage limit" ARE BEING STRUCK AND WILL BE OFFERED FOR SALE LATER THIS YEAR" when that is clearly not the case, as evidenced by the fact that they are not accepting back orders.
It very well might be an AI response. If not, it's certainly not something anyone at the Mint is willing to attach a name to. So I treat it accordingly. YMMV.
I asked. They answered, admittedly forwarded and unsigned. Thought that their answer was intriguing, so I shared it.
Given that I cannot corroborate the Mint answer, your skepticism is justified.
Did they release lots more, they're available this morning?
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@zeesh said:
if they release the rest without the HHL, how long are we thinking for the bigs to clear em out?
15 minutes
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@jmlanzaf said:
I have it on good (?) authority from NJ that this morning never happened.
Yup! Just goes to show, they can and will do anything. @MetroD's response from the Mint was spot on, and, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it. I saw it, and now I believe it.
They effed over everyone who wanted one, and couldn't get one on August 21st, when the HHL was one, while feeding unlimited quantities to whoever was given a heads-up that these would be coming out this morning. Or whoever had a bot set up to grab them when they appeared.
3K gone in 15 minutes. I'm sure retail was well taken care of. Which begs the question, why play games, and why have HHLs at all? 2/3 of a maximum mintage made available at release, with a full quarter of them going to Big Boys.
People wondering whether more will be made, with those who directly ask being privately told yes. A "Remind Me" button on the website invites people to sign up for notifications when more are made available.
More are made available, suddenly, without notification, and without HHLs. They are all scarfed up in a few minutes.
Whatever. At this point, nothing is shocking, nothing is transparent, nothing is "fair," and they have pretty well established that there are no rules.
Their sandbox. They can do what they want, as long as people are willing to go along. At some point, people will likely get annoyed, and the game will be over. They seem to be having a problem giving away 170K proof Peace Dollars at slightly more than 2x spot.
@jmlanzaf said:
I have it on good (?) authority from NJ that this morning never happened.
Yup! Just goes to show, they can and will do anything. @MetroD's response from the Mint was spot on, and, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it. I saw it, and now I believe it.
They effed over everyone who wanted one, and couldn't get one on August 21st, when the HHL was one, while feeding unlimited quantities to whoever was given a heads-up that these would be coming out this morning. Or whoever had a bot set up to grab them when they appeared.
3K gone in 15 minutes. I'm sure retail was well taken care of. Which begs the question, why play games, and why have HHLs at all? 2/3 of a maximum mintage made available at release, with a full quarter of them going to Big Boys.
People wondering whether more will be made, with those who directly ask being privately told yes. A "Remind Me" button on the website invites people to sign up for notifications when more are made available.
More are made available, suddenly, without notification, and without HHLs. They are all scarfed up in a few minutes.
Whatever. At this point, nothing is shocking, nothing is transparent, nothing is "fair," and they have pretty well established that there are no rules.
Their sandbox. They can do what they want, as long as people are willing to go along. At some point, people will likely get annoyed, and the game will be over. They seem to be having a problem giving away 170K proof Peace Dollars at slightly more than 2x spot.
I'm glad you're admitting you were wrong. Oh wait, you're actually just rambling on more justifying your wrongness, lol. By now you should have learned the life lesson: the past is not a guarantee of the future. But I'm sure you're just going to ramble on for a few paragraphs in attempt to repair your ego. Your credibility is lost. Move along.
@jmlanzaf said:
I have it on good (?) authority from NJ that this morning never happened.
Yup! Just goes to show, they can and will do anything. @MetroD's response from the Mint was spot on, and, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it. I saw it, and now I believe it.
Any chance you've learned why it's important not to make assumptions and pretend you know what the mint is doing or plans to do when it turns out you have no clue?
They effed over everyone who wanted one, and couldn't get one on August 21st, when the HHL was one, while feeding unlimited quantities to whoever was given a heads-up that these would be coming out this morning. Or whoever had a bot set up to grab them when they appeared.
Not really. Anyone who wanted one easily got one during the hours after the initial release. Now you're making assumptions again about insiders having special information. It's a public website, anyone can see when things become available.
3K gone in 15 minutes. I'm sure retail was well taken care of. Which begs the question, why play games, and why have HHLs at all? 2/3 of a maximum mintage made available at release, with a full quarter of them going to Big Boys.
The HHL allowed anyone who wanted one to get one during the first few hours of release. It used to be a mad scramble and lottery, and now it's very easy to get any new coin they release without a lot of angst and effort.
People wondering whether more will be made, with those who directly ask being privately told yes. A "Remind Me" button on the website invites people to sign up for notifications when more are made available.
Evidently they weren't available long enough to let everyone know.
More are made available, suddenly, without notification, and without HHLs. They are all scarfed up in a few minutes.
Whatever. At this point, nothing is shocking, nothing is transparent, nothing is "fair," and they have pretty well established that there are no rules.
The US mint waiting room that lets anyone who wants one to get one on release day is the fairest thing they've ever done. How could they make it more fair?
Their sandbox. They can do what they want, as long as people are willing to go along. At some point, people will likely get annoyed, and the game will be over. They seem to be having a problem giving away 170K proof Peace Dollars at slightly more than 2x spot.
And now maybe you can understand that manufacturing and selling numismatic products is unpredictable and not as straight-forward as you imagine it to be.
@jmlanzaf said:
I have it on good (?) authority from NJ that this morning never happened.
Yup! Just goes to show, they can and will do anything. @MetroD's response from the Mint was spot on, and, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it. I saw it, and now I believe it.
They effed over everyone who wanted one, and couldn't get one on August 21st, when the HHL was one, while feeding unlimited quantities to whoever was given a heads-up that these would be coming out this morning. Or whoever had a bot set up to grab them when they appeared.
3K gone in 15 minutes. I'm sure retail was well taken care of. Which begs the question, why play games, and why have HHLs at all? 2/3 of a maximum mintage made available at release, with a full quarter of them going to Big Boys.
People wondering whether more will be made, with those who directly ask being privately told yes. A "Remind Me" button on the website invites people to sign up for notifications when more are made available.
More are made available, suddenly, without notification, and without HHLs. They are all scarfed up in a few minutes.
Whatever. At this point, nothing is shocking, nothing is transparent, nothing is "fair," and they have pretty well established that there are no rules.
Their sandbox. They can do what they want, as long as people are willing to go along. At some point, people will likely get annoyed, and the game will be over. They seem to be having a problem giving away 170K proof Peace Dollars at slightly more than 2x spot.
I'm glad you're admitting you were wrong. Oh wait, you're actually just rambling on more justifying your wrongness, lol. By now you should have learned the life lesson: the past is not a guarantee of the future. But I'm sure you're just going to ramble on for a few paragraphs in attempt to repair your ego. Your credibility is lost. Move along.
I still think USMint and big boys are playing a game with us. Even they released more coin, how many were bought by individuals? For whoever in this forum wanted to buy one (or one more from USMint), were you able to buy? Please chime in. I believe most people, who didn't buy on Aug 21, were not able to buy a coin today. They'll have to go to buy from big boys at a manipulated price.
You have to love it. The US Mint restricts retail buyers by HHL of 1 but opens the floodgates after the fact for the dealers. They pulled the same stunt with the privy silver proof eagle coins, waiting 10 days to remove the HHL without any notice.
@jmlanzaf said:
I have it on good (?) authority from NJ that this morning never happened.
Yup! Just goes to show, they can and will do anything. @MetroD's response from the Mint was spot on, and, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it. I saw it, and now I believe it.
They effed over everyone who wanted one, and couldn't get one on August 21st, when the HHL was one, while feeding unlimited quantities to whoever was given a heads-up that these would be coming out this morning. Or whoever had a bot set up to grab them when they appeared.
3K gone in 15 minutes. I'm sure retail was well taken care of. Which begs the question, why play games, and why have HHLs at all? 2/3 of a maximum mintage made available at release, with a full quarter of them going to Big Boys.
People wondering whether more will be made, with those who directly ask being privately told yes. A "Remind Me" button on the website invites people to sign up for notifications when more are made available.
More are made available, suddenly, without notification, and without HHLs. They are all scarfed up in a few minutes.
Whatever. At this point, nothing is shocking, nothing is transparent, nothing is "fair," and they have pretty well established that there are no rules.
Their sandbox. They can do what they want, as long as people are willing to go along. At some point, people will likely get annoyed, and the game will be over. They seem to be having a problem giving away 170K proof Peace Dollars at slightly more than 2x spot.
I'm glad you're admitting you were wrong. Oh wait, you're actually just rambling on more justifying your wrongness, lol. By now you should have learned the life lesson: the past is not a guarantee of the future. But I'm sure you're just going to ramble on for a few paragraphs in attempt to repair your ego. Your credibility is lost. Move along.
No ego, and it's the Mint's credibility that is lost. HHL of 1. But only on less than 6K of a 12K mintage. The rest go to Big Boys, or to bots. Assuming they make them at all. TBD, based on nothing other than whatever they decide.
@CoolCoins said:
What does this bring the total mintage to if 2800 coins were released?
Right now the mintage is about 10,800.
But over 5000 have been taken by the big buys,
and we now know why the mint raised the price $150 this week.
The Mint raised their price because gold went up. It's a fixed formula. They did NOT raise the price for any other reason. They adjust ALL such coin prices every Wednesday.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@jmlanzaf said:
I have it on good (?) authority from NJ that this morning never happened.
Yup! Just goes to show, they can and will do anything. @MetroD's response from the Mint was spot on, and, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it. I saw it, and now I believe it.
They effed over everyone who wanted one, and couldn't get one on August 21st, when the HHL was one, while feeding unlimited quantities to whoever was given a heads-up that these would be coming out this morning. Or whoever had a bot set up to grab them when they appeared.
3K gone in 15 minutes. I'm sure retail was well taken care of. Which begs the question, why play games, and why have HHLs at all? 2/3 of a maximum mintage made available at release, with a full quarter of them going to Big Boys.
People wondering whether more will be made, with those who directly ask being privately told yes. A "Remind Me" button on the website invites people to sign up for notifications when more are made available.
More are made available, suddenly, without notification, and without HHLs. They are all scarfed up in a few minutes.
Whatever. At this point, nothing is shocking, nothing is transparent, nothing is "fair," and they have pretty well established that there are no rules.
Their sandbox. They can do what they want, as long as people are willing to go along. At some point, people will likely get annoyed, and the game will be over. They seem to be having a problem giving away 170K proof Peace Dollars at slightly more than 2x spot.
I'm glad you're admitting you were wrong. Oh wait, you're actually just rambling on more justifying your wrongness, lol. By now you should have learned the life lesson: the past is not a guarantee of the future. But I'm sure you're just going to ramble on for a few paragraphs in attempt to repair your ego. Your credibility is lost. Move along.
I still think USMint and big boys are playing a game with us. Even they released more coin, how many were bought by individuals? For whoever in this forum wanted to buy one (or one more from USMint), were you able to buy? Please chime in. I believe most people, who didn't buy on Aug 21, were not able to buy a coin today. They'll have to go to buy from big boys at a manipulated price.
You can't "manipulate" a price for a relatively common item that's easy to acquire.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@zeesh said:
Some people had issues with the waiting room on release day and it would say wait time 10 hours….and sold out within 2 hours.
Well there should be more at 730 for the next couple days….
It would say 10 hours for a little while then drop to something more reasonable as the estimated wait time became clearer. They have to calculate it, it's not a known value.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
Comments
Yeah. "For some reason."
I do understand that there is a first time for everything. I also understand that my experience and memory might not be as good as some others here. If so, hopefully someone will correct me.
That said, my "some reason" would be that if they actually follow through, it will be the first time they have ever done it. As I noted in a post above, they have a well established process to either pre-sell or accept back orders.
If they really had production issues, producing exactly 8K, the 8K they coincidentally loaded into ATS weeks before the on-sale date, would indeed be quite the coincidence. If the plan all along was to make 8K to gauge demand before striking 12K, they would have gone to Back Order immediately after the initial 8K were spoken for.
Didn't happen here. When things go Unavailable, they ordinarily only come back in quantity when the Mint cancels orders in quantity, as happened with the Army privy, or when customers cancel in quantity, as I recall happening at least once with, I think, an enhanced uncirculated set.
I have never seen them go back and make more of anything without taking Back Orders. Does anyone know if I am missing something? It not, that's "some reason," after the intentional misinformation shared with Coin World last year in connection with the gold and silver flowing hair releases.
Also, if the Mint is busy going back making up for short strikes, are they also doing so with the 2025 proof sets? The silver medals? I would LOVE to see them actually make up to the published limit if demand warrants. But the reaction of folks like @Raufus who bought in anticipation of an apparent short strike, as well as likely screaming from everyone who bought at elevated prices from the Mint's precious Big Boys, gives me another "some reason" to think this is just nonsense being spewed by someone answering inquiries at the Mint.
Because, again, people who want these want them now. They might not want them the day after tomorrow. If what the Mint told you is true, what is stopping them from accepting back orders, right now, as they have done before with other items when they ran out of inventory but knew they were making more?
As a result, after they have already destroyed their credibility, multiple times over the past year or so, "for some reason" I go with my lyin' eyes rather than what the Mint says. Not saying it can't happen, because, obviously, anything can happen. Just saying I'll believe it when it happens. YMMV. Good luck waiting for your coins.
I contracted with a dealer to buy another one. They said their ABBP order is on back order. Perhaps more will be minted. Hard to imagine that they’d mess with the big boys.
I’m with NJ on this one. I would like another and a couple silver versions though. Such a beauty in hand! But don’t hold your breath waiting on them to go back on sale.
on boobtube, "Son of a silver stacker" seems to have an insight into the US Mint stuff. He is either a cheerleader for US Mint or has some inside channels. Recently he 'surmised' that probably "later more Gold Sunflowers would be released". So this email response cross references his notion.
Why not? The technical analysis available indicated a good probability of Gold spot prices going up. The updated prices for any possible later released Gold Libs will also. Just business.
Right. THEIR order is on Back Order. The rest of us are unable to place Back Orders.
It could also very well be that the Mint accepted too many ABPP orders. Hard to believe, but maybe there is actually a limit for them, given that fewer than 6K of 8K were made available to the public.
I'm a new member here and this is my first post. I know sss pretty well. He does not have inside connections at the U.S. Mint who would share such information. He follows their weekly and monthly sales data closely. He speculates based on the available empirical data. He's strictly guessing about future production of the 2025 American Liberty gold coins and silver medals. In my opinion if there was a firm plan to release a batch of a few thousand more gold coins at a future time ... given the price and popularity of this release ... we'd have already heard about it via Coinnews.net or directly from the U.S. Mint itself. By the way, I was the person who managed to buy the other 2025 American Liberty gold coin on Saturday, September 6th. I was on the U.S. Mint web site at 7:20am that morning all ready to go. I had missed on 5 other mornings when I managed to get the gold coin in my bag, finish the online ordering sequence, and hit the "Submit Order" button ... all within 8 seconds. Each time I found myself looking at the words (in red): "Please remove this item from your bag. The item is no longer available." Last Saturday at 7:30 am I refreshed the page. Nothing. I hit refresh again and again nothing. I did it a 3rd time and I thought my eyes were deceiving me. The "Add to Bag" button went red. I went through the same procedure as before but this time when I tapped the "Submit Order" button, it said "Please wait". Then I saw "Thank you for your order." I let out a loud scream and almost spilled my coffee. The coin arrived a few minutes ago (I had it shipped UPS 2nd day air). It's gorgeous. I hope they hold the total mintage at no more than 8,000 coins.
Congratulations on your score, and welcome to the forum.
Paragraphs help! 😀
I'm certainly no SSS, and have absolutely no inside information myself. I also don't pore over Mint sales reports, and then engage in idle speculation "based on the available empirical data. " Just a modicum of common sense informing an analysis.
If the Mint dumps 4K more coins on the market, one month plus after an 8K short strike sell out, that will destroy the Big Boy's ability to resell any future short strikes for premium prices. Can't have that.
If they are going to retain their ability to be opaque and not mint up to the published limit regardless of demand, no more coins will magically appear. Otherwise, they are just going to piss off everyone who likes the short strikes, in addition to everyone wanting transparency. When they run out of people to piss off, their problems creating excitement for their numismatic offerings will reach heights heretofore unimaginable.
If they do mint 4,000 more do I need to have one of that mintage also?
The USM did for some reason have issues with production this year. They stopped production of the silver proof set and recalled unsold inventory due to corrosion, and apparently from another post here the proof set must have had some kind of issue. Those of course were S mint.
what url or email address did you use?
inquiries@usmint.treas.gov
How do we know who that email gets forwarded to?
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
if they release the rest without the HHL, how long are we thinking for the bigs to clear em out?
Yet another reason I don't think this is ever going to happen. If they ever had any intent to do this, the HHL would still be in place, given how many people were shut out on Day One. And, I've never seen them reinstate a HHL after lifting one.
interesting
treasry contact page says it is for non-product inquiries
anyway, the mint was quoted in numisedia saying all of some issue were minted and sold out... it wasn't
we need a red phone to the person posting sales figures
They did tell you the plan. The plan is to mint no more than 12k. That hasn't changed.
As you can see there is at least a notion of a second production run. The managers probably have to see if they can fit into to their production schedule. You never know what maintenance or logistical issues may have come up. I'm sure the production process is very fluid. For example, they probably have some capacity freed up if they decide to short run the rest of the Comic coins due to poor sales. You ascribe ill intentions and incompetence, but the reality is that running a production line is not trivial. You want more clarity but it's likely the mint doesn't even know, so perhaps a little grace is warranted.
Easy. Uncertainty about being able to produce them. They don't want to write checks they can't cash, which is smart and prudent.
Quite possibly they were pre-orders and backorders due to production issues or backlogs. Stop pretending that you know their operations run flawlessly.
Ah, now you get it. But you can rely on the production limit. They tend not to exceed that number.
http://ProofCollection.Net
Fair question.
I do not know the 'identity/position' of the person responding.
It's AI. 🤣
All kidding aside, the fact that it's a canned, unsigned, generic response means it has as much weight as the notice on the web page saying that "We are currently out of this item, but it may be restocked later." Sure, they restock them a few at a time as returns come in.
If they actually had plans to make more, they'd accept back orders. They could always cancel them if the "unexpected" happens and their plans change. They have no plans. If they did, the HHL would still be in place, in order to give those who missed out the same shot at them everyone else had on release day.
As @ProofCollection so astutely notes above, "Uncertainty about being able to produce them. They don't want to write checks they can't cash, which is smart and prudent."
Which begs the question as to why the generic response states with certainty "The remaining balance of the "mintage limit" ARE BEING STRUCK AND WILL BE OFFERED FOR SALE LATER THIS YEAR" when that is clearly not the case, as evidenced by the fact that they are not accepting back orders.
It very well might be an AI response. If not, it's certainly not something anyone at the Mint is willing to attach a name to. So I treat it accordingly. YMMV.
C'mon guys, I know the truth is painful, but the fact is that there is no more struck for this coin. The train has left and you're LATE to the party. Just ACCEPT it
4565
New price ... old news
I asked. They answered, admittedly forwarded and unsigned. Thought that their answer was intriguing, so I shared it.
Given that I cannot corroborate the Mint answer, your skepticism is justified.
Did they release lots more, they're available this morning?
jdimmick;Gerard;wondercoin;claychaser;agentjim007;CCC2010;guitarwes;TAMU15;Zubie;mariner67;segoja;Smittys;kaz;CARDSANDCOINS;FadeToBlack;
jrt103;tizofthe;bronze6827;mkman;Scootersdad;AllCoinsRule;coindeuce;dmarks;piecesofme; and many more
The gold coin is now on back order with an estimated ship date of Fri, 26 Sep 2025.
Over 2800 were available this morning.
About 2000 were gone immediately.
How many silver medals did they release?
Those bastards!
Big boys needed more inventory........
7:46 eastern time - all gone
Back to unavailable status
15 minutes
jdimmick;Gerard;wondercoin;claychaser;agentjim007;CCC2010;guitarwes;TAMU15;Zubie;mariner67;segoja;Smittys;kaz;CARDSANDCOINS;FadeToBlack;
jrt103;tizofthe;bronze6827;mkman;Scootersdad;AllCoinsRule;coindeuce;dmarks;piecesofme; and many more
I have it on good (?) authority from NJ that this morning never happened.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
What does this bring the total mintage to if 2800 coins were released?
Right now the mintage is about 10,800.
But over 5000 have been taken by the big buys,
and we now know why the mint raised the price $150 this week.
Yup! Just goes to show, they can and will do anything. @MetroD's response from the Mint was spot on, and, as I said, I'll believe it when I see it. I saw it, and now I believe it.
They effed over everyone who wanted one, and couldn't get one on August 21st, when the HHL was one, while feeding unlimited quantities to whoever was given a heads-up that these would be coming out this morning. Or whoever had a bot set up to grab them when they appeared.
3K gone in 15 minutes. I'm sure retail was well taken care of. Which begs the question, why play games, and why have HHLs at all? 2/3 of a maximum mintage made available at release, with a full quarter of them going to Big Boys.
People wondering whether more will be made, with those who directly ask being privately told yes. A "Remind Me" button on the website invites people to sign up for notifications when more are made available.
More are made available, suddenly, without notification, and without HHLs. They are all scarfed up in a few minutes.
Whatever. At this point, nothing is shocking, nothing is transparent, nothing is "fair," and they have pretty well established that there are no rules.
Their sandbox. They can do what they want, as long as people are willing to go along. At some point, people will likely get annoyed, and the game will be over. They seem to be having a problem giving away 170K proof Peace Dollars at slightly more than 2x spot.
I'm glad you're admitting you were wrong. Oh wait, you're actually just rambling on more justifying your wrongness, lol. By now you should have learned the life lesson: the past is not a guarantee of the future. But I'm sure you're just going to ramble on for a few paragraphs in attempt to repair your ego. Your credibility is lost. Move along.
Source: https://www.usmint.gov/resources/product-pricing
Link to: Pricing Range Table
Link to: Detailed Pricing Instructions (for adjustments post-release, like this one)
Any chance you've learned why it's important not to make assumptions and pretend you know what the mint is doing or plans to do when it turns out you have no clue?
Not really. Anyone who wanted one easily got one during the hours after the initial release. Now you're making assumptions again about insiders having special information. It's a public website, anyone can see when things become available.
The HHL allowed anyone who wanted one to get one during the first few hours of release. It used to be a mad scramble and lottery, and now it's very easy to get any new coin they release without a lot of angst and effort.
Evidently they weren't available long enough to let everyone know.
The US mint waiting room that lets anyone who wants one to get one on release day is the fairest thing they've ever done. How could they make it more fair?
And now maybe you can understand that manufacturing and selling numismatic products is unpredictable and not as straight-forward as you imagine it to be.
http://ProofCollection.Net
I still think USMint and big boys are playing a game with us. Even they released more coin, how many were bought by individuals? For whoever in this forum wanted to buy one (or one more from USMint), were you able to buy? Please chime in. I believe most people, who didn't buy on Aug 21, were not able to buy a coin today. They'll have to go to buy from big boys at a manipulated price.
They may have had a packaging issue, and still more are left to come out later.
Good stuff, just when it felt like this issue might become boring, more drama!
Keep it up MyMint!
You have to love it. The US Mint restricts retail buyers by HHL of 1 but opens the floodgates after the fact for the dealers. They pulled the same stunt with the privy silver proof eagle coins, waiting 10 days to remove the HHL without any notice.
Some people had issues with the waiting room on release day and it would say wait time 10 hours….and sold out within 2 hours.
Well there should be more at 730 for the next couple days….
No ego, and it's the Mint's credibility that is lost. HHL of 1. But only on less than 6K of a 12K mintage. The rest go to Big Boys, or to bots. Assuming they make them at all. TBD, based on nothing other than whatever they decide.
Poor customer service by the U.S. Mint. I checked the remind me for future availability to be emailed to me. Heard not a peep.
The Mint raised their price because gold went up. It's a fixed formula. They did NOT raise the price for any other reason. They adjust ALL such coin prices every Wednesday.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
You can't "manipulate" a price for a relatively common item that's easy to acquire.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
It would say 10 hours for a little while then drop to something more reasonable as the estimated wait time became clearer. They have to calculate it, it's not a known value.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
There are more conspiracy theories on this thread than an X-files episode.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.