Just read that someone stole a gold nugget at the Long Beach Show
Mr_Spud
Posts: 5,325 ✭✭✭✭✭
I just read this on Facebook
Mr_Spud
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Mr_Spud
Posts: 5,325 ✭✭✭✭✭
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There goes + $50k right out the door.
I’m telling anyone that will listen: the days we’re used to are over. You gotta be so vigilant now. Situational awareness and counter surveillance is everything.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
I’m not surprised.
A few years ago a dealer who had a table at Long Beach decided to stop at a LA casino on his way home. He left his car in the parking lot and when he returned to his car a few hours later he was cleaned out.
How does someone get their paws on a 26 ounce gold rock??
Was it just sitting out on the counter or does someone give it to you to handle and then turn their back?
Time to be much more accountable and try to keep your mind on your task.
I'm not blaming the vendor but something is off.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
There is a chance, unless he sees this flyer (unlikely) he will return either today or tomorrow.
Maybe even wearing the same tee-shirt.
peacockcoins
If the guy circled in red is the thief, then he'll be arrested soon enough.
The problem is the LA County DA. Does Gascon even worry about crimes like this?
Trivia:
If this thief entered the convention center with the intent to steal and then does so he committed two felonies.
Can you name both of them?
peacockcoins
Not sure about Cali but in FL it’s at least a burglary. Could also throw in possession of stolen property.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
Very clever how he camouflaged his shirt with mustard stains so he could walk freely among the dealers and not raise any suspicion.
Very good point. The $10,000 reward will never get paid, because the DA won’t prosecute to convict. Why would I waste my time?
Man you know it’s gonna be melted down 🤬
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/quarters/washington-quarters-major-sets/washington-quarters-date-set-circulation-strikes-1932-present/publishedset/209923
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/quarters/washington-quarters-major-sets/washington-quarters-date-set-circulation-strikes-1932-present/album/209923
Probably already is.
How in the world can a dealer let that big of a nugget get away? Holy Crap.
These days I tend to trust most animals than I do most humans. There seems to be less and less people with a moral compass. Best to be vigilant than sorry.
Is nothing sacred anymore? I hope that the facial recognition computers are working overtime on this lowlife!
Punishment needs to happen that is what is starting to lack. Society has grown soft on criminals and sees them as social ''victims''. Bull my family is not rich and none of us are criminals same goes for people in my area were 99% are hard workers and would never steal from each other.
People chose to be criminals (rich and poor) unless they are insane.
Until justice is swift, certain and severe, this kind of thing will go on unchecked. The crook is the evil villain, the person robbed the victim. Many in our nation and the millennial generation refuse to see that.
What is with Canada and the US not prosecuting criminals?
Is it because of a lack of prison space.
You'd think with all the billions of aid money we give to foreign countries, we could keep a few billion to build numerous prisons for our citizens who actively and knowingly choose to break our laws.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Don't people in CA get to steal a certain amount in value with no chance of prosecution? Maybe he thought the gold colored rock was under the $900 max.
In his right hand looks like a yellow plastic bag. Could be the gold was in that bag.
I think that gold nugget is worth a whole lot more than $50k. A huge premium is paid for gold nuggets. Sure if it gets melted down it will have less value but in it's natural state I cannot begin to imagine it's current value.
Man I hate hearing about this stuff. I really do. I don't blame the dealer but I do wonder how this dirt bag was able to pull this heist off.
Seems impossible.
I'd love to see the whole video.
Student of numismatics and collector of Morgan dollars
Successful BST transactions with: Namvet Justindan Mattniss RWW olah_in_MA
Dantheman984 Toyz4geo SurfinxHI greencopper RWW bigjpst bretsan
It's being done purposely by a well funded crop of newly elected district attorneys. It's so bad in a couple of places that they've been removed. That's all I can say without making it political.
I guess that the "Coin Shows" all over the United States should start having a video of everyone who enters the show followed up by name and address, it's ashamed how low people have gotten. after all the dealers are trying to make a living and be robbed of their inventory by some low life is disgusting, less and less is being done to put these people away.
Some events like concerts bags are checked on the way in. Maybe bags in this case at coin shows, bags should be checked on the way out. In this case the perp may have been caught. But then again all dealers do not provide receipts for purchases. So would be hard to prove ownership without a receipt for legitimate purchases.
I'd like to know the circumstances of the theft. Did the dealer have some sale fliers on his table and he was using the gold nugget as a paperweight?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
It would be cool if wrongdoers just died on the spot.
Or , in other words, as read on a bumper sticker , years ago: " Despite the cost of living , the wages of sin remain the same !
I hope the owner gets his property and the criminal is caught and punished.
...but I truly don't understand the California bashing and degradation of culture bemoaning. This show has an ID check going in, and a camera along with armed guards at the entrance and throughout the show. Precautions were taken.
But how can anyone be even a little bit surprised that a criminal would try to steal a high value, untraceable (if melted) item? Is this something new? I don't think so.
Whether a planned crime or crime of opportunity, this has gone on in all societies for all time. Theft will not stop anytime soon, even if we cut off the right hand of the thieves (which is Sharia law btw). If anyone thinks this is some new development because the world/California/millenials/etc have gone to hell in a hand basket, they are kidding themselves.
Chopmarked Trade Dollar Registry Set --- US & World Gold Showcase --- World Chopmark Showcase
Can't echo enough -- security was rock solid at Long Beach once again. Plenty of visible presence throughout. Thieves gonna thieve no matter what, no matter where.
I think we’re coming to the point that you need a background investigation to get into a show.
I know, right? The State of California and its large cities refusing to prosecute and incarcerate thieves in no way attracts and motivates career criminals to form organized shoplifting syndicates, attempt brazen thefts like this, etc.
Retailers have been leaving California and/or putting all their inventory behind glass for some other reason that I just can't quite figure out.
Chicago, NYC, Detroit, Baltimore have all had similar problems so it's not just California like so many people suggest. I mean, it's not like these jurisdictions all have one glaring problem in common that is at the root of their recently worsened crime problems.
P.S. I hope your sarcasm detector is fully charged.
Probably not, but I’ll try: grand theft & fraud?
“The thrill of the hunt never gets old”
PCGS Registry: Screaming Eagles
Copperindian
Retired sets: Soaring Eagles
Copperindian
I too just don't understand.
Howe could something like that be accessible to anyone easily?
Pete
-Grand theft- check.
What is considered grand theft in California?
Grand theft under California Penal Code Section 487(a) is defined as the illegal or unlawful taking of another person's property which is valued in excess of $950. This crime can be charged as either a felony or a misdemeanor.
-Burglary- check.
What is the burglary rule in California?
According to 459 of California's Penal Code, a person commits burglary when he or she: Enters a house, room, apartment, store, building or other structure (numerous others are listed in the statute) With the intent to commit petty theft, grand theft, or a felony.
peacockcoins
@braddick: thanks!
“The thrill of the hunt never gets old”
PCGS Registry: Screaming Eagles
Copperindian
Retired sets: Soaring Eagles
Copperindian
That's a different and valid conversation (although I suspect we have different viewpoints). This was some guy. It could have happened anywhere. I doubt CA policies about who to prosecute/incarcerate had any impact on one lone guy walking out with a $50k gold nugget.
I have a friend whose camera is the one that captured the pic above. Apparently the thief was trying to open/testing display cases at a number of tables (including Witter). He found the owner's display case to be unlocked/broken, cracked it open and took the nugget.
Chopmarked Trade Dollar Registry Set --- US & World Gold Showcase --- World Chopmark Showcase
Califoria doesn't kid around when it comes to robbery.
What is the sentence for robbery in California?
Robbery is a Felony punished in First and Second Degrees. If convicted of First Degree Robbery, you face up to nine years in state prison. If convicted of the Second Degree form, you can serve up to five years in a state prison. You also face fines of up to $10,000 or fines and a prison sentence with both forms.
Under California Penal Code 211 PC, robbery is defined as the felonious taking of personal property in someone's possession, from their immediate presence, and against their will using force or fear.
If at the Long Beach coin show a suspect were to use strong intimidation- such as hunkering over a dealer as the dealer sits behind his case and agressively point his finger at the dealer and menacingly pick up a coin and walk away that would be robbery as their was fear involved.
It is sometimes confusing as many people think robbery requires force and fear when it is actually defined as either or.
The simple tactic of using genuine fear is enough to chance the charge from theft to robbery even if there were no actual force involved.
peacockcoins
Lermish
I appreciate your efforts to try to keep politics out of this and similar threads. Some folks wake up in the morning wanting to turn every conversation into a referendum on politics. At the office, the golf course, the gym, the grocery store, the dry cleaner and yes, even a coin forum.
There’s plenty of social media places to spew politics left and right. But that apparently is not enough.
Anyway, thanks for your efforts. Since others were critical, I thought I needed to say something.
"Look up, old boy, and see what you get." -William Bonney.
Where abouts was the dealer?
I believe right around the black dot there. My buddy usually has a portion of that purple table (or the green one above it if I'm misremembering) and Witter is usually the orange table.
Chopmarked Trade Dollar Registry Set --- US & World Gold Showcase --- World Chopmark Showcase
Here's a better map https://longbeachexpo.expocad.com/Events/lbe624/index.html
Black dot is my buddy, red is the victim
Chopmarked Trade Dollar Registry Set --- US & World Gold Showcase --- World Chopmark Showcase
Whoa . . . Bob from All About Coins here in SLC?????? I saw that nugget several weeks ago in Layton, UT. I will see him next week in Sandy, UT at his local show. Not good. He is security conscious . . . so ANYONE can be hit if he was . . . . .
Drunner
Doggone. Just saw the 2 LA news articles. It is just a shame . . .and out of control.
Drunne4r
You'd have to enter a structure Illegally with the purpose to commit theft. I dont think he'd ever be charged with burglary after paying admission to get into a coin. Even with the theft component.
In NJ, he would be hit with 2nd degree theft and conspiracy to commit theft. (Same degree)
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
I've owned big nuggets (several posted here years ago) and just feel so bad for the owner. Thesse are super RARE puppies.
bob
What good is the ID check if that process cannot solve this crime / immediately identify the thief? I still think it’s just a way to send me a mailer for upcoming shows and to sell my information to other coin companies. Just look at the Baltimore show and the heap of correspondence/spam you get from that “ID check” going in.
Smoke & mirrors security measures apparently don’t work. Pcgs or whoever is running this show and piecemealing security needs to step it up.
What effective, but practical solution do you advocate?
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I don't attend coin shows anymore but do any dealers put small video cameras on their back table pointing to the front of their display table where the customers and thieves stand? I would think this would have a serious deterrent effect.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Some do. That is how the video of this crime was captured. I agree, I think it's a good and inexpensive idea that many should emulate but I don't think very many actually do.
Chopmarked Trade Dollar Registry Set --- US & World Gold Showcase --- World Chopmark Showcase
I’m gonna be set up with Noah at shows so by proxy I’ll have camera surveillance. If I wasn’t setting up with Noah I would be investing in my own cameras for sure with what I’ll have on display.
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Security measures are not my forte, but there needs to be an action plan put together between the show and the security team so this does not happen again. What plan did heritage put in place when the purses got stolen in New York?
https://www.amny.com/news/midtown-auction-house-smasher-suspects/