@craig44 said:
seems like a moot point when you can just send in for a reholder. I guess i am not seeing the issue here
Exactly.
I don’t agree with it, but the people in question think cards graded a long time ago are of lower average quality for the grade. Whether the card is reholdered or not, the cert number tells the tale of when it was graded.
@craig44 said:
seems like a moot point when you can just send in for a reholder. I guess i am not seeing the issue here
It’s not an issue of the holder, but of the cert number, which can be used to date when the card was graded.
Lets assume that is true, doesnt PSA guarantee their grades? So if an owner were thinking a card was undergraded they could send it in for review and if it was overgraded wouldnt PSA pay you the difference?
@craig44 said:
seems like a moot point when you can just send in for a reholder. I guess i am not seeing the issue here
It’s not an issue of the holder, but of the cert number, which can be used to date when the card was graded.
Lets assume that is true, doesnt PSA guarantee their grades? So if an owner were thinking a card was undergraded they could send it in for review and if it was overgraded wouldnt PSA pay you the difference?
I don’t think PSA would admit that a card was overgraded unless there was something super crazy. But no one would want to go through all that hassle every time they get a card they aren’t happy with.
Olb
Not really, there are several with quantity like this. I also have 2400+ 1971 Topps Larry Hisle’s.
3000 or more 1987 Topps Stars like Rose, Schmidt, Strawberry, Brett etc
I had many many stars from the 70’s and 80’s back in the day before grading. I remember selling 1980 Henderson rookies at $5-$10 a pop in the early 80’s. I remember selling 1973 Topps Gossage rookies for $10 apiece in the 80’s
If I still had the stock now that I had then I’d be sipping Pina Coladas in the Caribbean in a mansion by the sea.
Did find a small batch of 1980 Henderson’s earlier in 2023 left and still have a bunch of 81-82s
Look at the pop reports for these cards
1974 Topps Hal McRae
1976 Topps Lou Gehrig All-Time
1976 Topps George Foster
1976 Topps Joe Morgan
I wrecked the pop reports on those in 9 and 10
Also had a pristine batch of 1974 and 1975 Topps Seaver’s that graded 10.
That I got directly from Woody Gelman stock thru Capital Cards decades ago
Not all the 10’s were from that group but most. Also 75 Yaz too. Got the first 1975 Jackson 10, now I think there is a second. Sold the Jackson thru an auction house and got $1750 which I thought was amazing at the time
@DotStore said:
I don't avoid older cert #'s, but given the choice between the same card in the same grade , with the same eye appeal, I would pay a slight premium for the newer Cert #.
I hope there are a lot of collectors like you. Might win more auctions because I would take the cheaper equal card every single time be it SGC or old holder.
Me too!
I also buy PSA 9's!!!! 😱
Please everyone, stop bidding on anything other than "freshly" graded PSA 10's.
Ever heard the expression "were you lying then, or are you lying now?" We used to say PSA was already the strictest grading company, now those same cards are OVER graded?
PLEASE, stay away from those old 10's.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
Many are running away with the idea that ALL older graded cards are overgraded. Nobody is saying 100% ALL.
Then some are posting their properly graded (or possibly undergraded) old cert cards and saying "SEE!", like some point was made. Again, nobody is saying ALL.
Then many agree to people saying the grading standards have changed and they won't send in to PSA until it's fixed. Can't have it both ways.
Just through casual observation, I'm more often disappointed in cards in 2XXXXXXX holders, for example. Not ALL.
They tend to be overgraded a little more often than other cert numbers, compared to what I think the grade should be. Not ALL. Maybe those are just the ones people are trying to sell. I don't know.
And before someone posts their beautiful 2XXXXXXX holder card, I'm not saying 100% ALL, as I too, have very nice, appropriately graded cards in 2XXXXXXX holders.
Just through casual observation, I'm more often disappointed in cards in 2XXXXXXX holders, for example. Not ALL.
They tend to be overgraded a little more often than other cert numbers, compared to what I think the grade should be. Not ALL. Maybe those are just the ones people are trying to sell. I don't know.
Funny you mention that. I tend to agree on 21-23 certs. In fact my very first sub was in the 21 days and I couldn’t believe the 9s and 10s I got that I wasn’t expecting.
On the other hand, I am very happy with the 41-44 era in 2018-19. Have a ton of really nice cards graded during that era.
@82FootballWaxMemorys said:
I've noticed on some of the cards I seek purchase the under 6XXXX's going for less.
Yes I buy the card not the flip! Still all things condition wise being equal, buying the post 2021 cert # may be wiser
As easily 95% of my PSA slabs are pre-2021 this trend which is clearly growing does concern me.
Somewhat concerning...... I'm right there with you with pre-2021 slabs as I'm sure many collectors are. I sold most of the higher grade copies to fund my collection and would say 95% of what's left would be pure profit no matter what price it would get.
@Harnessracing said:
Olb
Not really, there are several with quantity like this. I also have 2400+ 1971 Topps Larry Hisle’s.
3000 or more 1987 Topps Stars like Rose, Schmidt, Strawberry, Brett etc
I had many many stars from the 70’s and 80’s back in the day before grading. I remember selling 1980 Henderson rookies at $5-$10 a pop in the early 80’s. I remember selling 1973 Topps Gossage rookies for $10 apiece in the 80’s
If I still had the stock now that I had then I’d be sipping Pina Coladas in the Caribbean in a mansion by the sea.
Did find a small batch of 1980 Henderson’s earlier in 2023 left and still have a bunch of 81-82s
Look at the pop reports for these cards
1974 Topps Hal McRae
1976 Topps Lou Gehrig All-Time
1976 Topps George Foster
1976 Topps Joe Morgan
I wrecked the pop reports on those in 9 and 10
Also had a pristine batch of 1974 and 1975 Topps Seaver’s that graded 10.
That I got directly from Woody Gelman stock thru Capital Cards decades ago
Not all the 10’s were from that group but most. Also 75 Yaz too. Got the first 1975 Jackson 10, now I think there is a second. Sold the Jackson thru an auction house and got $1750 which I thought was amazing at the time
I've been here long enough to remember all the things people brag about, so thank you for bragging (and for picking harnessracing as your user name) because I just realized who you are. You are the previously disgraced member gaspipe26 (still active but no longer posts) that tried to defraud people with your big Delaware purchase of unopened material that was all deemed to be not authentic by Steve Hart and you continued selling it to people. Disgusting.
But you don’t mention that I’m the one who got on a plane to BBCE the next day so everyone found out the boxes were no good. I’m the one who helped many others not pay or get refunded for what they won. I’m also the one who filed the complaint against the Auction House in Delaware. The 1 box that was sold was promptly refunded but you don’t mention any of that do you? Nah, your nothing but an angry old man who has nothing better to do than complain about every one and anything. I’ve seen posts by others saying what a tool you are and I agree.
By the way that Auction House has never had another auction and has had a chain across the entrance for years. Brand new building has been shuttered ever since
The fact that you were sending out messages like this one on the afternoon of 5/5 tells me all I need to know about you.
The part in red shows that you were not willing to share the information you got from Steve with an unsuspecting buyer. The part in green is just a disgusting lie because you had already tried to "do that myself and get more" but Steve Hart rejected your stuff. Lastly, the part in blue shows you're a crook (or ignorant) since you absolutely know that Steve Hart is PSA's pack authenticator.
@Harnessracing said:
But you don’t mention that I’m the one who got on a plane to BBCE the next day so everyone found out the boxes were no good. I’m the one who helped many others not pay or get refunded for what they won. I’m also the one who filed the complaint against the Auction House in Delaware. The 1 box that was sold was promptly refunded but you don’t mention any of that do you? Nah, your nothing but an angry old man who has nothing better to do than complain about every one and anything. I’ve seen posts by others saying what a tool you are and I agree.
By the way that Auction House has never had another auction and has had a chain across the entrance for years. Brand new building has been shuttered ever since
First of all, I'm younger than you Robert. Secondly, why the new CU ID when gaspipe26 was never banned? I'll answer that for you, because your name is crap and you are a disgrace to this fine community.
No one was cheated, the boxes looked good and many buyers were spared. I dont deny I tried to sell boxes that’s why I got on the plane. You just keep complaining about nothing that happened. Ask the others who got refunded or stopped payments because I went to BBCE immediately there on this site. You keep thinking what you want. The people that matter know the truth. You again are nothing but a complainer who does nothing but try to find fault with everyone. Crawl back into your basement.
First of all, I'm younger than you Robert.** Secondly, why the new CU ID when gaspipe26 was never banned?** I'll answer that for you, because your name is crap and you are a disgrace to this fine community.
In general, this form has existed for quite some time and emails tend to get lost or inaccessible. I remember having to open another account while overseas because I didn't have access to the original email for a password change.
I have a number of early graded cards…and look at the card itself for quality if it meets the assigned grade b4 buying . There are a number of early graded beautifull cards which would meet recent grading standards.
So much quality stuff was submitted "way back when". If you generally assume that old certs are less reliable, it might help to examine how the grading got done. Small orders received greater scrutiny, particularly on higher valued cards. Bulk orders which included higher valued cards passing through at rocket speed would have the potential for some grading errors simply because they weren't seen by a grader's eye or got damaged in processing.
The problem lies in how the 'uglies' keep getting shuffled around and some folks will think they're getting a properly graded card because the label says so.....
Certainly nothing “scientific” about it but I tend to value certs in the high 5s and low 6s when there seemed to be a consensus among collectors that PSA was grading vintage much tougher in that time frame (2021-22).
Comments
I don’t agree with it, but the people in question think cards graded a long time ago are of lower average quality for the grade. Whether the card is reholdered or not, the cert number tells the tale of when it was graded.
Lets assume that is true, doesnt PSA guarantee their grades? So if an owner were thinking a card was undergraded they could send it in for review and if it was overgraded wouldnt PSA pay you the difference?
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I don’t think PSA would admit that a card was overgraded unless there was something super crazy. But no one would want to go through all that hassle every time they get a card they aren’t happy with.
Olb
Not really, there are several with quantity like this. I also have 2400+ 1971 Topps Larry Hisle’s.
3000 or more 1987 Topps Stars like Rose, Schmidt, Strawberry, Brett etc
I had many many stars from the 70’s and 80’s back in the day before grading. I remember selling 1980 Henderson rookies at $5-$10 a pop in the early 80’s. I remember selling 1973 Topps Gossage rookies for $10 apiece in the 80’s
If I still had the stock now that I had then I’d be sipping Pina Coladas in the Caribbean in a mansion by the sea.
Did find a small batch of 1980 Henderson’s earlier in 2023 left and still have a bunch of 81-82s
Look at the pop reports for these cards
1974 Topps Hal McRae
1976 Topps Lou Gehrig All-Time
1976 Topps George Foster
1976 Topps Joe Morgan
I wrecked the pop reports on those in 9 and 10
Also had a pristine batch of 1974 and 1975 Topps Seaver’s that graded 10.
That I got directly from Woody Gelman stock thru Capital Cards decades ago
Not all the 10’s were from that group but most. Also 75 Yaz too. Got the first 1975 Jackson 10, now I think there is a second. Sold the Jackson thru an auction house and got $1750 which I thought was amazing at the time
Me too!
I also buy PSA 9's!!!! 😱
Please everyone, stop bidding on anything other than "freshly" graded PSA 10's.
Ever heard the expression "were you lying then, or are you lying now?" We used to say PSA was already the strictest grading company, now those same cards are OVER graded?
PLEASE, stay away from those old 10's.
Many are running away with the idea that ALL older graded cards are overgraded. Nobody is saying 100% ALL.
Then some are posting their properly graded (or possibly undergraded) old cert cards and saying "SEE!", like some point was made. Again, nobody is saying ALL.
Then many agree to people saying the grading standards have changed and they won't send in to PSA until it's fixed. Can't have it both ways.
Just through casual observation, I'm more often disappointed in cards in 2XXXXXXX holders, for example. Not ALL.
They tend to be overgraded a little more often than other cert numbers, compared to what I think the grade should be. Not ALL. Maybe those are just the ones people are trying to sell. I don't know.
And before someone posts their beautiful 2XXXXXXX holder card, I'm not saying 100% ALL, as I too, have very nice, appropriately graded cards in 2XXXXXXX holders.
Funny you mention that. I tend to agree on 21-23 certs. In fact my very first sub was in the 21 days and I couldn’t believe the 9s and 10s I got that I wasn’t expecting.
On the other hand, I am very happy with the 41-44 era in 2018-19. Have a ton of really nice cards graded during that era.
That card today would get hammered for the background snow.
Or maybe not.
Only one way to find out.
Somewhat concerning...... I'm right there with you with pre-2021 slabs as I'm sure many collectors are. I sold most of the higher grade copies to fund my collection and would say 95% of what's left would be pure profit no matter what price it would get.
Another incredibly overgraded card of recent origin. This one should literally be a PSA 6 based on corners alone.
I've been here long enough to remember all the things people brag about, so thank you for bragging (and for picking harnessracing as your user name) because I just realized who you are. You are the previously disgraced member gaspipe26 (still active but no longer posts) that tried to defraud people with your big Delaware purchase of unopened material that was all deemed to be not authentic by Steve Hart and you continued selling it to people. Disgusting.
But you don’t mention that I’m the one who got on a plane to BBCE the next day so everyone found out the boxes were no good. I’m the one who helped many others not pay or get refunded for what they won. I’m also the one who filed the complaint against the Auction House in Delaware. The 1 box that was sold was promptly refunded but you don’t mention any of that do you? Nah, your nothing but an angry old man who has nothing better to do than complain about every one and anything. I’ve seen posts by others saying what a tool you are and I agree.
By the way that Auction House has never had another auction and has had a chain across the entrance for years. Brand new building has been shuttered ever since
The fact that you were sending out messages like this one on the afternoon of 5/5 tells me all I need to know about you.
The part in red shows that you were not willing to share the information you got from Steve with an unsuspecting buyer. The part in green is just a disgusting lie because you had already tried to "do that myself and get more" but Steve Hart rejected your stuff. Lastly, the part in blue shows you're a crook (or ignorant) since you absolutely know that Steve Hart is PSA's pack authenticator.
First of all, I'm younger than you Robert. Secondly, why the new CU ID when gaspipe26 was never banned? I'll answer that for you, because your name is crap and you are a disgrace to this fine community.
In
No one was cheated, the boxes looked good and many buyers were spared. I dont deny I tried to sell boxes that’s why I got on the plane. You just keep complaining about nothing that happened. Ask the others who got refunded or stopped payments because I went to BBCE immediately there on this site. You keep thinking what you want. The people that matter know the truth. You again are nothing but a complainer who does nothing but try to find fault with everyone. Crawl back into your basement.
In general, this form has existed for quite some time and emails tend to get lost or inaccessible. I remember having to open another account while overseas because I didn't have access to the original email for a password change.
harnessracing is gaspipe26 is that correct?
I have a number of early graded cards…and look at the card itself for quality if it meets the assigned grade b4 buying . There are a number of early graded beautifull cards which would meet recent grading standards.
So much quality stuff was submitted "way back when". If you generally assume that old certs are less reliable, it might help to examine how the grading got done. Small orders received greater scrutiny, particularly on higher valued cards. Bulk orders which included higher valued cards passing through at rocket speed would have the potential for some grading errors simply because they weren't seen by a grader's eye or got damaged in processing.
The problem lies in how the 'uglies' keep getting shuffled around and some folks will think they're getting a properly graded card because the label says so.....
Come on people now. Smile on your brothers.
Certainly nothing “scientific” about it but I tend to value certs in the high 5s and low 6s when there seemed to be a consensus among collectors that PSA was grading vintage much tougher in that time frame (2021-22).
The best grader for my cards is me. If I like the card, I could care less if it is an old cert or new cert, I'll buy it.
When was that sent in? I hope I get the same treatment for the 69's I just sent in.
I'd give the williams a 7 based on what we can see. I would have got a 6 though.
I got cards in better shape than that Williams coming back as 5s in 2022/23.
I'd still like to have this one though.