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How does a coin get this many devices faded or missing?
hawkowl
Posts: 30 ✭✭✭
I found this one in a coin roll. There are a lot of devices faded or missing altogether. It doesn't look like someone went at this with a sander or buffer, but what could cause such conditions - grease strike thorough? worn dies? Odd that this is on both sides of the coin.
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I’m guessing the grease fell into the empty dies after the planchet was ejected and before the next planchet got placed between the dies and that may be how it affected both sides
Mr_Spud
I have no idea but that is impressive. James
It is a Grease Filled Die. Unusual to see it on both sides though.
Could it be a die set-up coin? It looks like an extremely weak strike from when new dies are installed in the coin press and a few coins are struck so the die spacing (and die pressure) can adjusted.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
If it was a die adjustment strike, the rims wouldn't be full.
Aren't the rims already mostly formed when the planchet is run through the upsetting machine?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
They are slightly raised, but not fully formed as on this coin.
Grease strike, and a nice one!
Really interesting coin.... I lean toward grease strike, though unusual to be both sides like that. @hawkowl ... Was this a roll find?? Cheers, RickO
Thanks all for the comments. I wondered about a grease strike, but I have never seen it so pervasive on both sides of a coin.
And yes, @ricko, this was a coin roll find, and a surprising one at that!
This looks like severe PMD to me, but hopefully one of the error guys will chime in soon.
I'm seeing struck though grease. As a Louisiana native, I like it! Nice Find!
It's all about what the people want...
Two articles about adjustment strikes.
Pete
Thanks @BuffaloIronTail . It doesn't make sense that BOTH dies would have prodigious amounts of grease on them. I still say it looks like an die adjustment strike as depicted in the above references.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
@CaptHenway and @MarkFeld were both professional graders. I'd like to hear their opinions. Also, @FredWeinberg is an expert on the minting process and I would appreciate his thoughts on this coin.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
As stated, it’s a “struck through grease“ – both obv. & rev dies
I use the term “grease“ although it’s machinery oil/lubricant of different types that are used in the process
Hypothetically, if you ran a vertical striking press all day and the press was nice and warm and then you shut it off for the night or weekend, AND the press was leaking a bit of grease that was running down the side of the hammer die and then around the rim to the face of the die, AND the grease built up on the face of the hammer die so much so that some of it dripped down onto the anvil die, when you turned the press back on and started striking coins the pressure of the striking would redistribute the grease in interesting patterns.
Another way to tell a Filled Die vs. a Die Adjustment is by the reeded edge. The reeding will be fully struck on a Filled Die and lightly struck or nonexistent on a Die Adjustment.
Here is a filled die in my collection. I also have several Die Adjustment pieces but don't have photos readily at hand.
@MWallace said:
"Another way to tell a Filled Die vs. a Die Adjustment is by the reeded edge. The reeding will be fully struck on a Filled Die and lightly struck or nonexistent on a Die Adjustment."
Thanks again all for the great detailed discussion. The edge is fully reeded, so I guess that lends more weight to the Filled Die/"grease" hypothesis.
Is something like this worth the cost of getting attributed?
grease filled die for sure. Here is a SBA I found in a roll of new dollars way back when. Also a grease filled die on both sides.
I have some odds and ends like this w/Jeff nickels but haven't photographed them. Usually labeled as "unusually weak dies" strike.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection